Schuimpge

Hopefully it will go the same way as the Crypto-Tax 2yrs ago.

Memo out from Revenue Department: Starting 2022, everyone need to report their income from Crypto trading and pay 15% withholding tax on that.

Crypto Exchanges: Mr. Revenue, how do you want our customers to calculate the income? 
Revenue Department: Errmm, we don't know. They just report income to us.

Crypto Exchanges: Here's a list of possible ways to calculate, and by the way, by law we are not required to provide you any info on our customer's trades, just to note..

Revenue Department: Hmmmm that's going to be very difficult..we'll get back to you.

Revenue Department: Ok, we've decided to delay the tax for 2 years. In January 2024 everyone has to report their crypto-income in their Personal Income Tax.

But, there's still no clear directions on how to calculate that income.

On 9/30/2023 at 3:10 PM, Isaan sailor said:

Amazingly, in the US, we have eleven states that tax Social Security income.

Check the Dutch taxes: They'll tax your savings based on an ASSUMED ROI! Yes, you read that correct. They assume you could make 5% on your savings and that's your tax-rate on it. 

20 minutes ago, Yumthai said:

 

Actually even less .

 

480K THB - 60K (Self allowance) = 420K THB taxable imcome = 19,500 THB PIT = 4.1% average tax rate

 

If wife has no income:

480K THB - 60K (Self allowance) - 60K (Wife without income allowance) = 360K THB taxable imcome = 13,500 THB PIT = 2.8% average tax rate

 

A taxpayer of 65 years old or older is entitled to up to 190K THB of income exemption from his total income, so first non-exempt PIT tier rate (5%) will start at 190K not 150K. That could reduce even more the average tax rate.  

 

If taxpayer has income from employment:

480K THB - 100K (Expenses) - 60K (Self allowance) - 60K (Wife without income allowance) = 260K THB taxable imcome = 5,500 THB PIT = 1.1% average tax rate

 

Updated 2023 information on Thailand PIT and deductions:

https://taxsummaries.pwc.com/thailand/individual/taxes-on-personal-income

 

https://taxsummaries.pwc.com/thailand/individual/deductions

Thanks for the detailed breakdown. Yep, indeed with more allowances and exemptions, tax becomes very reasonable in Thailand. My calculation was based on 65k p/month with no deductions as a maximum tax payment example.

I divert some of my monthly income between my wife and myself, so that I stay in a lower tax-bracket for example. if there's parents or grandparents, that would also give you deductibles, but only for one child (if there's more than one that pay tax). 

Put some money in an RMF or SFF. Not the highest returns, but it's a maximum of 600k THB that you don't give to the tax-man, instead you create a nice savings account. Do that for a couple years and you don't have to worry about health-insurance so much, instead consider paying cash if anything happens and maybe use the cheapest health-insurance available.

26 minutes ago, jerrymahoney said:

65,000 x 12 = 780,000

Your Calculation is correct, but you forget the 60,000 taxpayer allowance deduction. So the taxable income would be 720,000 THB.

1 minute ago, Irrumator said:

What about residents from a country in which their income is low enough that they  fall into the tax exempt band?

So does that mean they will also be tax exempt here? 

Guess not, it's money that's not taxed before.. but that situation would likely mean that you're also in the tax-exempt bracket over here, assuming that you're from a low-income country in such situation and working here to support your family at home.
 

2 hours ago, jerrymahoney said:

Well for a simple analysis, if you are on an exension via marriage at 40,000 baht per month that is 480,000 baht per year which would put you in the 10% bracket.

 

So 4000 baht per month for taxes or $US 100+ per month even assuming  ALL of the 40K per month is taxable.

 

The problem for extension via retirement is that the 65K per month would likewise put you in the 20% bracket. OUCH. Hopefully at least Social Security would be exempt and you would only pay tax on the difference between your SocSec and the 65K which you could try to keep in the 5% bracket.

No, it would put you in the 15% bracket, which puts your monthly tax at 145 USD.

example tax.xlsx

On 9/26/2023 at 4:45 PM, chickenslegs said:

I don't know how @Schuimpge did it, but I found a Thai income tax calculator - here ... https://www.uobam.co.th/en/tax-calculation

This includes deductibles.

Using an excel file. My accountant uses that to prepare my taxes. Will drop an empty version here tomorrow. Thai taxes are dead-simple. Literally 10 minutes

33 minutes ago, hwas said:

Greetings from the LTR Visa Unit.

