Exploring Chiangmai And Surroundings

[dibella]

This idea is for the bold and adventurous sort ...

When I arrived in CM, first thing I did was rent a motorbike for the complete length of my stay at a rate of 100 baht a day. It's a Yamaha Mio, with an automatic transmission, and not having driven a motorcycle in several years, I was completely surprised and delighted in how easy it is to use. Beyond it's ease and simplicity, the bike allows me so much more freedom and independence to do as I please. I believe it was a great decision to rent the bike. In the past week, I've probably been down every soi in old town, and now I'm begining to expand outward and beyond the city. Sure, it may seem dangerous to some, but it's not as bad as you might think. Just look at all the others out there using the motorbike in heavy traffic with complete comfort and ease. All the drivers I've encountered on the road are very courteous. The biggest hazard is breathing the polluted air, and in that regard we have gas masks of various qualities. I use another approach - early morning rides.

I found that the best time to explore is just before sunrise, when there is very little traffic, and so everyday I'm up at 5 AM and on the road before 6 AM. Each day I choose a different area to explore, and by 8 AM I'm either out of city traffic or done for the day. You'd be amazed with all you can find within two hours of exploring on a motorbike each day, and by the way, the early morning sun is often the best time for taking pictures.

Now here is my idea ... at times there can be a benefit in numbers, and so if there are others who would like to join in on these impromtu explores, we could meet daily at the Tha Phae Gate at 5:30 AM and depart promptly at 5:45 AM. As a group we could share ideas, favorite hide-aways, places to eat, give each other local travel and living tips, practice language skills - the cooperative possibilites as an exploration and sight seeing group are endless.

Here would be the group rules as I see it:

- plan to be there at 5:30

- we wait to leave at 5:45 in case anyone is late.

- if you need coffee to get you going in the AM, have it beforehand or wait for breakfast.

- fill up with gasoline the day before so we won't waste time.

- we'll stop about once each hour before 8 AM for about five or ten minutes.

- when the traffic get's heavy we're done, and we can stop for breakfast or go our own way.

- we'll decide where to go each morning, or randomly explore in a given direction.

- we'll select one of us each morning to lead - whoever is most familiar with the route or destination.

- we'll ride in a pack, within eyesight of each other.

- someone can be designated to ride at the tail to keep us together.

- if anyone wants to break away from the pack at anytime - no problem - we're all independent.

- if we want to do a longer ride out of town or a day trip, let's plan the day before.

I have this motorbike until early December and I'm going to be out on the road everyday, seven days a week, at 5:30 AM exploring Chiangmai and surroundings, regardless if anyone is interested in joining along. If you have any interest in this idea, whether you have a motorbike or not, let me know and we can ride together if even for one morning, and you lead the way if you want. Without a doubt, early morning is the is best time for riding and getting around. There is hardly any traffic and the air is still fresh and clean (well, as good as it gets anyway). Also, i think the the early morning markets are the best ... it's just all around good fun,

Edited October 25, 2006 by dibella

[Austhaied]

This idea is for the bold and adventurous sort ...

When I arrived in CM, first thing I did was rent a motorbike for the complete length of my stay at a rate of 100 baht a day. It's a Yamaha Mio, with an automatic transmission, and not having driven a motorcycle in several years, I was completely surprised and delighted in how easy it is to use. Beyond it's ease and simplicity, the bike allows me so much more freedom and independence to do as I please. I believe it was a great decision to rent the bike. In the past week, I've probably been down every soi in old town, and now I'm begining to expand outward and beyond the city. Sure, it may seem dangerous to some, but it's not as bad as you might think. Just look at all the others out there using the motorbike in heavy traffic with complete comfort and ease. All the drivers I've encountered on the road are very courteous. The biggest hazard is breathing the polluted air, and in that regard we have gas masks of various qualities. I use another approach - early morning rides.

I found that the best time to explore is just before sunrise, when there is very little traffic, and so everyday I'm up at 5 AM and on the road before 6 AM. Each day I choose a different area to explore, and by 8 AM I'm either out of city traffic or done for the day. You'd be amazed with all you can find within two hours of exploring on a motorbike each day, and by the way, the early morning sun is often the best time for taking pictures.

