Extension experience at Chiang Mai today

[jeffandgop]

On 4/22/2020 at 7:54 PM, Peter Denis said:

When being married to a thai national, you could apply for the 1-year extension based on your original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of MARRIAGE.

When doing so the thai IO-approved health-insurance is not required, and also the required financials are way lower than applying for reason of RETIREMENT. 

When it turns out that your present health-insurance is not thai IO-approved, you could thus applying for reason of marriage, or alternatively exit Thailand (necessary to kill the permission to stay of your present Non Imm O-A Visa) and then apply for a Non Imm O Visa for reason of retirement or for reason of marriage.  That application can be done either in a thai embassy/consulate in your home-country or a neighboring country, and it can also be done in-country at your local IO.

>> I did PM you a comprehensive guideline document outlining all options/details to apply for or convert to a Non Imm O - retirement Visa (and subsequent 1-year extensions).

It only addresses the 'retirement' option, but the process steps are similar when applying for reason of marriage (typically the financial requirements are way lower, but the requirements to provide evidence that you are still married to a thai national are somewhat of a hassle).

 

I'm going to CM Imm to do exactly that- after years of extensions of stay based on retirement (O-A Visa), I'm applying to extend on the basis of marriage..following Peter's details and a visit my wife & I made to Imm back in Jan.....

[Mamasun]

OmG what is that again ?  some months ago i read that insurance was only for the NEW OA visa request abroad....!!!!

 

And now ? doest it mean that ALL retirement extension need to have health insurance ?

 

 

[Peter Denis]

49 minutes ago, Mamasun said:

OmG what is that again ?  some months ago i read that insurance was only for the NEW OA visa request abroad....!!!!

And now ? doest it mean that ALL retirement extension need to have health insurance ?

Yes, a thai IO-approved health-insurance policy is mandatory when applying for the 1-year extension of your original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.

[Mamasun]

1 hour ago, Peter Denis said:

Yes, a thai IO-approved health-insurance policy is mandatory when applying for the 1-year extension of your original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.

An OA visa,,is a visa you obtain abroad in a Thai Ambassy...you have also O retirement base on an initial extension of stay via of a tourist visa !!!

 

So can someone confirm ,that all kind of retirement extension need an insurance ???

[ubonjoe]

8 minutes ago, Mamasun said:

So can someone confirm ,that all kind of retirement extension need an insurance ???

Only those that have been extending a entry from a Non-OA visa has to have insurance.

Those that entered on a Non-O visa or got one at immigration do not need insuarance.

[DrJack54]

35 minutes ago, Mamasun said:

An OA visa,,is a visa you obtain abroad in a Thai Ambassy...you have also O retirement base on an initial extension of stay via of a tourist visa !!!

 

So can someone confirm ,that all kind of retirement extension need an insurance ???

A non O-A is obtained in your own country. It has different requirements to a non-O (retirement). In fact many home countries do not issue the latter. Non o often obtained in nearby consulates.

Only extensions for folk that originally had an non O-A require insurance. 

 

[Mamasun]

I don't find anything relative to this subject on Immigration pages !

 

https://www.immigration.go.th/content/service_22

 

 

http://www.thaiembassy.org/wellington/th/news/1110/110441-Mandatory-health-insurance-requirement-for-retirem.html

 

 

How do they know you have apply for an OA after 15 years and 3 passeports ? the OA expire after 18 months ( I think) then you are elligible for an non O extension....??

Edited April 24, 2020 by Mamasun
ajout

[ubonjoe]

28 minutes ago, Mamasun said:

How do they know you have apply for an OA after 15 years and 3 passeports ? the OA expire after 18 months ( I think) then you are elligible for an non O extension....??

By looking at the big stamp on the first visa page of your newest passport that has info about the original visa you you used for entry to the country long ago.

[Mamasun]

I think its a miss understanding...they say for those with an OA visa

 

NOt for extension !!!

 

https://www.immigration.go.th/read?content_id=5d9c3b074d8a8f318362a8aa&fbclid=IwAR39UI_zBxVLedZKgZeAeYnvb0yyyIsr6SHPhnq64ohzACO7VsLUU_LlGn0

[Peter Denis]

18 minutes ago, Mamasun said:

I don't find anything relative to this subject on Immigration pages !

