Wingate

You're a funny little guy! "Law and Order" LOL! Let's see...set up a gallows to hang the sitting Vice President. Beat and injure 140 Capitol Police. What did Mr Law & Oder say on 6 January 2021: "We love you all very much." Then, when he gets elected again, he pardons those terrorists. 1984 is here in 2025.

Brendan Carr, the FCC Carnival Person who threatened ABC’s license over Kimmel’s hardly provocative comments, Tweeted back on 20 February 2020: “From internet memes to late-night comedians, from cartoons to plays and poems as old as organized government itself---Political Satire circumvents traditional gatekeepers & helps hold those in power accountable. Not surprising that it’s long been targeted for censorship. Shutting down this type of political speech---especially at the urging of those targeted or threatened by its message---would represent a serous threat to our freedoms.” Apparently Carr forgot the internet is forever.

Cute screen name. Did you plagiarize that from a 1st Grader?

Don’t read so much into comments. They do not necessarily reflect one’s overall attitude. It's just for amusement, parrying with fools. Personally, I think Trump is a vile, self-centered, weak, mendacious, miserable piece of excrement, the polar opposite of everything the country was hoped to be and against everything I believed when I served the country. Similarly, I think all of his supporters are either woefully ignorant, or just losers…save for the billionaires who likely think Trump is scum, but they want tax breaks and to stay out of jail. I do not hold back expressing that. None of that gets in the way of life’s enjoyment. I’ve gained secondary citizenship and have no intention of stepping foot in the US again until MAGA is flushed into the same sewer as McCarthyism. I won’t give up my US Passport, because doing so requires me to pay a silly tax on all assets over $5 million. I refuse to contribute to Trump’s grifting or his garish ballroom or his golf cheating habit. I’m fit, healthy, wealthy and live a life I know is infinitely better than the vast majority of humans, who have ever walked on this planet, got to enjoy. Of course I don’t suffer fools easily, and MAGAs are, in my opinion, fools. They do not even begin to understand real American ideals, the kind that the Founders, who knew quite well their own moral shortcomings, set the nation on an endless path to achieve. The US took many steps forward over the last 250 years and is currently taking some giant steps backwards. This, too, shall pass. Trump and MAGA will be viewed historically for the moral and intellectual emptiness that is their stock and trade.

If reality gets in the way of Trump's false narrative, erase history. Fascists do that. Ergo, Trump is a fascist. Until the Kirk killing, a report was on the Dept of Justice website detailing that the vast majority of political violence comes from the far right. That apparently was an inconvenient truth, so the day after the Kirk shooting, the report was removed. It didn't fir the narrative lie being promoted by the Administration. https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/fact-check-doj-removed-study-173600975.html Elsewhere, in an article on Bloomberg, it noted Trump has asked DoJ and FCC is he can pull broadcast licenses of any station or network that criticizes him, gentle snowflake that he is. Apparently Trump has decided Jefferson and Madison were wrong, and the US doesn't need free speech nor a free press, but rather lese majeste laws. We know from history that making jokes about Trump gets the FCC to threaten license removal of networks, while trying to hang the sitting Vice President of the United States gets you a pardon. Riddle me that, MAGAs. As for Kimmel, his monologue is available on line in its complete form. One had to be really a snowflake to find anything offensive, certainly not in a land up until now ruled by a Constitution containing the important 1st Amendment. And as for Kirk, here is a quite that suggests the guy wasn't exactly a saint. In fact, his "opinions" are infinitely more offensive that anything Kimmel or Colbert of anyone in media or press has ever said: “Joy Reid, Michelle Obama, Sheila Jackson Lee and Kentaji Brown Jackson … We know you do not have brain processing power to otherwise be taken seriously,” he said on The Charlie Kirk Show in a clip that resurfaced as his death. “You had to go steal a white person’s slot to be taken somewhat seriously.” I don't think a guy rejected by West Point, who briefly attended a community college, and never received a college degree is qualified to discuss anyone else's "brain processing power". He never demonstrated any sort of intellectual superiority. Would it be possible today, I'd be willing to pay to sit him in a room with Ms Obama and Brown Jackson and have all three take an IQ test. Kirk would come in 3rd.

Jimmy Kimmel Stephen Colbert Jon Stewart Bill Maher Richard Pryor Robin Williams Chris Rock John Oliver And here's the list of funny right wingers: ------ Of course MAGAs don't get it. Slapstick is about as sophisticated as they can get. Maybe fart jokes are high brow to them. Heck we even have someone here who thinks his screen name is funny because if one says it quickly, it sounds like a prurient word for a woman's body part. I bet he even thinks he's the first non-1st Grader to think of it.

