Nigeone

T

The amount of people stating about DNA tests done by RTP are missing the point. Let's clear this up! The RTP stated that they had there DNA tested and it didn't match...And we all believe whatever the RTP say don't we.. They also said that DNA samples went to Singapore and that's been discounted now. They also said they couldn't do DNA test for a week as they needed to go to Bangkok. They then tested Nomsad and cleared him in 24 hours . No there liars and not very good ones at that. Plain to see!!

That Sir is a Farce!

As pointed out here several times in the past, and only if you would read this, the Police only play a small part in Forensics Evidence. There are several steps and procedures that must be followed and verified, before DNA can be validated and considered evidence. This can involve several other people in a Crime Lab, and Prosecution, and thus it is not just one Policeman's Word.

If you recall, which you probably don't as you probably never read this either, that when 1 of the accused was picked up on the main land, (Win I think) the Police requested that his DNA be tested as soon as possible, and the first results came in less than a day proving Positive. Or as reported by the Media anyway. In other words instead of waiting for all the other 200 samples they collected from the Island to be tested, they put this at the top of the list.

Since you seem to claim you know so much about DNA Testing Times, how long does it take to preform a DNA Test? .

Pol Lt Gen Kamrob Panyakaew, chief of the Office of Police Forensic Science, said the closest forensic lab to Koh Tao capable of conducting DNA tests was in Songkhla province, but it could not take on the testing as it was overloaded with cases from the southern conflict. He said experts in Bangkok were rushing to complete the tests, though each sample takes at least 48 hours to complete.

Bangkok Post 28-9-14

Gold buggy, do you even read what you write?! In your first sentence you acknowledge the fact that many people and factors are involved in verifying DNA. Shoot yourself in the foot if you want but the above poster is correct as to what was stated.. Also at one stage they were having to use Bangkok but it might take up to a week! The other matter is can you tell me, conspiracy aside!? that you are prepared to believe everything the RTP tell you?? I certainly don't trust that media joke DNA test done for the show that was carried out! So your happy to accept that a DNA test that they said couldn't be done for a couple of days or more conviently was produced,with all the necessary people and techniques you say are involved in less than a day! No way!

I will though just for your benefit check with my friend who's a CI in police here and was scenes of crime officer for 20 years for his take on DNA collection and reporting. I would say this will be a international standard procedures and not those that lose, use up or can't find the DNA at a later date when required by courts ! Point made ??

DNA Tests Done in 4 Hours

http://www.acs.org/content/acs/en/pressroom/presspacs/2010/acs-presspac-august-4-2010/fast-forensic-test-can-match-suspects-dna-with-crime-samples-in-four-hours.html

Did you read that attachment you posted. That method of testing is not readily available yet and if you can remember the compromised crime scene with complete contamination of scene in a totally unsterile environment and then witnessed the local police,not properly trained personal taking the samples you still think this matter wasn't utterly compromised . Also the article clearly states that Crime DNA takes 24 to 72 hours at least by qualified personal to take and compare. At no time was the proper testing at any stage was acquired and further more as another poster has quite clearly stated proper protocol in collecting, and independently !! checked and tested wasn't carried out. The many statements of DNA supposedly gathered has most been lost used up or none left as stated by the Police. The defense did not at any stage as required by law in a civilized country being allowed to independently verify said DNA so the whole case if in the UK or other country would not even make it to court I'm afraid. That's a fact. We already had a witness saying he moved the hoe, apparently the murder weapon! and then was asked to wash it! That's a crime scene! The policeman admitted to moving the body,the police stated the murdered couples clothes were in a neat pile! Pictures of the crime scene clearly show the items of clothing and pink shoes etc were all over the place. It's been totally compromised in every shape and form and should be stopped now. Now goldbuggy that's me finished answering you for now. It's a bit repetive I'm afraid

If they steer the sub anything like they drive their cars it will fix the fishing boat problems too - or maybe they will be used as target practice?

what a farce

Your right..your often hearing in the UK about fishing boats mysteriously being towed backwards or even sunk.. No one ever admits responsibility but it's generally accepted its subs maybe even Russian from time to time.

Bring it on..can't wait. As long as some poor sailors don't die I can't wait for the 'comedy' to begin. 10 years.. The first one is not going to last 10 months from going to sea...as I've said before hope there thought out the rescue of men from a submerged sub...now there's a hub to be proud off..world leaders on rescuing crew from inoperable submarines.

You are so right especially about any unnecessary and unfortunate deaths but we can be sure if there's any incident and, perish the thought, a tragedy there will be no shortage of excuses produced and probably an economy with the truth.