 

https://www.immigration.go.th/content/service_22

 

How do they know you have apply for an OA after 15 years and 3 passeports ? the OA expire after 18 months ( I think) then you are elligible for an non O extension....??

The requirements when applying for a 1-year extension of stay of a Non Imm O - retirement Visa are the same as for a 1-year extension based on an original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.

The only difference being that when extending your permission to stay on the basis of an original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement also a thai IO-approved health-insurance policy is required.  This requirement is addressed in the attached PoliceOrder effective October 31, 2019.

= = =

When you entered on the Non Imm O-A Visa which you acquired 15 years ago in your home-country, you were provided with a 1-year permission to stay on entry. 

If you entered on a Non Imm O - retirement Visa, you were only provided a 90-day permission to stay on entry. 

You can also look in the first pages of your present passport, because IO writes the Visa category on which the permission to stay was based from your old passport, over into your new passport.

1511398266_InsuranceO-AVisaNewPoliceOrder.pdf

[Mamasun]

5 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

The requirements when applying for a 1-year extension of stay of a Non Imm O - retirement Visa are the same as for a 1-year extension based on an original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.

The only difference being that when extending your permission to stay on the basis of an original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement also a thai IO-approved health-insurance policy is required.  This requirement is addressed in the attached PoliceOrder effective October 31, 2019.

= = =

When you entered on the Non Imm O-A Visa which you acquired 15 years ago in your home-country, you were provided with a 1-year permission to stay on entry. 

If you entered on a Non Imm O - retirement Visa, you were only provided a 90-day permission to stay on entry. 

You can also look in the first pages of your present passport, because IO writes the Visa category on which the permission to stay was based from your old passport, over into your new passport.

1511398266_InsuranceO-AVisaNewPoliceOrder.pdf 1.87 MB · 0 downloads

YEs I have it ....again it is writing VISA OA .    Not extension of stay base on ...because me I don't have anymore visa. I just have an ; NON O extension,

[Peter Denis]

Just now, Mamasun said:

YEs I have it ....again it is writing VISA OA .    Not extension of stay base on ...because me I don't have anymore visa. I just have an ; NON O extension,

If it says in your passport on the first page that the last permission to stay from your previous passport was based on a Non Imm O-A Visa, and you have been continuously applying for 1-year extensions based on that original Non Imm O-A Visa for years, you will now be required to also meet the thai IO-approved health-insurance requirement (when you apply for reason of RETIREMENT).

But if you acquired a Non Imm O Visa in your home-country, a neighboring country or in Thailand, and you have been applying for 1-year extensions of that original Non Imm O Visa, the health-insurance requirement is not applicable for you.

>> If you are in doubt about what original Visa you entered Thailand with and which you have been extending yearly just post a scan of the first page of your passport with your personal details erased.

[Mamasun]

All this doesn't ring right for me....such a non sens...how people of 70 or 80 years old can get insure here ? so it mean if all those people who have built their lives here ..have a house ect...suddenly they need to go out and leave Thailand ???

Sorry I don't believe it ! 

 

I know exactly of wich Visa i was !!! and sorry to deceive you...but I have an health insurance since the first week I arrive in the Kingdom

 

BUT sorry again i still think ,,,its a misunderstanding !!!

[Slugs11]

Just completed my Non O-A year extension at UbonRatchathani immigration office. It was due to expire on 11 May, so had no problem doing it in advance. The office said you can do extension up to 45 days in before the old one expire. The only extra thing I had to do this yr compared to previous years was to get Thai health insurance, which was no problem, and only cost 7700 baht for the yr (Completed the form online with insurance company, no medical or tests required) paid the money and they sent the insurance certificate via email, which I printed off, and immigration accepted with no problems. 

[Mamasun]

1 hour ago, Slugs11 said:

Just completed my Non O-A year extension at UbonRatchathani immigration office. It was due to expire on 11 May, so had no problem doing it in advance. The office said you can do extension up to 45 days in before the old one expire. The only extra thing I had to do this yr compared to previous years was to get Thai health insurance, which was no problem, and only cost 7700 baht for the yr (Completed the form online with insurance company, no medical or tests required) paid the money and they sent the insurance certificate via email, which I printed off, and immigration accepted with no problems. 