MAGAs already own the racists, misogynists, white supremacists, Neo Nazis, Incels, QAnon and the poorly educated. Now they have assumed Cancel Culture. Kimmel did not act unctuously sycophantic enough, so he ran afoul of the new lack of free speech rights in the US. Yes, ABC is a private company not subject to free speech rights, but it’s abundantly clear they fear retribution from a non-free speech advocating government that has the power to pull FCC broadcast licenses. Kirk had opinions at odds with many people. He held views that could be considered racist and misogynistic. He was patronizing toward one half of the species, telling them how they should live….making babies rather than careers. Yes, he delivered his message in a polite way, but sugar doesn’t take away the sour taste. He is being treated as if he was the Second Coming, but his 3 days have passed and he hasn’t risen. One crazy guy is responsible for the murder. Try him, and if found guilty, punish him according to the law. MAGA has decided that the act of one crazed guy is the fault of everyone left of center. Of course MAGA would never accept responsibility for the slaughter of 27 Hispanics in a Walmart by a guy driven by the “murderers and rapists” hate speech of Trump, nor the slaughter of 11 people at a synagogue because a guy was upset they were aiding South American migrants, nor the 13 bombs sent to people Trump had called enemies, nor the target list of media and elected officials a guy who even used Trump-given nicknames made. MAGA = hypocrisy. I remember when Nancy Pelosi’s husband was literally hammered by a MAGA, Fox talking heads made jokes about it, and right wing podcasters kept noting an old Peter, Paul & Mary song. Another Fox talking head says homeless people should be euthanized. He still is on air, with no punishment for advocating murder. Funny, too, that trying to capture and hang the sitting Vice President (for doing his duty) is a pardonable offense, but not praising Kirk is a crime requiring cancellation. Beating 140 Capitol Police gets you an “I love you all” from Trump, and later a pardon, but Jimmy Kimmel has to go to the penalty box. Oh, and being a pedophile and groomer, trafficking underage girls for one’s boss, gets one not just a country club prison, but talk of a pardon…so long as she toes the line and doesn’t implicate Trump in any way. The US is becoming a rancid cesspool, the polar opposite of what the Founders intended. It is increasingly fascist, and even has Orwellian overtones of groupthink and thought crime. MAGAs are okay with that. Real American patriots are not.

It’s probably a good time to take a break for a week or so, as the rightist sanctimony and hypocrisy continues its unctuous drip, and they get to play the victim card….as if the right hasn’t slaughtered plenty of innocents. Heck, one rightist on this Forum called for counterrevolution. Molon Labe, Rambo. I knew nothing of him before the heinous murder, but in the few days since I have learned a lot about what he believed. No thanks. I appreciate that he spoke gently and met with people who opposed his view, but after getting a clearer understanding of what he advocated, I cannot help but think he was Andrew Tate, albeit with a better presentation. He gets lots of attention now, but in a month he’ll be forgotten. Kirk did not carry a message of peace so much as a message that all will be well if you adopt his political ideology, his social structure, and his superstitions regarding deities. He was no MLK, Jr., His “message” appealed primarily to MAGAs, who are generally less successful and accomplished, less educated and often never going to get a prom date. They need to be built up and to feel they belong to something outside of themselves, because individually they are not much of anything. He allowed white males in particular to valor steal by trying to take credit for what achievements other white males have made. He felt he was allowed to say what a female’s role should be (“having babies is more important than a career”), apparently unaware that equality means equality across genders. He once told fellow rightist Jack Prosobiec that if he saw a Black pilot, he would worry if the man was qualified. Apparently Kirk never heard of the Tuskeegee Airmen. Kirk was someone who feared and spoke of “replacement theory”, where non-whites would become the majority. Kirk argued against separation of church and State, calling it a misrepresentation. I don’t think he read Madison or Jefferson, and the US is not Christian, which is what he advocated. The USA was founded by secular humanists, most all of whom were atheists. There is a reason there is no mention of any deity in the US Constitution. The Founders wanted to build a nation built on logic, not fantasy or superstition. They specifically allowed all to believe as they wish, so long as the government does not impose any particular superstition on everyone. Best we not forget that, because the US is now home to a range of belief systems from those believing in millions of deities all the way to those believing in none, and certainly not the kind of White Jeebus Kirk seemed to fancy. Reading his statements, it seems the New Testament idea of loving thy neighbor as thyself, stopped at the southern border and primarily with white males. In the book Kirk supposedly followed, John writes: “But if anyone has the world's goods and sees his brother in need, yet closes his heart against him, how does God's love abide in him?” No mention or caveat saying, “Unless they’re migrants or Blacks” It’s a bit curious also---and this is not Kirk’s fault---that the US Taxpayer had to pay so that Air Force 2 could carry his remains to AZ, at a time when the US decided it cannot give food or medicine to starving and sick children. DOGE cut foreign aid. Somehow, though, there’s money to carry a podcaster on AF2. In a few posts I have noted a few of the many instances of rightist violence against innocent people, but that has been met with derision and thumbs down. I call that hypocrisy. I just wanted to see how honest the right is, and I was left wanting. Honesty is not a trait common on the right. Hypocrisy is their bread and butter. Also, if there is one single person most responsible for the division in the US and the hate directed toward innocent people, it is Donald Trump. Even at the moment of tragedy, Trump chose to take the low road and attack “deranged radical leftists”. That is in stark contrast to not only the words coming from other living Presidents, but in particular to what Bush II did after 9-11, when anger directed toward innocent Moslems could have gotten out of hand. Bush not only visited a mosque, but he had a very ecumenical memorial ceremony at the National Cathedral, which included an iman. Trump inspired people to shoot Hispanics, Jews aiding South American migrants, send bombs to people Trump specifically noted as enemies, make death threats against judges and public officials, even resulting in the killing of a judge’s son. Trump absolutely fomented the 6 Jan 2021 terrorist attack (FBI Dir Christopher Wray’s term) against the Capitol and threatening to kill Trump’s own VP for simply doing the VP’s job. So let's not foist all society's ills onto the far left, when it is the cirrent mainstream right most responsible for hate, division and violence.