 

We want to clarify that the tax exemption for overseas income will commence from the month you receive the LTR Visa onward, which typically falls within the next tax year. 

 

Any income earned in the period prior to holding the LTR Visa will not be considered for tax exemption.

 

 

Thanks for that info. Very useful. 

Question: Let's say I apply and be granted an LTR Visa in 2024. I have my savings/investments from working, it's outside Thailand. I put my savings in Fixed Deposits and they start generating interest.

Would the generated interest then be considered Tax Exempt?

What I'm really curious about is: With an offshore account, using a debit or credit card, how will they track/tax that?

Speculating here, if I pull cash from an ATM with a foreign debit-card, pretty sure that banks can only track transactions linked to their customer's accounts because of security measures around ATM card use. So when a foreigner using an ATM card from a foreign bank gets cash from say BBL ATM, then the ATM establishes a link with the foreigner's bank and only records the cash withdrawal, but not the account-details from the foreigner.

Credit-cards are even worse I guess...

4 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

You are mixing up LTR and Elite.  LTR costs 50k for two times 5 years.

 

Also BOI will have several issues to "clarify" with the Tax people, no one can be sure of the outcome. They will have to chose between  extra Tax revenue or attracting affluent foreigners.

You're right..I copied that info from the links given by the OP. They used LTR-visa, which I copied, and I assume (from their wording), that they mean elite-visa.. but it's 2 different visa.

17 minutes ago, Schuimpge said:

It already works that way. First 150k is tax free, then up to 300k is 5% etc. 35% tax applies only to income above 5m THB. So for a foreigner living off a pension, if you'd spend 100k THB/month, you would pay zero tax if your country has a double-tax agreement, if not, then your tax (without deductibles) would be 150,000 THB/year. (GBP 282.00 p/month)
If you're living of 50,000 THB p/month and you had to pay full tax, then your tax p/year would be 33,500 THB (GBP 63.00 per month).

Sorry, read your post again, it's the opposite from what I understood at first.

Lowering the starting  bracket for income tax you mean if I read correctly.

That would be really messy with very little extra revenue I think.

Let's assume very generously that you'd get 10 million people to pay the lowest tax-rate. 

10m x 33,500 THB ~ THB 29 billion. 

Attack the top 5% richest people in Thailand. That would instantly solve financial problems for the next 10 years..lol.

Another source would be non-registered businesses. There's hardly any person that sells stuff in markets and along the street that pays tax. Plenty of them make a decent living from that. Why do I have to register my business and they do not?

9 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

This is a clear as u can get at this stage:

 

Foreign source income

Long Term Resident Visa Tax

 

But I am sure it can all end up somewhat different

Lol, yep.. as clear as mud, since LTR tax rules are now basically void given 'Foreign Source Income' instruction No. Por 161/2566 item number 2: "All rules, regulations, orders, responses to consultations or practices that are contrary to or inconsistent with this Instruction are cancelled;"

So any 'wealthy citizen or retiree or work-from-Thailand' person who just invested a million baht in an LTR on the basis of zero tax now needs to pay tax on funds brought into Thailand if not under double tax agreements. 

I see some nice mess coming up. Sure will kill off the elite visa scheme.

6 hours ago, actonion said:

Why not raise the threshold  so lower earning  Thais  pay income tax,...  my  (Thai) wife,  53 years old, has held an office job all her working life &  has never paid   income  tax

It already works that way. First 150k is tax free, then up to 300k is 5% etc. 35% tax applies only to income above 5m THB. So for a foreigner living off a pension, if you'd spend 100k THB/month, you would pay zero tax if your country has a double-tax agreement, if not, then your tax (without deductibles) would be 150,000 THB/year. (GBP 282.00 p/month)
If you're living of 50,000 THB p/month and you had to pay full tax, then your tax p/year would be 33,500 THB (GBP 63.00 per month).

5 hours ago, pluto_manibo said:

The article is a bit misleading and xenophobic. The law is not only aimed at foreigners, all the Thai people who work abroad, invest abroad and want to remit funds, trying to survive in this difficult economic climate are the main targets.

 

To end all confusion, the correct interpretation is: "The law is aimed at all Thai tax-residents with overseas funds/income/earnings". (A Thai tax-resident is anyone residing in Thailand for more than 180 days per 1 calendar year.) You could be Santa from the North-Pole, you're a tax resident if you stay here for more than 180 days in one year...

My bet right now is that Crypto will be viewed the same as Stocks.

As a retail investor, you're buying crypto, make a profit (capital gains) and that is tax-exempt for individuals.

