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Justaword
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Posts posted by Justaword
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It meets a psychological need to come up with an explanation for an event that causes fear. It is one of the reasons why there are so many conspiracy theories around. Human's have a great fear of the unknown and will go to great lengths to create explanations.
You also just defined religion, and I give my hat to you for this words.
To stay on topic, somebody mentioned that you are actually competent on forensic pathology, contrarily to most CSI apprentices here. You may find interesting the interview of the local doctor, found "somewhere else" on the net.
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Half a bottle of Samsung mixed with Coke and Redbull served in a small plastic bucket. A cheap and efficient way of getting very drunk, very quickly,, just what the youngsters want.I admit I have never been to Phi Phi and have no idea what a "special" bucket is.
Nope. That's a "standard" bucket. "special" refers to addition of recreational drugs at your request. Or insistence of the bar staff .It's fairly common in most popular SEA location targeting early-mid 20's travelers, with a good proportion of them willing to "try" even if they have never used drugs before. I am not speculating about the real reason of the death, only a thoroughly (and transparent) investigation may reveal the truth. Just saying that the OP suggestion was valid compared to some idiocies I have read in this thread.....
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More likely tainted party drugs than food poisoning
Finally a more open-minded reply.
Are you accusing these girls of cooking up some recreational drugs for just themselves in their bathroom? Even if someone supplied them the drugs then unless they were intentionally poisoned we would expect others that bought the drugs to be suffering the same consequences.. no?
If you knew Phi Phi, you would know what a "special" bucket is. Poster merely mentions that a (failed) mix is one of the plausible explanations.....
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Was there a window in their room ..?? Ground level...?? So the murderer got out through a window...? since the chain was on the door according to the Fox News report ???
To fuel your speculations, ground level and sliding glass door (not counting the chain locked door). Plus police collected various items including "headphones" with no mention of an attached device. Good luck Sherlock......
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it doesn't matter the local police have said food poisoning ... so until the source is discovered and confirmed then all local restaurants should be closed ... as well as investigations at local markets etc ..
If they confirm it is not food poisoning then OK .
better to be safe than sorry
If it is not food poisoning then the hotel and area should be closed until the source is found .....
Then you will have to evacuate the island. I am not saying you are wrong, but you have at least a couple of thousand people isolated on a very small island (which I know well as I used to work there for a while) with no other feeding options than to eat in the restaurants around. By now most of the tourist on the island should be aware of what happened. Are they leaving in mass ? Haven't heard about it, although I agree that they should, or resolve to not eat, drink only bottled water, sleep on the beach etc etc.....
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'Meanwhile Pol Col Wissawa Sanehha of Phi Phi sub police station said the initial police investigation had found that the sisters had visited a bar on the island that night before having a meal at a restaurant along the beach.
Dr Komkrit Phukrittayakami, director of Krabi Hospital said that from the condition of the bodies, it was likely that death had been caused by contaminated food but that an autopsy would be required to discover whether this was seafood, mushrooms or chemical substances.'
as posted at the beginning of this thread ... I assume that until the source of the poisoning is discovered all restaurants in the area are closed ? and that tourists are advised what is safe or not to eat .....and if there is suspicion even .005% that the poison came from around the resort then that or they should be closed too ...
If they have already identified in which place they drank and eat, yes, the logical move would be to shut down these places until more details are uncovered. But if you shut down all the restaurants "on the beach" my guess is that they would re-sold their stocks to the places still open....
What bothers me in this story is that only the two sisters have been affected. They MUST have drank or eaten the same thing, and only them.
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Thailand
Pufferfish, called pakpao in Thailand, are usually consumed by mistake. They are often cheaper than other fish, and because they contain inconsistent levels of toxins between fish and season, there is little awareness or monitoring of the danger. Consumers are regularly hospitalized and some even die from the poisoning.
But does this posion cause cyanosis ?....dont think it does....something like cynanide does..
I does: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetrodotoxin#symptoms_and_treatment
As the paralysis and aphonia would explain why they didn't seek for help.
And although epilepsy-like convulsions could lead to blood in the mouth due to tongue biting, it still doesn't explain skin lesions.