I posted on another OP the other day how I was watching UK forces TV and the commissioning of a new submarine. The UK has a great history of subs and the crew have been training on it for two years and only in the next week or two are heading to sea for the first time. God help the Thai submariners..subs are serious bits of kit..!! accident not waiting to happen but going to happen!

I'm sorry but 530,000 books => 20 millions THB. At this amount, it's not the job of a committee, this a police duty. Just call the cops!

Yes but I suppose that depends on whose in the loop doesn't it?! It's a big scam..maybe big people involved.

Is this the same story as the other day when it was reported a massive load of books had been destroyed by mistake? Has it developed or a complete different issue??

Bring it on..can't wait. As long as some poor sailors don't die I can't wait for the 'comedy' to begin. 10 years.. The first one is not going to last 10 months from going to sea...as I've said before hope there thought out the rescue of men from a submerged sub...now there's a hub to be proud off..world leaders on rescuing crew from inoperable submarines.

I've missed her informative and uplifting messages .. Quality tourist destination strike 1 ,laws to be amended and seriously enforced, strike 2 , and tourism numbers and revenues to increase strike 3 and sit on the bench,your out. Not even going to mention the group tourism bit, More Chinese anyone?

Mmmm went missing from production to delivery!!, is this just a paper transaction and there never were any books printed

Where's a market for 530,000 books Thais generally don't read...no this is a scam in my view. Order the books,books don't get printed, money gets paid happy days !

The amount of people stating about DNA tests done by RTP are missing the point. Let's clear this up! The RTP stated that they had there DNA tested and it didn't match...And we all believe whatever the RTP say don't we.. They also said that DNA samples went to Singapore and that's been discounted now. They also said they couldn't do DNA test for a week as they needed to go to Bangkok. They then tested Nomsad and cleared him in 24 hours . No there liars and not very good ones at that. Plain to see!!

The real question is why go on and on about this kid? Do you think he left at 9:30 with the intent to go murder two random people on the beach and therefore used a fake ID to board a plane and then arrange to get back in time for exams at University?

There is NOTHING linking this kid to the murders. As I recall his DNA was collected from at least three different labs involved in testing of DNA from the crime scene.

All this nonsense because because of people's personal issues. This kid and his family along with many others were investigated early on and rumors and false leads were disproven and even after they caught the two suspects in custody, the kid and his lawyers took issues to show he wasn't involved because of ignorant rumor spreading social media detectives. 10 Million other people in Bangkok who could have done it and has just as much means and motive as him but of course he should be suspected because of unreal expectations he hasn't proven beyond an unreal expectation that he is innocent ... all because his father carries wait on this tiny island.

The problem is, that no-one (i.e. the RTP) feels it necessary to check where he actually was and attempt to match his DNA to those found at the murder scene (or check plane manifests) and bring that forward to use as evidence/alibi - if he had nothing to hide, why not give himself up and allow tests to be carried out and explain exactly what he was doing at the time under oath...!?

The next thing we'll probably see, is that all 'foreign' reporters will be excluded from court; Thai media will flood in and let us all know that some kind of miraculous evidence has been found that foreigners are not privy to, then the case will be wrapped up!

And all because his father carries 'weight' somewhere in the Thai halls of power (including Koh Tao)....

Yes your right and as I mentioned above it doesn't fit in with there plan of this crime. Also there not allowed to dig in the obvious direction are they because it's going to open a massive can of worms which was the obvious point of this whole exercise framing the B2 from the start. The problem I see is getting Nomsad involved in the trial as he's not on trial or a suspect, in the RTP eyes that is, so there's no reason for him to be involved sadly. Someone will bubble him and his mates though one of these days and don't be surprised if it's one of the UK Sunday papers that pay some money

JTJ, Balo, Goldbuggy,Sviss Geez. Do you have an opinion on this?

If David was laid with Hannah when he was struck on the head with the blunt end of a Thai garden Hoe would some of his blood splashed onto Hannah's body? If you are in agreement that that is more than possible and very probable. Why was there no DNA from David discovered on Hannah's body.

I apologies to the family for asking in such a graphic way but I feel strongly that if theses murders were carried out in the way they are described by the prosecution there would have to have been DNA evidence and feel sure the prosecution would have shown this.

If he was , its impossible for us to know the facts here. You're guess is as good as mine.

I haven't seen a police report or lab report or heard court testimony that said none of David's DNA was found on Hannah.

I have also not seen a police report or lab report or heard court testimony that says David was killed while on top of Hannah, running away or while skinning dipping or a plethora of other possible positions.