Hi , What kind of health insurance can we get for 7000 B the year ??? incredible !!!

 

[Max69xl]

On 4/22/2020 at 6:20 PM, DrJack54 said:

The OP previously had a non O-A.

Any extension to permission of stay based on retirement will require insurance 

Not "any extension" based on retirement, only if the initial visa was an O-A. 

[Max69xl]

On 4/22/2020 at 6:26 PM, Thailand said:

I think this has come up at other offices.

But yes, they don't intend to make it easy here do they!

Chiang Mai immigration has always done things different. Don't confuse them with offices where they know what they're doing. 

[Max69xl]

On 4/22/2020 at 6:48 PM, Tarteso said:

I Have health insurance with AIA, at 61 y/o. They increased this month the payment from 4000k to 5000k monthly, Covering 1.000.000 y. (Only impatient). Hope will be enough when renove my Visa ext. ????

I think you mean inpatient, and the official requirement is still only 400k inpatient when having an initial O-A Visa. 

[Tarteso]

38 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

I think you mean inpatient, and the official requirement is still only 400k inpatient when having an initial O-A Visa. 

Sorry for the lapse????

[DrJack54]

7 hours ago, Max69xl said:

Not "any extension" based on retirement, only if the initial visa was an O-A. 

What's up with you.

I was referring to the OP who originally had a non O-A. Hence HE needs insurance for any extension HE does based on retirement.

Edited April 25, 2020 by DrJack54

[Peter Denis]

12 hours ago, Mamasun said:

..

BUT sorry again i still think ,,,its a misunderstanding !!!

When you have been continuously extending the original Non Imm O-A Visa which you acquired in your home-country and with which you entered Thailand years ago, you are since Oct 31, 2019 now required to subscribe to a thai IO-approved health-insurance policy when applying for the 1-year extension based on your original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.

Note: It seems that Phuket IO is recently not enforcing that health-insurance requirement for Non Imm O-A retirement extensions anymore.

You have 3 options:

1 - Subscribe to such a thai IO-approved health-insurance policy (international health-insurance is not accepted, nor policies from thai insurers that have not been approved by IO).

As these thai IO-approved health-insurance policies are exorbitantly expensive for the almost worthless coverage they provide, your best option is to go for the dirt-cheapest option (LMG Insurance provides IO-approved policies for 6.000 THB to 15.700 THB annual premium in the age-bracket 50 to 75).

2 - When you are married to a thai national, you can apply for the 1-year extension of your original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of MARRIAGE, and in that case a health-insurance policy is not required.  Also the financials to be proven are way lower than when applying for reason of retirement, but the admin to provide evidence that you are (still) married to a thai national is somewhat of a hassle (surely the first year, afterwards it's just a yearly repeat);

3 - When your Non Imm O-A Visa based permission to stay is due to expire, you can exit Thailand (necessary to 'kill' the permission to stay based on your present Non Imm O-A Visa) and apply at a foreign consulate for a 90-day Non Imm O - retirement Visa.  You can also re-enter Thailand VisaExempt and apply for the 90-day Non Imm O - retirement Visa at your local IO, and in the last 30 (some IOs allow 45) days of that 90-day permission to stay apply at that same local IO for the 1-year extension of stay based on that new Non Imm O - retirement Visa.  And when doing so NO health-insurance policy is required.

 

>>> I PM-ed you a comprehensive guideline document outlining all options/details to convert to such a Non Imm O - retirement Visa.

In order to access your PM-messages just click the letter-icon next to your Profile when logged in to the Forum.

[Old Croc]

5 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

 

Note: It seems that Phuket IO is recently not enforcing that health-insurance requirement for Non Imm O-A retirement extensions anymore.

 

I still haven't been able to gain access to the IO to test this as yet. At this stage I only know of one applicant who was extended without the insurance.

If the apparent amnesty for all is real, I will have time to swap to the marriage extension and probably won't continue with retirement. 

[Peter Denis]

2 minutes ago, Old Croc said:

I still haven't been able to gain access to the IO to test this as yet. At this stage I only know of one applicant who was extended without the insurance.

