peteinCM

In forums like these, one must always be aware that there are various agendas at stake when posters comment on businesses and one should really check out a venue for yourself rather than relying on postings from some posters, especially when there seems to be a certain vehemence to the postings.

I know one poster on this thread owns a competing business with one of the Lavender businesses and that he has been kicked off a number of gay forums for bashing this business to the point of being OTT.

Another negative poster has a BF who works at Lavender. The poster wants the BF to stay home and not work. The BF wants to work and earn money for himself and loves working at Lavender. Now I guess the BF has a new tactic--try to ruin the owner's buisness so the BF cannot work there.

My understanding is that this business is majority Thai-owned and that the interests who own it certainly will not let it fail. They also have powerful friends up and down the line (never to be underestimated in Thailand). I also understand (rightly or wrongly) that the business is already making money. It is certainly busier than most other gay businesses in CM. One just has to go into Power Boys to see that or to try to park on any weekend night when the overflow parking area is always being utilized. I understand from one of the Thai managers that they are also developing a very large and loyal Thai clientle in the massage and in the nightclub (and so many expats always underestimate the local Thai market in gay business venues). And this is a business complex with most businesses that have only been open for six weeks!

I like this place (well Power Boys and the lobby restaurant is all I've used so far). But, I like a lot of places others don't like and vice versa. See for yourself if you are interested in gay venues. And take the postings on both ends of the spectrum with a grain of salt.

I'm sorry, but I find many of attitudes on here puzzling. IMO, it is all just more Thai-bashing from Westerners who feel that all of Thailand should bow and scrape to them.

The woman in question ran from the police during questioning, resisted arrest, and then verbally abused the chief-of-police. In the USA, where I am from, any of these crimes carry serious charges. But in Thailand, where the Westerner is to be worshipped at all cost because all Thais should be whores to the tourist dollar (regardless of their station), the Thais are awful for detaining her while they decide how to handle this case and what charges to press.

In the end, it will probably be a small fine and no jail time just as with the Burroughs case (and in his case he abused and threatened airport security and immigration personnel which would also be a big crime in the US). That is not a big punishment to pay considering the circumstances. The woman from Australia is the one who made a petty problem very serious by her actions. Consider in your home country what would happen if you fled the police, resisted arrest, and verbally abused the cheif-of-police. But in Thailand, tourists should be able to do whatever it is they want according to the reasoning of some.

I DO agree that Thailand has endemic problems with police corruption, and criminal justice can be a twisted thing in LOS. However, in this case, I think the Thai authorities are within their rights. What must the Thais think when they are asked to excuse serious crimes for the sake of sucking up to tourists (and, no, I am not talking about a stolen bar mat)? It perputuates the sterotype many Thais have that all Westerners think Thailand and its people should excuse any behaviour and any crime from tourists and Westerners to save face with Westerners and their media.

Many of us know the worst thing one can ever do in Thailand, especially with authorities, is to raise one's voice, especially if verbal abuse is involved. This is NOT a case about a bar prank or a missing bar mat, and it must infuriate Thais that Westerners and their media want to paint it as such. Now the woman and the media are trying to insult the Thais and the Thai authorites involved by conducting a media campaign that makes Thailand look bad for holding someone in such a case (fleeing a police investigation, abuse of police staff). That is not a winning move on her part as she is now just fanning the flames, making a bad situation worse, and hardening the attitudes of the Thai authorities involved.

And had this happened in a Western country to a Thai person (and Thais who travel to other countries would probably never behave in such a manner) that fled police when being questioned and verbally abused the police and their cheif, would all of us be in an uproar? The woman (and any of us) need to learn that one must respect the laws, the authorities, and the customs in ANY country in which we choose to travel, and that being a Western tourist in a devloping country dependent in part upon tourism and tourist money does not give us the freedom to act in whatever manner we like and to break any laws we wish.

JMHO, and presented as another opinion in the face of all the rampant Thailand-bashing in this thread and the "another-nail-in-the-coffin" crowd who frequent the TV forum.

