RubberSideDown

Well, yeah, you'll notice the weight, but we're talking 50lbs if you want to compare the Z800 to the current 650cc class that's basically in the same sub-400K price-range- that's not a huge difference, but another 40hp really puts it in another league performance-wise- on the track I'd rather lose the weight, but on the street I want the ponies.

Once a bike is off the side-stand, as long as it has a reasonably narrow wheelbase and even weight distribution, some extra pounds don't make all that much difference on the street- I don't disagree with your point, but I think that there's really too much emphasis put on 500lbs when it's not really that much weight if the bike is properly designed.

I guess if Yamaha comes thru with that FZ09 847

at 414 lbs & 113hp they will be doing pretty good too?

Of course price will reflect taxes though

I saw that- if it's true that's really light, but I want to see what a magazine test comes up with when they toss it on a truck scale.

360-400lbs? What bike are you talking about? That might be a manufacturer's claimed dry weight for a middle-weight, but even a Gixxer 750 weighs about ~450lbs wet- a tiny R6 weighs about 420lbs.

I come from another era

900RR they were 420 wet stock & a lot lighter when we were done with them

But I always preferred my 600rr

It was well under 400 closer to 360

Even a 2007 600rr stock was 156kg

I see they gained though as 2013 is listed as 185kg wet

Its all good. Some folks like lighter some like heavier some dont care either way.

No, you don't- I've been riding sportbikes for over 20 years- I owned a 900RR in the mid-1990s.

I don't think the 600RR was under 415-420lbs wet for any model year- 156kg had to be a dry weight- MCN has the 2007 at 410lbs wet, which I think is a tad low- http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/bikereviews/searchresults/Bike-Reviews/Honda/Honda-CBR600RR-2007-current-/

360-400lbs? What bike are you talking about? That might be a manufacturer's claimed dry weight for a middle-weight, but even a Gixxer 750 weighs about ~450lbs wet- a tiny R6 weighs about 420lbs.

Look at the popularity of the ER6N- the Z800 is just over 10% heavier and puts out nearly 40% more horsepower- if I were looking at new bikes in the middleweight range at a sub-400K price-point, I think there's only one bike to choose if you want to get the most performance for your money- -I'll take an extra 25kg for another 40hp anytime when we're talking about a max weight of 500lbs.

Power-to-weight, what beats the Z800 for the price (up to 500K new in LOS)?

I'm used to a heavy motorcycle- my bike is ~550lbs (stock it was 585lbs), and I don't find it much of a problem to handle- yes, it can be difficult to push around in neutral (especially uphill) but in stop-and-go traffic or slow speeds it's no big deal- if I couldn't flatfoot it i might have more of an issue, but a bike of ~500lbs like the Z800 is really not much to deal with.

I think the big deal being made of the Z800's weight is a little ridiculous- it's not an 800lb cruiser.

True- those speeds are under perfect conditions (meaning a vacuum)- it also assumes the bike has the power to hit redline in 6th gear.

I sat on one of these yesterday. I'm 5'10 and I couldn't plant my feet on the ground. A much higher seat than I thought.

I used a lowering link on my z1k . One of the best mods i made and needed for safety

A lowered bike usually looks nicer as well.

So, who's put a deposit down on one? I figured we'd have seen several orders from members so far.

I have no problem with someone playing games to beat taxes or tariffs as they're so ridiculous here as long as the bike has been legitimately purchased and imported (and as long as they're upfront about it)- it's the potentially stolen stuff that bothers me.

It sounds like this 'Thai green book' could easily give a stolen bike the appearance of legitimacy- that's what bothers me about it. Yes, some detective work could probably spot something like that, but who's going to make the effort, especially if it's a bike that came over as 'parts' from overseas?

There's a reason why Thailand has a shady reputation in that regard, and too many people are blinded by a (seemingly) good deal to do their due diligence.

Again, this is not a comment directed toward the shop in the OP, but to the concept of accepting forged paperwork in general.

For the normal license check odds of a issue are slim.....If selling the odds increase as they (in pattaya) do a thorough vin check looking for new stamps, plates and welds. I have seen this with my eyes. If you happen to be involved in a accident and there's a investigation then your odds increase too.....

Personally i would go with no plate or book then committing fraud...

I think many people believe a couple hundred baht will get them out of any issue and don't worry too much about a bike's provenence.

My biggest worry about my bike (after a crash) is theft- it's just too easy to screw around with paperwork and send a bike to the other side of the country (and process it through a 'friendly' DLT)- suddenly it's a saleable commodity- as far as a bike being stolen, broken down as parts, shipped to LOS, reassembled, and sold as legitimate with a forged green book, well, that certainly happens as well.

Also, I guess anyone who says bike confiscation doesn't happen has never seen a policeman riding around on a BMW or full-dress Harley that cost a few years of his salary, and that bike will probably be coming up for sale eventually with a fake green book...

Bottom line is that if a bike has forged documents, you need to be willing to accept the fact that is could be stolen if you can't trace it from when it was originally purchased (even imported bikes can be researched through VIN/frame numbers).

It sounds like this 'Thai green book' could easily give a stolen bike the appearance of legitimacy- that's what bothers me about it. Yes, some detective work could probably spot something like that, but who's going to make the effort, especially if it's a bike that came over as 'parts' from overseas?

