ASEAN and the future of foreign teachers?

[jdlancaster]

For my friend living a comfortable life.... I have a pretty quiet life except for temple stuff.. I don't need internet except for my phone. ... if I need fast internet my school handles that... I have my motorbike. .. and my army reserve time give me extra money

[smotherb]

Isn't that just a teaching diploma like a PGCEi or the numerous Filipino teaching diploma's?

Pedagogy is the discipline that addresses teaching and education. Therefore, a pedgogic degree would be an educational degree and it could be construed to mean in English if you are gong to teach English. The PGCEi is the post-graduate certificate in English for international teaching and is a part-time online educational supplement for teachers with an appropriate degree. The PGCEi is not an educational degree itself; thus, may not meet the requirement. Most Filipino teachers I know have an education degree, but they, like farangs, also currently get hired with a bachelor degree in any discipline. However, we are talking about hearsay requirements for Vietnam, are we not? Who is to say a pedagogic degree will be needed in Thailand. The Thais would have to get serious about learning English.

[smotherb]

The poster saying he gets by on 20k... is honest. ... I live in phrae... and 20k is getting hammered almost every night.... unless you try to blow money....

Hammered on what? So, you drink cheap alcohol, and get hammered every night and only spend B20k/mo. Sure sounds like you have it made. You should be ready for the bone yard in five or six years. I would not wish that on my worst enemy, but if you are happy with it, go for it.

[duanebigsby]

Perfectly happy douche bag and cheap charlie living in chang rai i think.

I think the douche bag part is unnecessary and quite rude. can you not make your point without the slander?

I'm single, no family to worry about, don't do the bargirl thing and live in a small 2 bdrm townhouse in chiang Rai.at 3500 a month.

Very doable without being a cheap Charlie on 20k. I love to cook and so most meals are at home. I still go out quite a bit as I do like a pub atmosphere and hanging with friends.

[duanebigsby]

You put $400 away earning 30K/month?

That's getting by on 20,000 baht/month - not impossible but not my kind of lifestyle!

Only some expenses I've got every month. 4 K cold, about 2 K for electricity and water, without having an air conditioning unit on.

Then abut 1 K for internet, 5 K for Diesel oil. That's already 12 K, but I have to feed a family, need to pay for food, gas, and many other things, plus tax for my car, insurance for me, clothes for all of us, etc..

I couldn't live on that money. I know that mot Filipinos send a lot more home, but they do that for a reason.

I'm single, no family to worry about, don't do the bargirl thing and live in a small 2 bdrm townhouse in chiang Rai.at 3500 a month.

Very doable without being a cheap Charlie on 20k. I love to cook and so most meals are at home. I get by on motorbike for 500 baht fuel. If I need to I rent a car every once in a while.

share my internet, no cable tv, and pay about 700 for electric bill. I still go out quite a bit as I do like a pub atmosphere and hanging with friends.

different people have different needs.....we're not right or wrong...we're just different.

[scooterboy]

^Good on ya - sounds a very nice and 'comfortable' time you're having.

Some guys here seem to just like writing without thinking first - hopefully they don't teach the same the way......

[onlycw]

Re the source: after having been wooed for many moons, this is now said to make employment impossible.

Murky waters and all - lots of folks are teaching over there with no or unrelated BA degrees.

Some kind of harmonization would make sense though. OTOH: pay peanuts, get ...

[jdlancaster]

Smotherb... I don't drink every night... it was just to stress that things are cheaper here... and we drink chaang leo singh or asahi beer or buy a bottle of liquor. .. changes depending on who I am drinking with. Regency is popular. Corkage fees are minimal here if at all and a large chaang will set you back 70-80thb. I've lived in phuket before... nice to vacation. .. but I like it here... a real sense of community. .. random parties it seems every week. ... just nobody speaks English. .. I prefer it that way... but not.for everybody

[Benmart]

Go spend a small fortune on getting a degree to earn 30k a month for 9 months a year with a school that probavly wont bother getting u a permit at all in a ever increasing cost of living country. Wank wank. They get what they pay for.

People free to do as they wish, which includes posting juvenile and crude comment such as "wank, wank". Negative, cynical and judgmental comments are far easier than providing credible, experienced based information about the topic at hand.

[Loaded]

An unsubstantiated OP followed by 2 pages of unrelated drivel.