Now here is my idea ... at times there can be a benefit in numbers, and so if there are others who would like to join in on these impromtu explores, we could meet daily at the Tha Phae Gate at 5:30 AM and depart promptly at 5:45 AM. As a group we could share ideas, favorite hide-aways, places to eat, give each other local travel and living tips, practice language skills - the cooperative possibilites as an exploration and sight seeing group are endless.

Here would be the group rules as I see it:

- plan to be there at 5:30

- we wait to leave at 5:45 in case anyone is late.

- if you need coffee to get you going in the AM, have it beforehand or wait for breakfast.

- fill up with gasoline the day before so we won't waste time.

- we'll stop about once each hour before 8 AM for about five or ten minutes.

- when the traffic get's heavy we're done, and we can stop for breakfast or go our own way.

- we'll decide where to go each morning, or randomly explore in a given direction.

- we'll select one of us each morning to lead - whoever is most familiar with the route or destination.

- we'll ride in a pack, within eyesight of each other.

- someone can be designated to ride at the tail to keep us together.

- if anyone wants to break away from the pack at anytime - no problem - we're all independent.

- if we want to do a longer ride out of town or a day trip, let's plan the day before.

I have this motorbike until early December and I'm going to be out on the road everyday, seven days a week, at 5:30 AM exploring Chiangmai and surroundings, regardless if anyone is interested in joining along. If you have any interest in this idea, whether you have a motorbike or not, let me know and we can ride together if even for one morning, and you lead the way if you want. Without a doubt, early morning is the is best time for riding and getting around. There is hardly any traffic and the air is still fresh and clean (well, as good as it gets anyway). Also, i think the the early morning markets are the best ... it's just all around good fun,

I used to get home from my nights on the piss about that time..One word of warning ( from direct experience) is watch out for all the monks on alms rounds.. Also, i thought " Khun Tugskin's" war on drugs eliminated the amphetimines in CM..

Edited October 25, 2006 by Austhaied

[dibella]

Well of course this would not be the sort of thing for late night drinkers and meth doesn't seem to have done anyone any good anywhere either. I found being out there on the road with the monks to be another delightful aspect of these early morning adventures - - another reason it's a great time of day for picture taking ...

I used to get home from my nights on the piss about that time..One word of warning ( from direct experience) is watch out for all the monks on alms rounds.. Also, i thought " Khun Tugskin's" war on drugs eliminated the amphetimines in CM..

[ThaiPauly]

Personally I feel its a great idea dibella

Unfortunatley for Me I don't ride a bike, but I am always up at 6am..shame..I would like to do it, but bikes are not my thing..even as a pillion

I hope that others here will join in though..especially the early risers.

[fruittbatt]

Dibella,

I'm impressed that you want to share your own pleasure in getting out there and riding with others. You managed to convey the feeling of adventure in getting up early, and cruising in the cool and freshness of the morning very well, too. Your descriptions made me feel nostalgic and slightly envious.

It also made me regret my diminishing reflexes and timidity re CM traffic! I'm with Thai Pauly on that one.

Hope some younger enthusiasts will respond soon, and have fun!

Edited October 26, 2006 by fruittbatt

[Rasseru]

I moved to Chiangmai a few months ago, dibella, and have been renting a motorcycle or scooter since I got here, for getting both around and out of town. Nicer now that the rainy season is over. I am not quite ready to join you for early morning tours, although I know from motorcycle touring in an earlier life how good it can be in the morning, for all the reasons you mentioned, but if the urge hits me later I may get in touch again to see if I can join you.

In the meantime, one supplement you might want to consider to the rules of the touring road that you proposed. It's one that friends of mine and I followed whenever we toured, and we all found it very helpful: Whoever is leading the group stops and waits for everyone to catch up before turning off whatever road the group is on. That way, if you are behind and want to ride (or, because of your skill level, should be riding) a little more slowly than others, you don't have to worry about being left behind, and therefore aren't under any pressure to ride faster than you want or should.

