donshows

I had the pleasure of renewing my retirement visa and doing my 90 Day report yesterday! I was in and out in just over 1 hour!! That is the shortest time I've done my renewal..EVER!! The new office is easy to get to...I went by city bus #52... and the free shuttle to the immigration office.

The only bad part was when a man did not understand the officer who was calling out numbers to return their passport and 90 Day report. She did it in Thai and this man gave her hel_l for not speaking English. He took it to the extreme and just wouldn't let up with this police officer!! As he turned to walk away, in her best English she said: "This is Thailand!" Not sure if he heard this but everyone else did! So embarrassing for the rest of us sitting there and give expat a bad image!

BUT it was a good experience and the new office is great!! Love the nice coffee shoppes and shoping there also!

It is common knowledge in our little community but in case you have not heard @Richards is up for sale. Richard wants to spend more time in Canada and the bar owner wants to sell up.

A lot of us more mature guys have made @Richards our home from home but now that he's leaving my question is "Where do we go from here?" I know there are lots of bars in Bangkok but not with the same homely ambiance that Richard has made. Even some of the other places that are owned by foreigners are said to be for sale so what will we be left with?

Where can the retired gay foreigner feel at welcome in Bangkok and not be fleeced of his savings and pension?

It always amazes me how these rumors get started. And this one is the funniest I’ve heard in years!

First of all even though I am white I grew up here and have very few "western" morals and I know that Thais respect their elders. What I object to is the attitude of westerners that come here and treat Thai youth as their personal smorgasbord just because they have the money to do so. If at 60 you find love with a 20 year old, good luck to you, but believe me, such cases are very rare. Time and again I meet older farangs that end up penny less and heart broken and have to be repatriated by their embassies. My b/f is 12 years younger then me, but our relationship has never been based on monetary values, but on mutual respect.

Very good post, particularly as a spring board for further discussion.

I am an older white westerner living here (retirement visa)...who has no desire to meet young guys. I have been in a committed relationship with a Thai for over 15 years now...first long distance, now living together. I guess we are rather boring...just lead a normal life. I could describe our relationship just as you describe yours!

I am rather appalled by those white westerners who "use" Thai guys (whether young or not) as their own smorgasbord (as you put it...and that is a good way to put it). On the other hand, I'm just as appalled by those Thai guys who "use" Westerners in a relationship for money or so they can live more comfortably...however you want to phrase it. It's a rather symbiotic relationship, either way.

First I have been here longer then most of you, since I was 3 years old, so maybe my English is not perfect enough for making my self understood perfectly even though I live part of the year in Australia. All I ever objected to is the way guys with big wallets use young Thai kids for their sexual gratification. I also realize that Thais are using farangs as meal tickets, but the extra Baths are hard to resist. I don't give a hoot if you are 120 and your friend is 20 as long as it is a genuine relationship, exploitation is what I object to. As for repatriation of penniless farangs, it happens far more then you think, mostly with straight guys who marry their big holiday love and it also happens with some gay guys. I know this because until recently I worked at an embassy of a European country. Sorry if I caused controversy, this is my last comment on the subject and you can all stop bitching.

OH MY GOD....I just wanted to give an opinion about complainers...and sure got more than I expected!! Please don't make more of this than people should repsect Thailand and embrace it for what it is...a wonderful place to live and work. The people are wonderful but sometimes we...farangs...just don't see the forest because of the trees!

It always amazes me how much farangs complain about how Thailand is not like “home.” They don’t speak English here! How can they eat that food? Don’t they know how to do things the right way? What’s wrong with these people?

Complaining, complaining, complaining! OH MY GOD! If Thailand is so bad....then go back HOME!! Wherever that may be and SHUT UP!

There’s nothing wrong here except the farangs who complain about Thailand.

I think you can meet nice Thai men anywhere. It is my opinion that meeting a nice boy/man in a bar, go go bar, massage shop or place like that, you will usually find that they are not too well educated and are from some place other than Bangkok and here to make a living. They are sending money back to their family and will do almost anything to get money. You can't blame them for that! I have been in Thailand for over 5 years now and I am so lucky to have a partner that is from a nice family, well educated works and goes to school to get his second MBA and takes wonderful care of me! We take good care of each other. We found each other on line and that's been over 2 years now. I do need to tell you that in my profile, I was very clear that if anyone asked me for money....that would end everything!

Money boys are out there but you don't have to date them or even put up with that behavior if you don't want to and still meet nice men!

