vernthai

hi mike,

what kinds of things do you want pictures of? I have many photos having lived there for 18 months or so... I'd rather not just start posting random things - what do you have in mind?

VJ

I've been here for a couple months - it's quite liveable. Now, I came from Ubon Ratchathani in Isaan so that's my comparison. I also spent a few months in Phuket before Ubon so I have a rather small frame of reference, but for what it's worth I'll give you some thoughts

Surat has limited things to do within the city limits... however, the coolest thing about this town is it's proximity to other great places. On a Friday after working (at school) I can head to: Koh Samui, Koh Tao, Koh Pangnan, Krabi, Railay Beach, Trang, Khao Sok national park, Tai Rom Yen national park, Nakhon Si Thammarat (not as great as the others but it's a big city). I have only a motorbike and so I can drive to all those places on the motorbike WITH my girlfriend on the back. It's just about at the limit of comfort going to Krabi or Trang (over 2 hours) but, still quite doable. There are buses going very often to Krabi, Phuket, Don Sak Pier to catch the ferry to the islands near Samui... So, for 2 day weekends we can go any of those places. Now, for 3 day weekends we can hit Phuket, Koh PiPi, Chumpon, Hua Hin, Bangkok (night train sleeper), Penang (but I don't like it much), or a slew of other parks containing waterfalls, caves, lookouts, hiking, etc.

Surat is a Thai town but they are used to seeing foreigners. They pay us little mind. There are some decent Thai places to eat - but FEW farang places. There is one decent italian pizza place by the river and the ferries - Milanos pizza, that is quite good. Other farang food is best found on Samui where there is italian, mcdonalds, haagen dazs, mexican, american, as well as better thai restraurants than I've found here in Surat.

Surat has 2 nice parks where many go to walk, run, and play all kinds of sports in the early evening. One located on a small island in the river. One located off Donnok Road.

There is a Tesco, a Big C, KFC, and some sandwich places around. There was a black Canyon coffee at the tesco - but they've been renovating the entire concessionairre area at tesco and it may not return - not sure.

The people here are nice - not nearly as friendly as Ubon though. There are MANY farangs here working as english teachers and they have quite a contingent that goes off to Krabi, Samui and other places together - sometimes as many as 20+ of them going to the same place. They also go to same bars many times.

Oh, I've been here June-present and it's NOT hot. Next few months will rain a lot and get cooler. March through May will be pretty warm i've heard.

Hmm... hope that helps.

Any more questions about something in particular?

VJ

No problem John.

Hopeless - yes, of course she tried to straighten it out at the police station. They singled her out because they weren't getting anywhere with both of us men and they knew they could put her in jail right then without any problem. They knew they could scare her - and us. In all, we talked to these guys for 30 minutes trying to explain, and they didn't care. They understood, and after a while we understood - the whole thing was a scam. It's not about if what we did was right - we were right... or the agent at the border that CHECKED the cart would have told us right there that we're not in compliance with the law. I'm sure they make quite a bit of money on a daily basis from this.

It happens all over, but I've been to Chong Mek about 12 times and this is the first I've had anything happen and I've never heard of anything happen from other expats in the area.

I think the one thing I've learned from it is that I shouldn't blow it up to be a big deal. It happens - a lot. I am a victim - yes. But, don't blow it out of proportion. When my friend and I started getting pissed and the main guy was losing face because I was embarassing him, he could have had a cop plant some drugs in the car and we would have been Féd bigtime. We're totally at their mercy even when we think we have a leg to stand on. I'm just glad it turned out the way it did...

I cross-posted this in the general form as well, figuring that there are many visitors that end up coming up through Isaan and to Chong Mek to get to Laos...

Today at 1:15 pm a friend of mine (American living in Thailand, myself (American), and his Thai wife of 5 years were stopped by "Excise" officials.

Here are the facts -

About 1:00 pm we stopped at the duty free alcohol shop on the Laos side of Chong mek border crossing, intending to get some beer laos like we usually do, and also pick up a bottle of something stronger. We had heard that the law had changed recently since Thailand was now heavily taxing the harder liquors.