[Ta22]

- Send me Your MSN , - i would be keen , and let plan out something together ..

the way i see it .. so far alot is just waiting for a large enough group to have some program ..

plus most are not that adverture type ..

i am alway keen in such trip . .. so far i have a few on my list who is keen ,

i think i would drive , but bike is ok with me ..

.

[dibella]

Thanks for all these comments.

> I Unfortunately for Me I don't ride a bike, but I am always up at 6am

> It also made me regret my diminishing reflexes and timidity re CM traffic!

> I am not quite ready to join you for early morning tours,

I must say that being from Hawaii I have never driven in or experienced such

uncontrolled traffic anywhere. In fact, I have not driven a car for ten years

and only rode a bicycle everywhere. Yet with traffic being unregulated as it is,

it is very orderly, almost like a dance with each of us playing our own

individual part.

Before I left for Thailand, I studied up on the North Country, and felt for

certain I would not do the motorbike thing. Upon arriving in Bangkok and seeing

the conjested conditions, I quickly decided to get out and take the sleeper

train to CM. In arriving here a complete stranger not knowing the language, I

ignored all the touts and started walking west. After a couple miles, and on a

whim, I rented a bike at 'Mr.Order' for 200 baht. It was so cheap and I figured

'what the heck' at least I can spend the day scouting around for a good

affordable guesthouse. What other choices did I have?

Walk, tuk-tuk, or taxi.

Anyway, after one day of cruising the streets that is all I needed to sell me

on the idea of spending my time in the north country touring by motorbike. Later

I negotiated a monthly rate of 100 baht a day. Already there is no way I would

have been able to do what I have already done or see what I have seen for so

little money or so little hassle. The freedom and independence is such a great

value. I quickly located a decent guesthouse for 600 baht a week which more

than enough saves for the bike.

Anyway, let me say that riding in traffic is not as bad it may seem by any

means. With the automatic transmission these modern bikes have all the zip you

need to get out of traffic or trouble spots. They are extremely responsive and

take no time at all to get used to. I also tried the old-fashioned manual shift

model and did not like it. These are two completely different worlds of

experience and they do not compare. With this little Yamaha Mio you can quickly

accelerate and easily lead the pack if you want to do that. Today I road to

Phuping Castle and then coasted the bike all the way back down with the motor

off. A side adventure to Monthatarn falls in the early AM was beyond compare.

Not a soul was there. These roads are wonderful in the early AM with little

traffic, but bring a jacket.

I do not use a helmet simply because I like the freedom, but I would suggest

that you do, along with a face shield and gas mask, if that is your thing. Yes,

I might regret this choice someday maybe, but I always move slowly and safely

and try to be very courteous and mindful in all my movements at all times.

The countryside surrounding Chiangmai is very beautiful and impressive. I

believe this is what really makes Chiangmai a great place. Later I will post a

link with some photos. My biggest handicap is that I cannot speak or read Thai,

therefore I often have no idea where I am or what I am seeing, and I cannot ask

anyone questions. Today I believe I discovered a crematorium somewhere off

Klong Chon Prathan. I am also lacking really good detailed maps of this area.

All I really have is Nancy Chandler's creation, which is okay. With a

motorbike, I can each day pick something on her map and easily go find it. There

are such hidden treasures everywhere.

I now wish I had bought that Garmin eTrex GPS at amazon.com before I left. It

would have been great for pinpointing locations to attach to my photos and for

easily finding why way back to places. I could have used the coordinates for

reference on my web travelogue so that others can easily get there too. I saw

a Garmin xTrex here but it is way overpriced compared to Amazon.

Concerning language as a barrier to my explorations, I really want to learn. I

saw on this discussion board that this group was forming:

> Talkarama will meet weekly every Saturday from 7:30 to 9 pm.

> Get-together is in Wawee Coffee, 2 soi 9. Nimmanhaeminda Road,

> Suthep, Muang, Chiang Mai 50200

> http://oravanpyora.blogspot.com/

and so I wrote to the organizer a few days ago but did not get a response as

yet. If anyone knows of any other language groups, or how to acquire very

detailed maps of this area, or if you have a handheld Garmin eTrex GPS for sale,

send me a note.