Well, I tried the search function, but I could not come up with the right word combination. So, I will ask a question probably already covered in depth:

What is the most upscale food/grocery market in CM?

I am finally moving to CM and need to stock the cupboards.

My venture is a private company, and I am not selling stocks or interest in any sort of public offering.

I know the SEC in Thailand regulates securities, and there are criminal penalties if one does not register as a securities broker. However, what do they really consider a security and would make a fuss about?

If I try to find a few investors for my business venture, am I considered a securities trader? Would the Thai SEC even care about something like this, or is this too under the radar for them, and their interest is with actual traders and sellers of stocks, bonds, commodities, and commonly-traded financial securities?

In the US, offering any type of investment offering, even in a start up business, is considered a regulated security offering, but the SEC in the US offers safe habor exemptions and clearly defines them. I can't find anything similar on the SEC website in Thailand.

Someone last asked about this in 2007 with no replies being given.

Does anyone know of any English-speaking lawyers in CR, or is it advised to just use a firm in BKK?

I have a home in CR and my BF is living and working there now while I am in the US. A new massage shop/spa opened in 2008 with gay massage boys. I saw the flyer in Lobo, and a friend of mine who was visiting actually went by talked with the owners. I have not checked it out and don't know the name of it but you could find out at Lobo.

I like the laid back vibe in the two CR bars and have never had a problem with my check bin. I always like the boys at Lobo better and have taken off the captain and boys there for a long night at the discos. I always have a great time.

My Bf always arranges for me to meet local boys which is fun. I see gay boys in any of the large discos and if you buy them a drink most would help you pick up a guy.

CR is great except for lack of a good movie theater and an English book shop, but CM is close. I love the area, the mountains, and the many great day trips. Doi Mae Salong is my favorite place in Thailand.

Look on gayromeo to meet some local guys and once you know a few nice guys it will be very easy to make friends with people in CR. Plus, there are two very large Universities.

Good luck and enjoy your stay. I will home in CR in mid-Feb, so feel free to look me up then if you wanna meet for drinks,\.

I've done this trip several times, and I have always paid full price for myself and any Thais I brought along. IMO, the trip is well worth the price. Also, knowing the owners of Connect as a long-time customer, I don't think either of them would ever try to rip off a customer so blatantly. Just MHO.

My current relationship is an OPEN relationship, and frankly the BF and I wouldn't have it any other way. We also greatly enjoy inviting other men into our bed, and some of the best sex of my life has been with the BF and another guy (or guys).

My BF is Thai, and while he loves farang guys, he also loves Thai guys. Like me, he is a gay man who enjoys the wide spectrum of the male human race.

For me, as a gay man who faces a world of judgement about my relationship choices, I resent when other gay men seek to judge the quality or health of my relationship based solely upon the choices they make in theirs.

As to the OP, I think you should discuss with the BF your relationship status and your desires to practise monogamy or not. However, as already pointed out, many Thais often are of the "don't ask-don't tell" mentality when it comes to sex outside the relationship. IMO, many Thais see sex as sanook, and don't approach casual sex with the same views as do many Westerners. If your BF does stray outside your relationship with or without your approval, don't expect to hear about it, and IMO, you shouldn't think too much about it. In my case, my BF sleeps with me every night when I am in Thailand and that works for the two of us.

Every relationship is different as the two people involved are different. Good luck as you figure out yours.

Thanks for the advice. I found Orn's today (behind the temple and to the right). It is a second-hand bookshop just as I like: quaint, atmospheric, and with everything clearly labeled and marked. Decent selection as well. My partner was impressed that Orn spoke fluent Thai.

Bancha, I will not be in Mae Chan long enough for regular paper delivery, but thanks for the offer.

Pete

I am sure this has been covered, but a search did not help.

I am looking for a place in the CR area (close to Mae Chan if there are any) that sells second-hand English language books and/or new magazines and newspapers. I'd love to find a place selling the Herald Trib or USA Today.

Thanks for any info anyone can give.