At the package store they explained to us (long-time customers) that we were allowed to take a case of beer each and 1 bottle of whisky each. This is what we did. We asked the owner of the store as well as the clerks. All were of the same opinion. We don't think that they would have scammed us by telling us the wrong amounts just so we buy more because we are in their store once every couple weeks buying over 2000 baht worth of goods each time.

We paid, got receipts and headed outside to find a guy with a pushcart to take the stuff to our car on the TH side. The store actually found us a guy to do it for 20baht.

We walked alongside him until the border and we took the footpath and he took the road where his push cart fit easily. A border agent checked what he had in the cart and let him through.

We kept walking and met him on the other side and walked to our car. Upon arriving at the car a man came right up to us to look at what was in the cart. He said that we had too much alcohol and that only 1 liter per person was allowed. I didn't understand as we had one 200ml bottle of red label, one 375 ml bottle of black label, and a 1.5 liter of baileys irish cream. We also had 1 case of beer laos dark (exceptional by the way), and 1 case of beer laos regular (both in bottles).There were 3 of us.

The guy was very low-key and had a tattered ID card - which i didnt believe. I insisted he call his boss and that we're not paying the 2000 baht he suggested...

As he left to go get the rest of the party, he told us to remain there. We did - waiting about 10 minutes. Then he came with 3 other guys. One had an "Excise" ID - #037/48... he was in charge. He explained that the guy at the border was "ARMY" and that he is under a different group of people. NOT the same. If the border guy said OK, it doesnt mean it's OK. He wanted to charge us 1000 baht excise tax on the liquor we had.

We argued a lot and tried to rationalize, when I realized and my friend did too, that they didn't want to budge. We'd have to pay them off. My friend reaches in his pocket to get 1000 baht and asked that we get a receipt for the "fine".

The excise official (ID - #037/48) said loudly that he couldnt take a bribe! So my friend repeated, no, no bribe, we're wrong, let us just pay the fine - give us a receipt and we'll go.

Well the guy was embarassed a bit now - or something wasn't going his way, so now he said we must go to the police station to do the paperwork. he was going to go to court against US because we were saying he is trying to scam us. He also said that if this happened, my friends wife would have to go to JAIL because she is the one behind all this. THEY NEVER LOOKED AT MY FRIEND'S OR MY PASSPORT AT ALL, just hers.

We tried to pay there and avoid the police station - because who knows what could happen there.

Reluctantly we went to the police station - we drove - main guy (ID - #037/48)came with us in back seat. It's close to the border - 3 minute ride. The main guy starts writing lots of accusations about my friend's wife. Calling her a smuggler and that when the court case comes up she'll be put in jail and they'll have to pay 20,000 baht to get her out. He is threatening her with a lot of things - making her very afraid. We weren't sure he wasn't going to put her in jail right there.

The jail was visible from the front of the building where we were standing at the desk he was filling out the paperwork. Two guys were standing - one was getting strip searched - i saw him strip to his underwear. There were 15-20 other men sitting and laying in the cell - who knows how long they had been there. I did not have a good feeling.

Before we left the car to walk up the police steps i had the sense to shut the trunk - as I didnt need these clowns planting yaba on us and upping the ante...

So, the guy berated my friend's wife and we continued to try to rationalize. They were having none of it and told my friend's wife if we keep pushing it - she'd go to jail.

She paid the 1000 baht. Got a receipt. The officer then said he needed to get into the trunk to get our alcohol! We were told before we left chong mek that we would keep the alcohol if we paid the 1000 baht "fine".

So a guy reaches in and grabs 4 beer laos and that was it. Shuts the trunk.

We drove off feeling screwed, and yet happy that she wasn't in jail and we weren't in jail for having some cigarettes or yaba or something else planted in the car.

What a ######ed up day at Chong Mek.

