Maui John

Excellent info everyone!

Potter: For the house, would not want to be in town, prefer to be within 30 - 45 minutes of town. Air con, garden, security or a safe area, quiet, and all at a western standard. 2 floors would be good as well.

Thanks again to all, your input is extremely helpful.

Thanks, very helpful!

Aloha,

As part of a larger trip, I will need to spend a couple of days in Bangkok visiting jewelry wholesalers on Khao San Road and Chareon Krung Rd. What are normal Thai business hours and days of operation? Are they open on Saturdays or Sundays?

Are there any holidays that would shut things down on November 3, 4, or 5 (fri, sat, sun) of this year?

Thanks,

John

Thanks for the replies. I'm impressed with the type of houses on the lana realty site. I didn't know what to expect after reading the allaboutpai.com website and seeing that nice fellow living in a dive. In fact, most of the Pai photos on his site made the area look too 3rd world for my tastes.

I'm glad to see that Chaing Rai is many steps improved! I'm not rich and am a cheapskate in most regards, but will spend a larger amount of my budget on housing in order to be comfortable.

Aloha,

Housing:

Is it possible to get housing rentals in Phuket that approach western standards and have enough distance from a neighbor that you can't hear the karoke machine?

How much would such a place cost to rent?

Please describe in general terms what the following rent levels buy you:

4000 baht/ month:

8000 baht/ month:

12,000 baht/ month:

16,000 baht/ month:

Ideally I'd like to rent a nice big house of near western standards on a decent size piece of property, large enough to create an oasis of monastic like peace and quiet.

Crime:

How do the crime rates compare to the west? As a farang, do you become a target like in central american countries, or are things fairly safe in Phuket?

Mahalo Plenny,

John

Aloha,

Housing:

Is it possible to get housing rentals in the greater (including rural) Chiang Rai area that approach western standards and have enough distance from a neighbor that you can't hear the karoke machine?

How much would such a place cost to rent?

Please describe in general terms what the following rent levels buy you:

4000 baht/ month:

8000 baht/ month:

12,000 baht/ month:

16,000 baht/ month:

Ideally I'd like to rent a nice big house of near western standards on a decent size piece of property, large enough to create an oasis of monastic like peace and quiet.

Crime:

How do the crime rates compare to the west? As a farang, do you become a target like in central american countries, or are things fairly safe in Chiang Rai?

Mahalo Plenny,

John

Very good point, I'll investigate Mae Hong Son as well....... What is the elevation in Mae Hong Son? Is it higher than either Pai or Chiang Rai, both of which seem to be around 600m (1600 ft)?

Maui John: Are you aware that there is an Honorary Thai Consulate on O'ahu? See: http://www.thaiembdc.org/directry/direc_e.htm#HI

If your friend is pretty sure she is inclined to go for the retirement visa, she can probably apply for an O-A visa through Mr. Miyabara. An e-mail or phone call might prove helpful.

I'm planning to obtain my retirement visa before the end of the year, and have been asking tons of questions, including here on ThaiVisa, and think I have a good grasp on the options and the procedures. Lopburi3 has been a patient font of information.

One way to get the retirement visa is to do the entire process in the US: It will require a police report in addition to the health check, income/savings verification, photos, etc. A benefit is that you can keep the money in the US for an extra year. You WILL need to bring the money into Thailand once you start getting the annual one-year extensions, but that's not going to be until one year after you enter Thailand. This method of getting the retirement visa in the US before setting foot on Thai soil is referred to as an O-A visa.

The other way to get the retirement visa is to enter Thailand on some other (i.e. NOT an O-A) type of visa, whether a plain old O visa or a tourist visa. Then once you are in Thailand you get the income verification from the American Embassy in BKK, get a health clearance form from a Thai doctor, etc, but you do NOT need a police report. (You will only need a police report when getting the O-A visa before you get to Thailand.) Then you initiate the retirement visa application process at a Thai Immigrations office in Thailand.

It might be easier for you and your friend to deal with the Honorary Thai Counsul in Honolulu and have all her ducks in a row before getting to Thailand than the doing-it-all-in-Thailand option. The worse that could happen is that she arrives with the O-A visa and then decides she does NOT like living in Thailand. Still, overall, the comfort of dealing with the bureaucracy while still on the A'ina might be of significant value. Mailing her passport to another island might be preferrable to physically running errands in Thailand, such as to the American Embassy in BKK.