Pete

CR has two gay bars. They are smaller and not too busy, but there are okay boys in both bars and can be fun. There are also a number of discoes with a mixed clientle. Not much to do or see in CR city itself except the small night market (nice food court with music though) and the white temple.

As Krub said, the best thing is to see the countryside around CR which is very nice. I highly reccomend Doi Tung for the beautiful gardens, the drive from Chiang Saen to Mae Sai along the Kong river (and through the golden triangle area), a quick trip into Laos via boat near Chiang Saen or into Burma via the Mae Sai gate, and especially the drive to Doi Mae Salong which is a Chinese settlement and tea growing region in the mountains (if you go to Mae Salong check out the temple above the city which is beautiful and offers stunning views). My favorite thing to do in this area is to drive the back roads and check out all of the rice farms and pastoral and mountain settings.

I've only been to Rayong for visa runs and was never impressed, but I can't really say I saw much from the bus.

The Gay Forum Post of the Month on ThaiVisa goes to Rainwalker. Who ever said that a low post count always denotes a no-nothing who couldn't express himself?

Rainwalker is a well-known and very well-respected member of the four existing gay-specific message boards about Thailand that exist outside Thai Visa. He has years of posting experience about issues relating to gay Thailand, just not on Thai Visa. I am sure there are many members of this forum (gay or otherwise) who may not post much at Thai Visa but who are prolific posters elsewhere. You shouldn't measure a poster's knowledge or ability to express himself based solely on something as arbitrary as post count, although I do know that PB was being tongue-in-cheek.

I do agree with RW's post in its entirety, and I have choosen to live my professional life totally outside the closet. Oddly enough, my current supervisor is going through some rough times in his professional life because of his desire to selectively out himself to coworkers but keep his sexuality hidden from the bosses.

As for the OP, have you tried some of the Thai language websites and web boards such a thaiboy.net or or siam boy or gthai.net? You might find some professional Thais on there who can give you a more Thai perspective and know more about meeting places in BKK. Fridae also has a very active posting section with professionals from all over Asia. If you are looking for farang gay friends you might try gay.com or gaydar or some of the more farang-oriented meeting places in BKK such as @richards, DJ station, dick's, sphinx, bed supperclub, ect where there are few actual moneyboys (except at DJS). As for professional clubs, the closest would be the Long Yang Club which is a club for farangs-Asians to socialize. There is a BKK chapter and you can find them on the web.

BKK has more gay venues and outlets for gay men than almost any other city in the world. Just get out there and enjoy your life outside of work and let things progress from there.

The T&L rankings are just a luxury magazine's way of selling mags on the news stand. It is common for many magazines to have rankings of something relating to their subject matter. The T&L rankings and the Conde Nast rankings ARE big deals in the travel industry.

As an FYI, this is not a new award for BKK from T&L. It has consistently been ranked in the Top Five for many years. Also, Chiang Mai is often ranked in the Top Five as well. Thailand and Italy are the only two countries with two cities consistently in the Top Ten. The Penisula, The Oriental BKK, and Four Seasons-CM also do very well each year in the rankings for this magazine.

Conde Nast and Frommer's also rate Thailand cities and luxury hotels very highly in their surveys. Frommer's has named Chiang Mai as the best value city in the world for travelers. Many industry experts consider Four Seasons CM as one of the Top Five hotels in the world, and many others include The Penisula and Oriental BKK in the Top Ten as well. There are a number of other Thailand luxury properties that also make the rankings.

Believe it or not, Thailand is one of the world's top travel destinations, has been for many years, and remains so for a number of reasons. Strange that members of this board would find that so astonishing, or wonder what foreigners could possibly see in BKK that would make them rank it as one of the world's top destination cities for travellers. Geesh.

The OP already has a business in Thailand and is already here legally and has a trusted Thai business parter. He is not wanting to come in and set up a new shop and get a WP from it. He is asking what is a good second SMALL business to open for 400K which is a fortune for opening a SMALL business in LOS if one is leasing the business premises and is set up outside the major tourist areas.

