bbradsby

OP, hopefully we just missed the part where you got written approval of your block wall floor plans from the HOA and the structural engineer of the building? Gypsum board on metal studs would have served your purposes easily, including wall-mounted equipment, and acoustically could have done as well with proper design & construction. If gyp/stud walls were what the original builders used, thats what the structure is designed for. Likely not anything more!

[edit] I see now that its done, seemingly without the above approvals? If so, youre banking your - and your downstairs neighbors - fate on the safety margin of the engineering design [unknown] and the quality of [Thai!] construction. No one should consider the OP's path as one to follow.

Danger. You risk losing it all in a swindle if youre not entrusting the land purchase to a Thai wife. Even then, your investment is only as secure as your marriage. Research the many threads on " Real Estate, housing, house and land ownership" - not the "DIY Housing Forum."

Simple answer: buy a condo.

Good comments above, but be aware that one cannot refer to Thailand's "tropical climate" as a singular beast. If you look into the Koppen climate zones, the Northern mountain climates are obviously not like the coastal Tropics, so high thermal mass may be made to work. Northeastern plains have a climate similar to the African Sahel, very dry but with heavy, seasonal monsoon rains when they do happen. Diurnal temperature ranges makes a high thermal mass building system workable - but only if high R-value ceiling insulation, great attic ventilation, and serious overhangs are designed specifically in response to sun angles, large windows oriented to utilize predominant breezes. Still, there will be nights where you'll want an A/C to take the edge off unless your fully acclimatized. These are just a primer, and good building performance requires a systems approach to design that begins at the property lines and moves in from there.

Warning about earth block or rammed earth systems - they are inherently dangerous in seismically active areas, and parts of the North and West do have some seismic activity. I've designed and constructed Pise' buildings in Seismic Zone 4 [ as seismically active as it gets] but thats steel reinforced soil-cement mix pneumatically placed. Not for beginners.

Then, wind is another lateral loading consideration. Monsoon winds in the Northeast plains can be extreme, so wall height and geometry are important considerations.

Then theres the soil selection and mix. Organic matter in the mix (dung...) weakens the mix and invites mold, mildew, bugs. And, lastly, sourcing proper non-expansive clay is critical to safety, much less success. Good luck running various, alternative soil samples to a lab in Thailand, and cost of soil import to your site if the stuff onsite isn't suitable, will be prohibitive. Has anybody found a soils map for Thailand? If so, please share a link to this Group.

After all the above considerations are solved, and you've actually verified that a simple CMU house isn't cheaper for the same thermal mass performance, a stabilized earth mix with 10% portland cement and sealer coat on the exterior should get it done. Let us know how you do, as it happens!

All the best,

Feel free to PM me for further discussions.

The pool can help very much in cooling the house in the hot-dry season in Isaan - look at a salt water pool, so chlorine smell doesn't take over the house.

Shade the courtyard, south & west walls. Full stop. You have to protect your exterior walls and paved surfaces from sun to the largest degree possible to keep from getting cooked (temperature or electricity bill from air-con)

Add columns along the courtyard to carry the 2m overhangs you mention. Then, add another 1m overhang. seriously, shade that courtyard, and add planting areas in there as well. Plants cool the air around them via evapo-transpiration.

Your design should be able to be built for THB15,000 per m2 if you keep it simple geometrically, and get a proper set of drawings and decent builder.

Yes, it would condense moisture on the cool side of the assembly if the existing concrete above does not have insulation above it.

Is the existing roof/ceiling assembly a low-slope concrete slab with a roofing membrane on top? If so, you should think about an (google it) 'inverted roof' assembly with extruded polystyrene insulation over your existing roof membrane, held down with basically a big net and gravel ballast. That will keep the mass of the concrete nice and cool, working for oyu versus against you as it is now. Just make sure your engineer/architect would agree to the added weight of the ballast needed to keep the exterior roof insulation from blowing away in the wind. The attached detail shows a green roof, even cooler as it provides evaporative cooling, if lots more weight; all you need is ballast.