Cheers,
Luc

Was wondering about taxes just now. So I checked BitKub's support forum.

This is what they state: "We do not apply tax guidelines/policies from any digital asset (cryptocurrency) purchase in any way. The reason behind this is that the Revenue Department does not have clear guidelines to tax this type of purchases. If you want to know more about this, we strongly suggest getting in touch with the Revenue Department directly.

For questions and inquiries, please feel free to contact us."

Looks clear to me. There's no reporting from them.

On 5/22/2020 at 5:10 PM, Bob A Kneale said:

"It’s not a grime, it’s rat urine and droppings and yes it is included to wipe the dirt if made during service". 

That's exactly what I said, if the grime occurred as a result of the work done at the dealer, the dealer should clean it.  In your case the dealer didn't cause the grime stains.

 

"So you telling me leaving under the hood filthy dirty is a standard?"

Once again, yes, I am.  If the dealer didn't cause the mess, why should he clean your engine?  You didn't pay for an engine clean.

 

"I can not help but wonder if you ever owned a new car and had it serviced by the dealer"

Yes, I have, many times and not once did the dealer clean the engine without being asked and charging for it.

 

I can't but wonder why you would keep banging on about expecting a free engine clean when the dealer wasn't responsible for the dirt.

Sorry to burst your bubble.. Every time my car or my wife's car goes for service at the Pathumtani dealer, it's delivered back clean.. washed inside and out, including under the hood.

Also, service, appointment, drive in at the agreed time, I'll leave it there and go back home. They'll call me for for anything they find aside of the first diagnose and normal service items. Even a 300 Baht part needs replacing.. they'll call and let me know. I can leave it or give the ok for them to replace.. (which I always do)..

Do know that these are 2nd hand cars I did not buy at their dealership!

I just hate it that Ford stopped selling small cars here, as now I gotta figure a way to replace my wife's 2013 Fiesta some day soon with something else Ford, just so we'll keep the same dealer for servicing.. 

On 5/3/2020 at 8:46 PM, donmuang37 said:

If you aren't happy with the Pattaya dealer, you can take your vehicle to any Ford dealer in Thailand. In the past few years we have bought a Fiesta, a Focus and 2 Ranger Wildtraks, including my current Wildtrak Bi-Turbo. We have had outstanding service from our Pathum Thani dealer. Good luck!

Second that. Fiesta 2013 and Everest 2016, both bought second hand, serviced @ Pathum Ford Dealer. Great service, fast, easy and reasonable priced.. 

3 hours ago, Berkshire said:

Wow.  This gentleman has lost what's left of his mind. 

You're being generous to assume that he even had one to start with.

House-Loans, (2 shophouses combined, different bank-loans) SCB for one because they extended the 3% flood-interest rate for another couple years. The other was a bank-sale with KrungThai. Not using the accounts for anything else.

SCB (local branch) used to have good service and helpful. New manager ended that.

Recently bought another shophouse for my brother, which was done through the BBL branch I use for personal banking. Other banks came with loads of rubbish upfront to submit and clear. Not so with BBL. Clear list of documents, submit that, no need to bank-statements Sir, we have that already. Sat at their branch for an hour or so to sign everything, after that it took about 7 days for approval and get to the land-office. Wonderful.. easy and fast.

Everything else is BBL as well. 2 accounts, at the branch close to my factory in Navanakorn. Dealing only with 1 guy taking care of everything, including the house-loan mentioned. Last two years started with an LTF and RMF fund. Everything arranged in my own office, guy comes over with documents, we discuss and fill in everything, he goes back to the bank and finishes everything. 

Calls me with advise on new funds every now and then, but very polite, nothing pushy. Happy with that.

Company same, 3 accounts (2 different companies), all with BBL. Very fast transfers from overseas, low cost, easy to use online-banking and good safety controls.

Their new ATM card.. problematic initially, getting better. Some GSB ATM's still not accepting it. Mostly in Thailand anyway, so I'm ok with that. Using AMEX for most on-line payments/orders from eBay and the likes.

In the end, what counts most for me is that I'm taken care of well. Personal contact and good service is very high on my list for choosing and staying with a bank (or any other service provider, be it a car-garage, insurance, anything)

Cheers,
Luc

Here's an example of Isaan lighting design and electric craftsmanship:

Compliments, this absolutely beats anything I've seen before.

I especially like the safety-pins.. They really give an artistic touch to it...

Cheers,

Luc

You people make me laugh !!!

