Oblomov

Agree - a lot of hassle but this might be the only way for a very long time to come. I'm mid-journey right now and I certainly would be doing all this without the STV and a very strong reason to jump the hurdles

It either is, or is about to be driving up rates throughout Europe, so restrictions on travel would, if they began with UK, soon cover the rest of Europe and USA. That for Thailand, considering the Chinese aren't travelling would amount to another closed border. It's more ajar slightly than open anyway. One thing is certain, Thailand will not be receiving this new variant via an air traveller but will through the more porous land borders, so it would be like locking and bolting the front door with the CCTV camera above it but leaving the back door and all the windows open. The handful of cases that were identified quickly and isolated.

Don't forget the 25% owned by Qatar.

You say obesity is not contagious - that's a ridiculous comment but elucidates a point - obesity causes many other complex and chronic conditions that could be avoided assuming a person was intelligent enough to recognize that. Why would anyone knowingly increase the chances of severe outcomes when there are simple and scientific ways to reduce them with effort and an instinct to survive what is survivable? Diet has become what we want rather than what we need so robust responses to illness are weakening to dangerous levels. We are all well aware of the contagious nature of this and viruses similar, but as the contagion along with mutations is inevitable, then it's time to look at other ways to aid survival personally. We are also all aware of the complexities of developing 'bespoke' vaccines for an ever changing virus. Had it not had this component to its own survival tools then we'd be in front of this but it dos have this perpetual ability. It's not the first (or last) humans will not defeat a threat. All that aside, those that can improve their chances and should be trying and even impelled to make that effort. Most of us manage risks perfectly adequately with myriad threats to ourselves and others. I've always been a 'social distancer' and have always been extremely hygienic and still swim a km a day in pools, and swim in the sea, and remain at virtually the same weight in my 40s as I was in my 20s. I understand that a contagious virus most likely would be mild for me but could be much more difficult for those in my circle of contacts, so I'm aware and responsible about that. This is not instead of being vaccinated but as well as. The point is that we give ourselves the best chances by our own actions and if medicine can then keep up with this wiry mutating menace, then fantastic, but we're not at that point yet and in the meantime, we all have to live and work and educate our young alongside this and every other threat out there.

Haven't got time to read that but you miss the point entirely. Viruses like these have much worse outcomes on the many that simply imperil themselves in myriad ways by a total disregard for themselves through obesity and laziness leading to poor fitness. As individuals, so many like you drone on about this virus yet dom't look at how best you'd get through it, with an adult approach to personal good health. You're on the ignore list so don't bother with another facile essay in reply

The cancer specialist near the conclusion of the Mail article has the most salient point - stop burying contributing factors or omitting them completely. Most adults can make rational decisions if armed with facts. The govt in UK obfuscating again doesn't help - nobody is asking for invasions of privacy with regards to names, or even where they live - simple clarity about age and contributing factors. It will leak out anyway and we already know the deceased was in their 70s, so why not treat adults as adults and let us make our own assessments predicated on the facts. Throughout life we manage risks if we are smart, by staying within weight and fitness parameters but as with anything health related, we need facts.

Agree - creating ruin and chaos for so many was shameful and deluded - we'll always be a step behind this virus as it's impossible to predict where and when a variant will emerge, then equally in the dark as to what it will look like. Targeting vaccines is made almost impossible as by the time said vaccine is developed, tested, approved and then produced on any scale, the virus it has been 'tweaked' to combat is probably less of an issue and a different one or more has emerged. Vaccines are a useful tool but will only ever be a partial remedy against a perpetually mutating virus such as corona. We only need look at how the corona virus that causes common colds is so wiry and difficult to remedy As you say, isolate the vulnerable as effectively as humanly possible, then the rest must carry on in the productive endeavours that fund not just their own and their children's live but fund the social care and treatment of those now non-productive in the economic sense. Life is a risk and numerous things we do knowingly imperil us and to me it's extraordinary that this one risk, which in reality isn't a huge risk to most, is given such extraordinary focus when health statistics globally elucidate on the fact that health services have been put under pressure for decades with alarming levels of obesity related illnesses of very serious consequence, as well as smoking related, alcohol related... IMO opinion we can do as much as is humanly possible for now but the best chance was lost at the genesis of this. I remember hearing about this 'new virus' living on Bali and for weeks or even months after Chinese visitors continued arriving on Bali (and everywhere else obviously.) I remember one of the staff at the villa asked me why 'they' didn't stop them coming to my island?'

And then the next variant will hit elsewhere. And the next.... Thailand needs to revive important economic sectors so that the wider economy can be revived and Thais reclaim an ability to get their lives back. The Pass with Test and Go works and will not be the way variants get into Thailand. Porous land borders will be the way the strain enters and probably already has. US/UK/Europe are developing and supplying vaccines, donated and at cost, so I wouldn't expect national governments to be as petty and timid as some are, as the facts are plain. This is everyone's problem and the cyclical nature of outbreaks will ignore no region.

In reality it's quite plain that the latest variant is set to dominate all western countries very quickly, so picking out nations like UK, Denmark, France, Germany, USA... is both futile and ignores the fact that splendid isolation is impossoble for obvious reasons. If this is to the dominant strain, and it certainly seems it will be from all projections, then the faster higher infections could leave in their wake, higher natural immunity as other strains did, then better to stay calm. As UK is one of the most heavily vaccinated and 'boosted' nations (750,000 boosters yestersay alone) then all of those to whom vaccine is the key, had better hope that the Europeam model succeeds as variants can't be stopped, only delayed.