Go look in the mirror or go grow up. Maybe both. Who is the fount of all the "deranged" and "murderers and rapists" and "s-hole countries" ? Your messiah and cult leader. Look at the political hate crimes where the criminal was caught. Patrick Crusius shot 49 Hispanics and killed 27 after listening to Trump for years. Robert Bowers slaughtered 11 people in a synagogue because he heard that place of worship was aiding South and Central American migrants...you know, those "rapists and murderers". Cesar Sayoc, a guy whose van was plastered with Trump images and slogans, sent bombs to 13 people Trump had called enemies. Christopher Hansson built a spreadsheet of people he planned to assassinate, using the nicknames Trump had given them, like Pocahontas and Pencil Neck (for Sens Warren and Schiff. Edgar Welch drove from North Carolina to DC to shoot up a pizza parlor because the right wing lunatics claimed that's where Hillary ran an international pedophile ring....in the basement of a shop that had no basement. IN a report issued during Trump's first term, the FBI and Homeland Security noted that 75% of all terrorist acts since 9-11 were carried out by right wingers, white supremacists and Neo Nazis, none of whom is progressive. Contrast Trump's response to the heinous killing of Kirk vs how George Bush II handled things after 9-11. Trump blames Democrats, even before the killer is caught. Bush not only visited a mosque to diffuse hate and anger against Moslems, he had an Imam speak at the memorial service at the National Cathedral. There is hate on both sides, but history shows much more not only on the right, but much of it in the last decade fomented by Trump. Perhaps you missed the beating of 143 police at the Capitol on 6 Jan 2021 after Trump called them to DC ("It'll be WILD !", he tweeted) and told them to march to the Capitol. Even his former VP---a man the terrorists threatened to hand and set up a gallows to do so---said Trump bears responsibility. Go ahead and thumbs down this, because you cannot refute it. Weak.

Looking at the new images of the suspect, his shirt suggests he's rather pro-gun. I did read a few stories last week that said the far right gun types were outraged that anybody would talk about banning even trans people from owning guns. They view any restriction---trans, wifebeaters, felons---as the first step toward confiscation. A predominant community in the State of Utah has many people rabidly pro-2nd Amendment. Even the NRA came out against banning trans gun ownership. Let's wait until the killer is caught and see what his motivations and ideology actually are, rather than make assumptions that it had to be someone on the left. The US is home to all sorts of crazies on both sides of the political spectrum, particularly at the extremes.

On Fox a couple of their talking heads made a joke about it. I read at the time some right wing podcasters were bringing up the 1960's Peter, Paul & Mary hit song. There are disgusting people on both sides of the political spectrum. Honesty demands we admit that.