So, my question - what IS the law... we did not see a sign at the border that the Excise guy said is there. The people at the duty free store said they would refund us the 1000 baht AND give us 4 bottles of beer laos when we return (we called and they remembered us). They said that this same excise guy comes and buys 10 cases of beer and gets it across the border every now and then with apparently no problem.

We saw people get on the tour bus from Thailand with over 10 bottles of alcohol for ONE PERSON.

Advising everyone to be VERY careful here. And even if you are - LIKE WE WERE, you may still be had...

this IS Thailand - corruption is everywhere.

Today at 1:15 pm a friend of mine (American living in Thailand, myself (American), and his Thai wife of 5 years were stopped by "Excise" officials.

Here are the facts -

About 1:00 pm we stopped at the duty free alcohol shop on the Laos side of Chong mek border crossing, intending to get some beer laos like we usually do, and also pick up a bottle of something stronger. We had heard that the law had changed recently since Thailand was now heavily taxing the harder liquors.

At the package store they explained to us (long-time customers) that we were allowed to take a case of beer each and 1 bottle of whisky each. This is what we did. We asked the owner of the store as well as the clerks. All were of the same opinion. We don't think that they would have scammed us by telling us the wrong amounts just so we buy more because we are in their store once every couple weeks buying over 2000 baht worth of goods each time.

We paid, got receipts and headed outside to find a guy with a pushcart to take the stuff to our car on the TH side. The store actually found us a guy to do it for 20baht.

We walked alongside him until the border and we took the footpath and he took the road where his push cart fit easily. A border agent checked what he had in the cart and let him through.

We kept walking and met him on the other side and walked to our car. Upon arriving at the car a man came right up to us to look at what was in the cart. He said that we had too much alcohol and that only 1 liter per person was allowed. I didn't understand as we had one 200ml bottle of red label, one 375 ml bottle of black label, and a 1.5 liter of baileys irish cream. We also had 1 case of beer laos dark (exceptional by the way), and 1 case of beer laos regular (both in bottles).There were 3 of us.

The guy was very low-key and had a tattered ID card - which i didnt believe. I insisted he call his boss and that we're not paying the 2000 baht he suggested...

As he left to go get the rest of the party, he told us to remain there. We did - waiting about 10 minutes. Then he came with 3 other guys. One had an "Excise" ID - #037/48... he was in charge. He explained that the guy at the border was "ARMY" and that he is under a different group of people. NOT the same. If the border guy said OK, it doesnt mean it's OK. He wanted to charge us 1000 baht excise tax on the liquor we had.

We argued a lot and tried to rationalize, when I realized and my friend did too, that they didn't want to budge. We'd have to pay them off. My friend reaches in his pocket to get 1000 baht and asked that we get a receipt for the "fine".

The excise official (ID - #037/48) said loudly that he couldnt take a bribe! So my friend repeated, no, no bribe, we're wrong, let us just pay the fine - give us a receipt and we'll go.

Well the guy was embarassed a bit now - or something wasn't going his way, so now he said we must go to the police station to do the paperwork. he was going to go to court against US because we were saying he is trying to scam us. He also said that if this happened, my friends wife would have to go to JAIL because she is the one behind all this. THEY NEVER LOOKED AT MY FRIEND'S OR MY PASSPORT AT ALL, just hers.

We tried to pay there and avoid the police station - because who knows what could happen there.

Reluctantly we went to the police station - we drove - main guy (ID - #037/48)came with us in back seat. It's close to the border - 3 minute ride. The main guy starts writing lots of accusations about my friend's wife. Calling her a smuggler and that when the court case comes up she'll be put in jail and they'll have to pay 20,000 baht to get her out. He is threatening her with a lot of things - making her very afraid. We weren't sure he wasn't going to put her in jail right there.

The jail was visible from the front of the building where we were standing at the desk he was filling out the paperwork. Two guys were standing - one was getting strip searched - i saw him strip to his underwear. There were 15-20 other men sitting and laying in the cell - who knows how long they had been there. I did not have a good feeling.

Before we left the car to walk up the police steps i had the sense to shut the trunk - as I didnt need these clowns planting yaba on us and upping the ante...