The discussion was about the merits or otherwise of hospital efficiency - By saying I found Bangkok the best I was talking about procedural. In UK a lot of resources are wasted by the GP referral method, especially in exceptional times. Having had some scuba-diving sun related issues, In Bangkok for example, I saw a doctor and was referred to a consultant on the same day, then had a surgical procedure the next day. In UK, for something similar, I had to get a GP appointment, then a referral to a consultant, then a wait... By the time I factored in days off work in UK, it was much cheaper and less stressful to simply pay and use one of the many decent hospitals in Bangkok. That's all I meant by finding Bangkok the easiest for smaller procedures and dentistry etc..

It obviously varies by area but the London trust I'm familiar with is somewhat disrupted but all of our experiences are different. I live between London, Bali amd Bangkok so have wildly different experiences of each, and always find Bangkok the best.

Deaths remain relatively stable in UK but the true number will be when the lag from increased rates of infection kick in - agree with you about the bed blocking as UK had a huge backlog in screenings and treatments for the extremely serious conditions such as cancer etc., where these is a huge benefit from early diagnoses through tests and screening. Looking at number in UK, it remains that an overwhelming majority of fatalities are those with myriad and complex serious pre-existing conditions and the aged. One would hope the 30 million boosters administered so far will lessen the impact in those groups. I don't think the public here resist pragmatic protocols to attempt to lessen the transmission rate but many of us have to balance our livelihoods, educations of out young as well as health in other areas so there's a balance that is hard to find and nothing to do with wilful resistance. We'll all know more by the middle of January nut of course these vaccines were never designed for this variant and we'll have a hell of a job keeping pace with variants.

Yes totally agree - cancer deaths will be on the increase soon with hundreds of thousands of tests and screening appointments missed , of which many will be youngsters and young mothers who've missed breast screenings. I think we all know how transmissible this virus is but as you say, it's the hospitalizations and deaths that should be the first data to be scrutinized and reacted upon and not so obsessively on new infections as that looks like it will ebb and flow for an eternity. BBC still make a good drama but unfortunately their drama writers seem to write the news too. Chelsea fan eh? I wonder if you can hang on to Rudiger - I'm hoping Liverpool can hang on to Salah and that someone would get De Bruyne away from City : )

I've never heard of this requirement and I fly in a few days - was this information given to your friend by the Embassy in UK ? As far as things stand, it's still the PCR test no more than 72 hours from departure and then the test and go at the hotel in Thailand

Of course it's not - obviously - but the point is that it has become some sort of competition with those with decreasing rates having some bizarre notion that infection levels has much to do with the published numbers - any country can record a 'surge' if they squander resources with massive testing programs, often with no tangible benefit and conversely any country can soothe their populations by testing less and recording less.

Some people think that a non-medical person hasn't the tools to research and make a comment - only asks that daft question if a view varies from own view. I'd assume that those that do agree with that member's view wouldn't be asked for medical credentials LOL I think we've learned to be very sceptical of certain medical professionals with their wild projections and vague data, bereft of the context required for a rational response.

Simple fact missed as always - Tourist authorities do not get to pick who they'd like to visit their countries - Visitors choose where they want to go based on what they're looking for. Thailand attracts a diverse range of visitors and has a bit of something that appeals to all of them presumably, so if I were them I'd take the loot on offer and use the income generated for improving infrastructure and improving environmental initiatives on Thai islands that may one day attract more of the tourism they seem fixated upon. In difficult times it would be madness to turn away the very groups that spend money in the local bars and restaurants, often fund Thais in ventures or property acquisition. They want the wealthy as they are more likely to keep the money within the Asian upper end hotel groups and chain restaurants. Personally I'd rather have a good impact on the regular Thais that have really suffered.

LOL - yes I noticed that

Instead of asking daft questions, do some thorough research yourself - it's all out there if you have the intellectual nous to filter out the tendentious nonsense. TVF Professor LOL That's hilarious. You'd be the TVF comedian right?

UK is testing 960 000 per day - How many per day do Thailand test ? Is that published ? UK does a huge quantity of genome sequencing as do the other countries that are gaining more accurate data

Agree completely - I know other large orgs are equally guilty. Can't navigate through a BBC platform without it extolling the virtues of trans lifestyles at a time when those unfortunate children that were indulged too young, are now campaigning for the opposite and wish they'd been allowed to reach adulthood before taking extreme decisions. The danger is that the more they try to manipulate opinion and mood and engineer societies, the bigger the reaction to it. Societies have never been more divided since BBC and others started this dangerous experiment

Very true and been saying this for years - modern medicine and treatments are literally life changing today but as you say they can only be truly efficacious in those of us that take our own health and fitness seriously - those that don't can expect worse outcomes even with modern treatments. There are also those that do have extremely dire health issues through no fault of their own. This is a wake up call for all who can and have the intelligence, or even some visceral self-survival instinct, to tackle obesity with better diets and better fitness for themselves and more importantly their children. It's not a secret what causes bad health and weak immune responses in those that ignore personal good health in favour of the hope there'll always be a pill or injection.

I'd imagine some were a lot worse than that. Someone came up with an 'excess deaths' argument but of course there are excess deaths when a previously unknown (in humans) virus is unleashed - don't we all accept a certain number of deaths from a million different conditions annually ? - but then as treatments catch up a bit and more is known then a realistic number of deaths becomes yet another part of accepted statistics. No doubt that the obesity and unhealthy diets and lifestyles of so many affects the ability of those to have any natural ability to survive these types of viruses.

Yes sadly - dived there and Koh Phan Ngan and Tao first 25+ years ago but the marine life is so depleted it is sad to dive there now

I don't doubt it - I don't think the BBC agenda is necessarily sinister but it's the use of fear rather than rational news with context, that allows adults to make rational decisions because fear tactics simply entrench a substantial opposition, then the ability of societies to have a coherent strategy to deal with these things together is lost.