Lopburi3, and others, please feel free to refine/correct my advice and information to Maui John. I understand only too well his confusion and frustration.!

Visa Runner: That's ok, we can agree to disagree. I still feel the Sunbelt response was not clear at all. I also feel backflip was very condescending and uninformative. Just because someone replies to my post doesn't mean I have to fall to their feet and wash their toes. If both Sunbelt and Backflip relate to my reply properly, they'll take it as a challenge that leads to higher level of communication on their part. I'm not a politician, I say what I think

Wpcoe: On the other hand, your reply was very clear and informative, Mahalo Plenny! I now understand what the "mystery letter" is all about and have a better grasp on the retirement visa situation.

My friend is going to give Thailand a try for 3 - 4 months (on tourist visas) and see what she thinks. She has to return to Maui by March to catch the Dalai Lama's first visit to the island. If she's still likes Thailand, she'll return for good, and I think you are correct, the consulate in Oahu is the way to go. She has the legit funds, thus nothing to hide on that front.

Is it true that when you deposit the funds in a Thai bank for the renewal, that you can transfer the funds back out of Thailand once you get the extension, and then transfer them back in for the renewal process the following year?

Or do the funds have to remain in the Thai bank the whole year?

Thank again (including Sunbelt and Backflip),

John

Hi maui john,

Talk about advance planning. In 5 to 7 years a lot of things can change in Pai or Chiang Rai. You may or may not have seen www.allaboutpai.com Loads of pics and current info on Pai and last year's disastrous floods.

Cheers

CountryBoy

It could be within a year as well, depends what happens on several fronts..... Thanks for the website on Pai!

And thank you everyone else for your thoughts, most helpful.

Thank you Abrasol and Blackbart!

We're going to be in CM anyway, thought it would be interesting to see what was available. For many years we have dealt with a wholesaler in Honolulu who sells a lot of Thai silver. We're using the opportunity to see how much we can save by buying directly from the Thai's.

Thanks again,

John

There isn't anywhere in Thailand that has a climate like the Hawaiian Islands so if that's what you want then forget it....it's much hotter here generally speaking....everywhere.

Oh, I'm under no illusion that I'll find what I have on Maui in terms of climate. But the median home price is over $700,000. A fixer upper starts at over $500,000. The cost of living is 30% higher than San Francisco. The ways and means have trumped the sunny day!

But there are places in the world that will suffice climate wise, albeit with concessions compared to Hawaii. One of my non Thai favorites is Boquete, Panama. It comes very close.

Thank you everyone else for the replies. I mistakenly wrote:

"3) I don't like most Asian cities. What are the rural areas surround Chiang Mai like for farang living? Far enough to be out of the noise and pollution of the city, but close enough that shopping trips are not a big hassle."

It should have read "Chiang Rai", not "Mai". It was late and my brain obviously failed me

You can;t beat the gut feeling you get from visiting a place firsthand and spending a few days talking face to face with locals and the westerners living there.

Sorry but i find it strange that youd consider retiring to a place youve never visited, and then upon a visit to thailand you cant check out both places because youre too busy in krabi and phuket?

Its like ordering a mail-order bride... oops, sorry guys here that have! no offense!

Hi Nigel,

I'm not retiring tomorrow, I'm only 37 years old. But I will retire (from a regular job) within the next 6 years, maybe next year, maybe later. I want to write, and writing takes free time and Thailand's low cost of living can provide me that time, something I cannot afford to do in Hawaii or on the US mainland. I'm not the first person to consider Thailand for such a reason.

I will be in Thailand for other reasons in late October. My airfare and travel expenses are being paid for me. While there, I thought it would be interesting to check out potential locations for my semi-retirement. As life would have it, I only have so much time, hence I'm asking questions so I will be able to make the most efficient use of my time while there.

No grand decision is going to be made any time soon. These are just preliminary investigations

Thanks!

Hi Abrasol,

It would be a great help if you could provide the names of a few of the best wholesalers in CM for hill tribe jewelry. If it's too much trouble, don't worry about it.

We want to avoid getting to CM and having to rely upon the advice of the tourist industry folks we encounter as it's likely to have us wasting time at their "uncle's" shop. I've tried Google searches but it's a needle in the haystack situation.

Having recommendations from knowledgeable people like you is invaluable.

Thanks,

John

Yes, I've been to Thailand 3 times, but never to the north.