Or just go with rigid insulation on the concrete deck to insulate the mass, cover it with roof sheathing, then do a torch-down single-ply roof.

The naturally-occurring convection air currents in the occupied space evaporate any moisture that forms on the ceiling surface. It's trapped moisture (inside the wall system) that just sits and grows mold and destroys the gyp board and damages finishes. The ceilings stay pretty dry in the absence of a roof leak.

In hot climates, rain or humidity is absorbed into the exterior concrete/plaster/block masonry material like a sponge. Then solar insolation or just ambient exterior tropical heat drives the vapor through the wall toward the relatively drier & cooler inside air until it hits a surface with a temperature at or below the dew point. Thats where it collects. If it's inside a non-ventilated cavity (gyp on block wall), thats the problem. If it condenses on the inside finished surface (your typical, simple block & cement render wall) where the air currents evaporate it.

To minimize moisture problems, place insulation on the warm side of the wall assembly, as far as possible. In the tropics, that is the exterior side and outside the blockwork is ideal. Of course, no one does that, since building science is not practiced in LoS - just layperson knowledge that is passed from generation to generation. Was not a problem long as houses were built from tropical rainforest woods which are naturally resistant to fungal & insect attack. The problems started when all the forests were cut down and concrete block was introduced late in the 20th century. The folk techniques are not adapting, and the universities here dont appear to be developing any building science programs. Its all coming from the Western universities, institutes, and Western-influenced or managed local building material manufacturers. QCon would be an example.

Great information. I'm in Mexico now for six months, and may end up buying a house here. I had inquired on a local expat message board here and asked why they don't use a layer of fiberglass beneath the ultra-high (12' to 13' high) ceilings with a simple gyspum/wallboard ceiling beneath them and was told that gyspum wouldn't work because of the high humidity. I didn't understand, but see the same kind of warning in this thread. What would happen to a gypsum ceiling with fiberglass insulation above it? Does the humidity eat away at the gypsum and it crumbles? Does the paper disintegrate? Or, what? Would a water-sealant applied before the pain help?

If I understand correctly, you are asking about Gypsum (drywall) on the ceiling, and fiberglass insulation over it to insulate the ceiling from the attic heat??

Most suspended ceilings are made this way here in Thailand. They frame the ceiling with metal strips, insulate with fiberglass insulation over the metal strips, then they attach drywall underneath the metal strips, tape and plaster normally as in the west.

For ceilings it does not seem to be a problem. I was told because the heat from the attic keep the Gypsum dry.

But I was warned not to use it in the walls, because the lack of circulation and high humidity, could cause mold . I don't know how true that is, I have not tried it my self.

I am just as interested as you to find out as I like working with drywall.

Perhaps some one who has used Gypsum on the wall, and have had it for a while, could chime in and tell as what his/hers experience is.

Yes, that's the scenario I was considering: Gypsum/drywall facing the room with a layer of fiber insulation above that. I'm confused on the idea that "heat from the attic keep the Gypsum dry" -- if the insulation was adequate, would the heat not be reaching the gypsum? I don't think fiber insluation would wick moisture away from the gypsum, would it?

In the old world in the old days when I grew up, gypsum was simply screwed to wooden beams (2x4's or 2x6's?) and the fiberglass insulation rolled between the wood beams. It got pretty hot & humid during the summers and that system seemed to work pretty well, but I was clearly told it was not a valid option for the humid Mexican weather which is pretty much the same as humid Thailand weather, I think.

Theyre blowing hot air up your serape.

Hot air holds moisture just fine, hot attics dont dry out insulated ceilings, and insulated gyp ceilings are mandatory in hot climates, whether humid or arid. the vapor pressure pushes the water molecules through your building assembly via osmosis and air pressure differential. Thats ok, but you do want to stop air infiltration.