I am surprised nobody mentioned yet meningitis ("perfect" symptoms), leptospirosis or......whatever, possibilities are almost endless, and only a proper autopsy and full toxicology test can lead to an explanation.
The bottom line is that speculations are only speculations. And I agree with the posters who fustigate TV CSI experts.
The "facts" people are trying to interpret are still changing, depending who is quoted, who translated it, etc etc.
Start of a cover-up ? Looks like. I can see in the new headline an effort to discharge the hotel from any responsibility.
Link to Chiang Mai events or Laleena guesthouse ? Just a supposition which is not backed up by any fact so far. Similarities, yes. As per any case of poisoning....
"poisoning", "food poisoning", or "poisoning by food contaminated by a chemical" ? Don't forget that all headlines here are often poorly reported or translated....
In the meanwhile, RIP to the victims and sincere condolences to the family....
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@ OP : been there, except for the kid.....
First thought after your initial post was "take holidays", like many others said, but when you started to disclose more details things started to look a bit differently....
Some people wrote great comments, and some very balanced opinions have been expressed. Can't quote everybody, but there is an unusual amount of wisdom in this thread !
Other people just kept quoting each other on the usual "thai vs foreigner" rant, as usual TV trolls do, but your latest comments suggest you are well aware of it....
So, I will give you my OPINION, which is only the result of my 11+ years personal (intense) experience here, but by this not meant by any ways to be the "perfect" answer :
- Not only you are in Thailand, which "culture" is already puzzling for most foreigners, but you are in Isaan, despised even by "educated" Thais. I live here at the moment, like you, and trying to compare to our western experiences is utterly useless. Your girl doesn't say "hello" when she comes back ? Don't take it personal. Mine didn't do neither, until I complained about it, and still......
She actually had troubles to understand why I was so upset about it. People here don't greet each other as we (farang) do if they see each other every day, unless there is a (very) high level of Thai "respect" involved. People here will almost drop on their knees for a monk or the rich local guy, but will ignore their own kids/parents/brothers/sisters/husbands/wives most of the time.
Even after months of separation, a kid coming back home simply "way" his parents, and then everybody goes back to their own business. Which could be working in the fields, sleeping, or playing cards. I know that in depth it's far more complicated than this, but there is an abyssal gap between what Thai people can think and feel, and whatever they are willing to show.
- Housekeeping etc. Well, unfortunately I have to agree with some of the most radical posts here.....As much as MOST of Thais are very keen on their personal hygiene, the house and surroundings are the least of their problems, UNLESS they they think they belong to the "elite" and therefore have maids and a need to show off with huge empty houses with chromed fences, immaculate lawns etc etc.....
In clear, here, in an Isaan VILLAGE , no matter how much garbage is lying around the place, if your house is bigger than everybody around you still are better than the others....As another poster experienced, I tried to "improve" things in my western way, cleaning the crap, fixing leaking roofs and walls, fighting against the dirt and stuff, locals around were just laughing at me. I even planned painting exterior walls and bugs/moisture protecting major wooden structures, GF wisely advised to forget about it as family and neighbors will think I am insane....But back to your own remarks, yes, when the place REALLY starts to get disgusting, somebody will eventually broom some stuff out.....and that's it. Accept it.....
A poster said he had the feeling he got the twin sister of your miss, well, it's more like there are a few millions of genetically cloned twins around here. And what I mean by this, is that WE (or they?) ARE DIFFERENT, that's it. As strange as it sounds, I have traveled a lot, been involved in relationships a bit everywhere, and settled up in Thailand while admitting that people here behave miles away from what we are used to. Maybe it's the challenge which keep us here.....Oh, by the way, and I am not that old, bald or fat, and finding good looking girls back home has never been a problem. It's just that once I got here, well, I never felt as going back. Hard to explain.In fact, can't even explain it to myself.....
-Trust. Well, as much you seem to trust her, as much she doesn't trust you, if I relate to your trip to UK. Nothing new here. Again, Thai "culture" is made of this. Songs, movies, soapies, all give the same message. Cheating on each other while in a relationship is such a common image here that being faithful is almost felt as "abnormal", and commonly perceived as impossible. No matter what you really do, no matter what you say, your Thai partner will always think that you DO cheat on her/him. And SOME will seek revenge, on the basis that because you "probably" <deleted> around, there is no reason not to do the same. It's like the egg/chick paradox.....
