Safe Food?

[bartender100]

You might want to read this in SATURDAYS Mail.Could do serious damage to Thai prawn farms

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10...-eat-again.html

[WilliamTarmby]

So many Thai people I have known, died of cancer in their 40s and 50s - it's shocking. Certainly, I made the connection years ago between the food that is allowed to be sold to humans and cancer rates.

A local Thai restaurant used by locals and tourists in Chiang Mai proudly had a Good Quality sign hanging on it's wall. It said in English that this restaurant was inspected and had passed strict testing bla bla. At the bottom of the sign is a small space to allow the name of the restaurant to be printed. The owner (a non-English reader) eventualy caught on to why farang kept laughing at his sign - in English the name of the restaurant was McDonalds, Changklan Road.

Nobody cares here. It's all a game. This a country where 'copyright' is read as 'right to copy'; cheating is common and only negative if the cheater is exposed as a cheat - loss of face for getting caught. Unfortunately we have to accept this situation because if Thais don't care, there's little chance of farangs making a difference. Can you really believe the organic label on 'organic' fruit and veggies at Rimping and other high-end supermarkets? Who checks?

EXACTLY MATE!

That was all I was trying to point out, we were given this stupid Q cert, without asking for it, or even wanting it. I'll be honest, I use pesticides, and a bit of fertilizer now and again, and I also use Roundup, but NOT on the Lam Yai as the price of the fruit doesn't make it worth the expense, all I was trying to point out is that the Q label means bugger all!

And for pointing that out, I have been accused of hating Thais....where is the logic? Just don't be fooled by the packaging, you think you may be paying more for a safer product...it's crap! Grow your own is the only way to go.

[WilliamTarmby]

It goes beyond the pesticides, the chemicals the fertilizer.

Where we live they love to eat Lab Moo (Raw pork with pigs blood and some herbs, despite the fact that there is a bile duct infection that causes cancer, and a HORRIBLE death, due to liver fluke, they continue to eat it!

A recent funeral for a young guy(20's) that died of this terrible cancer took place, the cause was well known, but at the wake later, they were eating the same shit that killed him! And when asked why, they said " they like eating it" What can you do?

The only thing I would say is to publicize the lies and bullshit that goes on here, and at least those with a bit of nouse, can at least make an informed decision.

After all, it's not you and me that are going to be slowly eaten away(LOL I'm past caring now and the ravages of the years have probably taken their toll already), it's going to be our kids! At least be aware for their sake...then we can start about the water...government and bottled...but that is for another day!

[Tyke]

You ever wonder why they cannot export pork to Europe???

I don't understand this - do a google using the phrase:

thailand pork exports to EU

It seems to suggest the opposite. What is your source for the banning of thai pork exports to Europe?

But the general points about safety in Thailand are probably valid. I wouldn't trust anything where food safety is concerned here - and that includes organic food. However, having said that, and not being a fan of organic food in the west where pesticide use regulations are more stringently enforced and suppliers have a lot more to loose if they do not comply, I must say I would probably trust organic food more in Thailand than I would trust chemically treated crops.

I love broccolli too!

[jdinasia]

I see so many claims being made in this thread that just are not proven out when a little research is done. The best one on THIS page is liver flukes from pork being the big thing,

Note that there is an increased incidence of liver fluke infestation in humans in NE Thailand, note also that this form of liver fluke comes from raw FISH not pork

Note that pork products ARE exported to the EU from Thailand

Note that no citation was ever given for the WHO claim earlier in the thread

Note that "The Thais" and lies and other hyperbole are still running rampant in this thread

(citation for liver fluke/cancer/fish correlation http://www.inchem.org/documents/iarc/vol61/m61-2.html )

[WilliamTarmby]

Liver fluke comes from RAW PORK, it comes from pig shit and it comes from fish, the fish eat the shit, but it is present in laab moo.

Also, have a look at the idiots that ate the raw "deer" if that was actuallly what it was, from near Chiang Rai...after letting the "delicacy" PUTRIFY in a black plastic bag for half a day...

I'll check on the pork exports, maybe I am wrong, but a couple of years ago, the export of pork was banned due to steroids or similar....maybe it has changed.