I've lived in Thailand for over 5 years and I have the most wonderful boyfriend that you could ever ask for....BUT...he is late....often....no matter what I say...he is late. Not all of the time but I can't tell you how long I've had to wait for him. So I also plan this into my day and I've also arrived LATE for him...and he doesn't care....it's just the Thai way. If you can't stand the heat...then get out of the kitchen! Sorry but it's their custom and their country...we are guest here and we need to fit in. So find a way to adjust and stop worrying about it. Take care...

"Prakonon-you get the drama queen story award!In my years with sammi noi and mia noi, never a fire brigade has come to my door.Praka-are you the guy in Singapore who only hires Thais who have degrees from the west and from Chulalongkorn, in pharmaceutical research?"

Not just Chula in Thailand but all have oversea's degree's - either first degree in Thailand then ovesea's for MSc or Undergrad oversea's - its the Thai's themselves who apply these standards and other countries are much less exacting for the roles.

As for the drama queen and the stretcher it has become an in-joke among us now. He tried to rib me about something and I replied, "At least the last girl who left my condo was not strapped to stretcher screaming my name" - when we see pretty girls walking past the bar we now say, "She is worth a stretcher"

I've lived in Thailand for 5 years and I'm always surprised that farang are supporting a boyfriend/girlfriend! And it is say and rightfully so..."It's my money and I can do what I want with it!" BUT what are we doing to these people buy supporting them? We are not giving them any thing but a free ride. We are not giving them any skills....well...one...to learn how to live off of someone and not themselves. When the relationship ends...and so many do, the poor boy/man/girl/woman will have nothing but a few years of living it up and then be left with NOTHING but good memories! The think that this is the way the world is. Well...not where I come from...the USA...I had to get my own money by WORKING and supporting myself. I was taught that that's the way life is.

So here we are teaching an entire nation that IF you are cute enough and SMART enough, you can get a farang to take care of you. All you have to do is put out on demand. After all...we have the MONEY and we all believe in the golden rule...."Those who have the gold, make the rules!" And the Thais know this also...that's why they all think farangs are richer than God and have more money than we can ever spend.

I have to say that I have several friends who are in long term relationships and don't support their boyfriend/girlfriends. They may help them but they don't pay them to live with them. Helping them to get an education and have a FUTURE is a good thing.

This is just one mans opinion and like I've been told....opinions are like ass holes...everyone has one and most of them stink! But I hope I've made a point.

Thanks.

"Prakonon-you get the drama queen story award!In my years with sammi noi and mia noi, never a fire brigade has come to my door.Praka-are you the guy in Singapore who only hires Thais who have degrees from the west and from Chulalongkorn, in pharmaceutical research?"

Not just Chula in Thailand but all have oversea's degree's - either first degree in Thailand then ovesea's for MSc or Undergrad oversea's - its the Thai's themselves who apply these standards and other countries are much less exacting for the roles.

As for the drama queen and the stretcher it has become an in-joke among us now. He tried to rib me about something and I replied, "At least the last girl who left my condo was not strapped to stretcher screaming my name" - when we see pretty girls walking past the bar we now say, "She is worth a stretcher"

Hi Alex: I've been in Thailand for almost 5 years. I've heard this story many times. On of my Thai friends is so assounded that we farang are so easily taken in! I wish I could be more supportive of you and your situation. I've always had a way of handling anyone. When they ask for money..that ends the friendship/relationship.....I don't care what the story or excuse for needing of money...but if I gave money to every Thai man who needed it, I'd be on a corner with a cup in my hand.

You can not varify your boyfriends story. You either believe him or not. It takes a lot of time to know anyone...Thai or otherwise.

I have a Thai boyfriend. We've been together for 19 months. He doesn't live with me on a full time basis but we see each other every day. I've met his mom and other members of his family. He comes from a well-to-do family, had an education and works. He has never asked me for money and IF HE DID...well...that would end it!

I am not your average westerner...I don't have a big income to support anyone but myself. So I can't relate to you being able to give your boyfriend 15,000bht a month....just not in my income level.

BUT you if you are happy with this man and trust him..then do what you think is best for you. ONE thing you will find out, if you don't know yet....you will NEVER be number one! It's just not the Thai thing. Family will always come first, then other Thais. So don't expect to ever be number one...no matter what your boyfriend tells you.

Also, when a Thai says "I love You" it's not the same as a westerner. Keep in mind that there is a culture and way of life here that is so different from our western ways. A good book to read is Thai Feaver. You can get this in almost any book story and it will help you to understand the Thai culture and way of life here. It is in Thai and English...so get your boyfriend to read this also....it will help him to understand YOU!

I hope I haven't been too negative for you. I have been honest and hope you will take all that I've said as honest.