Even without any evidence, at some point, you will be accused of infidelity in any related or not argument. Bear in mind that, EVERYWHERE in the world, there are people practicing the old adage "the best defense is attack". As far as I have experienced, girls (from all over the world) excel in this kind of rhetoric, with Thais being probably the masters.....
- Respect. Maybe the main issue in your situation, as it has been for mine. Yes, as many people have pointed out, there is a lack of "respect" from her side. But always remember that we (farang) don't define it in the same way. There is a very well established hierarchy of respect here, and whoever has lived/worked here can understand the concept. Traditionally, it's Monarchy, Religion, Family. Practically it's Monarchy, then religion and WEALTH. In most Thai eyes, what you are, or what you do, is irrelevant compared to what you OWN. But you have to SHOW your wealth, or nobody will take you seriously. It's not my cup of tea, and it's why I am moving out soon WITH my half to escape family pressure, at least for a while..... Yes, I know, it's sad from OUR point of view. But (unfortunately for us) it's the truth for them.
Oh, and don't forget that unless you are VERY wealthy, as a foreigner you will be always VERY low on the scale of "respect" anyway.
Where I disagree with some posters, in your particular situation, it's about the "scam" between foreign guys vs Thai girls. Yes, s**t happens all the time, heard so many stories I can't even remember half. Western Union is probably making a fortune here, thanks to all the stupid Teeraks around the world...... but I don't think you are in this kind of situation. As rule of thumb, just be sure that the brother or the cousin are what they pretend to be
I have been bothered to post, for once, because your story remembers so much of mine that I couldn't be indifferent. And it sounds that you really need some help. So, the least I could do is to share my experience of a similar situation and how I dealt with it.....
1) "grow some balls" as somebody said, although it has to be taken in a positive way and not as a disguised insult (wear a dress etc etc.....). By western modern standards, doing laundry etc as a guy is viewed these days like a positive attitude, and I was exactly like you, garden included.
But here it's not viewed like this. Not yet at least, and especially not were you and me are living right now. Yes, excessive kindness here is viewed as weakness. Be nice, be fair, don't be arrogant, but don't be weak. "Chicks dig a**holes" is unfortunately true most of the times, everywhere in the world. Doesn't mean you need to be one, but being a doormat will NOT earn you ANY of the respect you are lacking or the attention you are looking for.
Said that, I do understand your position. You are not working, living on your assets, but she does, and she comes back home tired. Fair enough. Same me not so long time ago, although I was making decent money with an online business but "playing on the computer is not working" Yeah.....15 hours of coding a day is not viewed as work here.....Well, whatever. Solution ? Do what you think you have to do in the house to keep it nice and clean, be proud of the fact that YOU are doing it willingly, but tell her to go to hell if she ASKS you to do it. Keep remembering her who is paying the bills. When all arguments fail, money has often the last word.....
Oh, and of course, as somebody suggested earlier on, next time she calls you infuriated asking where you are, answer very spontaneously that you are with the mia noi or for short time or something like this. She will go mad for a bit, but in the end she won't believe you because in her mind you wouldn't say it if it was true, so problem solved. .......It's one of the first tricks I learned here to deal with the ferocious jealousy of some.....But be consistent, say it every time, and she will give up asking. Works like a charm.....As weird as it sounds, Thai DO expect you to lie anyway, the same way they do, and nobody here will believe you if you pretends that you ALWAYS say the truth. Took me a while to get used to that.....
2) clarify money situation. Most (Thai) woman set their priorities early in their lives. Usually here, it's a house, a car and a family, with variations in the order of them, although the family part is the first they get, usually unwillingly.... And of course money on top of it. Westeners include also work gratification and a social status ("power") but in Thailand it seems than only men have real interest in it.
It's not clear if you own (or at least paid for) the house you are living in, but the pick up story says it all. SHE bought the car with HER money without even asking you. Sorry to say it, but unless you paid for the house, you are doomed on the respect side. Of course, you didn't really need a car, and it's parked most of the time. Of course she couldn't really afford it, and it's why she's struggling to pay for it. Doesn't matter. She did Buy it, not you. She did show the money, not you. Even if she did only to prove her independence, you are doomed. Maybe not in her eyes, but in the family/friends eyes, yes. For them, you are a looser. Easy to fix it though, just buy something bigger or a bunch of shiny gold and you will save your face....