If the apparent amnesty for all is real, I will have time to swap to the marriage extension and probably won't continue with retirement. 

Hi Old Croc,

You are in a very specific situation (being over 75 and thus not able to meet the health-insurance requirement now required when applying for the 1-year extension of your Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement).

However, be aware that the amnesty (till 31 July) most probably does not fully apply to those on 1-year extensions of their original Non Imm O or O-A Visa.

When you do NOT visit your local IO when the permission to stay of Non Imm O-A Visa is due to expire, that would MOST PROBABLY have some consequences.

1 - Although you would be technically on over-stay, you won't be fined or suffer any other consequences from that, as the amnesty will be applicable;

2 - However it is still to be seen whether IO would allow you to simply extend your present permission to stay when applying for the 1-year extension after the window in which you are supposed to do that (30 or 45 days before till due date) has expired.

As this is Thailand, some IOs will probably allow you to do so, but for sure there will be others (already 1 case reported) that would not do so and then force you to exit Thailand and start the application process from scratch again.

>>> So in your case, it is recommended to visit your local IO once your present permission to stay is due to expire, and apply for the 1-year extension of stay based on your present Non Imm O-A Visa.

At least then you would also have certainty about the available options in case they do not allow a 1-year extension for reason of retirement without the health-insurance policy.

 

 

[Old Croc]

2 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

Hi Old Croc,

You are in a very specific situation (being over 75 and thus not able to meet the health-insurance requirement now required when applying for the 1-year extension of your Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement).

However, be aware that the amnesty (till 31 July) most probably does not fully apply to those on 1-year extensions of their original Non Imm O or O-A Visa.

When you do NOT visit your local IO when the permission to stay of Non Imm O-A Visa is due to expire, that would MOST PROBABLY have some consequences.

1 - Although you would be technically on over-stay, you won't be fined or suffer any other consequences from that, as the amnesty will be applicable;

2 - However it is still to be seen whether IO would allow you to simply extend your present permission to stay when applying for the 1-year extension after the window in which you are supposed to do that (30 or 45 days before till due date) has expired.

As this is Thailand, some IOs will probably allow you to do so, but for sure there will be others (already 1 case reported) that would not do so and then force you to exit Thailand and start the application process from scratch again.

>>> So in your case, it is recommended to visit your local IO once your present permission to stay is due to expire, and apply for the 1-year extension of stay based on your present Non Imm O-A Visa.

At least then you would also have certainty about the available options in case they do not allow a 1-year extension for reason of retirement without the health-insurance policy.

 

 

A couple of points:

Firstly I am not over 75, I will be 72 in a couple of weeks. My belief that I wouldn't qualify for insurance stems from ongoing health issues.

 

Secondly, I don't necessarily ascribe to what you say is most probable, that the amnesty doesn't apply to those on 1 year extensions. I refer to an interview with Phuket's Immigration Deputy Chief in local media:

"Col Nareuwat said that he was aware of the Cabinet’s approval granted yesterday, but noted that technically his office still has to receive the official order before they can enforce it.

However, he did confirm the automatic visa extension does apply to all visa types.

Asked specifically whether the extension apply to one-year visas, he said, “Yes, the extension applies to all visa types.”    - Phuket News.

 

Thirdly the (over) use of the term visa, by all sides, to describe permission to stay in the country is technically incorrect as all single entry visas cease to exist when used at entry.

Permission to stay is granted by the stamping of a Permit (temporary entry permit) at the airport.

Ergo, those basing their belief on the use of the word visa, could very well be using an incorrect yardstick.

 

Of course inconsistency is a trademark of the Department in Thailand so anything could still happen.

[Peter Denis]

13 minutes ago, Old Croc said:

A couple of points:

Firstly I am not over 75, I will be 72 in a couple of weeks. My belief that I wouldn't qualify for insurance stems from ongoing health issues.

 

Secondly, I don't necessarily ascribe to what you say is most probable, that the amnesty doesn't apply to those on 1 year extensions. I refer to an interview with Phuket's Immigration Deputy Chief in local media:

"Col Nareuwat said that he was aware of the Cabinet’s approval granted yesterday, but noted that technically his office still has to receive the official order before they can enforce it.