So, the guy berated my friend's wife and we continued to try to rationalize. They were having none of it and told my friend's wife if we keep pushing it - she'd go to jail.

She paid the 1000 baht. Got a receipt. The officer then said he needed to get into the trunk to get our alcohol! We were told before we left chong mek that we would keep the alcohol if we paid the 1000 baht "fine".

So a guy reaches in and grabs 4 beer laos and that was it. Shuts the trunk.

We drove off feeling screwed, and yet happy that she wasn't in jail and we weren't in jail for having some cigarettes or yaba or something else planted in the car.

What a ######ed up day at Chong Mek.

So, my question - what IS the law... we did not see a sign at the border that the Excise guy said is there. The people at the duty free store said they would refund us the 1000 baht AND give us 4 bottles of beer laos when we return (we called and they remembered us). They said that this same excise guy comes and buys 10 cases of beer and gets it across the border every now and then with apparently no problem.

We saw people get on the tour bus from Thailand with over 10 bottles of alcohol for ONE PERSON.

Advising everyone to be VERY careful here. And even if you are - LIKE WE WERE, you may still be had...

this IS Thailand - corruption is everywhere.

I've been in Ubon for about a year now. There is no meeting place that I've heard about, though I have been able to meet a few other farangs that I hang out with on occasion. Some places I've seen guys include: Robinson, Big C, Lotus, KFC, SWING PARTY HOUSE, and sometimes walking around downtown. There are quite a few farangs teaching at the local colleges and universities here. Also there are a number of us retired here and it's a great place for that... if you don't crave any action.

Ubon IS the kind of place that farangs come and live because they don't really want to see other farangs. I include myself in this group. Yes, it's nice to feel "special" by being one of the few... however, that's not really a motivation for being here. I have never felt the emotion "jealousy" at seeing another farang in the city - what an odd idea. One thing that is true is that I might not go out of my way to say HI to another westerner in Tesco or Big C.

In my own view most of the farangs I see coming here are some of the same ones I see in Pattaya or Patong... Loud, fat, bald, smoking, rude, tattooed jackasses that have come because they think that Ubon is an extension of Pattaya and they will find some drop-dead gorgeous Isaan girl that is just dying to jump in bed with their degenerate selves.... or they are here because they met a whore in Pattaya, BKK, Patong or Samui and are back here to meet the girl's parents and family.

That categorizes most of the farangs I have seen come through Ubon... however, there are those that come for other reasons... and I've had great conversations with some that I've met.

I have few farang friends here because there are so many guys here that are rejects of their European or American society residing in Ubon. Really, even though we see each other on a weekly or once per month basis we might not say even a word to the other.

In this boring little town I've met some of the most bizarre people that I have ever met in my life... one 60 year old teacher at a government school in downtown Ubon and another while getting my motorsai fixed... the old guy fixing it told me that I just HAD to meet this other farang he knew... (Both were Americans like me).

Swing Party House club across from Robinson and the big Toyota dealer on Chayangkun seems to be the club with the most farangs in it at any specific time. It's not to my liking, but I get dragged there by co-workers occasionally. You'll likely have to introduce yourself because nobody will care that you are a farang in there. Coffee shops seem to be hot spots. Anywhere around Tung c Muang during the tourist season you can spot a farang or two. Really not many though. On average over the course of one year I've seen maybe 1 farang per day here.

Remember... In Ubon you're special to the Thais, they will stare at you, smile at you, you'll have women talk to you first... But to the other farang, you're not special. Don't expect to be and you'll have a more enjoyable stay... or life if you intend to live here.

Vern

THANKS all... I will head down to kata / karon beach in October and see what I can see. Appreciate the help...

Does anyone know, is there somewhere in Thailand that has waves big enough to surf or bodyboard? I've been to Patong during November. Now living in Isaan and craving waves... Thanks for any help...

George - me thinks you left out a critical dash... 40-50 percent - not 4050 percent.