I would say to the OP that there are hundreds of businesses one can set up for 400K. Your best source of info is your Thai business partner and your Thai friends. They will know what is needed in your area and what types of businesses might succeed. As you probably know, you will also have to think outside the box a bit as Thais will often just copy an already exisiting business model that seems to be working. As with any business, there has to be an identifiable market, and only you will know what the market is like in your area and what may work best in tandem with your already existing business.

I spent a total of about 150K opening a flower shop and a small restaurant for my Thai BF (in separate locations). Both earn in profit between 10K-20K in profit in normal months. The upside is that on four different occassions the flower shop landed some very nice accounts with big paydays (over 100K profit). The BF has actually funneled back my initial 150K investment to me, and he has bought a new car. The downside is that the flower shop has little business in the hot and rainy months as it is not wedding season and there are no big festivals, so the income in the June-Aug months is about 5K profit. However, the restaurant business remains steady.

We have looked at a number of other smaller business in his town (a suburb in the north), and there are some winning possibilities for 400K investment. One could possibly make 50K-100K profit each month after two-to-three years off one of the better ideas and grow it into something even bigger. However, we are looking at a different business in another city that requires a much larger investment but has a tremendous potential for earnings (and no, I won't discuss either of those businesses here).

So yes, there are many businesses that an exisiting company or a Thai person can open for 400K. I also agree with another poster above that TIT. There is a bend and flow to doing business here that a true entrepenuer needs to be able to stomach. It helps for the small investor to already have a company or to have a very trusted Thai business partner. The OP has both. He is a smart man in that he is willing to take a risk on a new business which will give him a much better return on investment than any other investment into which he can put his money. I think he already realizes that it carries much greater risk.

There are thousands and thousands of farang and expats who have successful businesses in LOS. Many of them did live like Thai people (what does this mean anyway? not having AC and eating street food? Is that so bad?) and worked their asses off and put their money back into growing their business and expanding into new ventures. Sunbelt has many businesses listed under 1 mill baht, and some have real potential with hard work and the right frame of mind.

Most business is about risk and working very hard to succeed. The OP already lives in LOS, has a Thai wife, and already has a business that supports them both. Telling him he cannot open a second small business with 400K TB is laughable. As for me, Thais love to eat, and I know the food industry, so I always think the right food venture has the potential to make a steady income. I would also advise the OP to consider a business with a 10k-20K net income, especially as it is a second business. If it works, then open a third small business in a year or so or expand one of your first two businesses. I just find 10-20K net each month a good marker for most Thai small businesses. However, with 400K you can open what many consider to be a medium-size business, and could easily see profits of 30K-60K each month if successful.

BTW, for many naysayers about business in LOS, I think it is an excellent country in which to do business. Once one works through the business regulations (really not that hard) and understands the unspoken rules for business here, then one has a market with exceptionally cheap labor, cheap rents (with a few exceptions), very cheap COGs, low taxes, and really, fairly unencumbersome business regulations when compared with other countries. Plus, maintaining a good standard of living is cheap in LOS. However, as stated before, any startup business is very risky (most fail in every country), but with great potential ROI, and requires A LOT of work for the small businessman.

I wish the OP luck in figuring out the business for him and his wife. Just make sure it is something you will enjoy and about which you already have some knowledge.

P

Hmmm....well my name isn't really Pete, but I use it on the assorted forums about gay Thailand, and I don't live in CM yet, although I am working on it. I am a 37yo service-industry professional from the US who is working very hard to open a business and move to LOS over the next 12-to-24 months. It looks promising, but one never knows.

I have a 25yo Thai BF who is currently working on his MBA in Chiang Rai and who owns two small shops in his city. We match up very well together, and we both feel as if we may have lucked into finding the right life partner. It looks promising, but one never knows.

I post on TV rather sporadically, but thought I'd join in the introductions just the same.

IMO, what it all boils down to is the happiness of the two people in the relationship.

If you want to support your BF and have him not work, and you are both happy, then more power to you. Likewise, if you and your BF both work hard, and neither of you would have it any other way, then more power to you. Relationships are very unique to the two people involved, and no two relationships are ever alike.