By the way, 800k in the bank is merely a car. She works, you don't. She bought a car to show off, you didn't. You were probably smarter than her on this, but it's not what her friends and family will think. And they will keep telling her all the time. And, if it's not done yet, she will start to blame you. Peer pressure, loss of face, call it how you want, but it's there. The only good farangs are the rich ones....
When my miss was still working, you know what her friends were telling her ? "You have a farang boyfriend, why you NEED to work ???" It's a good question.Yes, people talk about "educated" girls, who are proud of their financial independence. Yes, they do exist. They work in offices, companies, some make 20k+, which is not bad here. Bar girls can make a lot more than this, but they have to deal with a far more uncertain future, and usually have kids, BF and brothers to feed.... But who would work a basic job for a misery if they had the choice ?
Your miss works hard for 6k, mine wasn't making much more. Why ? Because she's either scared that you will leave her, so she has to plan for herself, or she doesn't trust your ability to "take care" of her and the family, which is based on the misconception that you are not working hence not earning any money. Or she knows already that you are not part of her future.
I am not saying that ONLY money matters, but it's often the main concern. Ever been to a wedding or a funeral ? Ever been shocked by all the ceremonies about the donations, counting the money received publicly etc etc ? Well, I did....
It took years to my miss to accept the fact that I was "viable", and finally quit her crap job so we could have more time together, as I am now working offshore and my schedule is quite unpredictable. But, as you at some point, I was deceived that without the financial reward of a paid job she suddenly became the laziest one ever....Everybody who has/had an Isaan gf can testify of the incredible ratio of eating/drinking/sleeping/playing cards time spent against any other activity.....And NO, offering money to clean up the place were she is herself living is NOT the solution. She's probably still laughing at the idea.....
So it's where you are. She took for granted that you will do everything in the house, it was somehow justified when she was working, but she then expected the same when she was NOT working, which was wrong even by western standards.
You know what ? You need a life, your life. But you know it already. You said that maybe you just feel lonely. I bet you are over there, on your own.
Go out, find other farangs to have a beer with. Get involved in something which gives you the occasion to spend time out of the house or the garden. Have your own agenda and don't keep on looking for her permanent attention, they hate this.
A girl like yours sounds like mine, they like to have their own time and hate sticky partners, and it's not necessarily for wrongdoing (insert usual rants and doubts here....). She has probably been raised as she raised her kids, with little or no supervision. Appearing and disappearing randomly without notice is as natural as breathing. They have no clue of what WE call respect or even what is to be polite with "ordinary" people in a western way.
Even if you speak fluent Thai, you are lost with the dialects. Even if you could understand what they say, they will not understand you and you will not REALLY understand them. You are a farang, in a country that has no real respect for other cultures.
I have been in your situation, booze included (and yes, it just makes things worst). I wouldn't say I "won", because it's not a game or a war. But at some point I started to stand up again, I remembered when to say NO and when to say <deleted> OFF, and I recovered my dignity, somehow. As strange it can sound, I earned respect by slamming the door and walking away more than once. Sober.
The last couple of times I was really going to give up, many fishes in the sea. I guess she felt it and started to soften. She started to talk. We started to understand, and accept each other as we are, with our differences. Nobody really knows what they have to loose until they are loosing it for good.
Since then everything went better. A lot better. But the fact that I got a new "real" job later on, which keeps me away quite often from the deep Isaan, helps too......
Don't let her slam the door on you again. Do it. Slam it and walk away. If she cares, you will know it. And you will have a chance to talk together. Or take her for a couple of days somewhere else, in a place where she doesn't know anybody, just the two of you. It works for me....
If id doesn't get better, well, maybe it's time to think about yourself. This country is filled with good earthed guy who thought they have met a pearl, until they realize it was only shine on a potato. Or worst. But there are exceptions, of course. Just be aware that the "she's different" line is a magnet for sarcasm....
