intel4004

If you can filter out the trolls, the posters with nothing constructive to add and the self obsessed you will be doing yourself a big favour.

Is there anything left?

You have to look carefully

Of all the people I know personally who use this forum they've all said TV can be a very negative, judgemental place. If you can filter out the trolls, the posters with nothing constructive to add and the self obsessed you will be doing yourself a big favour. I'm learning this slowly otherwise you can end up wasting so much of your valuable time

Do you count each sign separately? Here' a great youtube from a guy in NYC where you get fined

for riding bikes on the sidewalk (pavements), or out of a designated bicycle lane.

Fantastic find and very funny. Police officer not fit for purpose. As regards the cycle lanes, well it's a typical scenario anywhere.

How do you know she's blocking anything?

Maybe I'll wait till after I've paid for said item!

I don't, but it sounds like she's on the pavement, so her stall is just one of those that you had a good rant about in an earlier post, which you illustrated with a photo of a motorbike parked on the pavement, but with room to walk around whilst staying on said pavement. (Take another breath).

Oh dear, honestly mate you are indeed sad if you are picking me up on this, on this thread. Please stick with the theme of the post and redirect your nit picking in the appropriate thread and I'm sure you know which one that is.

Oh and please put it in some context so we all know where we stand for other posters sake. Then will I reply appropriately.

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Pai

http://www.agoda.com/asia/thailand/pai/reverie_siam_resort.html?

3500bt

Amazing

All I'm getting is rates of 5k Bt

Try Malee's Nature Lovers Bungalows next door to Chiang Dao Nest. I think they have ground level bungalows. Great owner. Google for website.

Looks good for me but a bit short on spa features for her.

How do you know she's blocking anything?

Maybe I'll wait till after I've paid for said item!

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http://www.fourseasons.com/chiangmai/

http://www.dharadhevi.com

http://www.snhcollection.com/137pillarshouse/

If money was no object these would be great but the harsh reality is, it is. Our max budget is 3k BHT / per room per night.

What he does with his life from here is his choice and he obviously has much to deal with. I don't doubt that it will be very difficult back home given his injuries and circumstances and no doubt like all of us he'll make some mistakes. However, he appeared to me to be genuinely grateful that there are still those willing to take some time to show some compassion and assist others in need and not leap to prejudiced judgement.

That's made my day! I am so pleased that he is getting back on his feet and will hopefully have continuing support back home. We all make mistakes, sometimes terrible ones but compassion and forgiveness is key.

Well done to all those who helped

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With my arthritis getting worse quickly, I've been giving thoughts to modes of transportation. I live in a little village in Isaan, about in the middle of a triangle formed bumUdon Thani, Loei, and Khon Kaen. It ain't the end of the world, but at times you can sure see it from here. Pavements? Oh, no, wouldn't those be nice. Ramps? Well yes actually, some people have ramps for their scooters, not very wide, though. Steps? Most definitely? Crumbled road surfaces? In spades.

So here's the best of what I've found online so far. Not perfect, but small enough to get around the aisles in the stores. Easy enough to build an electric-powered winched ramp to the back of a pickup, or get a small trailer. The problem with a trailer is parking in the relatively small blue space.

Would it be worth 10 grand US? http://www.gizmag.com/unimo-continuous-track-electric-wheelchair/29748/

All you need is a turret to blast scooters and vendors out of the way?

I would like to see footpaths used as footpaths and not for shopkeepers to put an an extra table there and sell goods. The local council should clamp down on such practices and fine the perpetrators. It is unsafe and nobody should be forced onto a busy roadway just because some shopkeeper thinks it is their property. Unfortunately I don't think this will change anytime soon.

Thailand doesn't go anywhere near acceptable when people with mobility issues want to get around with ease. Did you see the video of the Thai guy in a wheelchair ask a security officer why all the disabled spots were taken in Central Festival Pattaya? The guard said, they were for VIP's (rich people with expensive cars) very appaling and he was asked to occupy another spot much further away.

<The local council should clamp down on such practices and fine the perpetrators. It is unsafe and nobody should be forced onto a busy roadway just because some shopkeeper thinks it is their property. >

The day that happens it won't be the Thailand most of us love.

<Unfortunately I don't think this will change anytime soon.>

You've got it there.

Unfortunately, those of us in such situations have to live in the real world, and in the real world, Thailand is NOT disabled friendly. Where I live there aren't any pavements at all, and unless they knock down the street front properties never will be. Try driving through Mae Rim when the schools get out alt=w00t.gif> .

I'm completely baffled why you think one of the reasons we love Thailand is because we are forced to use the road to walk whilst dodging scooters and cars, because that's what I have to do when I go walking.