> Send me Your MSN , - i would be keen , and let plan out something together ..

Best way to reach me right now is at hopiland at gmail dot com. My internet

access is irregular and so I am also looking for good free wi-fi hotspots

anywhere around Chiangmai. Right now I found this free access at the Hopf

Coffee House on Rajawithe Road in old town. You only need to buy one coffee an

hour. They do not have decaf, but there are other options. If you know of any

other good free wi-fi hot spot lounges where I could bring my laptop and spend a

few hours each day let me know! Maybe that would be a good topic for another

thread.

> Hope some younger enthusiasts will respond soon,

Well, I am 50 years old and think if you are 60 or even an active 70 that would

be okay. Of course if you are 20 or so it would be great to have you lead the

way as well. It is really all about being sensible and safety minded. Believe

me, you can do it, if only for one day, unless you are missing a leg or

something, but you need to at least have your wits about you. If you been out

drinking all night that won't work.

> Whoever is leading the group stops and waits for everyone to

> catch up before turning off whatever road the group is on.

Thanks for this. Everyone's input is very much appreciated!

Edited October 27, 2006 by dibella

[Ulysses G.]

I must say that being from Hawaii I have never driven in or experienced such

uncontrolled traffic anywhere.

Try Vietnam sometime, Thai drivers are most gentle and polite in comparison!

[Blinky Bill]

This idea is for the bold and adventurous sort ...

- plan to be there at 5:30

- we wait to leave at 5:45 in case anyone is late.

I have this motorbike until early December and I'm going to be out on the road everyday, seven days a week, at 5:30 AM exploring Chiangmai and surroundings, regardless if anyone is interested in joining along. ............ There is hardly any traffic and the air is still fresh and clean (well, as good as it gets anyway). Also, i think the the early morning markets are the best ... it's just all around good fun,

Beware the late returnees at this hour.......many drivers and riders have just left their secret drinking and whoring haunts totally shitfaced and seem unable to see the or comprehend the redlights at the crossroads. I have seen numerous splattered motorcyclists and wrecked cars at this time of day over the years, the latest being last Wednesday at 5.30 am in Bangkok on the corner of Sukhumvit and Soi 3 on my way to the airport. This phenomenom is not restricted to Bangkok.....it is everywhere so be on your guard.

[chuchok]

What Blinky Bill is trying to say, is that he was one of those returnees..probably still is.can't trust Aussies see...

[dibella]

> Beware the late returnees at this hour.......

> secret drinking and whoring haunts totally shitfaced

> I have seen numerous splattered motorcyclists and wrecked cars

We each can find 101 reasons to evoke fear and trepidation into ourselves and others, and surely some might get a thrill out of doing just that. Certainly each of us could write a short essay about why any of us might NOT go out and explore Chiangmai on a motorbike early each morning, but what would be the purpose? Bottom line is that being on the road and/or experiencing adventure of any sort, such as bungee jumping, river rafting, rock climbing, you name it, is dangerous, and we could find ourselves dead, or worse, mutilated and paralyzed. The fact of the matter is that I have lived a free, independent, wholesome, and full life, and when dying time comes I'll know it was meant to be. Furthermore, in looking back on my life, statistically I should have been dead long ago. Forgive me if I take your post all too seriously, but splattered MC's are serious business, and I've sat along side a few friends who happened to end up on that road. This post is about adventure, and so as the saying goes, "Live Free or Die."

Edited October 27, 2006 by dibella

[Blinky Bill]

What Blinky Bill is trying to say, is that he was one of those returnees..probably still is.can't trust Aussies see...

Hey ChewChoke, how did you know that? I think you hang out in that sleazy place next door with the other Kiwis and perhaps have spotted my departure on the odd occasion. Anyway, I have seen the error of my evil ways and given up that debauched and nefarious lifestyle. It's been the most boring week of my life.

