US says Chinese warship seized Navy underwater drone

[Usernames]

Where's Publicus? He usually camps out on these China topics.

[Andaman Al]

So Trump leaps in before he is even in the chair!

 

Quote

Donald Trump wades into diplomatic crisis with China again - but gets his spelling wrong with 'unpresidented' tweet

 

Quote

Both countries had been seeking to quietly resolve the delicate incident, with the Chinese foreign ministry stating it was working with the United States to "appropriately handle" the matter. President Barack Obama avoided passing comment at his end-of-year press conferenceon Friday. 

But in the early hours of Saturday morning the US president-elect waded into the row, tweeting out a misspelled commentary: "China steals United States Navy research drone in international waters - rips it out of water and takes it to China in unpresidented act."

 

US and China had both appeared keen not to allow the drone capture, which occurred on Thursday in the South China Sea, to escalate into afull blown diplomatic incident.

The Chinese foreign ministry played down the details, explaining it was negotiating with the US over the “glider”, which is used to collect unclassified scientific data.

It said in a brief statement that the two countries were using military channels to "appropriately handle" this issue.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/17/donald-trump-wades-diplomatic-crisis-china-get-spelling-wrong/

 

Trump is absolutely dangerous!

[Elkski]

Part of me says I wish Trump will give China 72 hours notice he will deposit 10 of our oldest tomahawks on the illegal South China Sea base.   They can make the choice to leave or stay.  

[Dustdevil]

Speculate all you want--it's still international waters and a significant shipping lane.

[sgtsabai]

I do believe they are already testing the Trump. I would say fascist but I might offend some folks, I can't so I didn't. And if I did it was all misunderstood joke, right...lol? Hey, it works for the Trump.

 

China will push him to the max and he will either back down or we go to war. Better put those PFD's on, extremely rough seas ahead. This all should have be stopped when the first dredge showed up. China is pushing and pushing and unfortunately when a bully gets away with it time and time again the bully just gets more bold until somebody stands up to him and puts him on the ground, or under the sea in this case. A lot of lives are going to be lost.

[Elkski]

Maybe the strategy was to let China build a working base and then take it intact?

[Andaman Al]

Trump is simply trying every reality TV trick in the book. He was briefed this was going on, he waits a few days then he tweets how bad the Chinese are, the Chinese will give it back (as both sides always do) and Trump will say it was him that got the Chinese to capitulate and return the drone. And 50% of Americans will believe him, just like Carrier.

[halloween]

History is littered with precedents (Trump - note spelling) of countries becoming indebted to weaker neighbours and solving their insolvency by a declaration of war on some pretext. With a new president with the stated intention of running the country like a business, and a SOP of finding ways not to pay his debts, China would be wise not to offer such blatantly illegal provocation. 

[Johpa]

My concern is that although Putin can play Trump like a Stradivarius having "handled" people just like Trump as a profession, the Chinese may serious misjudge having little experience with such an awkward cultural artifact.


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[Thaidream]

Both the US and Russia see China as their enemy because the Chinese present a clear and present danger to both countries. The Chinese goal is to keep seeking and taking the resources of any country that blinks so as to  keep their population docile and the Communist Party in charge. Trump sees Putin as a potential ally against Chinese encroachment in the Pacific Basin and I would expect there will be some type of confrontation if the Chinese keep testing and pushing the American resolve.

[55Jay]

Trump isn't paying attention to his briefings again, or he is and doesn't like not being the center of attention.  

 

The Pentagon has, apparently, worked out the return of the drone.  And then Trump Tweets, "Let 'em keep it".   Kelly Anne Conway has got to be massaging her temples and chewing on extra strength Tylenol  trying to manage Trump and his random blurting issues. 

Edited December 18, 2016 by 55Jay

[elgordo38]

18 hours ago, Usernames said:

 

China is playing into his hands.  Easy to impose a 35 percent tariff on a nation that engages in piracy on the high seas.

You may want to consider this comment. Looks like a door has been opened for the Defense contractors in a big way. Bend over taxpayers. Here comes the Golden Finger Award again. 

 

U.S. Navy Secretary Ray Mabus cited a “growing China” as one of the reasons that the Navy needed to expand its fleet to 355 ships, including 12 carriers, 104 large surface combatants, 38 amphibious ships and 66 submarines.

[elgordo38]

17 hours ago, Usernames said:

Where's Publicus? He usually camps out on these China topics.

Having a napicus. 

[rijb]

3 hours ago, Thaidream said:

Both the US and Russia see China as their enemy because the Chinese present a clear and present danger to both countries. The Chinese goal is to keep seeking and taking the resources of any country that blinks so as to  keep their population docile and the Communist Party in charge. Trump sees Putin as a potential ally against Chinese encroachment in the Pacific Basin and I would expect there will be some type of confrontation if the Chinese keep testing and pushing the American resolve.

 

Many countries see China as a clear and present danger, except Thailand.  And now the Philippines.

Edited December 18, 2016 by rijb

[Basil B]

Maybe the Americans will in future fit such drones with anti tamper explosives.

[Silurian]

On 12/17/2016 at 4:15 PM, dunroaming said:

It will be interesting to see how Trump handles the situations when China starts "testing" him as hey undoubtedly will.

 

Looks like he just won't care.

 

Trump: US should let China keep seized drone

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/12/18/trump-us-should-let-china-keep-seized-drone.html

 

[Elkski]

Maybe the strategy was to let China build a working base and then take it intact?

 

Glider?  I wonder what the glide ratio is?  So no motor or noise!   Just glides off as it depends then blows ballast tank to surface.   Hmmm. If gliders in air have 60/1 ratios what is it in a water glider?  The same I recon.  So in 1000 m deep water a vessel can decent for 60 km then accent for another 60 km +/-  hmmm.  