[smotherb]

Smotherb... I don't drink every night... it was just to stress that things are cheaper here... and we drink chaang leo singh or asahi beer or buy a bottle of liquor. .. changes depending on who I am drinking with. Regency is popular. Corkage fees are minimal here if at all and a large chaang will set you back 70-80thb. I've lived in phuket before... nice to vacation. .. but I like it here... a real sense of community. .. random parties it seems every week. ... just nobody speaks English. .. I prefer it that way... but not.for everybody

You are not the only TV poster who claims to live "well" on B20k/mo or even less. I guess it depends upon your definition of "well"

I certainly doubt you live well by my definition. I too enjoy an occaisional Regency with my Thai friends, but I, and now most of them, prefer Jack. Although I do like Thai food, and spicy too, I also enjoy farang food--a good steak, wine, cheeses, hard-crusted bread, and good desserts, not those plastic sugar-coated desserts the Thais seem to like. I also travel frequently throughout Southeast Asia and Thailand, visiting friends and enjoying the local and farang amenities I do not get in Southern Thailand. I choose to live in Southern Thailand because there are fewer farangs; thus, fewer adverse situations with Thais, and things do cost less here. I have a very nice three-story house in a upscale neighborhood, use a/c 24/7, have the best internet and cable TV service available--just that, no doubt, would normally cost B20/mo or more. I also enjoy riding my Harley, going out almost everyday and not just to get hammered, but to enjoy my lady's company, have a good meal, go to a movie or concert, go to a sporting event, or just hit the bars to fraternize with friends. I get to choose when I deal with farangs and listen to their all too often pitiful tales of woe. And, best of all, if I want something, I just buy it--I like to go through life not caring about the right side of the menu. I bet you cannot do that on B20k/mo. I wouldn't want to do any less than I currently do. Again, I am sincerely happy if you think you are living well. We all need to think we are a success.

[duanebigsby]

Smotherb... I don't drink every night... it was just to stress that things are cheaper here... and we drink chaang leo singh or asahi beer or buy a bottle of liquor. .. changes depending on who I am drinking with. Regency is popular. Corkage fees are minimal here if at all and a large chaang will set you back 70-80thb. I've lived in phuket before... nice to vacation. .. but I like it here... a real sense of community. .. random parties it seems every week. ... just nobody speaks English. .. I prefer it that way... but not.for everybody

You are not the only TV poster who claims to live "well" on B20k/mo or even less. I guess it depends upon your definition of "well"

I certainly doubt you live well by my definition. I too enjoy an occaisional Regency with my Thai friends, but I, and now most of them, prefer Jack. Although I do like Thai food, and spicy too, I also enjoy farang food--a good steak, wine, cheeses, hard-crusted bread, and good desserts, not those plastic sugar-coated desserts the Thais seem to like. I also travel frequently throughout Southeast Asia and Thailand, visiting friends and enjoying the local and farang amenities I do not get in Southern Thailand. I choose to live in Southern Thailand because there are fewer farangs; thus, fewer adverse situations with Thais, and things do cost less here. I have a very nice three-story house in a upscale neighborhood, use a/c 24/7, have the best internet and cable TV service available--just that, no doubt, would normally cost B20/mo or more. I also enjoy riding my Harley, going out almost everyday and not just to get hammered, but to enjoy my lady's company, have a good meal, go to a movie or concert, go to a sporting event, or just hit the bars to fraternize with friends. I get to choose when I deal with farangs and listen to their all too often pitiful tales of woe. And, best of all, if I want something, I just buy it--I like to go through life not caring about the right side of the menu. I bet you cannot do that on B20k/mo. I wouldn't want to do any less than I currently do. Again, I am sincerely happy if you think you are living well. We all need to think we are a success.

as I keep saying, we're all different and there is no right way or wrong way. You can live "well" on 20k a month.

I live by myself...I don't need a posh 3 story home in a "nice" neighborhood. I live well in a 2 bdrm townhouse. I don't watch tv so don't pay anything for the idiot box. Those things you've deemed important seem like a frivolous wastes of money for a single guy like me

.

So without spending on those things you deem necessary, I can go out, eat a steak or salmon, enjoy my beers, and enjoy life without worrying about the price of the menu.

my definition of "well" is enjoying life, having good food, beers, and friends..and going out when I want. I can do it on 20k.

