Seeking favours, Trump asked Ukraine president to investigate Biden

[BobBKK]

Just now, spidermike007 said:

There is no doubt that Trump feels he is above the law. This is not a witch hunt. This is an integrity hunt. Does the man possess any? I do not think so. It is clear he attempted to interfere with an election, once again. He is incapable of learning, and clearly feel that he is "untouchable". We shall see. I believe he is going down and will suffer a massive drubbing in the next election. 

But you don't mind Bidens son selling his company for $3m and getting a seat on the board (when he has ZERO Ukraine experience). Then that company gets investigated and Biden boats he got the prosecutor fired?  that's all 'ok'? Trump is right to ask questions - I see nothing in that phone call.  Dems fail at the Russia thing, fail at the Muller thing and will try any tactic but this one was born to FAIL as they don't have the votes.

[Katipo]

2 hours ago, TopDeadSenter said:

My understanding of this latest smear and muck-fling against Trump might be limited, but from what I can gather. Biden's son is gifted a plummy job working for a Ukrainian company paying an insanely high salary. The company he works for gets investigated for dodgy activities. Biden sr as US vice President threatens witholding a 1 Billion dollar loan guarantee to the Ukraine until the prosecutor in the case is removed. And now we are somehow bashing Trump for this!?! 

 

 This is just another spectacular own goal, unless I am really missing something?

It's interesting, because depending on which websites you go to, you get different interpretations. The right going one way, and the left the other. The left leaning say that the prosecutor had been a target for removal from western nations and within the Ukraine for quite some time. That Biden did nothing wrong. One can't ignore that his son Hunter was involved however, and this certainly looks like a conflict of interest. The truth is that politicians on both sides will be manipulating the 'facts' to serve their agenda. Biden's actions certainly look dirty to me, but at the same time Trump shouldn't have then kind of done the same thing with his phone calls and holding funding. So how would you like your crooked politician, poached or scrambled?

[BobBKK]

Just now, Katipo said:

It's interesting, because depending on which websites you go to, you get different interpretations. The right going one way, and the left the other. The left leaning say that the prosecutor had been a target for removal from western nations and within the Ukraine for quite some time. That Biden did nothing wrong. One can't ignore that his son Hunter was involved however, and this certainly looks like a conflict of interest. The truth is that politicians on both sides will be manipulating the 'facts' to serve their agenda. Biden's actions certainly look dirty to me, but at the same time Trump shouldn't have then kind of done the same thing with his phone calls and holding funding. So how would you like your crooked politician, poached or scrambled?

The fact IS he sold his 'equity company' for $3m and the prosecutor investigated and Biden visited and he got fired. When public prosecutors get fired one should be very concerned. What experience did Daddy's son have in Ukraine?  speaks the language maybe? any other connection, besides his Dad?  don't think so. 

[bristolboy]

10 minutes ago, Katipo said:

It's interesting, because depending on which websites you go to, you get different interpretations. The right going one way, and the left the other. The left leaning say that the prosecutor had been a target for removal from western nations and within the Ukraine for quite some time. That Biden did nothing wrong. One can't ignore that his son Hunter was involved however, and this certainly looks like a conflict of interest. The truth is that politicians on both sides will be manipulating the 'facts' to serve their agenda. Biden's actions certainly look dirty to me, but at the same time Trump shouldn't have then kind of done the same thing with his phone calls and holding funding. So how would you like your crooked politician, poached or scrambled?

Who do Biden's actions look dirty? He was carrying out US policy? Which agreed with EU policy and most liberal democracies. What's more the prosecutor wasn't even investigating Burisma, the company Hunter Biden worked for. Much less investigating Hunter Biden.

[BobBKK]

Just now, bristolboy said:

Who do Biden's actions look dirty? He was carrying out US policy? Which agreed with EU policy and most liberal democracies. What's more the prosecutor wasn't even investigating Burisma, the company Hunter Biden worked for. Much less investigating Hunter Biden.

Oh it's just coincidence that Hunter sold his company to a Ukrainian company? right... right...  what if Trumps son had sold a company to a Russian company you think that's ok?  pure hypocrisy 

[Silurian]

21 minutes ago, BobBKK said:

But you don't mind Bidens son selling his company for $3m and getting a seat on the board (when he has ZERO Ukraine experience). Then that company gets investigated and Biden boats he got the prosecutor fired?  that's all 'ok'?

