IDL

See my story. It proves everything is doable, but how far are you prepared to go...?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/639409-still-buy-an-old-big-bike-but-do-be-ultra-careful/

BTW, that was back when the manufacturers weren't making big bikes for the local market. Now they are, I'd have to agree with other posters n favour something newer,

Update. The plot thickens. Got the scanned Green Book. It's in some Thai man's name with an address in Phuket. ** Wait a minute, some farang is selling someone else's bike? Mmh.

The book is new but a "replacement" and the numbers seem to match or at least be all from Honda.

Verifying the book requires accessing the computer at the DMV. This can be accomplished, since I know someone who knows someone who is working there or some other bike import related ministry.

That Er6n looks mightily tempting with a 100% green book, 2 years warranty for only THB 75,000 more. Just thinking aloud here.

Thank you for all posts, I will re-read them a few times.

Have fun!

Chris

Probably a BIB

I've been saying it for over two decades, the Chinese are going to spoil the world!

Sure there are dodgy dealers world-over, but it's culture to 'avoid' the expense of doing things by-the-book for these guys. Hundreds of years of development by many countries will see all the ethics, money, research, social accountability, etc, wasted, as the Chinese become more powerful.

I've been seeing it coming for decades, why haven't my politicians???

Well what you have to do then, is play the Chinese game, if you want to catch up. I already do. Stop with the ethics and morality and all that crap...it doesn't get you very far in developing Asia particularly with the Chinese as your direct competitors. If they are willing to pay bribes, so you should be too (obviously you don't want to do this in a high level deal where officials from your western government are around otherwise you could be implicated by your government and tried on bribery of foreign officials charges). Although on a low level everyday basis, the chance of this ever happening are extremely slim. If they [the Chinese] are willing to pay government officials to look the other way when they break local labor laws by only employing their own people or employing too few locals, why don't other countries that have investments in such countries as Laos do the same thing? All I can think of is that they follow the same set of standards as in their own countries, not taking into account differences in local conditions, laws and the rule of law (like how contracts aren't necessarily enforced in the same ways as back home, laws can change at a whim's notice, paying a little bit of money to get the ball rolling is an accepted part of business etc.)

I'm not disputing that what you say has its place. However, anarchy is the first thing that springs to my mind.

Aside from them being better at the 'game' than we are (old hat to them, newish concept to us, generally speaking of course), to what end? Sure, it would [whilst living somewhere like here] reduce the grey-hair growth, lower the blood pressure, and generally make everyday living a little less stressful, but for long-term stability, and for me, it just tastes wrong.

I certainly don't see my viewpoint coming from some higher moral ground (or "crap" as you put it), simply we have been taught a certain way (and I don't mean brainwashed, as 'our' ways for the betterment of all makes total sense to me), and because I see it as a perfectly justifiable and sensible way forward, I'm unlikely to ever change the way I feel about it.

Oh and I'm all for a level playing field. If one's not connected or privy to the resources to 'fix' a contract/situation, how's that fair. Sure world-over the top dogs monopolize the top contracts, but at least the 'little' people get a chance to get-off-the-ground.

Just saying like,

I have already been to immigration to get my certificate of residence,but the Toyota garage said they had to keep the original, so I'm now left with a photo copy.

Planning to get my 1 year drivers licence next week, will the photo copy of the certificate of residence be OK, or will I have to back to immigration and get another one so I can present an original?

Thank you for your help

In my experience they will always tell you the doc needs to be the original. However, last year, after all these years of frustratingly following the [lost] pied-piper, I stood firmer on all this wasted money/time and appealed to them to accept a copy. I actually used the copy 3 times in the space of 3 months to get new licence, transfer my bike to new owner, and the same again to transfer the car to new owner.

Now heading off, so no need to get further frustrated by things here.

As a follow up to my post yesterday. I went to my local Amphur today and got my letter confirming residence at my wifes house. We saw the second in command and explained that we had previously been refused the neccessary letter. He immediately arranged for someone else to type out the letter for me which was great. Not so great was the 90 minute wait whilst we had to wait for statements from my wife and father in law to say that 'yes I really did live at their house'.

These statements were hand written and included when and where I met my wife and dates of previous stays in Thailand. Oh well, at least I got my letter.

Thus armed it was off to the local Dept of Land and Transport. Arrived at 3.30, waited in line and presented my documents whereupon I was told that contrary to what I was told yesterday and to what is listed in the second post of this thread that I now needed a doctors note.