Do you think the nature of this place will be radically changed because some thought is given to pedestrianisation?

Whether you like it or not Thailand is changing as is everywhere. Better this change be channelled in a positive direction whenever possible is what I think as there's enough stupidity out there already.

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Thailand in General is not Wheelchair friendly, just going about your daily routine here, is an effort, and trying to cross the road, they nearly kill you ?? It's like they try and drive faster and aim for you, I can't get my head around it...

I once stopped at a Zebra crossing and a car nearly drove into the back of me, and then a Scooter, overtook me and nearly knocked the old lady down .... Bad mannered or what....

But that's how,it is... Unfortunately.....

Very same thing happened to me last night. I was going around the moat on my scooter and up ahead was a pedestrian crossing (nobody crossing) with traffic lights which were red. I stopped and behind me a songthaew driver who had more time than me to stop swerved narrowly avoided me shouting abuse as he went past going through the red light!

So I take it the songthaew drivers don't have to obey red lights at pedestrian crossings.

They just finished constructing a 4 lane dual carriageway along Srinakarin road complete with pedestrian/wheelchair friendly walkway with ramps. There is a separate coloured cycleway designated for cycles.

They then came along and planted trees along the cycleway so that the motorcycle taxis use the on and off ramps for the disabled to access the footpath. The concrete flagstones are already breaking up due to inferior quality. It never fails to amaze me how they can build second hand quality roads.

I always remember previous Bangkok Governor, Pichit Ratakhun falling down a drain whilst on an inspection of the pavements, caught on camera by his accompanying TV crew. Neverthless no improvements were made despite him pushing for clear pavements with accomodation for the disabled.

You almost feel like throwing your hands up in the air and giving up with the Thai people. I think a lot of expats just accept and move on which of course means there is no movement or progress. With the Thais the potential is there but they just seem destined to f@@k it up one way or another!!

I disagree with these posts. I am 83 and can barely walk with a stick. I cant climb steps alone or open doors, All the shopping centers have toilets for disabled. There are disabled parking lots and excellant wheelchair facilities at airports. But on the whole not many other facilities for us. However the Thais seem to be exceptionally very helpful and friendly to me where ever I go. People help me across the street, open doors help me up steps. Far more friendly than most countries and on a hoilday to Chiangmai I very impressed by the Thais therre. The worst was Pattaya I fell down the steps of a big shopping center with lots of "farangs" sitting on the steps. Not one offered to help me get up but two Thais did. But it did not surprise me

I'm not having a go at the general public you meet on the street, I'm having a go at the lack of actual facilities for the less mobile when it comes to planning in general. And I'm talking about segregating pedestrians and traffic and keeping the pathways clear.

I'm looking for recommendations for a resort in the Chiang Mai area or within 2-3 hrs of Chiang Mai. Must be wheelchair / walking aid friendly or as much as possible within the context of Thailand.

Before anyone mentions I have looked at Panviman but would like to hear of alternatives.

Many thanks

I was only speaking to my wife about the footpaths mostly everywhere you go in Thailand. I said it would be a sight impaired persons nightmare. Even in Hua Hin where I went for a holiday there were large iron types of grates over some of the holes in the footpaths. In other cities the pavements are not level and venders carts block the footpaths. There are trees growing in the niddle of the walkways and some times a pedestrian road bridge starts in the middle of the footpath too.

I have a photo of a pavement with the raised pavers supposedly for the blind. The path they have to take leads them into hazards at head level and in one case directly into a power pole .

I also saw a bicycle lane painted on the Sukhumvit pavement opposite Soi 4 .

Not seeing any photos? Am using a tablet to view

Maybe it would be more sensible to visit countries with better footpaths?

I hope that was a poor attempt at trolling, otherwise you might want to confine yourself to less demanding issues.

Those are great mops. There is a lady that sells them on Wualai Road about 50 meters from Chiang Mai Gate on the left side of the street. She is there almost every night with her great little stall on the sidewalk.

Will be going to the Saturday night market this week so will check it out, thanks

I am sure the crackdown on walking is coming - just give them a few more days

Yes and about time! those bl@@dy walkers taking up space on the streets smashing into cars and motorcycles. Next they'll want better footpaths.

I, for one, do not wish it to change.

You'd prefer to walk on the road dodging cars and motorcycles which often get too close. You are happy to share the same space as the traffic!

Let me repeat myself... You actually don't want this to change! You are happy to give way to motorbikes blocking the footpath originally meant for you to walk on.