 

Incorrect and misrepresented. Please show where this is true?

 

In fact, per Daria Kaleniuk, executive director of Ukraine's Anti-Corruption Action Center...

 

Quote

"Shokin was not investigating. He didn't want to investigate Burisma," Daria Kaleniuk, executive director of Ukraine's Anti-Corruption Action Center, told the Washington Post for a July article. "And Shokin was fired not because he wanted to do that investigation, but quite to the contrary, because he failed that investigation."

 

[Tug]

54 minutes ago, CaptRon2 said:

Haha,  looks to me like the only news here is the Democrats just threw Biden under the bus and reassured Presidents Trumps re-election. In my opinion  Biden will be lucky to get out of this without jail time. Maybe with a little luck he can share a cell with his drug addict son.

Do you really think Warren has a chance against President Trump? Many thanks to Nancy for caving to AOC and once against launching another witch hunt, another week, another nothing burger from the left. Bye Bye Joe!

So you think it’s ok for a united states president to extort a country fearing dare I say experiencing a foreign invasion by a hostile foreign power that interfered in our election for help against a political foe?thats text book corruption no I think it’s your Donald that will be cellmates with his campaign manager lol

[Chomper Higgot]

2 hours ago, stevenl said:

IMO not much in the transcript, far from enough for an impeachment.

 

But still wondering about the IG complaint deemed 'credible and urgent' and the WH stonewalling, so I have the feeling there is more to it than has been released at the moment.

The summary is not a transcript.

 

The transcript has yet to be released

[mtls2005]

10 minutes ago, BobBKK said:

what if Trumps son had sold a company to a Russian company you think that's ok?  pure hypocrisy 

“So when I got in the cart with Eric,” Dodson says, “as we were setting off, I said, ‘Eric, who’s funding? I know no banks—because of the recession, the Great Recession—have touched a golf course. You know, no one’s funding any kind of golf construction. It’s dead in the water the last four or five years.’ And this is what he said. He said, ‘Well, we don’t rely on American banks. We have all the funding we need out of Russia.’ I said, ‘Really?’ And he said, ‘Oh, yeah. We’ve got some guys that really, really love golf, and they’re really invested in our programs. We just go there all the time.’ Now that was three years ago, so it was pretty interesting.”

 

 

When whataboutism whips around and smacks you in the nose.

[Katipo]

13 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Who do Biden's actions look dirty? He was carrying out US policy? Which agreed with EU policy and most liberal democracies. What's more the prosecutor wasn't even investigating Burisma, the company Hunter Biden worked for. Much less investigating Hunter Biden.

As I said, depends what you read. To me, Biden's actions, the resulting, firing, and of course the timing of everything, looks very suspicious, regardless of what might end of in the press. At the same time, Trump's actions are dodgy as too. Read the other reply to my comment, that takes the opposite angle to you. There in lies one of the biggest problems in US politics today.

[Katipo]

18 minutes ago, BobBKK said:

The fact IS he sold his 'equity company' for $3m and the prosecutor investigated and Biden visited and he got fired. When public prosecutors get fired one should be very concerned. What experience did Daddy's son have in Ukraine?  speaks the language maybe? any other connection, besides his Dad?  don't think so. 

Not disagreeing. But also stating that I think Trump is dodgy too. Two wrongs don't make a right so to speak. And you'll find people in this forum who take both sides.... the problem as I see it, not enough people in the middle.

[bristolboy]

13 minutes ago, BobBKK said:

Oh it's just coincidence that Hunter sold his company to a Ukrainian company? right... right...  what if Trumps son had sold a company to a Russian company you think that's ok?  pure hypocrisy 

That isn't the point. There would only be an issue if there as any evidence that Biden had personally taken action to further that purchase. There isn't any. Nothing. Nada. 0

[bristolboy]

1 minute ago, Katipo said:

Not disagreeing. But also stating that I think Trump is dodgy too. Two wrongs don't make a right so to speak. And you'll find people in this forum who take both sides.... the problem as I see it, not enough people in the middle.

No. That's false equivalence. There is no evidence that Biden intervened on his son's behalf. But it's clear that Trump intervened to damage a political opponent. An opponent he saw as the strongest at the time.