And my apologies to Dibella, I guess I read the wrong meaning in your initial post. My reply was merely a warning to be aware of the dangers on the roads here. Bet you can't do The Riverside in Lampang to the Maddog in Chiang Mai in 43 minutes at night. One of my mad Kiwi mates and I managed it one night after discovering that 2 large Heinekens each is the perfect alcohol to fuel ratio for Ducatis and Kawasakis.

[fruittbatt]

> Beware the late returnees at this hour.......

> secret drinking and whoring haunts totally shitfaced

> I have seen numerous splattered motorcyclists and wrecked cars

We each can find 101 reasons to evoke fear and trepidation into ourselves and others, and surely some might get a thrill out of doing just that. Certainly each of us could write a short essay about why any of us might NOT go out and explore Chiangmai on a motorbike early each morning, but what would be the purpose? Bottom line is that being on the road and/or experiencing adventure of any sort, such as bungee jumping, river rafting, rock climbing, you name it, is dangerous, and we could find ourselves dead, or worse, mutilated and paralyzed. The fact of the matter is that I have lived a free, independent, wholesome, and full life, and when dying time comes I'll know it was meant to be. Furthermore, in looking back on my life, statistically I should have been dead long ago. Forgive me if I take your post all too seriously, but splattered MC's are serious business, and I've sat along side a few friends who happened to end up on that road. This post is about adventure, and so as the saying goes, "Live Free or Die."

Dibella, I applaud your encouragement to physical bravery and full enjoyment of life. One of the greater challenges of my life has been in gaining physical courage and ignoring the voice of caution which says "that's madness" or "you can't do that".

It all started with my first parachute jump. We were all waiting our turns when we saw our friend's parachute fail to open. She plummeted to earth and died. That was the end of parachuting for some of us. Irrational probably, but we just felt too vulnerable and sick.

After almost losing my sight a few years ago, I determined to make the very most of my faculties while I could still enjoy them. This meant giving up the thrills and accompanying nightmares of driving a tractor & ride-on mower on steep slopes, living with feral pigs, poisonous snakes, and a crocodile-infested river on our idyllic North Queensland rainforest property. It meant fulfilling my dream of giving up 7-day a week farm and wholesaling work, and retiring to finish my education and write my first novel in Thailand. It also meant reaching out more to other people: my husband, children and siblings as well as friends and acquaintances....and anonymous ThaiVisa forum posters!

Sometimes the blood stirs with a rekindled desire to hit the open road on a bike, and your post certainly made me recall the pleasure of a cool wind on one's face, the feeling of endless opportunity while looking at the sky on a brand new day, the thrill of cruising down steep slopes, the blur of green and tarmac, the pleasure in the skill of neat manouvres. Yes, I have become tame and timid here. thanks for the reminder. I've determined to get a Thai licence. The biking will follow in my own good time. You guys....enjoy!

[Ta22]

- if DEATH IS WHAT YUO FEAR

[Ta22]

If DEATH is what you FEAR . let me Assure You by this "

" YOU WILL DIE " one day ..

I had a Bike crash many years ago . when i was young reckless and dangerous ..

i crash my fav sport bike aprillia ( italian sport bike ) at about 180-170 km .

i i was lucky i escape unhurt - even when i was throw about 3-4 cars away

--- the moment of impact . what crosses my mind is not death , in fact it was a peacful feeling .

not Fear ..

Well , anyway afe rthat when i ride i felt funny feeling and kinda weird .. a tinging feeling that i might meet die at the next turn ..

so years pass..i travel in asia alot ..blah blah blah .blah ..

i got a Small Motorcycle in chiangmai ..

is a OLD 100cc Honda Dream ..

here a List of places i travel on my Honda dream ALONE .

chang rai

mae sai

chang sean

change kong

Hot

mae chan

mai ai

mae jo

laos border along the meakong river

lamphun

lampang

Lee

Theon

Tak

Mae sot

many more which i can't spell the name or i don'tknow what is the name

i almost reach bangkok . but my motor cycle broke down on the highway .. some stranger with a pick up help me and send me to the nearest town . spending 1 days waiting for my bike to be fix .. i lost the excitment to travel on so i made my way back .