If If why why question for those not involved are a game (lets play internet detective) and doesn't yield any answers except for those who believe they can derive facts in the case that are based on things they don't know or have not been shared publicly.

JTJ. I've stayed away from you for obvious reasons as most posters on here will know why that is but this gets my goat!

Your very right you haven't seen this that or lots of things to do with this crime and do you know why!!

I'll give you a clue! This crime and investigation,evidence and everything involved with it from the moment that phone call was made after approx a week has been arranged,manipulated and what ever other words you want to add by the RTP completely to there dreamed up imagination! That's why nothing fits and sad for them there not clever enough to have carried it out as has been proven in the first 3 days of trial.You have to be a very very good lier to tie everything together and keep a pretence up of this magnitude for any length of time and the big mistake was they thinking that this was another crime to conviently sweep under the carpet to protect the elite! Scum (mafia) on that Island.

There being found out daily by the power of the media,forums like this and CSI and the brave efforts of Andy Hall and his team.And make no mistake he's one brave dude! The sooner you and your mates with obvious vested interests in this case smell the coffee the better is going to be for all concerned .Because make no mistake this fight is not going away! And I've said before I believe the UK media scent a massive story and are not going to go away...

There is next to no chance that the families follow the twisted, regurgitated nonsense that is posted here, don't worry about that aspect. Why would they?

Well if it was my relative and I was spending alot of time stuck in hotels waiting around I'd probably want to dig for as much info as possible regardless. They don't know Thailand and how the system works like we do. So maybe there is a family member reading this thread.

Everyone here is in agreement and would like to see the right people arrested- most here think the family are are being led a merry dance by the authorities. I can't imagine how that would feel, when you'd start to realise whats going on. Who do you trust then??

I wouldn't be sure that the actual direct family's would be reading on here but I'm sure people connected as in friends etc will be.. I know If I had a friend involved in something like this I would be tearing my hair out if only to be able to support the family. And look how much input has come from all us on here despite us not having any direct connection .No this crime has inflamed so many people in so many countries along with mainstream news in lots of countries. As I commented before I've been surprised how much coverage it has got in the UK ,pleasantly I,might say if you can use that would in this situation. Despite the trauma the poor family's must be going through they are educated and know what's right and wrong.This break in the court case will be terrible for them as it just drags out everything but I'm sure they will have thought over the farce of the first 3 days and will have been coming to thoughts of perhaps there's something wrong with this 'perfect case'. Whatever there thinking my heart goes out to them.

Just to throw into the mix: When asked his views Sean MCMystery said words to the effect :

"Check which 3 people did not come to work at the *** bar the next day."

It was at this time there was much speculation about 2 bouncers at this bar, one referred to as 'shark tooth ring.'

Reports stated that they both left the island that day.

Very little has been said about them since.

Just a reminder.

Where are they now I wonder?

Shark tooth man returned after the B2 were arrested, he's also got form, been accused of rape before by a HiSo Thai model, cant post that as its in Thai

Who is shark tooth guy? Chappie who posed with the hoe? or someone else?

Shark tooth man, different to the hoe guy

and this is the hoe guy. Aon Kohtao ( Facebook name )Aon-Koh-Tao.jpg

I would love it really love it to get these Koa Tao gangsters in a big room with some of Britains finest..I don't care, SAS, Royal Marines ,Para's or whoever. If only to beat the S*** out them and show them how hard there not! And hopefully and I think likely get the admission out them for this crime and I'm sure so many more. One can dream can't you! And when there finished with them perhaps they could on to the jet ski scum. If only!!

A pipe dream yes but you all get the point!!

Please guys now that everyone has seen the horrific pictures of Hannah and David show some respect. Think of the family and friends of those poor young people, not only seeing those shocking explicit photos, but reading posts where "interested" readers are more concerned about slanging each other off than they are about the heartbroken families of the deceased.

I don't think you can assume 'everyone' has seen the pictures. I haven't and don't want to. Other posters have previously made it clear they haven't either and have no desire to.

I'm the same..I have know wish to see them and it's enough to hear people's responses to seeing them to imagine the severity of them .God knows what it must have been like for the parents in court seeing there loved ones like that. The only possible good that might!! come out of this is the showing up of the corrupt Thai police and justice system. How I wish that's going to happen but I'm not sure it is . This is one time when I'm grateful for the UK media because as a rule they don't let go of something like this

Sadly , despite the obvious RTA attempts to pervert the course of justice from day one ,which despite the prosecution apologists on here , is quite clear and obvious to any person with a semblance of intelligence I fear the B2 are going to be found guilty..There is no way that should happen as the investigation has been compromised ever since the first RTP guy was removed and the great leader who must be obeyed opened his mouth. This is something right to the end I will hope and pray doesn't happen but to be honest the Thai police and court system is as rotten as it could be. I feel so sorry and my heart goes out to the family and parents of Hannah and David as they are having to relive what's been a nightmare for them and have now to listen to the court evidence and witnesses for the prosecution. They as I have said before are going to be intelligent people and despite there wishes to see justice served God knows what there thinking now after the last 3 days. It's quite clear the Thai authorities have no perception of how serious this all is and clearly are not used to been challenged with their form of Justice!!.