[heybruce]

3 hours ago, TopDeadSenter said:

My understanding of this latest smear and muck-fling against Trump might be limited, but from what I can gather. Biden's son is gifted a plummy job working for a Ukrainian company paying an insanely high salary. The company he works for gets investigated for dodgy activities. Biden sr as US vice President threatens witholding a 1 Billion dollar loan guarantee to the Ukraine until the prosecutor in the case is removed. And now we are somehow bashing Trump for this!?! 

 

 This is just another spectacular own goal, unless I am really missing something?

You are correct; your understanding is limited and you are missing a lot.

 

The US and a number of other countries wanted Ukraine to crack down on corruption before giving it a $1 billion loan, and the Ukrainian prosecutor was seen as lax on corruption.  The company Biden's son was working on was not under active investigation at the time.

 

When the President of Ukraine asked Trump about military sales to Ukraine, Trump responded by asking the President of Ukraine to come up with evidence for this discredited conspiracy theory.

 

Does that help your understanding?

[Saint Nick]

3 hours ago, stevenl said:

IMO not much in the transcript, far from enough for an impeachment.

 

But still wondering about the IG complaint deemed 'credible and urgent' and the WH stonewalling, so I have the feeling there is more to it than has been released at the moment.

Except for -as I understand it- it is not a transcript, but merely a summary!

Certain parts are missing from the conversation and some political pundits in the US think, even what is left in there, is damning enough!

[mtls2005]

Norway calling...

 

 

[heybruce]

46 minutes ago, BobBKK said:

But you don't mind Bidens son selling his company for $3m and getting a seat on the board (when he has ZERO Ukraine experience). Then that company gets investigated and Biden boats he got the prosecutor fired?  that's all 'ok'? Trump is right to ask questions - I see nothing in that phone call.  Dems fail at the Russia thing, fail at the Muller thing and will try any tactic but this one was born to FAIL as they don't have the votes.

 

39 minutes ago, BobBKK said:

The fact IS he sold his 'equity company' for $3m and the prosecutor investigated and Biden visited and he got fired. When public prosecutors get fired one should be very concerned. What experience did Daddy's son have in Ukraine?  speaks the language maybe? any other connection, besides his Dad?  don't think so. 

 

31 minutes ago, BobBKK said:

Oh it's just coincidence that Hunter sold his company to a Ukrainian company? right... right...  what if Trumps son had sold a company to a Russian company you think that's ok?  pure hypocrisy 

Why don't you provide some details about this company you keep claiming Hunter Biden sold.

 

Regarding the rest, Joe Biden was carrying out US policy when he pressed for the firing of an ineffective, if not totally corrupt, prosecutor.  A number of western countries wanted him fired. 

 

If you want to investigate something suspicious, how about Trump running a "let's be friends with Russia" campaign while negotiating a real estate deal in Moscow?

[mtls2005]

"I'm just a country lawyer".

 

Yeah, which country?

 

 

[Saint Nick]

To BOBBKK and BON MEE and all the other Trump - fans: this is not about the son of a former vice- president!

This is about Trump!

This is about the political wrongdoings of a sitting US- president!

If we want to do whataboutisms, you better don't start with "...but... but...but...Biden's son"!

Does the name Ivanka ring a bell? 

[CaptRon2]

46 minutes ago, Saint Nick said:

Except for -as I understand it- it is not a transcript, but merely a summary!

Certain parts are missing from the conversation and some political pundits in the US think, even what is left in there, is damning enough!

And of course you have a reference to support this statement, or is it just an opinion? 

[spidermike007]

If there is one thing Trump has given us, it is perspective. He has made Richard Nixon look like a fairly noble and honorable man. And he makes Clinton look like a man of truth. Who would have ever thought that possible?

[Srikcir]

1 hour ago, Silurian said:

 

Not only the US but the EU and the IMF were trying to get rid of Shokin. The reason they wanted Shokin gone is that he was corrupt and appeared to be hindering corruption investigations.

 

Fact check: What Trump has been getting wrong on Biden and Ukraine

 

 

 

I'd add further that the new Ukraine prosecutor Lutsenko in May 2019 said that he had no evidence of wrongdoing by U.S. Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden or his son.