Radius of about 50 km - 100 km from chiangmai is offen travelled on my Honda dream .

one of my fav hobby is riding out to unknown .. just travelling and enjoying the trip

when iw as younger i was doing alot of backpacking , the trip i enjoy most would be travelling from singapore to china crossing all the border by land ..

singapore , malaysia , thailand , laos , china .

- By no mean i am comparing anyone to my travel list .. to me travel can be from any distance ..

be it from your door step to the cloest 7-11

or from your living room to your bedroom .. all this is travelling ..

this is what push me on .

cos i don't see the distance and hardship or dangerous ..

my idea of travel is simple .. - riding in town .. usually i travel about 10-20 km a day .

some day i travell as much as 30 km .. i need to fill my gas tanks every 2 days

LET meet up - would be more then happy to travel .

how about one of the local market to start off - warm up trip

[Blinky Bill]

If DEATH is what you FEAR . let me Assure You by this "

" YOU WILL DIE " one day ..

I had a Bike crash many years ago . when i was young reckless and dangerous ..

i crash my fav sport bike aprillia ( italian sport bike ) at about 180-170 km .

i i was lucky i escape unhurt - even when i was throw about 3-4 cars away

--- the moment of impact . what crosses my mind is not death , in fact it was a peacful feeling .

not Fear ......................

At that speed the cars must have been spaced about 20 metres apart.......

Edited October 28, 2006 by Blinky Bill

[Rasseru]

Wow, what a thread. I applaud you, dibella, not only for your personal adventurousness and generosity, but also for having managed to inspire the broadest range of interesting and heartfelt responses I've seen on this forum yet. I think people should be lining up to hang out and have fun with you . . . even at 6:30 in the morning!

[dibella]

Hi again, and thanks for all the great comments. My wi-fi access is sketchy so I would appreciate any knowledge of good places to hangout and use wi-fi.

> ignoring the voice of caution which says

> "that's madness" or "you can't do that".

> we saw our friend's parachute fail to open.

> After almost losing my sight a few years ago,

> I determined to make the very most

In my earlier post I said: "find ourselves dead, or worse, mutilated and paralyzed." I should say "regret" being mulitated or paralyzed as I believe we might still live productive lives in spite of such injuries, as long as we do not become as vegetables. Risking our lives gives us a lot to think about if we take the time. The issue is really more about being safe, attentive, and mindful of others in spite of all the dangers. Drugs and alcohol put everyone at risk and we need to watch out for the other guy who abuses them. Technical failures are yet another story.

> If DEATH is what you FEAR . let me Assure You by this

> YOU WILL DIE one day ..

A certain amount of fear is healthy, but then it can get in the way if we don't know where to draw the line. When I ride Chiangmai streets and see the youths in their school dress zooming along in heavy traffic two on a bike without helmets, or the families of three all on a motorbike riding in traffic as if it's the everyday thing to do, or the mom with a three year old in front of her, it all makes me wonder. One thing I know for sure, when you are on a bike the cars are really no obsticle. For the most part they are crawling along so slow you just weave around through them. Whether the traffic is light or heavy I get to where I want to go in the same amount of time. At the traffic signals you just go to the front of the line and take off when the light changes. It's only on the roads where the bigger vehicles are traveling fast that it seems scary. In that case I just keep far to the left and go along rather slowly. Everyone seems to be quite aware and respectful of each other here. When traffic is really crawling that is when it is fun to weave through it all. It is only the exhaust fumes that ruin the day.

> I had a Bike crash many years ago .

> when i was young reckless and dangerous ..

> i was lucky i escape unhurt -

> even when i was throw about 3-4 cars away

> moment of impact . what crosses my mind is not death

> in fact it was a peacful feeling. not Fear ..

In 1976 when I was 20 I was thrown 300 feet as a passenger on a MC. We hit a car at an intersection going highway speeds. The driver of the MC was killed on impact. I survived with a compound fracture of the femur and other minor injuries. I never used a motorbike again, but with my love for the open road took up bicycle riding. A few years ago I traveled across several US states living on a recumbent bicycle for months at a time. The dangers of the road and carnage on the road is no stranger to me.