There’s a lot of self-righteousness and sanctimony here, where folks are claiming progressives are rejoicing about this guy’s demise. Well, I’m not one who spends any amount of time in the fever swamps of the far right, so I barely knew who he was. That’s probably how most non-rightists view him, if they even heard of him. I’d seen his name, but nothing made me curious enough to read articles about whatever it was he did or said. If I had been shown two pictures of guys on Tuesday, asking me to pick out Charlie Kirk, I would have had a 50% chance of guessing right. If told he made his name as a country singer or starred on The Real Housewives of Little Rock, I’d have had no reason to disbelieve. I had no ill will toward him nor did I rejoice over his demise, because he meant nothing to me. I think his killing is horrific, but otherwise my concern is that some people will use this as an excuse to gun down others. Since it’s America, I suspect somebody will.

Who would that be? Has his or her name been in the papers? I hope you're right, but I don't see it. Any hints? Don't leave us in suspense!

Like our truck driver friend, it seems you have no clue what the term "Marxist" means. Most, if not all of us, rather like Capitalism and what it can provide for those with a combination of skill, effort and dumb luck. As for whether Trump is in better health than anyone, I'm off to the gym shortly. Do you think Trump can do 35 dips and bench 340 lbs? All natty, too? I'm up for the challenge, should you have the "fit" guy on your Rolodex. Or you can be his surrogate, carrying the freak flag for all of MAGAstan. What'chu got, boy?

Well, fella, it isn't one photo. There are dozens of photos from yesterday at the Pentagon all showing his right side sinking and his eyes looking almost catatonic. Here's my Nostradamus: one of the most search terms over the next 3 days will be Bell's Palsy. Bell's is not so serious, but coupled with his cankles and obvious cognitive decline ("I stopped that"---the 1994 Rwandan Genocide, plus a host of other gaffes), the fat old guy doesn't look long for this world. He would be wise to open his Christmas presents now.

If the perp is going to be caught, authorities must be ready to turn over every stone. I’m not sure there are still any true professionals in the FBI, people who will consider any and all possibilities. The "loyalty test" drove out many who thought the Constitution, not an individual, is the law of the land. For example, after the recent school shooting, comments were made about banning trans people from gun ownership. Those most outraged by that idea were not trans people, but 2nd Amendment types, who see any restriction as an attack on what they view as the most important Amendment in the Constitution. Message boards favored by the gun community should be checked for comments suggesting violence against anyone suggesting any ban on gun ownership, even trans ownership. Check them out yourself. Gun rights types were apoplectic. The gunman was no casual gun owner. The shot wasn’t from a great distance (130 meters), but Kirk was under a covering and moving irregularly in order to address a crowd who sat almost circular to him. The obvious answer is that the perp is a progressive, but the obvious answer isn’t always the correct one.

Without bees, there is no life on Earth, save for lichen and bacteria. Without progressives and Blue State tax remittances, there is no functioning Federal Govt.

Curious what he's getting done. It seems the people around him are doing stuff, but little is coming from him. Well, he did ruin the Rose Garden with cement, so I guess that's something. As for "freeze frame", that right side mouth drop is not something that just happens. It does look like Bell's Palsy.

"You guys"? We're a collective? A hive? Like the Borg? BTW, Kirk has been dead for 1 day. It's maybe a little early to say his influence is stronger in death than alive. The attention span of today's public is about 3 seconds or the length of a TikTok video. Six months from now people won't know him from Captain Kirk or Kirk Cameron or Dunkirk. Also, you don't even know yet who or why he was killed. Neither I nor any of the progressive posters on this board shot him, so the "you guys" thing is a little silly. A thorough investigation of the possible killer also has to include those people so supportive of the Second Amendment that they went apoplectic last week after the Administration suggested banning trans people from owning guns. The real 2nd Amendment diehards---who are NOT progressives---were going crazy on web boards at ANY limitation of rights, whether for trans people, people convicted of domestic violence, even convicted felons like Trump. They think any ban is the first step to confiscation. To make the shot, when Kirk was under a covering and moving randomly to address the crowd who sat circular around him, indicates someone with pretty good familiarity with a small bolt-action rifle. I don't know for a fact, but I suspect trans folks primary hobby is not guns. Could be wrong. Let LE do a thorough investigation before you both condemn all progressives and beatify Kirk.

The rightists have all declared with certainty that it was a leftist and skilled sniper who carried out this heinous crime. If it was a left-leaning person killed, Alex Jones and others would be screaming "false flag". They are not now. Kirk alienated a lot of people in his career, from progressives to migrants to Moslems to Mormons to anybody who wasn't a rightist Christian. There are crazies in every demographic. Perhaps we all let law enforcement do its job before deciding who and why.

Perhaps you can name an outspoken progressive who hasn't received death threats? I have received email death threats because I was on a hacked contact list of a former senior member of the Obama Administration. You might want to grow up and accept there are bad people on both sides of the political spectrum.