[oldsailor35]

On 17/12/2016 at 5:20 PM, Usernames said:

Wonder if there is an auto destruct built in to go off if it doesn't get countermanded in time?

All drones of every type , should have this facility built in. Either remote destruct or automatic.

 

[Silurian]

10 hours ago, oldsailor35 said:

All drones of every type , should have this facility built in. Either remote destruct or automatic.

 

 

Well, it was stated that this captured drone was commercially available. A little dangerous if it has destruct abilities...maybe attach a Samsung Galaxy Note 7?

 

"The Pentagon confirmed the incident at a news briefing and said the drone used commercially available technology and sold for about $150,000."

[hawker9000]

On ‎12‎/‎17‎/‎2016 at 1:12 AM, jpinx said:

Positioning -- naval tactics are not your strong point, are they?

It was an oceanographic "glider" FPS.    This incident was a deliberate stick-in-the-eye by the Chinese.  The message they're sending isn't about the UUV, or even about the South China Sea.  It was purely a know-your-place/bow-before-us thing.  Every professional diplomat everywhere in the world understands the intent and the in-your-face aggression it represents.   Thank-you Obama, boy statesman, for shrinking U.S. credibility and commitment to the point where this can happen.   Trump will have a difficult choice now.  He can either prostrate himself and accept the new "Chinese world order", or he can do what needs to be done to reverse the trajectory (and that's going to result in SOME sort of confrontation - inevitably).   This is the position that idiot Obama leaves him in.

 

[jpinx]

11 minutes ago, hawker9000 said:

It was an oceanographic "glider" FPS.    This incident was a deliberate stick-in-the-eye by the Chinese.  The message they're sending isn't about the UUV, or even about the South China Sea.  It was purely a know-your-place/bow-before-us thing.  Every professional diplomat everywhere in the world understands the intent and the in-your-face aggression it represents.   Thank-you Obama, boy statesman, for shrinking U.S. credibility and commitment to the point where this can happen.   Trump will have a difficult choice now.  He can either prostrate himself and accept the new "Chinese world order", or he can do what needs to be done to reverse the trajectory (and that's going to result in SOME sort of confrontation - inevitably).   This is the position that idiot Obama leaves him in.

 

Maybe the chinese see this action as catch-up for the US flying over the "islands"

[craigt3365]

2 minutes ago, jpinx said:

Maybe the chinese see this action as catch-up for the US flying over the "islands"

You mean flying over islands the Chinese illegally occupy?  That actually belong to other nations?  Hmmm....

[jpinx]

1 minute ago, craigt3365 said:

You mean flying over islands the Chinese illegally occupy?  That actually belong to other nations?  Hmmm....

you need to look at this from all sides --  not only from your personal perception of right and wrong  

[craigt3365]

17 minutes ago, jpinx said:

you need to look at this from all sides --  not only from your personal perception of right and wrong  

That was a ruling from the International court.  Not my personal perception. 

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-36771749

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It says China's "nine-dash line", which China uses to demarcate its territorial claims, is unlawful under the UNCLOS convention.

 

From the Permanent Court of Arbitration in The Hague.

Edited December 20, 2016 by craigt3365

[jpinx]

7 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

That was a ruling from the International court.  Not my personal perception. 

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-36771749

 

From the Permanent Court of Arbitration in The Hague.

But China does not recognise the ruling. 

[hawker9000]

18 minutes ago, jpinx said:

you need to look at this from all sides --  not only from your personal perception of right and wrong  

You need to get a clue.  How about from the perspective international law as it relates to freedom of navigation in (and aviation over) international waters?   You really think this is all about some U.S. (or a TV member's - LOL) claim to these waters or this airspace?   You can't be serious!  It's most certainly not about any U.S. territorial stake, and NO ONE recognizes the absurd Chinese claims except CHINA!!!!   NO ONE!   It's a blatant territorial grab and theft of the resources within that territory.   China is squatting; and massively so.   It's simple, it's plain, and it's enormous!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jpinx]

1 minute ago, hawker9000 said:

You need to get a clue.  How about from the perspective international law as it relates to freedom of navigation in (and aviation over) international waters?   You really think this is all about some U.S. (or a TV member's - LOL) claim to these waters or this airspace?   You can't be serious!  It's most certainly not about any U.S. territorial stake, and NO ONE recognizes the absurd Chinese claims except CHINA!!!!   NO ONE!   It's a blatant territorial grab and theft of the resources within that territory.   China is squatting; and massively so.   It's simple, it's plain, and it's enormous!

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's not possible to impose western ideas of right and wrong in asia.  International law is a western concept.   If China is "squatting" and the US is so incensed - why has nothing been done?

[jpinx]

China has built these islands and nobody did anything.  China chases away any non-chinese boats and aircraft and no-one does anything.  China puts military equipment on the islands and *Still* no-one does anything.  What the US and others need to realise is that the only thing that is going to stop this pantomime is the US Pacific fleet cruising up there and blockading the islands -- but no-one has the guts for that, so China continues to build and re-inforce.  The longer they are allowed to continue, the harder this is going to be to resolve, and the greater the risk of a messy end.  Stealing the drone was just another poke in the eye from China - -designed to demonstrate that China has control.

Edited December 20, 2016 by jpinx

[Rhys]

Did the American Military ever give back the sub they appropriated from the China?

 

[craigt3365]

1 hour ago, jpinx said:

But China does not recognise the ruling. 

But you said it was my perception.  Which it is not.  Understood China doesn't recognize the ruling.  Thus, the problems.