But just as this is a cover up of epic proportions and lies are getting worse by the day they are digging them selves into a almighty hole..In a society that survives on money and corruption one day somebody will squeal and bring the house crashing down..I'm sure it's going to happen..if the government and RTP are having a tough time at the moment they haven't seen nothing yet..Thailand is getting incredible bad press but when the UK media get there claws into something they don't let go..The Sunday Papers will be working on this at is moment as the magnitude of a story that could actually bring a country down is one hell of story...watch this space I feel..but just to reiterate !! I so want justice to be done now , the head mans son and his cronies and the RTP and everyone involved in this stich up to get what they deserve and the B2 to be able to go back to there country to a happy safe life...

Just watched British forces TV.....they are about to commission a new submarine in the next month or so..Britain as you will know has a history of submarine warfare and they have been training for 2 years already and it hasn't gone to sea yet....that says it all I feel...and have they got underwater rescue facility because they really are going to need it...

Hmmmm

"Please allow the police and the court to do their jobs during the coming weeks and months. We, of course, want to see those responsible for the brutal murder of our precious girl brought to justice."

Yet another prejudicial statement from the Witheridge family. They mean of course, the B2.

As I've said before I can't imagine how the family's will be feeling in court listening to all that's gone on..

But they also must see that the prosecution case up to now is completely flawed..I so feel for them however

In this climate there brave guys..respect to them...it's a pity more weren't able to speak out.

God knows what those poor parents and family must be thinking sitting in court listening to what's gone on the last two days.Im sure they are intelligent people and can see what's unfolding in front of them...My heart goes out to,them..and more to come.Noboby can have any doubt that there is serious flaws in this court case.Like someone said this would be grounds for instant dismissal in any civilised society.

If the local hoodlums want to put a damper on the media reporting, instead of threatening some poor Thai girl translator, why don;t they just arrange for the SKY News reporter to have an unfortunate traffic accident on the way back to his hotel. We all know how dangerous are those roads on Koh Samui.

You really can't be serious can you...You don't get what a mess there in already. What do you think would happen if something like your suggesting happened..I'm sorry but your getting silly now. Some of these attempts at justifying what's happening are getting ridiculous. I know the Thais in the main are not educated to a high standard but I can't believe for one minute there that stupid .

In reply to JLCrab Post #353:-

The point is, which has already been stated, is that a translator working for Sky News has been warned off by presumably, the Thai mafia from Koh Tao. Whether that translator was working for Sky News, Reuters, the BBC, or ISIS is irrelevant - what are the RTP doing about it? And why has the roti seller been appointed as official translator for the court? Was the translator that was working for Sky News one and the same? (Sorry JD - conspiracy theory!)And if he is appearing as a witness for the prosecution, how is it possible that he can be appointed as official translator to the court?

So you're saying maybe SKY News is a bunch of wimps who will let their translator be frightened off by some goons from another island where the trial isn't taking place? Did the SKY News camera crew not have a photo or video of their translator being warned off?

Well we couldn't have expected a better comment could we.

Of course the Sky Guys making it up as well.

I've said already -- I don't see what possible advantage there is to whomever would want to scare off one or more translators. An eyewitness to the crime, maybe. Doesn't make sense.

It may not make sense to you but that does not mean it is not true and that is the important part, if it is true and its certainly credible enough for Sky News to report then that confirms that this intimidation is going on and perhaps a lot more than we are aware of. How many other people have had the same visit

Also I have already stated as I'm in the UK at the moment,there was a live interview from Koh Tao done yesterday where I watched a Burmese Worker state that the Mafia run the Island and everyone is frightened of saying who did it and they extort money from everyone. They then switched to Jonathan Samuels outside the court who informed everyone initially live,afterwards the same clip repeated thought the night and early UK time, that his local translator had been leaned on and they weren't able to help with translations anymore..Fact. This has been on SKY news continually..I hope this puts this one to bed. In a case with this much media coverage he really wouldn't lie. Why was the interpreter leant on. Simple to try and do anything to prevent or make it hard for the truth to come out. Andy Hall has also said there's a lack of Thai news reporters present. Do you really thing that's a coincidence . The big problem is the Thai authorities RTP and mafia are not allowing for the persistence of the UK media and they are not going to be suppressed. I think most people understand all this except for Thais and the people on here trying to stick up for this sham

So the police are saying they have no more sample and that is has 'all been used up'.

