rayongchelsea

On 07/02/2018 at 12:12 PM, AdrianBerry said:

I thought that it was time for another update on what is happening with my case...

 

After meeting with the OCPB in September,  they were committed to putting my file before the "Selection Committee" to see if it warranted being handled by their lawyers.  What that meant was a March time frame was given for the next sitting of the committee - no guarantee that it would have been selected or not, 6 months away, I decided to go it on my own and pay for the lawyer myself (Thai bureaucracy moves ...very... slow) as the legal fees are covered at part of the contract as claimable as well as the associated expenses I have made in relation to the travel to Bangkok and even potentially the lost opportunity costs (the money I would have received if the units had been rented out.

 

So I selected a local Pattaya lawyer that a friend had recommended who had recently won a case for him and speaks excellent English (previously I have gone through an "agent" that would relay all of the information to the Thai speaking lawyer - everything needed to be translated and I never got what I wanted explained).  I thought that his rate was reasonable (THB 50,000) for the initial court filing and handling - at least he was not asking for a straight % fee (I had been quoted 10% oor THB 300,000 by one lawyer) and was confident that I had a solid case.

 

My lawyer filed the case with in November with the Pattaya Provincial Civil Court.  As It had to do with a consumer complaint, I did not have to have to pay the 2% (bond?) fee to the Court.  I had our first meeting with the defendant's lawyer on Monday (they actually sent a "lawyer" this time and came from Bangkok as the company is based there) if they had not showed up or had send a clerk again like they had in the past, I would have "won" the initial submission and he would have asked for a judgement based on my submission and lack of appearance.

 

Not surprisingly, their side tried to get me to take one or both of the units "at a discount" though no numbers were thrown around - in reality even if I took one unit, they would still owe me money at this point.  I refused the offer on the basis that I am aware of significant safety issues in the property that would a:) expensive to fix and b:) they have already passed inspection.  Besides, they have exhibited unsavoury behaviour that I would not want to be associated with them as a tenant in the future.

 

The best that they would come up with was repayment of the principal amount.  I held firm to demanding the 7 1/2% interest and legal fees in addition to the principal but waived my claim to the opportunity costs.  The mediator who sat with us failed to get a resolution and he took his paperwork to the Judge to get him to sign off on it and arrange the next appearance date in 15 days (their lawyer was pissed off she had to cut her Chinese New Year trip short - awwww) No way I will pass up on the interest - they have been using my money for 5 years and still have the units to sell off... I will not reward them for bad behaviour.

 

The director of the company (through the lawyer) was saying he wished he could have just called me to resolve the issue instead of getting dragged to Court and to the OCPB - every email and every letter has my phone number right there! - He also had opportunity to answer my Facebook message that I sent him as well!

 

I was shocked that the Judge (who was signing off on the paperwork) came into the mediation room and tried to explain the "lay of the land" - he was getting nowhere in getting me to relent my position so he sent the lawyers out of the room to have a one-on-one with me.  He said that he has seen dozens of these cases here in Pattaya and that I should consider taking their offer as is was "as good as I was going to get" - or that it will end up going on and on for years (likely 2 or 3 years depending on appeal).  BRING IT ON!  There is no way I will "reward" a developer in giving up THB 700,000 in interest just because they think they are clever and can refuse to answer my letters and claims!

 

The director still has still not called me days later, I gave them 7 days to accept my reduced offer and we meet again on the 20th...  I am hoping for a resolution as I have a very good Contract but I think that they are just too foolish to give up.

In my opinion you should be focusing on the validity of the building. You’ll get no where by yourself or by focusing on your snags..

I very much doubt if they have complied with all the building “safety” requirements, e.g fire. Ask them if they complied with all necessary local and governmental requirements.

There is probably a standard clause in your contract that states all such compliance’s are in place.

You should be focusing on the tessabaan documentation and looking at the overall title deed of the property at the land department.

request a book of the rules and regulations for the condo..ask them to show the warranties for things like air con etc...look at the list of common property, have they all been transferred to the juristic office.

The developer doesn’t care, if you begin to realise that then you will realise and make sense of his actions.You have 2 units in a building where the committee and management company will be put in place by the developer...you simply have no idea what mess is to come..absolutely under no circumstances transfer..forget the 700k..

you never know what other cr*p is out there...and you clearly have not been educated in the Thai legal process..50k is nothing and how it works..

Good luck for your stance..

I think anyone who lives here for any significant amount of time, wherever, will get the blues, to the d..ckheads that say Pattaya is not Thailand, yes it is, just a different shade..

I don't mean to be rude or critical but here it is.

I was originally born and lived for my first 18 years in the U.S.