Look at your own houses, I am an Electrical Field Foreman in Saudi Arabia in charge of 6 oil rigs, I DO understand electricity. How many of you have appliances with the 2 round pins and the hole in it for the Earth connection (which can't connect) and still use them?

Do you REALLY expect Somchai, from the rice paddy to understand electricity? He is all you are going to get for 200 to 500 baht a day. There are electricians in this country who actually know what they are doing but hey are making $4000 a month.

You want European standards and safety but don't want to pay for it !! And on top of that you wont use your own common sense to ensure your own safety !!!

Well guess what YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR !!

I am in the process of helping a friend have his house wired and although the electrician doesn't seem stupid, his lack of understanding is mind boggling, he didn't even know you could solder wires to make a join !! (until I showed him).

The price of a combined MCB (Miniature Circuit Breaker) / RCD (Residual Current Device) in this country is more than double of that in Australia, and I am talking $40 to $110, no wonder no one uses them !! (I have done the home work and have both quotes). Trying to buy stranded cables here (which are the norm now in Australia) is not impossible but it as sure as Dickin's isn't easy I still haven't got it in my hand yet).

The power distribution system in this country from my own observation is actually very good. Too good, the transformers are grounded. The "mess" you see out there is the telecommunications system, not electric. They actually have standards, and appear to follow them. The problem is there appears to be no standards for the home, after the meter it is a "free for all". If I am wrong and someone has a copy of household electrical standards PLEASE send them to me.

So how much is your life worth? Would you pay $100 for a DOT approved helmet when you ride your bike? or do you wear an ice cream bucket because you can? Would you pay me my travelling and accommodation costs from Phuket and let's say $50 an hour to make sure your electrical installation is safe (not fixing it just inspecting and testing it)?

I am VERY sorry that 2 young lives were taken before their time , but ALL of you are just a culpable, put up or shut up !!! Don't just turn a blind eye, do something about it !! Put your money where your mouth is......

Fully agree with you. Into the second renovation, had the same Sparky coming over again.

When I renovate, I literally strip the house. Most people here, they put a lick of paint and it's good to go. But what you don't see is how the electric was done when the house was built!

Both my houses (next to each other) where build by Property Perfect. And boy I can tell you, the electric is plain horror. All loose cable on the gypsum ceilings, HomePro connecting aircons and heaters to that 2-wire mains directly from the meter by stripping some cable mantle, twist the aircon wires around it and then of course tape!

So when I renovated, I stripped all, then proper earth, yellow pipes for all cabling, grounded sockets for all appliances.

My sparky came in last week for the second house. Asked me if the first one was still ok. Big grin on my face...told him, even the floods in my village where no problem at all. Just switched off the kitchen and the rest perfectly ok.

My neighbors mostly left because of the shoddy electric installations they had.

A good sparky is easy to find in Thailand. You only need the slightest bit of common sense yourself

Electrocution doesn't have to mean deceased. Assume it does in this case, though I've combed the article and don't find it written.

He was asked to call the parents of the two kids. So to answer your question... Yes..both..

I would think the salary tax depends on the salaries paid.

I'm not sure about the insurance fees: What kind of business are you talking about?

Does the fee of THB 15,000 for a one-year visa include the fee for the work permit?

Thanks for the replies, the business is a 1 man I.T. business working from home our clients are mainly Thai businesses, I will however occasionally need to pay for the services of people to assist me and I believe although not 100% that the 15,000bht includes a work-permit.

I'm obviously looking to keep my initial start up costs to an absolute minimum whilst however obviously keeping everything legitimate.

Any advice is much appreciated.

You will need to ask whoever offered the visa service for THB 15,000 whether it includes the WP. In fact, the visa fees are very low, it is the WP that is more expensive.

Unless you have 4 Thai staff and at least THB 2,000,000 investment, you cannot legally work in this company though.

Interesting topic. Can you hire nominees and pay them 1 baht a month on order to meet the local staff requirements? If you are required by law to pay minimum salary, do you need to show proof?

Can a foreigner obtain a business license and own a business directly?

For work permit you need to show accounts for a certain period of time.

Those accounts need to show a profit or they might require you to increase the paid-up capital...

You also need to show Social Security Records for the persons that work for you.

You then need to provide pictures of your work-place / company.

The Social Security Records are the taxes paid every month, based on the salary paid to each employee. This has to be the minimum wage at least.

There might be additional requirements and the officer on the case might request documents as he/she sees fit.

So yes, you need to show 'quite some' proof.

Cheers

Luc