I will be coming this year at the end of October, but only for 2 1/2 weeks, part of which will be spent in Phuket / Krabi.

I agree, coming to see it is key. But equally important is communicating with those who live there as only so much can be learned in the 4 days I'll have in Chaing Rai. My 4 day experience can't come close to comparing to the knowledge gained by you folks who have lived there for perhaps years.

That's one of the wonders of the internet, and the reason for my questions. By asking questions I can gain knowledge that would be impossible to gain during a brief trip. For instance, I don't have time to go to both Pai and Chiang Rai. My guidebooks only talk about the places from a traveler's perspective. The sharing of your knowledge has convinced me that I should visit Chiang Rai instead of Pai. That has saved me both time and money!

You can visit Maui and see if you like it, which is valuable. I've been here 10 years and know the island backwards and forwards, things that one could never learn in a visit.

Thanks again,

John

Thanks for the feedback.

I have nothing against backpackers per se, but am not really into that scene. I don't drink or do drugs. Love genuine music played by genuine musicians, less enamored with hippy drum circles.

It's sort of like this. I love the Grateful Dead, but have almost nothing in common with the Grateful Dead scene, if that makes any sense. I'm very grounded and very real. Maui has a lot of the transient backpacker new age crowd which mostly drives me crazy as it's all too out there in la la land for my sensibilities.

I'd rather be around more mature less transient people rather than the "sowing their oats" crowd.

Here are some Chiang Rai questions:

1) Border skirmishes, what is that all about?

2) What size is the farang community? I'm all for being around local Thai, but having some measure of an english speaking community would be nice.

3) I don't like most Asian cities. What are the rural areas surround Chiang Mai like for farang living? Far enough to be out of the noise and pollution of the city, but close enough that shopping trips are not a big hassle.

4) What is the housing rental market like in terms of quality and cost in the areas outside of town? What do 3 bedroom houses of good standard rent for?

5) What are the mosquitos like? Can one sit in the yard in the sun and not be assaulted?

Thanks again!

Thanks for the advice. We're going to Khao San Road as well, just wondering what Chiang Mai had to offer. Sounds like, "not much".

Is Khao San Road the best place for experienced buyers to go (as opposed to tourist retail buyers)? Are there other areas of Bangkok with a concentration of wholesale silver jewelry companies? Would prefer many companies in one place so we can check them out in a quick and efficient manner.

Thanks!

G'day,

Where are the silver jewelry wholesale companies concentrated in Chiang Mai? Is there a section of town where serious and experienced buyers go (as oppose to tourist retail buyers)? Would prefer it to be an area with many wholesale outfits so we can peruse them in a quick and efficient manner without having to bop all around town.

Thanks!

Aloha,

We live in Kula, Maui. Located on the side of a volcano at 3000' (900 meters). We *love* the climate.

Summer temps: 60 - 80F (15 - 26C).

Winter temps: 50 - 70F (10 - 21C). A few nights a year it gets down to 42 F (6 C)

Rainfall per year: 35 inches (89 CM).

Mosquitos: Some in summer, not bad at all. They die off in the winter. No dengue or malaria.

We are looking for a place to retire that's in the tropics at higher elevation and comes somewhat close to the climate in Kula and is also a great place to live. Maui is absurdly expensive, unless we win the lottery, retiring on Maui is in impossibility. No chance. We like the mountains and don't have to be near the ocean. We love nature and want to live in a rural setting yet be within 30 - 60 minutes of a "base" town for shopping, etc. Have no problem with "second world" countries.

Other places we are considering are the highlands of Panama or something like Vilcabamba, Ecuador (The Valley of Longevity).

We are curious about Pai and Chiang Rai. I realize the hot time will be hotter and the wet time wetter than Maui, but we can sacrifice for the cost of living.

Please contrast Pai and Chiang Rai for me. How do they compare in terms of long term living? Please share your overall impressions. Your direct knowledge of these two places is invaluable to us.

Thanks,

John

I don't know about them limiting 30 day visas but when I do is forgo the visa and just get an entry card.....there is a list of countries whose citizens are not required to get visas...they are mostly the economically successful countries like European countries and the US etc.......so if you don't get a visa then any limit on visas is no problem.

But you still get stamped thus there is a record in your passport of how many times you have entered on the tourist exemption. I think this what the original poster was refering to when he mistakenly called it a "30 day visa". Isn't it an issue of semantics?