For an insulated assembly - ceiling or wall - gyp board is fine in a wet tropical climate. If you get mold-resistant gyp, all the better. For framed walls, this is common knowledge. However, local custom for walls is uninsulated blockwork, and there's the rub if you cover it with gyp - the water vapor will migrate (a good thing, as you dont want to trap it with a plastic barrier) but then get condensed on the concealed, inside surface of the block where the temperature meets the dew point - think about the outside of a glass of beer on a hot day in Samui. If you cover this surface with gyp board you will trap that condensation and mold will be happy to move in, eat the paper off the gyp and drink your dew.

If you use blockwork w/ gyp. board, use AAC block, insulate the inside face of block with 50mm rigid polystyrene, then install gyp on metal Hat Channels screwed through the insulation into the AAC; or for a cheaper solution use AAC block, render it, and work to keep it in the shade from 10:00AM to 5:00PM. Anything you can't shade, paint with radiant reflective paint. GIYF for all these terms/materials.

If you do build a loft home you will need to look at how to support that wide open area. Our upper floor was made from 4m concrete beams fitted crossways and relying on support from the middle uprights.

If I do this, I'll go with lightweight steel framing. Such structure will probably support itself.

As you have zero experience in construction, this will be your biggest challenge to a successfully delivered project. As you are clearly very particular on what you want, you'll need to bird-dog it full-time, buy six months of an experienced, English & Thai speaking construction manager's time to manage the trades and interpret drawings alongside you and head off mistakes before/as they happen... and they will happen weekly, if not daily. Possibly thrice daily, as you are not going "Local" in your design.

Where is your site, either already purchased or preferred? IF you are upcountry, you should stop now with the idea of building "outside the [Thai] box." If suburban or urban you have a chance of success with the right team.

To feel completely safe I will need to hire two guys like that, and provoke a feud between them, so that they keep an eye on each other. Divide et domicilium.

As for the rest, you are right, but I have guardedly high expectations about those fancy "building systems", and a handful of corresponding providers are active in Thailand, mostly in commercial and industrial segments. Those systems work like an erector set, so it's more difficult, though not impossible, to cut corners, and screw up — it simply will not fit where it doesn't belong, unless one tries really really hard.

Besides, when I contacted one of the providers, they claimed that they can give me the crew for framing assembly (at least), or may be even for the whole project (the guy sounded unclear). I am not holding my breath — the crew will be Thai, and Their boss will be Thai, and their work ethic will be Thai, but situation looks almost manageable from where I am standing. And I still have one year to do my homework.

There is nothing wrong in being self-complacent.

OK then. Your plan seems fool-proof, so you should be safe.

Be sure to post pix of the project progress and cost on this forum to pay forward the benefit you've received from the responders who took the time to offer their experience and advice to your request.

OP, for your proposed design I recommend the following:

Framing in steel; as the thai concrete trade here for single family residential projects is abysmally low-tech and actually would be dangerous for the spans you indicate in your photos. One of the other poster's comments about the amount of water in their concrete is spot-on. And add the improper rebar placement, poor forming & shoring, and stripping of forms before the concrete has set, all make for dangerous structural concrete beyond 4m column spacing if even that. Concrete overhead on your project would be a bad idea, depending on final design of course.

As for all projects, you must get a proper set of drawings in Thai (for builders) and English (for you to play along) for architectural, structural, electrical & plumbing. These are required for getting a proper building priced and constructed. I can do these for you, whether steel or concrete frame, loft or otherwise. pm me if you would like to pursue this.

As you have zero experience in construction, this will be your biggest challenge to a successfully delivered project. As you are clearly very particular on what you want, you'll need to bird-dog it full-time, buy six months of an experienced, English & Thai speaking construction manager's time to manage the trades and interpret drawings alongside you and head off mistakes before/as they happen... and they will happen weekly, if not daily. Possibly thrice daily, as you are not going "Local" in your design.

Where is your site, either already purchased or preferred? IF you are upcountry, you should stop now with the idea of building "outside the [Thai] box." If suburban or urban you have a chance of success with the right team.