I wish you the best. Take care......DON

There are many mature men living in Thailand and I'm sure you will get many replys. Just be careful and ask many questions of all those who contact you. Your first time should be a good one and one that you will have good memories. I wish you the best.

I've been in Thailand with my boyfriend for 4 months now..

He's a Thai and we met in Christchurch (NZ) almost 2 years ago..

With the normality of gayness in Thailand, it's hard not to accept more of the 'gay lifestyle'. In NZ I did not know any gay individuals, and had quite a straight lifestyle..

My boyfriend seems jealous when I even speak of another 'friend' I made today (such as what happened when i was at Immigration extending my visa, btw the friend was a guy).

Now in Thailand where being gay is quite ok, I'd like to get in touch with my 'gayness' by knowing my gay people and accepting it into my lifestyle...

In straight relationships (for the sake of comparison), the husband does'nt really know any gals and the wife does'nt really make friends with any guys.

So my question is...in a gay relationship, should we only make friends of the opposite gender (instead of with the same gender)?

Anyone with the same issue?Or is just my bf?hmmmmmmmmmmm..................

Hi: Well..I'm going to go another direction with your posting. Most, if not all of my gay Thai friends believe that it is difficult to be gay in Thailand and they are certain that it is much easier to be gay in a Western country. Their families want them to get married and have babies! Several of my farang friends have lost their Thai boyfriend because they had to get married.

My partner and I don't have the issue of friends of the same sex. He is much more concerned about the money boys and the go go boys. There is a class barrier in Thailand.

Where in Thailand are you?

We are in Bangkok!! DON

Don't know of any such group but it mght be a nice idea. My bf and I live in BKK and been an item for more than 20 years, and are about to finally sign up for a civil partnership.

Hi: There are civil partnerships in Thailand? Didn't know that. Would like to know more about that! We live in BKK also.

Is there a group for gay couples who are in a long term relationship? My boyfriend and I've been together for over a year and we would like to find other couples who would like to do social things together, movies, dinners, play tennis or other social events.

If there are any groups, please let me know. Thanks! DON

We've been together for 16 years; we're legally married now; he's 38 and I am 63. We go down to BKK several times during the year.

Do you live in BKK?

Hi: My partner and I've only been together for 15 months. We would like to find other couples who would like to do things together. We enjoy going to the movies and other social events. Pat is 24 and I'm 60...we live in BKK. Thanks, DON

Is there a group for gay couples who are in a long term relationship? My boyfriend and I've been together for over a year and we would like to find other couples who would like to do social things together, movies, dinners, play tennis or other social events.

If there are any groups, please let me know. Thanks! DON

Don, I am friends with another one of the victims, so this is very good news. Good for you for going to the effort of dealing with the legal system and following through until conviction; I hope many more convictions will follow and these guys will enjoy living 50-to-a-cell for many years.

Hi: Thanks for your information. I have met 5 other men who were kidnapped and robbed by these men. They nearly killed one man from San Francisco. My partner and I are still pursuing this...as the criminals were ordered to repay me the money they took or face more time in jail. So, we are still working on this. I never think I'll get the money back but I can make sure they stay in jail a lot longer. My boyfriend is seeing to this...THANK GOD! Take care...Don

Don read your private messages

YES...as far as I know they are still in jail. I will be talking with the Thai police in a few days to see what is happening with this.

DON

Kidnappers Target Gay Community - July 26 An Up-date.

On March 13, 2006....1 year after I was kidnapped and robbed....the 2 criminals went on trial. Not a nice experience BUT I went to court with my boyfriend and after 4 hours of testimony and intimidation from the 2 criminals the trial ended. Two weeks later, March 30, we went back to court to hear the sentencing. Much to my surprise and relief, each of them was sent to a Thai jail for 15 years each and ordered to return the money they stole from me. I doubt that I will ever see the money but with the wonderful help of my Thai boyfriend, we have filed another case against these two men to pursue this issue. IF they do not return the money, they will be sentenced to more time in jail and that’s all I want.

Another victim of these two men also filed charges and his trial was on July 2. The two criminals have decided to plead guilty to this and we will return to court next week to see how much time they will get for his kidnapping and robbery.

I met 5 other men from all over the world who had been kidnapped, robbed and in several cases, tortured. One was nearly killed by these men.

These two criminal are only in jail because of what I and the other victim did….we went to the Thai police and helped them to catch these two men. These criminals had been kidnapping and robbing older gay men for 5 years and bragged to both of us that they had stolen millions of Bhat during this time and continued to blackmail one man to the turn of 4 million Bhat.