You still cannot seem to get your head around the fact that the Amphur can issue a "Q" cert. fore something that has had absolutely no checks whatsoever, what are you trying to defend? I still go back to the original point, I could be using paraquat/DDT or whatever I like on the fruit trees, and be issued with their Q cert. which you claimed I had no idea what it meant, yet still you refuse to say what it means!

I think for the majority, people believe this "accreditation" to be that the food has not had chemicals or pesticides, totally wrong...again what are you trying to make a point about?

If you still believe your ridiculous statements, try looking here!

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=...568iMmgTxQ9JRhw

http://www.phsource.us/PH/ZD/Zoonotic_Disease_Table.htm

http://www.skylarkmedicalclinic.com/food2006parasites.htm

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=...H-D3MzH5ibglvFw

You obviously live on a different planet to the rest of us!

And yes I checked and pork exports are actually OK, it was back in 1997...a bit of time has lapsed!

[WilliamTarmby]

And more if you need convincing, however, I feel you will never be convinced, so do as you do...you really are not worth the effort, however, should a reasonable person understand the perils of some of the delicacys here and hopefully prevent them killing themselves, then I feel the thread to be worthwile, you however, are beyond rationality!

http://www.china.org.cn/archive/2005-05/17...ent_1129083.htm

http://maine.edu/~rcausey/lablec11.HTM

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=...Ckt8vTK9rSa-j9g

[jdinasia]

Hate to say it ... but you are still way off

Trichinosis (from cysts in undercooked pork) is not a liver fluke and the liver flukes you are talking about come from FISH.

(and yes that is from YOUR links)

But aren't you whining about fruit and not knowing what the quality seal actually means or certifies?

[WilliamTarmby]

I keep waiting for you to enlighten me as to what the Q cert. ACTUALLY means...how many days and how many posts, and you still cannot telll me!

Read again, liver fluke is caused by virtually any undercooked, raw meat, be it fish, pork, beef or whatever..are you retarded?

[jdinasia]

I keep waiting for you to enlighten me as to what the Q cert. ACTUALLY means...how many days and how many posts, and you still cannot telll me!

Read again, liver fluke is caused by virtually any undercooked, raw meat, be it fish, pork, beef or whatever..are you retarded?

1) It isn't my job to explain it to you, you are the one complaining about it in your first post while admitting you do not know what it means

2) from YOUR link http://lib.bioinfo.pl/auth:Kaewpitoon,N

Trichinosis is among the most common food-borne parasitic zoonoses in Thailand and many outbreaks are reported each year. This paper investigates the distribution of the disease in regions of north, north-east, central and south Thailand. Between the earliest recorded of outbreak of trichinosis in Mae Hong Son Province in 1962 and 2006, there have been 135 outbreaks involving 7340 patients and 97 deaths in Thailand. The highest number of cases, 557, was recorded in 1983. Most infected patients were in the 35-44 year age group, and the disease occurred more frequently in men than women during 1962-2003, with no significant sex difference during 2004-2006. Outbreaks were most common in the northern areas, especially in rural areas where raw and under-cooked pork and/or wild animals are eaten. Human infections occur annually in northern Thailand during communal feasts celebrating the Thai New Year. Trichinosis causes have been reported every year, supporting the need for planning education programs.

Trichinosis is not a liver fluke

Opisthorchiasis caused by Opisthorchis viverrini (O. viverrini) remains a major public health problem in many parts of Southeast Asia including Thailand, Lao PDR, Vietnam and Cambodia. The infection is associated with a number of hepatobiliary diseases, including cholangitis, obstructive jaundice, hepatomegaly, cholecystitis, chole-lithiasis and cholangiocarcinoma. The liver fluke infection was induced by eating raw or uncooked fish products that is the tradition and popular in the northeastern and northern region, particularly in rural areas of Thailand. Health education programs to prevent and control opisthorchiasis are still required in high-risk areas.