It seems you would have already left if it wasn't for the daughter. I understand how much you love her. But be aware that even if you sacrify your life for her, you MAY have a lot of deceptions in return later on. As somebody said early on, giving is nice, but don't expect any gratification in return. Especially here.
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Guy down the road from me, fair way down the road has just dumped his sat TV on gone over to high speed internet. Not sure of the provider, but the box was 5000 Baht [Optus] with directional antenna Gets unlimited down load at high speed and can watch live football in HD, Cost 675 Baht a month. He down loads movies in HD at night, my friend now, puts them on a USB so i can watch them. Will ge tthe number of the company in Ubon and post later. Jim
I am desperate for something like this.....Looking forward to get the contact info and will run to Ubon on monday morning !
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by the way:
also ships to Thailand. I recently ordered a set for my girfriend with Menthol smoke juice. she loves it.
What is the delivery delay, usually ?
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BANGKOK, Oct 29 -- Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra on Saturday said she believed the floodwater in Bangkok could reduce by the first week of November if relevant agencies could control the drainage of water, while the government has made preparations to rehabilitate public, agricultural and industrial sectors.
She also urged shops not to stockpile consumer goods to help solve the shortage of supplies to people.
-- TNA 2011-10-29
See ? But it's too late now. Once you say it will last one month, yes, people stockpile. Unfortunately saying now that everything will be better in three days will not refill the shelves...
Early on, Yunglick (as I like to call her) was critisized for not giving dire enough predictions, for not warning everyone that Bangkok stood a high chance of being completely inundated.
Now she is being critisized for having finally come out with the worst predictions.
Which is it? She should have given the worst possible predictions, or she shouldn't have?
If she refrained from being honest about the worst possible outcomes, Bangkok residents failed to evacuate and/or stockpile, and the worst occured, what then? Hundreds of thousands (millions) of stranded, hungry, thirsty people, that's what.
There is absolutely no perfect way to handle a disaster the size of which Thailand has been facing. If you want to find ways to discredit the prime minister, in such a situation, well, its really easy to do, no matter who they may be.
PS - much of the stockpiling isn't by people in the potential flood areas. Even residents of Chonburi, where there are no floods, are stock-piling. Why? Because the flooding that has already occured has cut off a lot of the production and distribution of various basic goods - millions of chickens drowned, shortage of eggs. Bottled water production facilities closed due to flooding. Diaper and formula production/distribution disrupted due to floods (I have a baby, I can testify to this one....). These disruptions in production/distribution have been to actual flooding, not due to speculation based on government warnings.
Fair point. But it's exactly when the resources are low that their distribution become more important. Yes, the production of many goods has been interrupted, but stocks could have lasted longer.
Communication in a disaster time is essential, and I agree that it's extremely difficult ti find what to say, what to hide, and when. People need to know the truth, but nobody wants to create a panic neither. But contradictions always do damage. And not only to credibility.
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BANGKOK, Oct 29 -- Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra on Saturday said she believed the floodwater in Bangkok could reduce by the first week of November if relevant agencies could control the drainage of water, while the government has made preparations to rehabilitate public, agricultural and industrial sectors.
She also urged shops not to stockpile consumer goods to help solve the shortage of supplies to people.
-- TNA 2011-10-29
See ? But it's too late now. Once you say it will last one month, yes, people stockpile. Unfortunately saying now that everything will be better in three days will not refill the shelves...
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Foreigners will lose their confidence in us due to our failure to protect our capital city," she said in hoarse voice.
So from that remark it would seem as if the welfare of the locals is of no importance compared to what, "foreigners" may think or see what is happening ?
Indeed it is so nice that now in her and her governments desperation they seem to be trying to shift blame for their inaction in the past which have led to the current actions onto the , " dreaded foreigners."
Or maybe the welfare of the locals is of no importance compared to Toyota interests. Somebody in another thread suggested that the road cuts proposed by Toyota are aimed at diverting the water from Chachongsao area, where they have two plants. Would be very interesting if somebody with a clue could have a look at the maps and confirm this.....Interesting that the government disregards most of the advices of the BMA and the Royal Department of Irrigation, which both have a long experience of flood management (good or bad is not even the point), but jumps instantly on the Japanese idea....