All the best,

Most usefull item from the US in hardware that I've never seen anywhere in Thailand are the hollow wall anchors known as butterfly bolts. (spring loaded self opening anchors). Always bring a bunch whenever I'm stateside. Another (just to blow Thai's minds and tongues) Habanero Pepper seeds which you can find at home depots plant dept.

I like the seeds idea. And, proper tortillas... truly pine for these in LoS. NONE of the restaurants or especially the grocery stores have anything I'd put on my plate.

main thing for me is proper machine tools. the ones in LoS are generally made of pig metal, except for one store called Tool Pro (pretty sure) on the edge of Udonthani.

My wife bought a Nexus in Texas. With a Thai plug.

i bought a fork in New York, (and a spare in Delaware), a hair cut in Connecticut, a guitar in Utah, a banana in Nevada, a coat hanger in Montana, played poker in Dakota (North and South), oh the list goes on

Sheila, dont forget tequila from yr Tia Juana in Tiajuana.

It's important to select a "home branch" near where you live since for some banking activities you have to go to that office.

Bangkok Bank will continue to accept accounts from Americans since they're the only Thai bank authorized for direct deposit of monthly payments from SS, VA, etc.

Also, since they have a commercial branch in NYC it's cheap and easy to use on-line banking to transfer funds from your U.S. account to your Thai Bangkok Bank account via ACH transfer. They also have a London commercial branch and something similar can be done. There are instructions on the Bangkok Bank website.

No need to go to NYC or London to set up these features. It's simply done following the instructions on their website once you have your local Bangkok Bank account. Oh, I did have to call my credit union in the U.S. to double check how to do an on-line "inter-bank transfer", to confirm that it was indeed an ACH transfer. Yup, very slick. The funds showed up in my Bangkok Bank account within a couple hours with minimal charges.

One more point on this is to be sure that your US bank or credit union clerk is applying the domestic transfer fee (if applicable) to your account, rather than the higher international transfer fee. The confusion could present itself seeing that the money is going into the Bangkok Bank. I speak from experience; the error was caught, and fees were adjusted.

So transfers from NYC BKK Bank to BKK BKK Bank (and vice versa) are not charged the international electronic funds transfer fee of ± $45.00?

3.5" SIP is pretty good insulation, as it's polystyrene or polyiso foam filled. Much better than brick or block. Make sure your ceiling is equally insulated and weatherstrip / seal the door & any window gaps to minimize infiltration of hot outside air. Also, make sure the edges of your SIP's are sealed (caulked).

Then, put a few good coats of concrete sealer on the slab. This is where your moisture is coming from, as concrete is a great sponge and will pull moisture from the soil continuously and them transfer it to your cooler inside air via evaporation... and then deposit it via condensation on the cool metal of your machine. Not cool.

Plant some banana trees on the west side for instant shade on your west facing wall, then install the beer keg fridge and let me know when its time to inspect!

Isaan is quite large. Where are you?

The proper response depends on whether youre in the coastal/peninsular wet Tropics portion of Thailand, or the seasonally dry & hot up-country sections. If you are up-country, then yes, closing up the house during the day during the hot/dry season is optimal. You are using the shaded thermal mass of your interior structure & walls to slow and attenuate temperature swings inside the living space. On a more subtle level, they also literally pull heat from warm bodies via radiation, and this helps quite a bit.

Combine this with effective weatherstripping of all exterior openings, and minimizing interior heat loads such as refrigerators in your "Living Zone," and you can keep the inside air quite comfortable with a little air movement at just above the floor level. Ceiling fans can work against you on this by mixing the stratified air and bringing the hot layer near the ceiling down to your living zone.

For the wet tropics, these strategies will work against you by making for a damp interior space without serious dehumidification or a completely different design & oeration strategy such as low mass building systems, 110% shaded site and lots of ventilation and cold beer... but I'm out of time for now.