Well by now it was too late to nip into town and get the said note so I guess that I will now finally get my 5 year license tomorrow unless they can think of some other document I need.

It is frustrating that there are no fixed rules as to what documents are required, or if there are that they are not followed, even in the same office from year to year.

Last week a mate of mine was told he needed a medical cert' , along with the famous 'letter', all while being on a retirement visa. I'd never heard of this before, but figured it might be related to his age [fit/younger looking 68]???

Mate, a few months back I went for my 3rd licence (1+5+...5, or so I was expecting). Super long story short, they initially said I can't get one on a TV. Eventually the head-poncho relented, but told me by law they can only issue a 1yr because I was on a TV. Always prepared for the unexpected here, I produced my soon-to-expire 5yr licence (issued to me on a TV) along with a whole host of evidence that I've lived here 14 years, and am only here on a TV coz I'm too young for a retirement type, and not currently working. Still, with proof of ownership of car, bike, bank accounts, previous licences, etc...they only issued a 1yr! Oh, and for the first time ever, I had to take a retarded test!!! Seeing this video, clearly explained why these guys drive like they do.

I feel your pain, and good luck!

I've been saying it for over two decades, the Chinese are going to spoil the world!

Sure there are dodgy dealers world-over, but it's culture to 'avoid' the expense of doing things by-the-book for these guys. Hundreds of years of development by many countries will see all the ethics, money, research, social accountability, etc, wasted, as the Chinese become more powerful.

I've been seeing it coming for decades, why haven't my politicians???

I would say just trial n error. Though it makes little sense (what does here) that different brands (sure they have the right, but you'll usually be told it's Gov policy, rather than the bank itself), branches, locations should have different 'rules', they clearly do. Over the years I've opened several accounts in Bangkok & CM, both with Non-B/work permit & on pre-purchased tourist visa; just remember that each individual/department/location of each Government office varies in what one can & cannot do. If the Gov is so inconsistent, no surprise private organizations are, too.

When I've opened them on T'visa, I have needed a letter (which I used to be able to get from immigration, but have in recent years only been able to get from UK consulate; others will tell you differently, that's just my own experience).

Unsure how long you've been here, but for your own sanity don't assume there is any consistency (nor rhyme or reason) from place to place; a few years here and you'll learn there is none!

In case you are new, TRY and get your head around this: whether to open a bank account, to register a car/bike, to get a licence, or anything else a foreigner wishes to call their own, on anything short of a Non-imm visa/w'permit you need to get a letter (proof of temporary residency - at least that's what they used to be called) from consulate/immigration. In order to get this letter, you need to 'prove' you live here (e.g. house contract, utility bills, etc). In order to get those qualifying 'proofs', you need to 'prove' you live here. So you 'prove' you live here to get a car [for example], you then need to use that 'proof' to get a letter (for say a licence) that 'proves' you live here!!! Confused? I am, and I've been here nearly 14 years!

And, in your case, you need to 'prove' you live here to get a bank account. If you later want another bank account (or anything else in your name), you likely have to get another letter 'proving' you live here, and will need to use your first account, at the consulate, to 'prove' you live here, in order to get a new letter that 'proves' you live here! Blimey, my head hurts.

There will always be some that have had different experiences here, but you would do well to not assume an easy route, just play the numbers game and learn for yourself.

Good luck

Girlfriends I had previously never came from poor families, owned their own car, had a credit card, paid their own way, were not single moms, never dated men twice their age, etc…not the same at all from what I've seen here so far. They dated a guy because they enjoyed his company, or so I thought.

Now I feel like my view of reality about Thai women is becoming all distorted. Are there not some honest, under 35, beautiful, single Thai girls working a decent job (100,000 baht + per month), well educated from a functional, friendly family who desire a relationship with a farang who is not attractive but has a good heart (and is not willing to support them or pay for their iPhones, clothes, etc.)?

Seems fair, not to much to ask, surely...!?

Mate, how have you made it this far? Do you actually read your input [aloud] back to yourself? I love your ideals, but, but, but...

Its funny how most of the post's have been calling the guy a weakling and a coward describing how they would have dealt with the situation. The OP also saying what he should have done or would do if it happened again.

I bet 90% of the people in here making those comments would have ended up face down in the dirt.

You guys do what you want. Some guy with a potential entourage waiting in the car barges in to my home and demands money here in Thailand, I'm handing him 3000 just to get it over with no bloodshed- his or mine.