[smotherb]

Smotherb... I don't drink every night... it was just to stress that things are cheaper here... and we drink chaang leo singh or asahi beer or buy a bottle of liquor. .. changes depending on who I am drinking with. Regency is popular. Corkage fees are minimal here if at all and a large chaang will set you back 70-80thb. I've lived in phuket before... nice to vacation. .. but I like it here... a real sense of community. .. random parties it seems every week. ... just nobody speaks English. .. I prefer it that way... but not.for everybody

You are not the only TV poster who claims to live "well" on B20k/mo or even less. I guess it depends upon your definition of "well"

I certainly doubt you live well by my definition. I too enjoy an occaisional Regency with my Thai friends, but I, and now most of them, prefer Jack. Although I do like Thai food, and spicy too, I also enjoy farang food--a good steak, wine, cheeses, hard-crusted bread, and good desserts, not those plastic sugar-coated desserts the Thais seem to like. I also travel frequently throughout Southeast Asia and Thailand, visiting friends and enjoying the local and farang amenities I do not get in Southern Thailand. I choose to live in Southern Thailand because there are fewer farangs; thus, fewer adverse situations with Thais, and things do cost less here. I have a very nice three-story house in a upscale neighborhood, use a/c 24/7, have the best internet and cable TV service available--just that, no doubt, would normally cost B20/mo or more. I also enjoy riding my Harley, going out almost everyday and not just to get hammered, but to enjoy my lady's company, have a good meal, go to a movie or concert, go to a sporting event, or just hit the bars to fraternize with friends. I get to choose when I deal with farangs and listen to their all too often pitiful tales of woe. And, best of all, if I want something, I just buy it--I like to go through life not caring about the right side of the menu. I bet you cannot do that on B20k/mo. I wouldn't want to do any less than I currently do. Again, I am sincerely happy if you think you are living well. We all need to think we are a success.

as I keep saying, we're all different and there is no right way or wrong way. You can live "well" on 20k a month.

I live by myself...I don't need a posh 3 story home in a "nice" neighborhood. I live well in a 2 bdrm townhouse. I don't watch tv so don't pay anything for the idiot box. Those things you've deemed important seem like a frivolous wastes of money for a single guy like me

.

So without spending on those things you deem necessary, I can go out, eat a steak or salmon, enjoy my beers, and enjoy life without worrying about the price of the menu.

my definition of "well" is enjoying life, having good food, beers, and friends..and going out when I want. I can do it on 20k.

good on ya mate, I am just glad I don't have to do that

[Rhys]

It appears the feathers are being ruffled again...all will pass,

[GanDoonToonPet]

Isn't that just a teaching diploma like a PGCEi or the numerous Filipino teaching diploma's?

The PGCEi is the post-graduate certificate in English for international teaching and is a part-time online educational supplement for teachers with an appropriate degree. The PGCEi is not an educational degree itself; thus, may not meet the requirement.

The PGCE(i) is the Post Graduate Certificate in Education (international) & is a full time distance learning pedagogical degree. The degree confers 60 credits at Masters' level just like the 'real' PGCE, but does not lead to QTS.

I personally know over 10 teachers who've been granted the Thai licence on the back of the PGCE(i) & several who now work in mid-tier international schools.

[EmptyHead]

Never mind about all this.

I hear Indonesia is trying to make it stricter as well. And we know Thailand is.

Well good luck to them. The top-tier schools will get it, if they don't have it already, but they will pay 100k baht (and more) a month.

It simply won't happen nationwide due to the money "going elsewhere".

My cousin is a qualified teacher in the UK. I said to her she may be able to get 100k in Thailand at a nice school with her qualifications. She didn't even think that was enough.

It ain't gonna happen. At ease gentlemen.

Edited April 18, 2015 by EmptyHead

[smotherb]

Isn't that just a teaching diploma like a PGCEi or the numerous Filipino teaching diploma's?

The PGCEi is the post-graduate certificate in English for international teaching and is a part-time online educational supplement for teachers with an appropriate degree. The PGCEi is not an educational degree itself; thus, may not meet the requirement.

The PGCE(i) is the Post Graduate Certificate in Education (international) & is a full time distance learning pedagogical degree. The degree confers 60 credits at Masters' level just like the 'real' PGCE, but does not lead to QTS.

I personally know over 10 teachers who've been granted the Thai licence on the back of the PGCE(i) & several who now work in mid-tier international schools.

Gee, funny it's called a "Certificate," if it is a degree

[casualbiker]

Isn't that just a teaching diploma like a PGCEi or the numerous Filipino teaching diploma's?

The PGCEi is the post-graduate certificate in English for international teaching and is a part-time online educational supplement for teachers with an appropriate degree. The PGCEi is not an educational degree itself; thus, may not meet the requirement.

The PGCE(i) is the Post Graduate Certificate in Education (international) & is a full time distance learning pedagogical degree. The degree confers 60 credits at Masters' level just like the 'real' PGCE, but does not lead to QTS.