Less than 2 hours ago I witnessed the aftermath of an accident near Maya shopping Centre on the 'super' highway. The motorcyclist was flat on her back, no movement. Then another woman came grabbed her by the arms and literally DRAGGED her onto the hard shoulder. There was no assessment of this woman's injuries, it was a case of "Oh lets get her out of the way of traffic". There was no need for this as the car involved was blocking/shielding from oncoming traffic on the slow lane. People here seem to be very accepting of risk to stick to their old ways.

Maybe I should add some context here as to why I am so sensitive on clearing and improving footpaths. I have someone coming to visit me soon who has restricted mobility and needs a wheelchair to go distances. Today having ridden around and tried to look at the state of the footpaths through the eyes of a person with these issues we would simply have resort to the road to use the wheelchair. Even if the paths were cleared of temporary obstructions it would still be out of the question to use footpaths due to their condition and permanent obstacles. This means us sharing the road space with traffic, and using the right hand side so at I can at least see what's coming. I or we don't expect any special consideration getting around and we will make do, after all it is our decision to be here.

My suggestion may have been tainted by my relationship with this person and some of our experiences in the UK when people show a lack of awareness of others, less able bodied. I honestly believe if the footpaths here could be improved by removing temporary obstacles (motorbikes, merchant's boards, cafe furniture, etc) it would be a start and in everyone's interests and a far nicer city to walk around. Initially it wouldn't even cost the local authority anything to enforce clear paths, they might even make money from fines. If they are currently clearing certain streets in Bangkok of traders blocking footpaths there is no reason they can't do something similar here.

It would be great to hear the thoughts of people with mobility issues join in on this discussion, see forked discussion here.

Just seen this advert running on the website called Invisible Thailand!!

Interesting please see this also

Just to give you some reality. I am not in a wheelchair but I am some what impaired walking. Clear the foot paths and I will still choose the streets. The up and down and holes in the foot paths plus the different elevations is defiantly not foot traffic unimpaired or impaired. For sure a wheel chair or a walker are out of the question. The bare foot paths are not pedestrian friendly.

Yes there are places that you must use them but I generally stay away from them. Perhaps take your friend to a handicapped friendlier city. Not that I know of one. But I am sure some one on the board will know of one.

As for the accident you witnessed you should be talking about people taking a first aid course. Got nothing to do with the foot paths.

Maybe I should add some context here as to why I am so sensitive on clearing and improving footpaths. I have someone coming to visit me soon who has restricted mobility and needs a wheelchair to go distances. Today having ridden around and tried to look at the state of the footpaths through the eyes of a person with these issues we would simply have resort to the road to use the wheelchair. Even if the paths were cleared of temporary obstructions it would still be out of the question to use footpaths due to their condition and permanent obstacles. This means us sharing the road space with traffic, and using the right hand side so at I can at least see what's coming. I or we don't expect any special consideration getting around and we will make do, after all it is our decision to be here.

I was hoping the last sentence in the third paragraph would have been a clue as to why I included the incident today.

As to the footpaths there are a few not many that are useable.

It's also good to see there are Thais who are not happy with the footpath situation and other annoyances. I think things will change for sure but I won't be holding my breath.

My girl friend used to have a mop which took wet cloths and was used to very effectively clean tile floors.

Do they exist here and if so could you point me in the right direction...

I, for one, do not wish it to change.

You'd prefer to walk on the road dodging cars and motorcycles which often get too close. You are happy to share the same space as the traffic!

Let me repeat myself... You actually don't want this to change! You are happy to give way to motorbikes blocking the footpath originally meant for you to walk on.

Less than 2 hours ago I witnessed the aftermath of an accident near Maya shopping Centre on the 'super' highway. The motorcyclist was flat on her back, no movement. Then another woman came grabbed her by the arms and literally DRAGGED her onto the hard shoulder. There was no assessment of this woman's injuries, it was a case of "Oh lets get her out of the way of traffic". There was no need for this as the car involved was blocking/shielding from oncoming traffic on the slow lane. People here seem to be very accepting of risk to stick to their old ways.

Maybe I should add some context here as to why I am so sensitive on clearing and improving footpaths. I have someone coming to visit me soon who has restricted mobility and needs a wheelchair to go distances. Today having ridden around and tried to look at the state of the footpaths through the eyes of a person with these issues we would simply have resort to the road to use the wheelchair. Even if the paths were cleared of temporary obstructions it would still be out of the question to use footpaths due to their condition and permanent obstacles. This means us sharing the road space with traffic, and using the right hand side so at I can at least see what's coming. I or we don't expect any special consideration getting around and we will make do, after all it is our decision to be here.