I worked for nearly 45 years in almost a dozen various countries around the world. None were perfect but I enjoyed them all by learning to adjust to where I was and I learned to live with myself.

Here is the truth, if you can not live with yourself wherever you happen to be in the world you will not be happy anywhere.

Thinking there is place that will make you happy if you can't live with yourself is an illusion.

If you can't learn to be your own person and not depend on where you are to be happy you are not going to be happy.

It took me over 60 years of life to learn that..... I'm retired and pushing 69 years later this year.

Just try to remember, every day you wake up and see the sun is still shining, is a good day.

Excellent post.

I'm a bit lost here.My experience over the years is that a few chaps come from the Land Office with new cement cone things , measure accurately disregarding any old ones and fat Poo Yai nit wits. Their .word goes I've found. They move ones placed by bribes from years ago and tell anyone who moans to .... off

Yep, i have the same experience.

Neighbour encroached for several meters, sold then the land to a police officer, the shit started when this police officer did put up a fence...

My father in law can not read or write, so i stepped in...

Land office comes, measure up, replaces if needed. costs 6000 bath, no bribes...

Even it was not my land, but my father in laws, the mear presence from a foreigner, who knows how to deal with things...

Life is much more simple if you don't give in to a bully... without being one yourself...

Bottom line, respect the law, use the law and be nice..

I shook hands with the police officer, tapped him amical on his shoulder, thanked him for his correctness and drunk a few beers with him..

No harm done, now good friends.

You try doing that when very influential parties are involved. Go to a meeting to arbitrate and have policemen present, they weren't there to drink beers.

Whatever ones circumstances it doesn't have to be 100% purgatory.

^^^^ effects the people who can afford to buy there, class doesn't go hand in hand with money.

No but it's a good indicator of how people behavior.

Is it any different to all other country's round the world?

You be screwed up where ever you live.lol

Rubbish.....................

hellstens is right.

No he is not. There is just no comparison...geez!! Been in court for 3 years , so I know..seen it with others etc...it's just complete and utter nonsense to even think they are even close..

Have a similar problem drinker in my extended Thai family. He and his wife (also increasingly drunk over her inability to cope with her loser husband) lived with MIL. We live nearby and the whole family is pretty close-knit - evening meal always taken group-mode.

My wife got them and family kicked out of the MIL's house. 6 months later my MIL relented and accepted them back to live.

I provide family support where it is needed have paid to help this increasingly drunk sister-in-law to get a school assistant's job and would pay to support her daughters if it all came to tears (I would do that in the UK in an equivalent situation; I'm not especially charitable (or stupid), just lucky to have had a good ride in life and a believer that families are important). I would never pay money for him other than a one-time attempt to get him proper help if I was convinced he wanted help.

My wife has never asked for help for him or his wife. It should not be assumed that all Thai ladies are helplessly bound to the family-first concept. They can be just as strong-minded as any Western gal, so don't fall into the trap of using Thainess as an excuse for sticking with a relationship or family situation that is driving you mental.

Even when you are not asked, it leaves you with a moral dilemna. They are both heading for the grave at 35. My wife is quite clear that the situation will only resolve if her sister kicks drunken bum out and it seems to me that it is only lack of confidence about a husband-less future (emotional and financial) that prevents this. It is quite possible that the offer of some financial support would lubricate the right result, but every piece of advice I ever read steers me away from getting involved. Being selfish I could paint many pictures where it goes badly for me (violent husband backlash being uppermost).

It's all the stuff of life in Thailand. Drives you mad but still way better than sitting on a promenade in Broadstairs or hacking round yet another windy golf course. What a barmy proposition that TV members seem to postulate here. Leave a perfectly good relationship in pursuit of some mythical invention whereby you choose a life-style on the basis of no extended family ties or some perfection of family ties? Save it for the bar-stool johnnies, many of whom probably never had a proper relationship in their lives.

Life in Thailand ( or elsewhere) is still better without out all this " stuff". You ain't helping at all from your stool of superiority....

Why on earth buy in Thai company?....the beauty of condos is owning them.

he'll learn.....

coughng up 15k a year audit fees, making false declarations to the revenue that the company receives no revenue...

only a matter of time before there's a knock on the door.

And then when he tries to sell it, realising that Thai Company stuff isn't desirable unless its for nowt, he'll be in for a long wait....

....

thai company name is not a problem, i could have bought in foreign name but when you sell a unit in a foreign name then you must pay ( 40% i think ) more tax on the overall value of the property.

correct me if im wrong.

so nobody anything positive to say about buying a condo from matrix ? or even buying a condo to re sell, look at all the condos on nova mirage wongamnat 10 years on and theyre still keeping their prices.