That's the first time.

I'll have a lot more information and a plan the second time.

$100 isn't a lot to hand over to avoid getting shot, stabbed or (if you play the Rambo card and win) jailed.

Egos buddy, harder to control than the bladder!

"There must be more to this story..." Actually, judging by the OP, rcox81, hasn't come back to see or answer questions asked of him, there is probably less to this story. Classic plum pie send-up. Someone, in a corner, with a plum fixed to his thumb, runs in his head the mantra loop: "What a good boy am I!" The story, and your pie slices are plum-less.

As earlier mentioned by someone, the OP is likely in a fragile emotional state. It could be that there's more, but it could simply be that he's had time to reflect and hates himself for not doing more. And taking a lot of these comments to heart. He might also be out there trying to establish his options and fix it...?

Any which way, from the posted description it does astound me that so many get all 'macho' in what 'they' would've done. I'm no slouch, but there has been a couple of incidents in the past that have taken me by surprise, and left me acting, or NOT reacting, in the way I would expect to, or even having done in similar prior events. It's true to say that you have to be faced with it, at that particular time, you cannot guarantee what you WOULD do.

As for his name-calling and 'words' of macho-ism after the event, we've all heard people 'growing a set' after the event, over the years; egos are fragile.

Quote

And don't get a gun. You can't legally have one.

That's actually not true, you can have a gun licence here under certain conditions.

But, its still good advice, don't get a gun....................

Under what conditions?

That you do not have a criminal record, that you are 20 years old or more, that you have a permanent address in Thailand and have your name listed in the house registration specifically in the area where you are applying for a license, for at least six months and you must be employed and receive income.

Licenses for gun possession will not be granted to individuals who are disabled or handicapped and incapable of using a gun, unless possession is only for keepsake purposes. Persons who are incompetent, quasi-incompetent, mentally insane or deranged will not be permitted a license.

http://www.thailawforum.com/database1/thailand-gun-law.html

and then you read about 'revenge' shootings over losing face in front of GF. Hell, I even remember the one over the chicken sauce!!!

As far as I know if any one walks into your home uninvited then you can end them in self defense of your life and home.

Please can some one tell me if this is correct because if this had been me he would be dead by now.

Other than the fact that he would not be able to do it again to me or someone else he also would not be able to talk about it.

No idea about the actual laws (but what would be the point in knowing that anyway, everything's far too 'flexible' here), but an ex-GF of mine had an intruder at her family home in Nakon Phatom a few years ago. A relatively affluent family, and [as far as I gather] pretty well respected (and connected) in the area.

The story I got was that the burglars were startled by her dad rushing down the stairs, so they ran. He shot one of them in the leg as they exited. The BIBs came, injured Gerbil sprawled out on the lawn, and the following happened: BIB had the burglar taken to hospital and GF's dad taken to station. Somewhere through the dark-network the burglar was also connected and so the GF's dad was 'advised' to pay the hospital fees and let this incident lie...who will ever know exactly what happened or who was who, but the point is her dad's connections weren't as 'useful' as I'm sure he thought they were, otherwise he would have [rightly] been considered the victim.

Welcome to Thailand buddy, a crap start, and my condolences. Have to say I've never heard of your particular case before, but you'll soon realize anything is possible. That's not to suggest everything will be negative for you, but with the image this place 'promotes' of itself, you'll notice a lot more differences as time goes by. *Never heard a UK-tourism campaign promoting happy people n blue skies......it just wouldn't work!

My initial thought, given you've only been in for a month, is did the previous resident have some unfinished biz...?

I once moved-in with a UK bloke (big 3-bed house), new to Thailand; he was a childhood friend of a good mate of mine, and wanted a 'familiar' face around, as well as my local knowledge.

Anyways, he told me all sorts of stories of his past, and reasons for moving here. Several months later, I moved out because he was truly a horrible, vindictive, nasty, fat pile of *hit. It was only then that I learned from my mate that he sold his house [and left UK] because he had a habit of picking-up hoes on the street, taking them home, and not paying. Things had [obviously] gotten to the point where regular bricks were being slung through his windows, graffiti daubed on the house, etc. Can you imagine how awful things were for the people who bought his place, would surely inherit his problems, at least until the [2nd tier] aggressors realized he'd upped n left.

You might consider having some relaxed chats with your neighbours to try and build a picture of your predecessor.