There's a reason why Thailand has a shady reputation in that regard, and too many people are blinded by a (seemingly) good deal to do their due diligence.

Again, this is not a comment directed toward the shop in the OP, but to the concept of accepting forged paperwork in general.

If I end up making a move I'm considering in the next six months, the Duke is on my short-list for a middleweight- I think it's a fantastic bike.

I would think it's better to just deal in bikes that are 100% legitimate rather than transfer fake titles- admitting that the bike has forged paperwork but selling it anyway falls a bit south of 'honest', IMHO.

I don't know this shop and I certainly can't make any claims against it, but if the post above is accurate, than- to me- that's not the proper way to do business.

I put a deposit on my bike before I had even seen one in person, and the first time I heard one running was when I started mine up after delivery (and payment-in-full)- when you know, you know.

Just wear a jacket with plenty of adjustment in the cuffs. When it's chilly I tighten them and put them under the glove cuffs, when it's hot I loosen them and wear them over the gloves giving a nice draught all the way to my pitts.

I've got a few motorcycle-specific leather jackets, and none of them would stay open at the cuffs enough to let air in, especially with putting them over gauntlets.

As I said, these 'Ventz' might be worthless- I want to wear my leather more than my textile, and if they help, they're more than worth 1K- I'm happy to be the test-pilot.

Seriously, if the product really is called "Ventz" with a Z, I'd refuse to buy it on principle

Well, in defense of the company, they have a patent on the name and the design- 'Vents' was already taken.

Here's the product evaluation report- if nothing else, they made a good effort:

http://www.ventz-range.com/Ventz%20Evaluation%20Report.pdf

hahaha thats badass !

looking around my room now for substitute parts

Badass, perhaps- these vents might also be completely useless- as they were mentioned in Fast Bikes (a publication which hasn't steered my wrong yet) and they weren't that expensive, I think they're worth a shot- there's actually very little in the way of reviews or info (just a couple of users saying 'OK' to 'very good'). Getting them seated right with my gloves is my biggest concern- I don't think they'd add much if any additional risk to the wrists in a crash.

Royal Mail is pretty fast- I should be able to give an opinion in a week or so.

I saw these in Fast Bikes magazine- less than 1K shipped from the UK via eBay, so I took a chance on 'em- they seem like a pretty good idea (though they might be a bit of a problem with full-gauntlet gloves)- I'm up for trying anything that will increase airflow and make wearing full gear more bearable in LOS. Hopefully they won't just get tossed on the pile of useless crap I've ordered in the past...

That would be good info to have, especially in LOS where benzine is nearly gone and there are a lot of older bikes on the road- please post it.

you can also take a chance and ship it disassembled, but it will never have a proper registration.

I dont think a CRF 250R could ever have proper registration given it is a motocross machine.

It could at least have registration paperwork that would allow it to be sold legally- it could be insured as well (if off-road machines are eligible for insurance- I really don't know).

That would be import paperwork not registration.

Can you legally operate or sell a motocross bike within Thailand that isn't registered? I realize the odds of having an issue are low, but I'm just curious as to what the law states- I don't think so- I've never dealt with an unregistered bike, though, but wouldn't they still have a green book? Is there a different law for off-road vehicles?

you can also take a chance and ship it disassembled, but it will never have a proper registration.

I dont think a CRF 250R could ever have proper registration given it is a motocross machine.

It could at least have registration paperwork that would allow it to be sold legally- it could be insured as well (if off-road machines are eligible for insurance- I really don't know).

It will cost close to 200% of the bike's value in import charges- a two grand bike will cost four grand to bring in, plus shipping, homologation certification, etc- that's if you want to do it legally- you can also take a chance and ship it disassembled, but it will never have a proper registration.

As far as I know this info is current:

http://www.customs.go.th/wps/wcm/connect/custen/individuals/importing+personal+vehicle/importingpersonalvehicle+

http://www.gt-rider.com/motorcycles-in-thailand/importing-motorcycles-into-thailand/motorcycle-import

You'll find you'll get to maximum speed quicker by upshifting immediately prior to the power peak - looks to be around 9k - I'd shift at 8k or thereabouts. Running to or past the redline is a total waste of time in racing terms - power rolls off so fast beyond the peak point that acceleration slows dramatically.

Why would you shift before peak power if you're looking for maximum performance? The point of running past the peak of the power curve is so you're in the heart of it when you up-shift- if you're short-shifting, you're falling behind. Racers always set their shift lights after the peak.

Look at the dyno chart- the bike puts out ~the same hp at 8K and 10K (using the stock curve)- if you shift at 8K you're dropping about 2500rpm on the upshift and falling way short of peak power- if you shift at 10K and drop the same 2500rpm, you're right back in the power curve, and will have utilized peak power- short-shifting will never accelerate as quickly as you're never using full power.

I think you're going to have to flash the ECU to change the limiter- it's not an easy thing to do.

Been researching it, i believe its a function of the oscillating crystal...i could change the frequency but, its going to open a can of worms.

It's not the same bike, but I just raised my rev limit by 500rpm through flashing the ECU- I would imagine it's the same for any recently-made motorcycle.