As an addon:

Do NOT try to get new tourist visas at the Thai Embassy in Singapore if you already have one or more in your passport.

Singapore is fine with Non Immigrant Visa applications, but follow closely the recommendation that people with more than one tourist visa in their passport have to stay out of Thailand for at least 3 months before they can apply for a tourist visa from Singapore again.

For tourist visas, try Kuala Lumpur or Penang.

Thanks for the advice, I appreciate it!

1) Are you saying that she can go to the USA embassy in Bangkok and get a letter? What sort of letter? A proof of income letter but without proof of income?

>>A proof of income/pension letter. You don't need "proof", but you do need 1200THB for the notorized letter from the US embassy.

2) You say no proof of income is needed at the Embassy. Do you mean the USA Embassy in Thailand or the Thai Embassy in the USA? Are you saying that the USA Embassy in Thailand doesn't require proof of income? But the USA Embassy isn't the one issuing the visa, the Thai government issues the visa. I'm confused by what you mean.

>>I guess this question needs to be answered several times for you. You need to apply for this letter from the US embassy located in BKK. If you were a Thai citizen, you'd visit the Thai embassy. If you are Australian, the Australian embassy. I hope you get the picture. When you get the letter, you apply for the visa from, get this, Thai Immigration...also located in Bangkok. Just how handy is that?

3) What do you mean by "at other Embassies pension, social security, and investment income all count towards the proof of income." What other Embassies?

>>Read my posting above, and you'll get the picture. Maybe.

4) Then you say "at others it's just pension." Once again, what other embassies? Other American Embassies around the world? Other Thai Embassies? I'm confused.

>>Oh, for God's sakes.

5) Your website says you charge 33,000 baht to convert a 60 day tourist visa into a type "O" visa that does not require that one leave over 90 days. What do you charge to handle the retirement visa?

>>You can do it for free? Why pay anyone?

Aloha Backflip,

I appreciate you taking the time to reply, however, there is no need for the condescending attitude. I was responding to a very poorly worded reply by the visa agency dude that was very unprecise it what it was saying.

It still makes no sense to me why you have to go to the American Embassy to get a letter that has to do with proof of income to get a Thai immigration visa. What in the world does the American Embassy have to do with either my income or my Thai visa? From a logistical perspective, it makes no sense. And to even further defy logic, you claim that I can get a letter from the American Embassy to do with proof of income that doesn't require that I show proof of income!

Only an idiot would not at least take the time to question this "mysterious American Embassy letter".

On the Thai government website it states very cleary that one must provide proof of income and or deposit money in a Thai bank in order to get a retirment visa. It says nothing about getting a letter from one's own embassy that absolves one from the income requirements.

I'm not saying your claim in regards to the American Embassy are wrong, but your claim is a large deviation from what the Thai government claims on their website are the requirements for the retirement visa. Doesn't it stand to reason that an intelligent person would give a bit more credence to the Thai government's own website over the claims of unknown entities on an internet discussion forum? And from that basis, wouldn't an intelligent person ask questions to clarify what the unknown internet entities are claiming, especially given the contradiction?

Perhaps you know this visa dance backwards and forwards, I do not. You may be absolutely correct about the American Embassy mystery letter. But before I have my disabled friend fly half way around the world to make a new life, I'm going to make sure I have the visa issue absolutely clear in my mind.

Certainly that isn't so bad, now is it.

When dealing with legal matters it's very important to get wording very clear so that there will be no problems down the road.

Once again, please explain the following:

1) What precisely is this "letter" from the American Embassy. What is it called? When you go into the Embassy, what do I ask for? I certainly can't say "please give me the letter Backflip talks about and assumes all the world's citizens know about from birth".

2) How can a letter from the American Embassy in Bangkok allow one to be free of the income requirements of the government of Thailand?

Throwing up your hands and saying "for God sakes" doesn't bring any sort of clarity. It only shows that you have a big frown in the land of smiles

Thanks again,

John

Aloha,

Am I correct to say that Chiang Mai has a good hospital?

What about Pai? What sort of medical facilities are there? Is there at least a clinic?

Thanks,

John

Yes

Cool. Can you elaborate? What sort of medical facilities are in Pai?

Aloha,

Am I correct to say that Chiang Mai has a good hospital?

What about Pai? What sort of medical facilities are there? Is there at least a clinic?

Thanks,

John