My suggestion may have been tainted by my relationship with this person and some of our experiences in the UK when people show a lack of awareness of others, less able bodied. I honestly believe if the footpaths here could be improved by removing temporary obstacles (motorbikes, merchant's boards, cafe furniture, etc) it would be a start and in everyone's interests and a far nicer city to walk around. Initially it wouldn't even cost the local authority anything to enforce clear paths, they might even make money from fines. If they are currently clearing certain streets in Bangkok of traders blocking footpaths there is no reason they can't do something similar here.

It would be great to hear the thoughts of people with mobility issues join in on this discussion, see forked discussion here.

Just seen this advert running on the website called Invisible Thailand!!

I started a discussion about reclaiming the footpaths for pedestrians in Chiang Mai here. Pretty much got a mixed response with surprisingly some even resisting change so I would be interested in hearing from those with mobility issues and how they manage.

Interesting please see this also

Brilliant, knew I could count on you for officiating on what's been a difficult process. Just think how many lives will be saved or accidents avoided. Can't wait to walk around tomorrow to police this new law, can you?

So I take it it's unanimous we would like the foot paths to be cleared then.

Pavements are being blocked more now because the police are now enforcing the traffic laws.

Last week teams of painters were around the city painting the red and white no parking and the odd/ even day no parking.

Parking tickets galore this last month, our lass got one for parking infront e of our business first time in four year, and a car yesterday full of swinging buddhas and photos of monks didn't help them!

The lack of planning for the growth of the city, cars,bikes,coaches etc will put more burden on the general public who will end up paying fines for beaureaucratic incompetency.

I take your point. I don't pretend things will change because of a moaning farang like me but they will change. Thailand is a developing economy but one day it will get there and things will be very different.

When the town planners were laying out CM do you think they built footpaths for motorbikes to park or were they exclusively for pedestrians. You may need to think about this one

I think the town planners were thinking rickshaws and the occasional ox cart mixed in with pedestrians.

Since the rickshaw did not appear until the late 1800's (1887 in some sources)I don't think the city planners were too bothered by them. I think they were more worried about defence than the movement of locals, tourists and resident farangs. (the last two terms not yet having been invented when Chiang Mai was established).

Lets be positive and look ahead, not backwards!

I was, sharing the road with other traffic is not good for ones health.

Those city planners must be 127 by now, thats where they are going wrong!!

I don't think this is a case of me seeing through western eyes since pedestrians need footpaths period.

I believe I have found you flaw in your logic... You are not in Kansas anymore Dorothy...

I was wondering how long it would take for the Dorothy response. Give up and go back to sleep for the rest of this thread my dear !

Let me pose some questions.

No matter what mode of transport you use, everyone has to walk at some time. Would your prefer to walk the streets or footpaths of Chiang Mai if the footpaths were cleared of any and all obstructions?

Having pedestrians walk into a carriageway is never going to be a good idea, especially at night is it?

But then again what's the odd life considering the road death toll here.

I get the impression that those who say they don't care mostly walk from the front door of their apartment to motorbike, motorbike to shop door and back again. So your input is not really valid in this discussion.

When the town planners were laying out CM do you think they built footpaths for motorbikes to park or were they exclusively for pedestrians. You may need to think about this one

Denying the truth is not a valid argument... Blocking the pavement with parked vehicles is nothing unique to Thailand... Travel to any 2nd or 3rd world country and you will find it is the norm as opposed to the exception... So perhaps you should travel more before making blinkered comments...

You last comment shows just how short-sighted you really are... Do you really think the "town planners" gave much thought to motorbikes in the year 1262?

Sorry, I've got better things to do than argue with you on whether certain behaviour can be changed or not. Nite nite, and I'm begging you...go to bed NOW!

I don't think this is a case of me seeing through western eyes since pedestrians need footpaths period.

I believe I have found you flaw in your logic... You are not in Kansas anymore Dorothy...

I was wondering how long it would take for the Dorothy response. Give up and go back to sleep for the rest of this thread my dear !

Let me pose some questions.

No matter what mode of transport you use, everyone has to walk at some time. Would your prefer to walk the streets or footpaths of Chiang Mai if the footpaths were cleared of any and all obstructions?

Having pedestrians walk into a carriageway is never going to be a good idea, especially at night is it?

But then again what's the odd life considering the road death toll here.

I get the impression that those who say they don't care mostly walk from the front door of their apartment to motorbike, motorbike to shop door and back again. So your input is not really valid in this discussion.

When the town planners were laying out CM do you think they built footpaths for motorbikes to park or were they exclusively for pedestrians. You may need to think about this one