Here is the full article:

QANTI-ALCOHOL MOVE: Excise tax raised for hard liquor

Published on September 07, 2005

Decision will affect brandy, whisky, special blends and distilled spirits. The Cabinet yesterday increased the excise tax on distilled liquor with high alcohol content while maintaining the current tax level on other drinks categories such as beer and wines, the PM’s Office deputy spokesman said yesterday.

Chalermchai Mahagitsiri said after yesterday’s roving Cabinet meeting in Phang Nga that the new taxes would take immediate effect.

“The government’s focus [in restructuring the alcohol excise tax structure] is to curb alcohol consumption. This change is enough to achieve the goal of slashing consumption and raising tax income,” Chalermchai said.

Larger players in the local liquor industry generally welcomed the new tax initiative.

Boonrawd Brewery, maker of Singha and Leo beers, earlier took out ad space in newspapers to show its support of the government’s move to raise taxes on spirits and beers.

Special blends, brandy, whisky and other types of distilled liquors are subject to the change. These types of liquor had been subject to a tax of between 35-50 per cent of market price, or Bt240 per litre of alcohol content. The new rate is 40-50 per cent, or Bt400 per litre - whichever is higher.

A Finance Ministry source said the government refused to raise excise taxes on other kinds of alcoholic drinks because those drinks were already subject to the maximum rate.

If additional taxes were to be levied, it said, the ministry would have to amend the laws governing the excise taxes.

“This will take time, so the government opted to raise taxes on those drinks that are not subject to the limit,” the source said.

Chalermchai said distilled liquor contained a higher alcohol content than other types of alcoholic products. The government believed those types of drinks had a negative impact on drinkers and they should be subject to higher taxes.

“If consumption remains high after this, we can assume that consumers will switch to products with lower alcohol content [which will be comparatively cheaper],” he said.

The Cabinet decided not to raise excise taxes on local liquors that have not yet reached their tax limit. The excise tax limit on local liquor is 60 per cent, or Bt100 per litre of alcohol content.

But in reality they pay only 25 per cent, or Bt70 per litre.

The Cabinet was concerned that if it raised excise taxes on beer, Thai Beverage Plc’s Chang beer would be the hardest hit due to its high alcohol content. Thai Beverage is currently the biggest player in both the whiskey and beer markets and it is preparing to list on the Stock Exchange of Thailand.

The United Nation’s Food and Agriculture Organisation said on its website at www.ias.org.uk that Thailand ranked fifth in the world in alcohol consumption, behind South Korea, the Bahamas, Taiwan and Bermuda.

Available evidence suggests that the number of alcohol drinkers is increasing. The latest survey in 2001 found that the number of drinkers increased from 13.7 million in 1996 to 15.3 million in 2001, representing an increase of 2.3 per cent per year.

Somchai Suthikulpanich, vice president of Thai Beverage Marketing Co, said the maker of Chang beer agreed it was appropriate for the government to raise the excise tax on distilled liquor with high alcohol content.

“The new tax will not have a serious impact on local liquor companies,” he said.

A source at Boonrawd Brewery said the tax hike proved that the government was serious about altering taxes to reduce alcohol consumption.

“In the past, local liquor producers have always objected when the government considered adjusting the excise tax on liquor,” he said.

Business Desk

The Nation

Just to update everyone on the situation...

Sunday night - caught the a/c bus from Ubon to Mukdahan. Arrived about 3:30pm. Took tuktuk to river and my g/f got a border pass good for 2 days and I got the departure from Thailand stamp. We caught the last ferry over the mekong and processed into Laos quickly - me with the 1500 baht charge and my g/f had paid 120 baht maybe for her border pass.

Arriving in Savannahkhet we found Hoongthip hotel - 1000 baht/night and payed for one night. We met a guy from Belgium who gave us a brief tour of the city and where everything was. VERY nice of him. He has lived there 2 yrs and works with a French company I believe he said.