Because it’s America, where violence begets more violence, it’s a sad bet there will be more shootings in the next week or two. Will we see the same outrage from the right when it’s a progressive news person or talk show host or podcaster or politician? We have a guy on this site---who has admitted he’s old and obese---calling for a 'counterrevolution', whatever that means. Okay, you first, Rambo. Rather than try to calm things and bring sides together, Trump is going off on his usual 'deranged' Dem rants. I recall when Speaker Pelosi’s husband was beaten with a hammer by a MAGA, a couple people on Fox made jokes about it. Right wing podcasters spoke of an old Peter, Paul & Mary song from the 1960s. I've already noted the vast difference in rightist (lack of) outrage when a Trumper slaughters innocents, or tries to do so. People directly radicalized and inspired by Trump---like the El Paso murderer, the Pittsburgh synagogue murderer, and the guy who sent bombs to people Trump specifically named as enemies---do not result in the same rightist outrage or calls for 'counterevolution'. That's called hypocrisy. Let's not forget Trump pardoned the people who wanted to hang his own Vice President, and wants a military funeral for a terrorist who attacked the Capitol. I also recall a different Republican President, after the attacks occurring 24 years ago today, trying to calm things by visiting a mosque. THAT is how to lay blame only where it belongs, plus try to get in the way of any revenge killings of innocents. For all the criticism Bush II might have gotten for some of his actions, he has infinitely more class than Trump will ever have.

The reality is there has been far more hateful rhetoric spewing from not only the right, but from Trump himself. What? Too soon? Isn't that the republican line? We have a poster here calling for a counterrevolution because of this one crime, when it isn't even known whom or why the perp did it. In the cases I noted, the motivation and inspiration was clear, at least for Sayoc, Crusius, Bowers and Hansson: Trump. That poster did not call for anything---either counterrevolution or changes in gun laws---after El Paso, Pittsburgh, Uvalde, Sunderland, Orlando, Parkland, or the bombs sent by Sayoc or the targets like "Pocahontas" of Hansson. I'm waiting for Trump's usual tag line: "We have to just move on", as he said after the Uvalde School shooting (17 kids, 2 teachers) and the Ohio school shooting (2 kids killed). To toss in another inconsistency and dollop of hypocrisy, the same posters here justifying the killing of tens of thousands of kids in Gaza are up in arms over this killing. Somehow I doubt the strength of their moral fiber. Are not ALL innocent deaths bad? Or does ethnicity obviate innocence? Let's be consistent. Violence perpetrated by any political ideology is evil. Killing of any innocents is bad. Let's catch the perp and prosecute.

Perhaps you posted it under another name, but I don't recall you posting "Rightist scum" after: Patrick Crusius Robert Bowers Cesar Sayoc Christopher Hansson If you did, I stand corrected. If you did not, ask yourself why.

It seems that in their haste to put all violence on the backs of those who vote Democrat, some people forget. As a reminder: Michael Estes, Curtis Allen, Gavin Wright, Patrick Stein, Adam Purinton, Jeremy Christian, Wade Page, Edgar Welch, Sam Woodward, James Fields, Dylann Roof, Robert Bowers, Ian David Long, Cesar Sayoc, Gregory Bush, Stephen Paddock, Christopher Hansson, Patrick Crusius Robert Bowers carried out his slaughter at a synagogue that had a reputation of aiding migrants. I wonder who radicalized him with regard to people from south of the border? The right's response was "thoughts and prayers". Edgar Welch shot up a basement-less pizza parlor in DC, after right wingers insisted it was Ground Zero for Hillary's international pedophile ring (sic). The right's response was "thoughts and prayers". Cesar Sayoc, who drove a van peppered with images his "favorite President", sent bombs to more than a dozen people, every single one of whom had been named by Trump as an enemy of some sort. The right's response was "thoughts and prayers". Patrick Crusius walked into a Walmart in El Paso and killed people who looked Hispanic....you know, those "rapists and murderers invading our once great country". The right's response was "thoughts and prayers". Christopher Hansson, a person fortunately caught before he could begin his killing, was found to have a spreadsheet of those he intended to assassinate, and he used nicknames for his targets, such as Pocahontas. Now who came up with that nickname for Sen Warren? The right's response was "thoughts and prayers". Now Kirk is dead. The right's response is outrage and "those bad lefties". Or the guy I quoted, "Its time for the counterevolution." We don't yet know if this killer was a Dem or Rep (if it's a Trumper, GUARANTEED the narrative will change to "just a crazy guy"), but the amount of violence starting not only on the right, but INSPIRED BY TRUMP, dwarfs what the so-called left is doing. Bad is bad. Evil is evil.