I personally know over 10 teachers who've been granted the Thai licence on the back of the PGCE(i) & several who now work in mid-tier international schools.

Gee, funny it's called a "Certificate," if it is a degree

Degree, certificate or diploma.. It works and enables teachers to get a teaching licence to teach in Thailand and in many other countries around the world. Why do you belittle it?

Also it can be used as credits against a Master's that would enable QTS.

[gerryBScot]

Yeah and the PG in PGCEi stands for Post-graduate (not parental guidance) so a level of prior academic attainment is normally required to gain entry to it and I doubt whether you would be admitted to it without some evidence of prior teaching experience.

[Jimdandy]

It might be more like ASEAN countries want to increase the literacy of their students so there are a lot of things happening. First, the salaries for teachers are low so that issue has to be addressed. To put it in perspective, in America many teachers make set salaries only to watch former students go on to jobs where they earn sometimes twice as much as they do. It is all relative. When I worked in China the Chinese teachers earned about 1/3 what we did and our pay was the equivalent of $1,000 monthly. There were the few teachers who were bribed and the government knew about it but by in large local teacher make very low wages. Second, It seems that as long as the degree is in the social sciences and not the performing arts along with the teaching credential they will be happy.

I mean after all let's be honest, how many expats do you know who said something to the effect of ' let's go to southeast Asia pretend to be teachers and make money'. Teaching is NOT a profession where you make lots of money unless you work at a university or in some high risk areas like the Middle East. If you want to make a lot of money try being an engineer.

Thanks

[smotherb]

Yeah and the PG in PGCEi stands for Post-graduate (not parental guidance) so a level of prior academic attainment is normally required to gain entry to it and I doubt whether you would be admitted to it without some evidence of prior teaching experience.

gerryBScott and casualbiker, it appears we are talking apples and oranges, or perhaps you have missed the point. The OP said, "a degree in paedagogic" which means a degree in education. The PGCE is continuing educational credit and not a degree in itself. Yes, the Post-Graduate part means the recipient has a bachelor degree, in some discipline as part of the requirement. If that were a bachelor degree in education, then the recipient of the PGCE may be qualified. If continuing educational credit is all that ASEAN nations will require, then the PGCE may be acceptable without a BEd.; however, if it is an educational degree ASEAN requires, the PGCE will not do--unless the recipient's bachelor degree is a pedagogic degree.

[GanDoonToonPet]

It's true that the PGCE is not classed as a degree, under the UK QCF framework. Within each level there are 'sub levels' of Certificate, Diploma, then Degree. For example:

Level 6 - Graduate Certificate, Graduate Diploma, Bachelor's Degree

Level 7 - Postgraduate Certificate, Postgraduate Diploma, Master's Degree

Currently the TCT require a Postgraduate Diploma in Teaching but you have to consider the international equivalence, as this is according to the Thai framework. For example, a 6 year Bachelor's Degree at a Thai university is considered equivalent to a 3 year Bachelor's Degree with Honours at a UK university.

I don't think even the TCT would refuse to issue the licence to a fully qualified UK teacher because they 'only' had a certificate.

[gerryBScot]

Yeah and the PG in PGCEi stands for Post-graduate (not parental guidance) so a level of prior academic attainment is normally required to gain entry to it and I doubt whether you would be admitted to it without some evidence of prior teaching experience.

gerryBScott and casualbiker, it appears we are talking apples and oranges, or perhaps you have missed the point. The OP said, "a degree in paedagogic" which means a degree in education. The PGCE is continuing educational credit and not a degree in itself. Yes, the Post-Graduate part means the recipient has a bachelor degree, in some discipline as part of the requirement. If that were a bachelor degree in education, then the recipient of the PGCE may be qualified. If continuing educational credit is all that ASEAN nations will require, then the PGCE may be acceptable without a BEd.; however, if it is an educational degree ASEAN requires, the PGCE will not do--unless the recipient's bachelor degree is a pedagogic degree.

I am not really sure what we are talking about. It might be bananas for all I know!

Yeah I think that in the UK undergraduate degree and post-grad certificate in education equals pedagogic qualification or meeting the academic requirements to teach; if they did away with that most secondary level, subject specialist teachers, like in Maths,Science, Humanities and Language Arts would need to get new qualifications. 'Pedagogic' is a curious term to describe a degree, IMHO, as it is but one aspect of the teaching game, that relating to teaching; most humble certificates contain modules relating to education psychology and theory, learning and the like and not just 'teaching'.

Or maybe I am missing something and showing signs of dementia and why it is time to pack it in!