The other good news is that these two criminals have 2 more trials to go through and with and good luck will spend the rest of their lives in a Thai jail.

I have found new hope with the Thai police and judicial system…far more than I ever thought I would. The “district attorney” who prosecuted these two men was a wonderful middle-aged woman who really knew what she was doing and wanted these two men to be in jail a long time. The police who I worked with were great. They asked the right questions and never asked any inappropriate questions…they just wanted the facts and wanted to get these criminals off the streets…which they did.

I also need to thank two wonderful Thai friends who made things so easy for me by going with me to the police and to court. They made a very very difficult time bearable for me.

I can now rest a little easier knowing that these men will not be out of jail for a long long time.

Don read your private messages

YES...as far as I know they are still in jail. I will be talking with the Thai police in a few days to see what is happening with this.

DON

I met my Swedish boyfriend on 2003 and it was very hard for us to see each other just twice a year, so we made a big decision to live together in Bangkok because I couldn’t move to Sweden, I have a good job here and my boyfriend got retirement last year. Now we’ve been together in Bangkok for one year already and everything goes very well for us. But only one thing that I’m worrying about my boyfriend is he’s far away from his country, his family and his friends. I go work in the morning and come back in the evening so my boyfriend has to be alone during the day time and I think it would be nice if he has some friends to talk to and go out with. Sometimes we went to the beach or the old city in the weekend and we think it would be nice to have some friends to accompany with us and have fun together.

Just want to know some nice guys who is living with his boyfriend in Bangkok and if we could meet someday and get to know each other more.

HI...there is a large gay community here in BKK and easy to find good friends. How old is your friend? Why kind of interest does he have? IF I can be of any help..please let me know...take care...DON

HI...I think you may have met me...I was the second to last vicitum of these kidnappers and I was kidnapped and robbeed March 13 and 14. So maybe I'm the "victum" you are talking about. I do go to soi 4 sometimes and that is where I tried to tell other protential victums of what had happened to me. And Yes...I am still meeting people from the internet. I do use my mobile a lot but not just to meet "boys"...so you may have not heard correctly while I was talking on the phone.

If you think I'm crazy to still want to meet nice people over the internet..that is your choice. I went through a terrible 14 hours that night I was being held. And I could let that stop me from many things. Some of my friends told me I should leave Thailand. Some told me to move from my apartment. I've done neither. I've decided to stay and help the Thai Police and the USA Embassy to make sure these guys never see the light of day again.

These kidnappers have been doing this for 5 years. If someone had done what I and the last victum are doing now...we would not have been a vicitum at all. Other victums just got on an airplane and ran away to leave the rest of us to be victumized. They were afraid to let anyone know they are gay...that is there choice also. I'm not afraid and will not let anyone make me afraid. I'm also not going to stop what I think is good for me..to meet nice men on line and hopefully develope some good friends...which I have in the 3 years I've been in Thailand.

When I put the information on this sight...I was criticized for that also. But I just wanted to make sure that people knew what happening and hopefully keep others from being victums also. So..that's what I have to say!! Hopefully I have explained things so that it wll be a little easier for everyone to understand. BUT until you have lived through this..you have no idea of what this is all about...and hopefully because I have done what I have done...you will never have this experience.

Thanks....DON

First of all I want ot say I am so happy they caught this guy. I did run into one of the victonms in Siliom soi 4. I was chatting wtih a friend and notice this guys phone was ringing crazy (phone of the victom) he was speaking english and pllanning on meeting several boys, it seeed his phone did not stop ringing and he made several phone calls himself....well then he started to talk to me and tell me the stroy of getting kidnapped, I must admit me and my frined thought it wasw s hoax, it was hard for me and my friend t image that accouding to his own worlds, the vitcim that htis had only happend 1 week before, and that he was still chatting and planning dates from the net...honnest me and my friend just toook it as a wild bar story and went on....I had no idea it was tru, and frankly if that happpend to me I would NOT be out just after one week meeting more guys again.......this guys was in his 60 told me he met the guys around Ladprao subway staion and the rest of the stroy was the same..do NOT get me wrong I am NOT trying to blame the victom, I think no one deserves to go through that, but once you are in your 60s and you do NOT learn and just one week you are meeting guys agian on the net I really question some of thse guys...I would NOT have gone back out to meet guys on teh net for mohtys or years after soemthing that bad happpend, maybe it is just me ...

once agian I am NOT trying to blame the victionm but wan to point out that one week after this happend the vitiem was planning and actively still meeting guys from the net.....