As regards paying the henchman: easy for us to say that was stupid, but we weren't there, and can't be sure of what we would do. Moving could well be the answer, but if not feasible, you really ought to think of ways to NOT pay these gerbils anymore. I personally wouldn't 'ask' the BIB for help, simply don't trust them and it would probably get even more expensive when they want their 'treats/salary'.

Just some ideas on prevention:

• Get a dog. I've no idea your locality, nor if you are secluded from others, but wouldn't recommend a puppy/dog that you get too attached to; seen it before, too easy for the gerbils to poison the thing.
• CCTV
• Alert your neighbours of what's going on.
• A sign at your front gate, in Thai, saying the last person that lived there is long gone. That's assuming your neighbours make suggestions he was the possible cause.
• Create a vibrant/busy home by putting on some parties and inviting people round. The locals tongue's will soon start wagging, and you could soon get a steady stream of visitors, that might keep the opportunists away.
• Start dating a Muay-Thai chick.

If you go down the road of weapons to feel safer, just remember you may have to use them (and live with the consequences), and/or you will then up the anti with the henchmen; no doubt things will get badly out of control then...

Good luck

Yes, many office admin type staff work for well under B20K pm here.

If the "quick service fee" goes directly to the bureaucrats rather than the income of the department then yes of course that is corruption.

Obviously these fees go mostly upstream to the higher-ranking officials, the ones who paid the most for their lucrative pyramid scheme. I am sure 1M USD per year isn't unusual at all in the higher ranks of depts like customs, Phuket land office etc

How much a given paper-pusher makes isn't really relevant though.

On the topic of how corruption hurts development, I don't think it's the money flows itself. It's the fact that potential entrepreneurs are more likely to sit on their hands due to the uncertainty that any police or army colonel can just come along and arbitrarily become your partner or uncle of a less successful competitor shut you down.

A vibrant competitive economy encouraging startups requires a level playing field and a strong enforcement culture of rule of law.

This is why the idea of rampant tax avoidance to me doesn't stifle development as much, but of course it does cripple the government's ability to fund its essential services, huge impact on the well-being of the population but IMO not as damaging long-term as keeping development down.

Agreed.

Corruption compromises the very foundation to which you build something. If there ain't a stable ground, how on earth is anything built on it going to be stable.

As a good ole Belgium mate of mine always says: "I am not racist, I just don't like anybody!"

Blimey! Wish I had the mindset to be doing what these guys do...I get all upset when a bank won't exchange foreign currency coz there's a tiny tear.

"Mostly posters are positive, balanced and truly in love with their adopted country"...really, we must be reading different material"£$%^&@?

"Contrary opinions to the norm are not at all welcome"...had you said "not always", I'd take you seriously.

I, like everybody else, must remember this in future and think of your particular needs before posting. My deepest apologies.

I have to wonder how long you've been here. You actually answered your own question but you don't want that answer - you cannot expect them to know everything. You were lucky to get a straight answer when she said she did not know. It's far more common for a local to make up an answer than to say "I don't know." And if you have trouble with those staples in your passport I also have to wonder how long you'll last here. I mean no disrespect - it's just my opinion.

If you read some of his posts, you would know what he is like.

Silly me, I was actually of the thought that this was the ideal place to have a little rant?

I have kids that go to international school here and I have always had the impression that the teachers are stuck up and have a superiority complex. I am the one paying the very high school fees and in essence paying their salary, yet when I have any questions or want to remark on any of their teaching methods I am made to feel I am inconveniencing them and also made to feel that they are talking down to me. I don't bring this up to them in case it has repercussions on my kids.

A few years back, when I was teaching, I had the opposite experience. It really didn't matter what the teacher thought of the student (I mean in a constructive sense), the parents HAD to be told something 'fluffy' about their cherub. It seems the Thai way is this way, perhaps you should be a little more dominant with the teachers without fearing repercussions on your child's education/environment. I'd be quite sure you can say more than you think you can, after all the school wants the money.

another stunt from Chuwit!

Has to be, I can't fathom a Thai (or many people for that matter) having the balls to attack the country's lead henchman, with witnesses, cameras and security around.

Then again, a bottle of sangsom later, who knows...

If it was real, probably not for "exercising the right to vote", more likely coz the guy is a hypocrite, a turncoat, and a great notch on the belt.