• "I do not want Ukraine to again be the subject of U.S. presidential elections," Lutsenko said in an interview Tuesday in his office in Kyiv. "Hunter Biden did not violate any Ukrainian laws -- at least as of now, we do not see any wrongdoing. A company can pay however much it wants to its board." He said if there is a tax problem, it's not in Ukraine. https://www.unian.info/politics/10552464-top-prosecutor-lutsenko-says-no-evidence-of-wrongdoing-by-bidens-in-ukraine-media.html

[Tug]

Whistle blower report will be released tomorrow there will be some redactions the plot thickens ehh

[Jingthing]

The main problem is in the Senate,  Republicans have a 53% majority who are all "followers" of POTUS. 
So impeachment is a waste of time, the Senate will never ratify impeachment against their "leader"

You're assuming there is nothing good that can come from impeachment without conviction and the trouble with that is there isn't one person on the planet that knows that will be so. For democrats pursuing impeachment was a risk but given the weight of the evidence so was not impeaching. In my view democrats just upped their stock significantly by doing the right thing regardless of fear of political risk.

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[CaptRon2]

1 hour ago, Tug said:

So you think it’s ok for a united states president to extort a country fearing dare I say experiencing a foreign invasion by a hostile foreign power that interfered in our election for help against a political foe?thats text book corruption no I think it’s your Donald that will be cellmates with his campaign manager lol

Apparently your reading skills need a little improvement, where in my post did I make any such statement or imply any acceptance of corruption on any level?

Are you actually misrepresenting my post and lying about what I said? You have once again disgraced yourself with yet another untrue post, if you had  any decency at all you would  be ashamed of yourself but I doubt you have the moral substance to even realize how despicable your post is and how bad your tactics are.

[Jingthing]

"trump" is calling this another hoax. How stupid does he think Americans are? I can understand trying to defend what he did as anyone accused deserves that but we already know he did it. In fact he has admitted it.

 

Of course he won't lose his hard core base no matter what so the hoax thing is for their benefit. He's betting they are that stupid and indeed revel in his gross lawlessness.

 

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[Rimmer]

An inflammatory post has been removed

[rudi49jr]

3 hours ago, PremiumLane said:

Trump supporters sound like cultist. Even with evidence of his wrongdoing right in front of you, you deny it.

It’s like Trump predicted himself: his supporters won’t give two hoots if he shoots someone in the middle of the street, they will still support him, no matter what despicable thing he does. Trump is not the president of America, he is the president of his base first and foremost. 

[Srikcir]

Either overlooked or ignored is the fact that Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy announced at a conference that the United States had released $250 million in military aid – with an additional $140 million on top of that sum. http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/support-ukraine-extra-140-million-draws-scrutiny

NBC News’ Chuck Todd asked Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin where the extra $140 million came from. From the transcript:

• MNUCHIN: Well, it was appropriated money that came through the State Department.
• TODD: [Ukrainians] didn’t know they were getting this money. Is there any indication why they got the money when they did?
• MNUCHIN: I’m not sure it’s correct for you to say they didn’t know they got the money. –
• TODD: The president said he was surprised to get it. The president of Ukraine said he was surprised to get an additional $140 million. He said it was a pleasant surprise but that he was surprised.
• MNUCHIN: I think he was referring to his expectations, as opposed to necessarily a surprise. But you’re getting into details.

"When you are waiting for $250m have the possibility to get $390m, I like this sort of relationship,” said Mr Zelensky.  https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-ukraine-joe-biden-military-aid-zelensky-kiev-a9111106.html

Might Trump have thought that he was able to get Zelensky's cooperation to investigate the Bidens and decided to kick in a little "hush" money? Being outside of the congressional approved funding for Ukraine it was essentially unaccountable or treated as part of an unofficial  slush fund. Remember that Trump and Pompeo had been slashing the State Department funding up to 30% - but now it has $140 million to spare? Thankfully, Zelensky disclosed the additional $140 million so if Trump was intended it as hush money - that didn't work.

[Tug]

12 minutes ago, CaptRon2 said:

Apparently your reading skills need a little improvement, where in my post did I make any such statement or imply any acceptance of corruption on any level?

Are you actually misrepresenting my post and lying about what I said? You have once again disgraced yourself with yet another untrue post, if you had  any decency at all you would  be ashamed of yourself but I doubt you have the moral substance to even realize how despicable your post is and how bad your tactics are.

Oh my reading is fine lol and I have a wonderfull 35 year marriage with a beautiful family I’ve worked hard all my life and never been a drag on anybody sleep real good cause I have good morals so nope no shame whatsoever lol sorry your boys in trouble lol