However, he did confirm the automatic visa extension does apply to all visa types.

Asked specifically whether the extension apply to one-year visas, he said, “Yes, the extension applies to all visa types.”    - Phuket News.

 

Thirdly the (over) use of the term visa, by all sides, to describe permission to stay in the country is technically incorrect as all single entry visas cease to exist when used at entry.

Permission to stay is granted by the stamping of a Permit (temporary entry permit) at the airport.

Ergo, those basing their belief on the use of the word visa, could very well be using an incorrect yardstick.

 

Of course inconsistency is a trademark of the Department in Thailand so anything could still happen.

The Amnesty does indeed apply to all those that have a Permit to Stay stamped in their passport that expires after 26 March.

And so there are no consequences of being on overstay during the amnesty period when not visiting your IO when your permission to stay is due to expire.

However, what is not so sure is whether your IO will allow you to extend that permission to stay when the permission to stay date has expired.  For those on VisaExempt or TouristVisa or 90-day permissions to stay from a Non Imm O Visa, that wouldn't matter as they would normally leave the country anyway.  But for those on 1-year extensions of stay from their long-stay Visa it is not so clear whether they will be able to extend that 1-year extension once the permission to stay date has expired.  Since this is Thailand, some IOs might provide leniency, but there are also already 2 reports of IOs that are not willing to do that, thus forcing those that did not apply for their 1-year extension during the window foreseen to exit Thailand once the borders are open again and start their application from scratch again.

Hence my recommendation to visit your local IO once your present permission to stay is due to expire, unless of course it was your intention to let it expire anyway.

 

[Slugs11]

Mamasun, try LMG insurance. You can find them on the internet easily. They are one of the insurance companies approved by immigration. They will insure up to 75 yrs, without medical or health checks. I took the option of having a 200k excess, meaning I would pay the first 200k on any claim. This keep the cost for insurance low. I only need this insurance to get my Non O-A yearly extension, I have no intention to claim on it. I already have another health insurance, which cover me worldwide.

[mickyr55]

On 4/22/2020 at 7:02 PM, Ventenio said:

I thought the expression was, "That's highway robbery!"

 

daylight works.....i'm not sure i've ever heard that one before.  the world is a big place.  

Daylight robbery is a very common saying in the UK.

 

 

 

[JimGant]

17 hours ago, Slugs11 said:

Just completed my Non O-A year extension at UbonRatchathani immigration office. It was due to expire on 11 May, so had no problem doing it in advance. The office said you can do extension up to 45 days in before the old one expire. The only extra thing I had to do this yr compared to previous years was to get Thai health insurance, which was no problem, and only cost 7700 baht for the yr (Completed the form online with insurance company, no medical or tests required) paid the money and they sent the insurance certificate via email, which I printed off, and immigration accepted with no problems. 

Christ, a little sanity being injected in this corpse, as I assume your insurance policy begins day of next extension renewal, i.e, you didn't need to buy gap insurance to cover early renewal days....?

[JimGant]

45 minutes ago, mickyr55 said:

Daylight robbery is a very common saying in the UK.

Yeah, British Highwaymen suffered carrot deficiency and vision problems, thus necessitating daytime robberies. Kinda like their sailors suffered lime deficiency ...... ????

[JimGant]

On 4/24/2020 at 1:06 PM, Mamasun said:

OmG what is that again ?  some months ago i read that insurance was only for the NEW OA visa request abroad....!!!!

 

And now ? doest it mean that ALL retirement extension need to have health insurance ?

Oh, Mamasun, I'm afraid, as an original O-A visa holder, you're in for a rude shock; and I can only imagine that there are a load of old timers, who really aren't computer literate, nor especially keen on tuning into such channels as TV, who will get the door slammed in their face come next renewal time. And many (most) of these will have home country insurance -- but, of course, that contributes nothing to the 12 Thai insurance companies that Immigration is in bed with. No, Mamasun, covid 19 may seem sinister -- but it ain't nothing compared to what the health and immigration ministries have cooked up. Sorry, old timer....but good luck, however that can manifest itself.