Personally, I don't see that specific to teachers, just some people are like that. In your case, especially given two being your direct neighbours, perhaps they are jealous of you for the things you have and/or a better job/no need to work. Perhaps they stick to those they know coz their paperwork isn't in order, perhaps your wife is prettier than theirs, perhaps you just got unlucky in your choice of moo-ban. Perhaps, perhaps...

A couple of years back I was waiting for a take-away in a Chinky in Dartford (not my hometown, I was in the area for a course). Bored senseless as it was taking an age, this chap walked in to collect his order. He kept turning to look at me. After a while, figured he, too, must be bored. Given he was carrying several bags from the local supermarket, I said "Hiya mate, the wife got you doing the shopping?". He snarled at me, asking "is there a problem with that?". I simply replied "Na mate. I mistook you for a pleasant chap, my mistake". The prick!

I was a little phased by his reaction, but then I've been away from UK many years. Having mentioned it to a few friends, pretty much 50/50 split in them understanding/agreeing/disagreeing with his attitude. However, pretty much all the friends had kind of a look of empathy [for me] in their eyes. I guess I'm just out of touch with my own culture now.

Point 1: I'm sure it's how it sits in the belly of the OP, not the amount.

Point 2: You're right, though probably still a belly-sitting issue.

Point 3: Wrong & right. You're either enjoying the quick-fix corruption yourself (like all Thais, if the truth be known), and/or simply don't give a *hit about wanting these people to improve themselves. But sure, much less stressful living here if you find it easy to look the other way. I'm off shortly because the pit of my stomach can't take any more.

They have to want to "improve themselves", themselves.

The actual PEOPLE of Thailand can eliminate this problem any time they like if they just realize

A how important it is to their development

B the fact that that they have that power, especially with comm tech these days

We foreigners are as relevant as a butt pimple to the issue.

And I don't think the current protests are anything to do with in in reality either, that's just a smokescreen.

Wym,

Seems we see things the same way. As you'll note from me saying/believing "...all Thais...", they could of course change things, but from top to bottom they don't want to; it's just too darn convenient at times. They simply have a dislike for corrupt practices as and when it works against them; slipping a couple of notes to the BIB for D+D will always be favourable. But my reference to it was as-seen-in-the-eyes-of a person from a country that has progressed through that stage, for the most part at least.

Of course corruption is everywhere, but my old saying is: it's possible one could live a whole lifetime, in England for example, and not directly witness corruption. Sure it still goes on, but not necessarily on a level that's tangible to the average Joe. Here, you can't go a day...unless you stay at home (and then there's no guarantees).

"A how important it is to their development" IMO, very important. Contrary to what they believe about themselves and their nation, this ain't China and never will be. The Chinese spent hundreds of years planning to get to where they are today, not least by way of 'planting' people in places all across the globe; IMO stupidity that the western world never saw it coming, but that's another matter entirely.

Thailand will always depend on others for growth, so in terms of development, if they continue the way they are, the days will always be numbered; fashion only last so long...

Reporting a corruption for 1,000 baht? 555555

There need to be proof and like most posters recommended, they are not forcing everyone to pay for this 'service'.

Save your righteous virtues and live and let live. You might find living here more stress free.

Point 1: I'm sure it's how it sits in the belly of the OP, not the amount.

Point 2: You're right, though probably still a belly-sitting issue.

Point 3: Wrong & right. You're either enjoying the quick-fix corruption yourself (like all Thais, if the truth be known), and/or simply don't give a *hit about wanting these people to improve themselves. But sure, much less stressful living here if you find it easy to look the other way. I'm off shortly because the pit of my stomach can't take any more.

Thanks to all, a good deal of the feedback has been noted, especially that of personal experience [world-wide].

It would appear that perhaps my 'attitude' has been a little bullish, and expectations too high.

After almost 14 years in Tryland, one can over-react because of the 'collective' daily trials and challenges; not making excuses, just saying one thing leads to another...

It still grates me, but on this subject I'll try to remember the input I've had.

Welll...for good or for bad....the drain has been flattened.

I don't mind being a case study.

fair play, what's done is done.

You sound like you've been victorious in past bouts with Thai families...everything's a numbers game mate, just hope you've the sense to not dig your own grave by riding a wave of [successful] arrogance, and not seeing when you'd be better off biting-the-bullet.

Oh, and keep that ego under control. When the girls refer to you as "handsome man", it ain't necessarily what they are really thinking. LOL

Good luck.