The liver fluke is from fish (raw)

Opisthorchiasis caused by Opisthorchis viverrini remains a major public health problem in many parts of Southeast Asia, including Thailand, Lao PDR, Vietnam and Cambodia. The infection is associated with a number of hepatobiliary diseases, including cholangitis, obstructive jaundice, hepatomegaly, cholecystitis and cholelithiasis. Multi-factorial etiology of cholangiocarcinoma, mechanical damage, parasite secretions, and immunopathology may enhance cholangiocarcinogenesis. Moreover, both experimental and epidemiological evidences strongly implicate liver fluke infection as the major risk factor in cholangiocarcinoma, cancer of the bile ducts. The liver fluke infection is induced by eating raw or uncooked fish products that is the tradition and popular in the northeastern and northern region, particularly in rural areas, of Thailand. The health education programs to prevent and control opisthorchiasis are still required in the high-risk areas.

again ----- the liver fluke --- fish ....

Knowledge, attitude and practice related to liver fluke infection in northeast Thailand.

Natthawut Kaewpitoon, Soraya-J Kaewpitoon, Prasit Pengsaa, Chutigan Pilasri

College of Medicine and Public Health, Ubon Rajathanee University, Ubon Ratchathani Province 34190, Thailand. [email protected].

AIM: To investigate the knowledge, attitude and practice (KAP) in prevention and control of liver fluke infection in northeast Thailand. METHODS: A descriptive KAP survey pertaining to liver fluke infection was carried out in June 2005 to October 2006 using structured questionnaires. Data were collected by questionnaires consisting of general parameters, knowledge, attitude, practice, and a history of participation in the prevention and control of liver fluke infection. RESULTS: A total of 1077 persons who were inter-viewed and completed the questionnaires were enrolled in the study. The majority were females (69.5%) and many of them were 15-20 years of age (37.26%). The questionnaires revealed that information resources on liver fluke infection included local public health volunteers (31.37%), public health officers (18.72%), televisions (14.38%), local heads of sub-districts (12.31%), doctors and nurses (9.18%), newspaper (5.72), internets (5.37%), and others (12.95%). Fifty-five point eleven percent of the population had a good level of liver fluke knowledge concerning the mode of disease transmission and 79.72% of the population had a good level of prevention and control knowledge with regards to defecation and consumption. The attitude and practice in liver fluke prevention and control were also at a good level with a positive awareness, participation, and satisfaction of 72.1% and 60.83% of the persons studied. However, good health behavior was found in 39.26% and 41.42% of the persons studied who had unhygienic defecation and ate raw cyprinoid's fish. The result also showed that 41.25% of the persons studied previously joined prevention and control campaigns. CONCLUSION: The persons studied have a high level of liver fluke knowledge and positive attitude. However, improvement is required regarding personal hygiene specifically with hygienic defecation and consumption of undercooked fish.

Liver fluke ---- fish

Trichinosis: epidemiology in Thailand.

Natthawut Kaewpitoon, Soraya-Jatesadapattaya Kaewpitoon, Chutikan Philasri, Ratana Leksomboon, Chanvit Maneenin, Samaporn Sirilaph, Prasit Pengsaa

College of Medicine and Public Health, Ubon Rajathanee University, Ubonratchathani 34190, Thailand. [email protected].

Trichinosis is one of the most common food-borne parasitic zoonoses in Thailand and many outbreaks are reported each year. This paper reviews the history, species, and epidemiology of the disease and food habits of the people with an emphasis on the north, northeast, central and south regions of Thailand. The earliest record of trichinosis in Thailand was in 1962 in the Mae Sariang District, Mae Hong Son Province. Since then, about 130 outbreaks have been reported involving 7392 patients and 97 deaths (1962-2005). The highest number of cases, 557, was recorded in 1983. The annual epidemiological surveillance reports of the Bureau of Epidemiology, Department of Disease Control, Ministry of Public Health, Thailand, show that trichinosis cases increased from 61 in 1997 to 351 in 1998. In contrast to these figures, the number of reported cases decreased to 16 in 1999 and 128 cases in 2000. There was no record of trichinosis in 2001, but then the figures for 2002, 2003 and 2004 were 289, 126 and 212 respectively. The infected patients were mostly in the 35-44 years age group and the disease occurred more frequently in men than women at a ratio of 1.7-2.0:1. There were 84 reported cases of trichinosis in Chiang Rai, Nan, Chiang Mai, Si Sa ket, Nakhon Phanom, Kalasin, Nakhon Ratchasima, Nakhon Nayok, Nakhon Pathom and Surat Thani, provinces located in different parts of Thailand in 2005. The outbreaks were more common in the northern areas, especially in rural areas where people ate raw or under-cooked pork and/or wild animals. This indicates the need for health education programs to prevent and control trichinosis as soon as possible in the high-risk areas.