The real fact may well be, that in terms of natural disasters the Japanese do have long, extensive and recent history. Plan for the worst, hope for the best doesn't translate well here. You are right though, it is interesting that they jump at the first sign of foreign advice.
I am always very wary of the statement "Up to you". It really means, if this is a screw up, it is your fault. That phrase alone is to coin a phrase the ultimate "condom on the prick of progress", because it causes instant paralysis in decision making.
At least they didn't execute the whole plan, but just "tried" on one road. As somebody mentioned earlier, no, water doesn't flow uphill, so of course nothing happened. In the same way that nothing happens if you have 2 taps on a pipe and open only one. But at least they can say "Thanks for your plan, unfortunately it doesn't work." No screw up, and face saved. Just a theory....
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Foreigners will lose their confidence in us due to our failure to protect our capital city," she said in hoarse voice.
So from that remark it would seem as if the welfare of the locals is of no importance compared to what, "foreigners" may think or see what is happening ?
Indeed it is so nice that now in her and her governments desperation they seem to be trying to shift blame for their inaction in the past which have led to the current actions onto the , " dreaded foreigners."
Or maybe the welfare of the locals is of no importance compared to Toyota interests. Somebody in another thread suggested that the road cuts proposed by Toyota are aimed at diverting the water from Chachongsao area, where they have two plants. Would be very interesting if somebody with a clue could have a look at the maps and confirm this.....Interesting that the government disregards most of the advices of the BMA and the Royal Department of Irrigation, which both have a long experience of flood management (good or bad is not even the point), but jumps instantly on the Japanese idea....
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Since only 1 truck has been photographed showing Thaksin's name, and hundreds of trucks are driving through Bangkok with aid packages without anything on them, I think it's safe to say that he has indeed donated these items.
If he wants to put his name on his donations, that's his choice. He can do that. He paid for them.
So before this gets any more ridiculous, please drop it.
But of course, the conspiracy theorists here will always find something new.
Anything to back that up, or is it just your opinion?
He just made it up
Don't bother with him. You could prove him wrong on this and then he'll only make something else up.
Actually MrT donated something. From the breaking news section yesterday:
"Thaicom Foundation presented 20 floating toilets and 1,000 emergency toilet sets through Thaksin Shinawatra's three children."
How better can he say to his people "See, now you can take care of your own s***!"
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There was discussion of putting large drainage tunnels through Bangkok. If this is done it obviously needs to be under existing roads. If this emergency cut is done with the idea of permanent solution being part of it, then it makes some sense. It is clear there is not close to enough flow through to prevent a repeat of what we have now. So anything is helpful in the long run.
Nope. The mentioned tunnels are dug by tunneling machines....
Tunnels through hills and deep underground yes, that is not what is needed.
Dig down 1-2 stories and pour cement over steel, then build the road back over it.Much of the USA and European subways were done like this. Later deeper tunnels were done under them with stone cutting machines, but for Bangkok that would be under sea level and useless.not neccesary to empty water all year long, just flood season. But EVERY flood season.
Well, try to Google "Construction of BMA Water Drainage Tunnel", and " Phra Khanong water pumping station".....
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There was discussion of putting large drainage tunnels through Bangkok. If this is done it obviously needs to be under existing roads. If this emergency cut is done with the idea of permanent solution being part of it, then it makes some sense. It is clear there is not close to enough flow through to prevent a repeat of what we have now. So anything is helpful in the long run.
Nope. The mentioned tunnels are dug by tunneling machines....
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If the Temple of the Emerald Buddha were to be completely underwater, Thais would have been dealt a big shock, losing all morale and strength to fight back. If the Emerald Buddha cannot protect the City of Angels, then the angels would have taken flight and the capital would have fallen.
With talk like that, anyone would think Thailand was a backward, primitive country, its barely literate, ill-informed, pathologically incurious citizens still hobbled by pre-scientific superstitions and liable to the whims of fakers, charlatans and pseudo-religious, mumbo-jumbo-spouting con artists.
Oh, right.
Oh, well...