I have a weakness for men in uniform--and out of uniform!

The best thing about a man in uniform...is getting him OUT OF IT!!

I have recently heard that a few embassies have gotten involved and that there will be a few foreigners flying in to Thailand simply to re-identify the guys who assaulted them. It's looking like the police can't let them slip away quietly this time without losing a *lot* of face... some good news on this story.

"Steven"

Steve: Can you share with me who is returning to Thailand? I'd like to know and meet them. I've met several already and would like to meet others. Also..which embassies are coopeating...Australia is not so forthcoming. Thanks...DON

Madsere, you're not reading very carefully. The OP is a victim and several members who've posted here have already said we know other victims. It's not a hoax.

Silomfarang, I'll get those photos to you soon (and to one or two others who've recently requested them).

"Steven"

The kidnappers are still in jail and it appears that they will stay in jail because they were arrested last year for the same crime and jumped bail. I've have 4 interviews with the Thai police and all have been very good and proper. It appears that they are working very well on my case the 3 others that have been filed against them.

Don

Any post or mail ending with something like

Please pass this on to anyone you think should know about this.

should generally be considered to be a hoax and NOT passed on.

If you are the one who had a gun pointed at you and a knife at your throat...you'd know the difference of a hoax or not. All I'm trying to do is get these men off the streets and keep them from hurting more people like you and me. So...if you are not a part of the solution...you are a part of the problem...GEES. These guys have hurt many gay men here in Thailand. They have stolen millions of Bhat from us...and I want this stopped. So please help by helping me find other victim who want to help keep these men in jail.

Hi Steve: I went to the US Embassy first...and have stayed in contact with them. The last man kidnapped is Danish and is in contact with his embassy also. We are contacting a Thai lawyer and will try to get at their money to stop them from using it to get out of jail.....DON

I want to follow up on this. Last week I had a call from the Thai Police and was asked to come to the police station to ID the men who kidnapped me. I was able to ID them and as of a few days ago..they are still in jail. It is believed that they kidnapped about 50 men over the last few years and their apartment was searched and many passports of other vicitims were found there. They have robbed most of us for about 300,000 bht each and one man has paid them over 4 million bht.

If you also see the current issue of Thai Puan, there is an article about my kidnapping and a photo of one of the men who kidnapped me.

I hope that we can keep these terrible men in jail along time and they will suffer like they made me and so many others.

It has been happening for over a year, gay men from Western countries are set up, kidnapped and robbed of hundreds of thousands of Bhat. Men from the USA, England, German, Australia and many other countries are contacted by a gang of 3 or more.

The pattern is always the same. Mature men are contacted through several of the online websites and a meeting is schedule in a public place and then you are taken to an apartment that turns out to be a hotel and a second man is there with a gun and knife. You are then held and forced to give up your PIN to access your credit card and ATM accounts.

Every abduction is very similar with the same results..money gone and you are told not to contact the police because the kidnappers have placed illegal drugs in your home or hotel room and they will notify the Thai Police.

You are terrified and don’t know what to do.

This happened to me a month ago and I’m still dealing with the terror that I went through but I’m also working with the US Embassy and the Thai Police. I have decided to fight these men and try to stop them from hurting and robbing others. I have found out that at least 10 other men have gone through this, as late as February and my kidnapping in March. This kidnapper has now contacted a friend of mine, it is a small world, and we have now informed the US Embassy and will contact the Thai Police regarding this.

The kidnapper is a 26 year old man who is half Thai and Indian, 183cm tall and nice looking. He was arrested last year for the same crime but has been released and is now back at it again. He works with another man who will just show up and act as if he is a good friend. But soon the gun and knife come out and you are stripped naked and handcuffed. Threats are made and a knife is put to your neck and you give your PIN up very easily.

Once they have all the money they can get out of your accounts, you are released and sent on your way with a final warning not to contact police or you will regret it.

For those who have accounts outside of Thailand, you will most likely get your money back. BUT if you have money in any Thai bank, your money is gone. The people at Bangkok Bank told me I shouldn’t have given out my PIN. The only way to get my money back is for the Thai Police to get the thieves and have them return my money.

I’m attaching a photo of the man who kidnapped me. The kidnapper sent his photo to my friend who is talking with him now. So please be on the lookout for him. He will trap you…he is very good at this. If you know of anyone who has had the same experience, please let me know..I’d like to get his information and pass it on to the US Embassy. Names are not necessary, are just trying to get a list of times and date when these kidnapping are taking place so IF these men are caught, we have more information for the police.

Please pass this on to anyone you think should know about this.

Thank for your help.