Trichinosis (not a liver fluke) pork

Remember --- that is just from the FIRST of your links .... I could easily take the rest of them apart ... but really, why bother? You gave the link .. the link states where liver fluke infections come from (and what parasitic infection comes from raw/undercooked pork)

edit --- to put all of my comments in red to distinguish what I said from what the Dr's said

Edited October 7, 2008 by jdinasia

[Lickey]

Excuse my ignorance, I sure ain't no farmer, but wont' the garlic permeate the product, and leave a taste??

Garlic flavoured mango's

Let me explain my experiment, we have/had 1200 papaya plants, in January this year, mealy bugs got hold of 90% of them, so systemic spray was used on 50% of the plants, I sprayed the lathe oil and garlic mix on 30% and the remaining 20% were left to fend for themselves,

A lot of plants got through this period because of the sprays and natural predators, the papaya i dont like is the systemic sprayed one, as you are not a farmer, systemic spray goes inside the plant and fruit making it taste bad for bugs ect,

Next time you buy papaya, cut it in half long ways, if it has a white fleshy coating over the yellow normal fruit colour, that has been sprayed with systemic stuff, if it hasnt got this, youve got a normal fruit or one that has been treated with organic pest sprays,

Fertiliser prices have doubled in Thailand since the fuel crisis, and personally i hope they go up even more, water run-off from over-fertilised fields are killing fish and other important micro-organisms, Anything green [weeds,leaves,+ kitchen waste,some cow/pig/chicken/bat crap] will make an ideal fertiliser, it will help with water retention and provide all the natural ingredients your soil needs,

Sorry posters, got a bit carried away there, but when i see articles on TV [ubc] about the dead areas in the gulf of mexico because of the recent Missasippi floods and all the agri chem run-off creating a dead patch the size of New Jersey, it really brings home how big the problem is.

[desertrat]

I have an exclusive diet of bread (whole wheat) and cheese, (see my nic) Am I safe ?

[bonobo]

I was thinking about food safety yesterday.  I was driving back from work under the elevated expressway which goes into Pin Klao from points west and I drove past a pickup truck full of split pig carcasses.  The carcasses had no ice nor refridgeration, some were hanging over the sides and back of the bed, and to top it off, a filthy man was asleep nestled between two of the carcasses. 

These carcasses undoubtedly came from Nakon Pathom, so aside from how long they sat at a slaughterhouse, they had been sitting in the back of a beat-up truck exposed to the weather, bugs, bacteria, etc, to say nothing of having served as some guy's bed. Depending on their destiantion in BKK, they could have ended up sitting there for hours.

I started thinking, and I have lived around the world, and I have even spent two months (two times at one month each) in two different jungles for survival training living off what I could gather. I have always thought of myself to have an iron constitution.  But while living in Thailand, I do get the monthly or "month-and-a-halfly" bouts of diarrhea and slight nausea.  I was thinking it was just part of getting older, but after following the carnal truck for so many kilometers, I am wondering if it is the food I eat.

There have been other threads about street stalls using oil until it is way too far gone to be safe.  I wonder how safe food here really is.  I realize no food supply is completely safe. And Thailand may or may not be worse than anywhere else. I am certainly not an expert on food safety.  But I do have to wonder.

Edited October 8, 2008 by bonobo

[apo]

hi just want to say this is one of the first threads I have bothered to read all the way though and I liked what I read... didnt agree with everything but it shows people are thinking and seeing more than the avg idiot farang I meet on the streets here in LOS

interesting and show me there are more than a bunch of dumb beer drinkers on this site