We ate at Laos Deli or something - on the river - decent food - menus in English. This area is NOT an area that I wanted to spend 3 days in - waiting until the thai consulate opened back up on Wednesday, so I chanced it and went by the office and it was OPEN! I arrived about 11:00am. I was able to get my new Non-Immigrant B visa and I was finished there at 3pm and got the ferry back across and a tuk tuk to the mukdahan bus station.

They were selling tickets for an a/c bus that may or may not have a seat on it... and i wasnt up for the 3 hour + journey standing up. I called Ploy Palace in Mukdahan. My friend Alister here in Ubon told me that they had a van going twice daily from Mukdahan to Ubon and back. I caught it in time to make them turn around and wait for me and my g/f - they had no passengers - and we took back roads to ubon and arrived about 6:30 or so.

Hope that helps someone else...

artisi -

The school ignored my letters. The education department in back of the school - ignored the letters. They also ignored the 7 or 8 incidents of physical abuse where the guy hurt children in some way... pushing them down, spraying ammonia in a kid's eyes... stuff like that. The sexual abuse that I saw could have been interpreted other ways - but, when everythign is put together... cannot be and so I call him a child molester and child abuser... When you add up things like he would pick up the pratom 1 students in their skirts - girls only for some reason - and turn them upside down so their underwear and privates were a foot from his nose and eyes - and this is how he played with them... or that he gave hugs with both arms and open legs - as he sat in his chair in the office... or that i walked in on him while he cradled a girl on the floor and rubbed her thigh up and down - under the guise of "comforting" her... when you add these things up - he is a sick faukker but, nothing was so overt like me seeing him put his fingers inside a girl... and for this - the thais can turn their head and save face...

I got to the point where, after the school ignored my second letter I was prepared to bring the whole house of cards down... and as I prepared to do just that - with rallying all the local farangs and thai teachers from the entire city and surrounding area - I realized that I might well be killed for embarassing those that chose not to do anything...

and i had good advice from others that have been here for years - relax... learn something about their culture before you turn it upside down and get yourself (myself) killed or get thrown out of the country...

and so, that's that - I left and have another job... and he's still there...

life sucks

WOW. Thank you all for the advice and comments! It's very much appreciated... If anyone has specific info on the trip from ubon to mukdahan to savannaket - busses, whether to take took took to savanaket or whatever else... a place to stay in mukdahan under or about 500 baht... a place to stay in savanaket close to the thai consulate... etc... please post for me if you have time. It's my first time to mukdahan but 5th trip to laos... (chongmek and vientianne other times).

Appreciate everything... and yes, of course I turned the guy in... I wrote 2 three page letters detailing separate incidents and the school ignored them. Saving face - remember? yes, it's that bad...

Name: Vern

Location: Ubon Ratchathani

Citizenship: USA

Previous position: Teacher with government school in Ubon. For this I had gone to Vientianne and obtained the non-immigrant b visa for 2000 baht. I had a work permit with this school.

Now: Working with private school in Ubon. I quit the government school as it was bizarre and twisted. I had a co-worker farang that was a child molester (witnessed) and they didn't care to get rid of him. I am at my new school now and they called the office at Phibun Mangsahan to see what I needed to do - as my 1st 90 day "check-in" is required by august 3rd. Phibun responded that - my VISA was CANCELLED by my previous government school! So, since I didn't go to Phibun within the 7 day window after cancellation (because i hadnt a clue they cancelled it) I was going to be fined 1200 baht and get a late mark on my passport... blah blah.

The officer then suggested that I go back to Vientianne and get a NEW non-immigrant b VISA and don't go to Phibun and pay the fee and get the late mark...

Then it was suggested I just go to Mukdahan and go over to savannahket since they do non-immigrant b visas and sometimes the same day. IS THIS TRUE? has anyone done that????

I always thought that Vientianne was it... closest place to UBON.

Can anyone help?

Mukdahan is a 3-4 hour drive and a one day process where by Vientianne is 2 days travel and one overnight stay.

It would really help if someone new something solid...

Thanks so much - this board is incredibly useful.

Vern

[email protected]