What a load of twoddle.

You only need the tiniest bit for a test, evn if you did sereral tests there would have been plenty left.

The cigarette butt alone would probably provide dozens of samples if not more. It would have been saturated in DNA.

Everything the police have come out with has been cock and bull and something you would expect a 5 year old child to come out with.

Your right but the cigarette butt would only prove they or one of them were there on the beach and that's not in doubt as they admitted they were. It doesn't mean they murdered anyone.

In reply to JLCrab Post #353:-

The point is, which has already been stated, is that a translator working for Sky News has been warned off by presumably, the Thai mafia from Koh Tao. Whether that translator was working for Sky News, Reuters, the BBC, or ISIS is irrelevant - what are the RTP doing about it? And why has the roti seller been appointed as official translator for the court? Was the translator that was working for Sky News one and the same? (Sorry JD - conspiracy theory!)And if he is appearing as a witness for the prosecution, how is it possible that he can be appointed as official translator to the court?

So you're saying maybe SKY News is a bunch of wimps who will let their translator be frightened off by some goons from another island where the trial isn't taking place? Did the SKY News camera crew not have a photo or video of their translator being warned off?

Don't spoil his story!!

You guys are really struggling aren't you..Most probably the translator was picked up locally..it would make sense no! Tell why the hell would SKY make up the story..it's well known the Mafia have lent on people on Koh Tao..In fact only early this morning was a live interview with a Burmese in Kho Tao stating that very same fact that the Mafia ruled the islands and everybody is very afraid if anything is said...no as I have said why would they have to shut people up if there wasn't something to hide. If I was there I would be scared too..but the media will get somebody to talk...just watch...as for the camera angle etc they probably didn't think. They would do it as it more then a bit stupid isn't it. The UK media won't be suppressed like the Thai media..no mate smell the coffee

Sky News reporter talking about his translator being warned off by mafia

https://www.facebook.com/heidi.a.zimmerman/videos/1000772946621286/

So if the translator can no longer work for him how does he know what happened in the Courtroom?

The poster hasn't made himself clear.I want to give you every chance to understand what's happening in the UK on the news.The reporting has not been updated on the news and they have just been repeating what was said over night and this morning prior to the court this morning in Thailand. It was Johnathan Samuels for Sky who's translator was leaned on..be sure when the court finishes over there there will be a updated news report.This is really getting covered and I sense the news channels sense a massive story sadly for the relatives..I'm sorry but once again your clutching at straws and I'm not letting you away with it. Open your eyes to what's happening here by the hour..The case is going out the window very quickly.

What a load of BS this is. All these two have done is sign something made up and written by the same human rights lawyer!! This should be dismissed as being 'evidence of their retraction'.
They didn't retract their statements it was done for them.

Perhaps your post is a load of B.S. unless you have proof of what you are saying

I'm no hand writing expert but you don't need to be to see that both letters are written by the same person. Simply look at the dates on both letters and they are identical in every way, as are the loops and style (I used a magnifying glass). I had to laugh when I see the torn out scraps of paper with one sentence scribbled out to make it appear genuine!!.
I don't think it is written in the Myanmar language either and are their signatures for real?
What I would do if I was the prosecutor is ask them to sign a piece of paper - I doubt that they (signatures) would look anything like what's written on the paper.
It is obvious to me that they did it.

Your probably right about the notes but to be honest it has not relevance to the case whatsoever..even if they did write the notes what would you expect them to say..And as for you saying it's obvious they did it..Have you not been reading the posts on this topic .Its only day 2 and without the defense saying anything I haven't heard or seen anything produced by the prosecutors to remotely suggest that they did it.In fact it's only gone to substantially confirm what most! have thought from virtually day one..I respect your rights to a opinion of course but question how you could arrive at it from what's been forthcoming in the last two days

Didnt it take 5 or 6 attempts to get this to go to court and now this nonsense. Did they just think the world press would be to busy to turn up?

They probably did after all the other stuff that's gone on in Thailand over the years..However this right from day one has had the media certainly in the UK really involved..I have been really heartened by the coverage on UK news channels ,it's been quite strong and consistent..it's quiet at the moment while the court case has been on but I am sure tonight it's all going to kick off after what's happened today.