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Also, these roads are protecting eastern Bangkok from eastern floodwaters not the northern waters. If you open these roads up, going by the elevation map, these eastern waters will drain into Bangkok via Klong San Saep and Klong Prawet, not out of it to Ban Pakong river.It will effectively flood inner Bangkok, Suvarnabhumi (because those floodwalls won't hold), and the Bang Chan and Lat Krabang industrial estates (any car manufacturers there?). However, it will drain the Ban Pakong rive as well (because it's currently at a higher lever to the klongs feeding into it).This will keep the two Toyota manufacturing plants in Chachongsao nice and dry. Coincidence?cheersDM
Toyota is shutting down some US plants by lack of parts made in TH. If your estimation about the flow of the released water is correct.....
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50 million cabic metres per second?
Can anyone imagine the size of such a pump?
It's probably a mistake or bad translation. The figure of 50 million cubic meters per DAY is far more conceivable with a relatively small amount of pumps. More or less the quantity that the Chinese sent.
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"only fortune-tellers can know for certain."
Perhaps the most intelligent thing uttered by Bangkok Dancing Bear. I loved his comment regarding the huge drain that was dug under BKK - you remember: a Japanese company reported that it had to bribe several BKK officials to get the contract, and that BKK investigated and didn't find anything wrong. Regardless, he mentioned that the drain does not work, and will never work. However, he continued, there are 3 more drains that are being dug right now, and all of them will work properly. I'm sure he misspoke. What he intended to say was "the 3 new drains will work as good as the first one".
Correct about the first drain and the bribes allegations. The whole project, started in 2003, included FIVE drains (as mentioned), but only one has been completed for sure, in 2007.
End of last year he said than the first of FOUR drains of his project (sic) will open in January 2011, don't know if it's actually in service. Which leaves THREE more drains to complete. The idea that they are being dug now is extremely misleading, it will not change anything to the current situation as it takes YEARS to build them....And the whole thing, even finished, will probably not work as expected because it's based on a1995 study and therefore already obsolete.
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Relief Operations Centre (FROC)
What is the term FROC short for? Never heard of it.
Actually, in French, "FROC" is a very common slang for "trousers".
Said that, it's not the time for too obvious bad jokes as the situation is serious. A quick look at the past will show that every administration has been blamed for their management of the floods, nothing new here. These last few weeks people have died, other will, millions of people are suffering, and anger goes towards whoever is in charge. I know this feeling. I have helped with saving lives during the 2004 Tsunami. I have also watched people die, impotent. You can be as strong as you want. But at some point, I can tell you, everybody cries.
So, does really matter if YS is competent for the job or not ? Can't really say she is in charge anyway, she is just taking all the hits. Yesterday she was the clone, tomorrow she will be called a pale copy.
Has the Government done a good job ? We will never know. If real, criminal mistakes have been done in the release of the dams, it will be covered up. And if somebody proves that the flow of water has been properly managed, somebody will prove the opposite. But placing the FROC in a location that has an high chance to get flooded undermine a lot of credibility....
Was the communication with the public and the victims sufficient ? Well, it was a total clusterFROC, as somebody mentioned in another thread. Wrong information, contradictions, all giving the feeling that the Government had no clue of what was happening, or what to to. Scary. Sometimes you don't want to alarm the population because panic is the LAST thing you need. Panic is chaos, irrational behaviors and more deaths. It's common to downsize the problem first, and then re-assess. But in this particular case I would laugh, if it wasn't for the people suffering out there.
Would a SOE have changed anything ? That's a whole debate by itself...
What we know is that SOMETHING has to be done, I am sure there are competent hydrologists (Dutch, Thai, or from Mars I don't care....) who can find a way to solve the problem on the long term. Many reasons, documented in other threads, will make these seasonal floods worse and worse. A large scale plan exists, and is apparently still underway, but it will take years to complete, if ever, and by that time it will be probably obsolete, because the land configuration has considerably changed since 15 years.
But for something to REALLY happen Thailand needs a real political commitment towards the Thai people and, so far, I haven't seen any. On one side the elite, with his disdain for the working class. On the other side a bunch of hypocrite go-getter's dreaming to BE the elite, Sad.
And no, english is not my first language.....
Canadian Sisters Died Of 'Food Poisoning' In Thailand Hotel
in Thailand News
Posted
A lot of people tried to relate the two tragedies. Well, three including Chiang Mai. It seems by now that there are enough differences to rule out a link.