Thai company is a big problem you reduce those who are likely to buy to almost no one, Condos are not very liquid to start with , you have just compounded that problem. If you sell as an individual it's about 5% and you can split it. If you sell to an individual you will need to transfer the asset ( taxed) out and dissolve the company yourself..

The corruption at schools is prevalent in the US, too. I just spent five minutes looking up these beauties. The one about the airplane purchse isn't the biggest, but maybe the most laughable (don't give them any ideas).

http://www.parentadvocates.org/nicecontent/dsp_printable.cfm?articleID=7485

https://www.azag.gov/press-release/terry-goddard-filing-petition-place-colorado-city-school-district-receivership

http://tucsoncitizen.com/morgue2/2005/11/29/122216-santa-cruz-schools-leader-indicted/

and in the case of the third item, Mr. Conchola was convicted of felony embezzlement, and promptly won re-election to his post.

I can never see the point of alluding to examples from another country as they don't in any way mitigate or justify the corruption in Thailand.

Totally agree. It makes the poster look stupid as opposed to contributing anything. It's systematic corruption here. It's a mind set..

everything seems to be okay. your wife has a bit of land which she can spare and she can provide a bit of rice and fish when he can choke it down which wont be often. you dont buy him anything and he has chosen a slow death. when the time comes , the local public hospital will take him in to die. you dont need to do any more, every family has one or two. they die relatively soon.

Unfortunately this is the reality.

Jeez..who needs this cr*p when you move countries..just don't do the white savior thingy which many seem prone to do...this is just the start of a living hell for you..I guess the father is dead of booze already..

and why not?

What is wrong with helping other human being? or are you one of those use and abuse kind?

Don't be silly. How can you infer that from what I said. Use and abuse..what sort of thought process extrapolates to that..

Jeez..who needs this cr*p when you move countries..just don't do the white savior thingy which many seem prone to do...this is just the start of a living hell for you..I guess the father is dead of booze already..

Being a complete cynic of these types of visas since I investigated it back in 2006 for a friend of mine..I think in 2015 it seems to be a viable alternative to those who can afford it..albeit with the usual risks attached to most promotions, visa rules etc..as for the 20 years more a gimmick..

They are not just here to play football. They are here to represent a local company..they failed in the latter..the outcome seems appropriate as it would be in any other industry.

It always seems to be the have-nots who start these threads, claiming they are better people by virtue of having less. Those who have more are put down and despised for their affluence. Commenters on both sides appear to have very little insight or understanding outside their own circles and rely far too much on media stereotypes, in my opinion. A little more understanding and a little less hate might be nice.

But the main stereotype on this board is that to live in the "real"Thailand you have to live in a village. You know as well as I that 25 years ago you could live an old traditional type house off Sathorn. Styles change.

The jealousy at times seems to be one way.This is another phenomena that I don't understand. One foreigner being jealous of the other..I know I am harping back but it use to be the case that just living in Thailand was a "winner" and that very few had a lot and if you did it didn't really matter.

Sure, Thai students don't do as well as their neighbors in scoring exams .. so what? How much do words on a piece of paper really mean? I'm sure they'd fail a Western-baised IQ test too. A stupid Thai has a much greater chance of serviving in Thai society than a well-educated farang. They were raised in Thailand, they know more than you ever will. All the subtilties of spoken and body gestures they've ingested over a life time trump all of our colored perceptions.

If anyone has hopes a culture with convert over to something more of your liking has a long wait. Like generations.

Oh brother; I only hope English is your 2nd language.

You have some serious spelling and grammatical limitations.

Firstly, we are not talking specifically about exams.

It's the new world mate; globalisation and competitiveness.

Get with the program bud.

I suggest you read and digest the entire thread before making further comments.

Agree. These foreigners who don't want the Thais to progress, especially if they have families are the worse sort.

The Thai may not be so "stupid" if they had access to better more equal opportunity education system.

Having more money than you need is better than just having enough money to live. You will be far happy in the former situation. Thailand is not cheap, health, children's education , good housing etc..having limited funds will catch up with eventually of that you can be assured. Never quite sure what a Thai lifestyle is..does it mean living like a poor one..all these restaurants, condos by the beach, nice cars , decent schools are these just the life style of a non Thai..

It's a general excuse to everything these days

I am refused buses because "it is not my country"

I am refused sales because "it is not my country"

etc...

And so we have another Thai bashing thread. A guy has has a traffic dispute and then it becomes a debate on why Thailand is the pits.

The oppressed and the persecuted. Life must be extremely miserable for you in Thailand.

Thai visa the hub of moaners, complainers and wringers. Why anyone would want to stay in a country where they are so unhappy beats me.

It could be because they would be far unhappier in their home country especially if it is the UK.