+1 to most everything Naam said, but add:

Keep glass in shade from mid morning to late afternoon to avoid massive heat gain using the recommended single pane windows.

You're probably referring to blown-in loose-fill insulation on top of the ceiling, but just in case, I wouldn't recommend spray foam on top of a ceiling; it'll encase cabling and light fixtures, which could cause an overheat/fire danger condition and will for sure make future electrical remodel work or troubleshooting problematic.

For one-off, custom homes, your chances of success are all about the cash flow: whos 'up" at the exact moment of the negotiation in question. This assumes a full-time Western construction manager to manage the payment:work in-place ratio week-to-week. Most here are working directly with rural farmer-builders, so imagine you're working with a water buffalo with delicate ego and power tools and you get the picture of how effective discussions will be if you dont hold the cash upper hand.

The large, merchant Thai developers, on the other hand, must perform to building standards, And I know from personal experience that they will rectify a situation if you put a gun to their project development site manager's head while kindly informing him of an element in your house that doesnt meet standards and is unsafe.

The veiled threat must be that they either fix your problem or you'll call the building department and then theyll look like an idiot or on the take in front of their boss and will have to fix the entire moobahn/condo building's worth. They don't care about your kids' safety of course, but they don't want to be embarrassed in front of their moobahn director and/or home office.

Element in question was lack of safety glass in the sliding glass doors of a spanking new, high end Land & Houses moobahn. Issue was made right within days. But you need jai yen and the message happens in Bhasa Thai, so if you cant do it your Thai wife or GF needs the stones to do it. That may actually be the hard part.

MMmmm... a few things pop up for me:

1. TeleTubby mansion. A bit goofy IMHO, but whatever blows yr kilt up.

2. He built a load bearing masonry dome structure, in Thailand Full Stop.

3. Then he painted it a sun-absorbing dark color... Should be a proper Roaster most of the year.

4. They'll move out, and the locals will convert it to a karaoke or brick firing kiln within a few months.

5. It's all good for the local economy.

TiT. The solution is merely to understand that when doing a custom house or customizing any portion thereof, you must hire a professional [read: non-Thai]. This is true anywhere in the world.

Now its done, but not a huge thing. Relax. Know you'll NEVER get money back in Thailand, will lose more months, money, hair and heartache trying to fight it. Cut to the inevitable chase scene: take it as a learning experience, then do it /contract it yourself. Upgrade the wires in the in-wall conduit that all merchant builders use, install a new GFCI breaker in it's own sub-panel off the main distribution panel if there's no room in the existing main panel. Done. The feeders upstream of the meter should be up to the job unless youve maxed out the house with air con units.

The sparky knowledge-base here is awesome, and someone can chime in on wire sizes if you provide the tech specs on your water heater.

All the best,

With proper traps, you only need a typical floor drain assembly. more complexity here is a rusting hair catcher, wasted money, and will work against you quickly in the maintenance department.

For spread footings bearing on a pad, most folks here wait at least one rainy season's worth of pounding down the pad, and then have at-it. If your pad material is solid and you have a engineered design, you may get by with spread footings in lieu of driven piles.

To me, its a false economy, what with the cost of 1m deep excavation, forming, rebar, then the concrete for a footing. Generally, every crossing of floor beams receives a footing, so it quickly comes up to 30 footings for a modest three-bedroom house, and your site begins to resemble a WWI battlefield... LOTS of really big holes. Then when its all said & done, your entire investment is resting on the relative merits of the dirt pad some farmer dropped off on your site.

Me, I always design and recommend driven piles for concrete construction unless site geotech strata indicate otherwise.

As stated, so that endlessly recurrent questions about dripping A/C units, appliance sticker removal, what's the best ant repellant, and clogged drains... don't clog up the DIY Housing Forum, whose title could change to DIY House Design & Construction to indicate housing design, construction, remodels/additions... DIY Housing.

This would be pretty clear, clean up the forum, and get people to the subject matter they want, faster.

What say, all?