Once on the bicycle I was slammed in the back of the neck by a rear view mirror going at highway speed. Fortunately the mirrors on these new vehicles are designed to break off on impact. I was stunned and sore but survived. If it was the older solid stationary mirror you would not be reading this as I would be dead. This happened on a cross country bicycle tour in Oklahoma in the year 2000. You are right about the moment of impact.

> here a List of places i travel on my Honda dream ALONE .

> chang rai, mae sai, chang sean, change kong, Hot

> mae chan, mai ai, mae jo, laos border along the meakong river

> lamphun, lampang, Lee, Theon, Tak, Mae sot

> Radius of about 50 km - 100 km from chiangmai

> is often travelled on my Honda

> one of my fav hobby is riding out to unknown ..

> just travelling and enjoying the trip

> i don't see the distance and hardship or dangerous ..

> my idea of travel is simple .. - riding in town ..

> usually i travel about 10-20 km a day .

> LET meet up - would be more then happy to travel .

> how about one of the local market to start of

This is exactly what I am talking about. Having seen quite a bit of Chiangmai (but surely not all by any means) I am starting to get anxious to go out on longer journeys to the surrounding areas now. Yes, there is a freedom in going at it alone - to be able to quickly turn down any street without confusing those behind you, or to stop anywhere on a whim to take a photo. Maybe a group of two might be all that is needed if both understand the needs and whims of the other. Nothing beats the freedom of solo riding but riding in pairs has it's benefit as well. Basically if this post just helps those of us who find motorbike touring a pleasure to network and get together that would be good. I know nothing of this area and much prefer when another who is confident and competent leads the way. Sounds like you are experienced and know what is necessary to show me and others a lot of interesting sights. Send me an email at hopiland at gmail dot com and we can connect up.

I am still going out for the early morning rides each day alone. Yes it is difficult at times to arise at that hour, but once I am out on the road I feel so happy. The freshness of the day, the monks out on their walks, the energy that is starting to build as the day begins, all ads up to make Chiangmai such a wonderful and mystical experience.

[dibella]

For future reference and for those who happen upon this thread through a google search looking for the detail maps I asked about, I finally found them at the Suriwong Book Center in Chiang Mai. I've attached a map for you in this post. The store is easy to find and they have a huge inventory of everything. I might add that if you are planning a visit to Thailand, you can buy your maps, guide books, language books and tapes, or whatever much cheaper here. If it's not absolutely necessary, wait and get it here. In my opinion there's enough info on the internet to get you by until then, and you can even do without the often heralded "Lonely Planet Guide".

[Mysterious Aussie]

For future reference and for those who happen upon this thread through a google search looking for the detail maps I asked about, I finally found them at the Suriwong Book Center in Chiang Mai. I've attached a map for you in this post. The store is easy to find and they have a huge inventory of everything. I might add that if you are planning a visit to Thailand, you can buy your maps, guide books, language books and tapes, or whatever much cheaper here. If it's not absolutely necessary, wait and get it here. In my opinion there's enough info on the internet to get you by until then, and you can even do without the often heralded "Lonely Planet Guide".

I you best buddy Ta22 a friend is in need. For the future reference and for the aquariuml, which finds this thread incidentally through research which searches the letters of details, on which I asked I found them at the end in the centre of pounds DK in. I applied the letter for you in this post. Store is easy find, and they have the huge equipment only. He could add that, if you cast visit in Thailand, you can his letters, the reins, the pounds of language.

[Ta22]

6 am is kinda late for me ..

i am usually up whole night like now is 3:39 am and i am typing away ..

chances is i sleep about 5-6 am ..

i used to ride my bike at 4-5 am .. in the morning ..

and that is when the street is really nice .. and cold ..

but i do enjoy riding out late night ..

the weather is getting COLD >. so do wear extra clothing .

PM me your Contact .. number .. and e-mail ..

i am alway on MSN ..

i don't mind break fast at about 6 am if i do sleep really late one of this night ..