Why the UK. I have friends over regularly, they like to visit but none want to retire here....

Change isn't necessary western..Thailand has changed massively over the last 25 years..partly because there are too many foreigners here..so you part of the change. They did well without you here..

If you don't think English is important you are mistaken, but then again I doubt you have ever worked here....

You infer that you work in Thailand, but, consider that there are too many foreigners here.

That loud whooshing noise you hear, is a shed-full of irony whizzing over your head........

Stopped working in Thailand a decade ago, having worked here for years prior..but I like the reply..

Turning Thailand into the West is the only thing that will ruin Thailand. They've done fine without the West for a few thousand years.

And, what would you call failure? What do you call smart? What is the standard for success? Look how many products are imported from Thailand. Back in the States, I didn't see many things with made in England on them, or Australia, or even "Made in USA."

And, as far as speaking English? Why? People want diversity so they can go to McDonalds' in Russia? English is a very clumsy language. (Not that many others are better.) Let's not put your own laziness for not learning a foreign language as a noose around anothers' neck.

Another comment..that's it suits me fine , why change it. Patronizing..

Change isn't necessary western..Thailand has changed massively over the last 25 years..partly because there are too many foreigners here..so you part of the change. They did well without you here..

If you don't think English is important you are mistaken, but then again I doubt you have ever worked here....

This topic has come up before...I have to pass many aggressive dogs in my Moobaan & I have said before - but doubt anyone believes it or is willing to try it - I carry dog treats - lots of them. And while a few are still not that friendly, the others are so glad to see me. No longer interested in biting me - very keen to see what the treats of the day are. Aggression begets aggression & whilst 1 or 2 dogs will be aggressive no matter what dog treats work wonders. Soi dogs are used to nothing but abuse - believe me, they are so delighted to get a treat. Have had a few foaming at the mouth ready to bite - but a tasty treat did the trick. Yes, really...

But you at some point become the main treat..yes, really..

^^^ true but what was appealing when you are young is not so appealing when you are older. Thailand knocks the spots off of those countries as we get closer to retirement.

As I said, one man's meat.....

20 years in the army and 16 years before that with a father who was harder to live with than khaki. "When soldiers die they go to heaven because they've already served their time in Hell" they used to say back in the day.

I'm not far from retirement myself, I choose to work. Having been a soldier through the dark days of the IRA and The Falklands, I expected the worst at any time, so dying doesn't bother me now and camping out a taxi ride from the nearest modern medical facility isn't a priority for me.

As I said, I've lived in Thailand, so enlighten me, "knocks the spots off Cambodia" I'm curious, how so? - apart from the better medical facilities?

I have a child and as a single parent priorities change. I live in Bangkok in a very good area..and all that comes with that..good medical, easy life style, close proximity to everything I need , good security, reasonable education etc..basically more choice..not anything I would have considered when I first came to Thailand in the late seventies...

My brother in law was blown up by the Ira in the chatrem ( spelling) bombing..he survived..your life perspective will be different from almost everyone else..especially those who come to live in Thailand today.

I have a Cambodian neighbor..lovely guy..

Good luck.

^^^ true but what was appealing when you are young is not so appealing when you are older. Thailand knocks the spots off of those countries as we get closer to retirement.

" As of 2012, the Thailand automotive industry was the largest in Southeast Asia and the 9th largest in the World. The Thailand industry has an annual output of near 1.5 million vehicles (mostly commercial vehicles), more than countries such as Belgium, the United Kingdom, Italy, Czech Republic, and Turkey"

There is no Thai automotive industry.

There are no Thai cars.. ( except maybe tuk tuks?)

Automotive industries from developed countries are taking advantage of Thailand's cheap uneducated labor to assemble their products for a fraction of the cost of assempl in their home countries.

Most motorcycles are produced here for the same reason..

.exploiting the cheap uneducated labor available here in Thailand.

I read recently that many Thais believe that FORD is a Thai car company! ( they are assembled here, right?)

Does Singapore have an auto industry? Hong Kong? How about most Euro countries, do they all have internationally recognized autos? Is there an Aussie brand auto? You're nit-picking. Would you rather Thailand not manufacture cars at all?

It's not just about cheap labor, otherwise manufacturers would be building cars in Somalia. Thailand has the infrastructure and workforce to support major manufacturing. But I'm sure anything positive about Thailand offends you.

Your argument is a good one, but because you always so one sided when discussing anything they loose credibility..why add the last sentence..

People must see your name and just switch off, the same with that other guy " something 69", you need to be more balanced..

There is a great manufacturing base here in Thailand, although primarily low skilled.

There are many positives about Thailand, but this topic ain't one of them.