I have various friends in the US who disagree with so many aspects of my relationship with my Thai BF: our age difference of 12 years, the fact that I pay for his University and give him an allowance, the fact that he looks much younger than his 25 years, the fact that I met him in a bar. My friends know me however, and know that I have little interest in trying to justify my relationship to them. Years ago, I learned to stopped justifying my homosexual relationships to the religious conservatives and the bigots, and it cured me of needing to justify anything in my relationships to anyone. As long as I am in a mutually-satisfying relationship with someone of legal age, then the dynamics of the relationship are strictly the business of me and my partner. I could give a rat's ass what anyone else thinks.

Life is very, very short. If you and your BF are both happy, then that is all that matters.

I stayed in Mae Chan with my Thai friend for about six weeks last fall. I really love this area as it is very central to everything, yet maintains a small town rural feeling. CR city is very close for more urban pursuits (bars, western shopping centers and restaurants).

My friend lived in a very nice residential community right off the road to Chiang Saen. From what I understand, the banks had foreclosed on some homes in the area, and listed all their homes for sale on their websites. Might be a good place to look. There was one beautiful four story home right off the major road to Chiang Saen that was listed at only 1.5 million baht.

I love the small evening market in Mae Chan as well as the many night time food vendors on a smaller soi near the center of town. I also found a couple of very decent restaurants in town. However, I am a night owl, so not having a 7-11 or any 24 hour market, and having everything close so early was a minor irritant for me.

I would not live there without a car, unless it was within Mae Chan itself. There is okay public transportation between Mae Chan and CR, but for me, the great joy of being in that area is driving through the countryside and having access to the many towns and villages in the area.

Moving full time to Chiang Mai soon, but I plan to be in the CR province often as I really love Thailand's northern countryside.

prtrolhead, you are a braver man than I am in giving specific details about your proposed business venture on this forum. If you listened to many of the members on Thai Visa you would quickly learn that:

1. No farang can succeed in business in LOS, and every farang business is doomed to failure

2. Every Thai person is out to rip off and to cheat every farang they meet (and all other Thais as well)

3. Farang should never in any circumstances marry or be friends with any Thai person because of #2--even Thai marriage partners of 20 years are just looking at the long view and are just biding time to take all of your money or to kill you in your sleep (or both)

4. Thailand is an awful backwater country run by people who can't even wipe their own noses, and nothing in Thailand works right, runs on time, or meets the same high standards as their home countries

5. Thais are ungrateful louts who have no business trying to restrict or manage the investment, travel, or residency of foreigners within Thailand (the bloody awful cheek)

6. Thais have no real understanding of Buddhism or religion in general and any religious hocus pocus in which they engage is all superstitious drivel practised by poor illiterates

7. Thai nationalism and pride in their country is a misguided notion by an insular and ignorant people who have no desire to embrace globalazition and the new world economy, and Thais should be ashamed of their pride in their country and of their nationalism

8. In the very, very near future, it will be doomsday for Thailand, and the economy will be destroyed, the tourists will no longer come to Thailand, there will be 50% unemployment, there will be civil war and rioting in the streets, and Thais will have to come begging on their knees to get the white man to return to their country and make everything all right

9. Thaskin and Surayad (or is it Sonthi?) share the role of the Antichrist (they alternate days) and all the woes of Thailand can be laid at their feet

It seems many people posting on this business forum have either failed in their business in Thailand (and probably are not the best people to ask for advice) or have never run any business in Thailand. I think Soundman and Greg from Sunbelt are two of the few successful businessmen posting on this forum. I guess most successful farang businessmen in LOS are too busy running their businesses to spend much time on Internet forums.

Frankly, I know of a great number of farang who have done well for themselves on their Thai business ventures. Almost all of them have already had business success in their choosen field before opening a similar business in LOS, and they almost all have good Thai partners. It sounds like you have both of these. I have nothing of value to add to your queries as I have no experience with the grocery retail business or the gas business. However, good luck to you, and forgive me for hijacking your thread with my little list of observations.

My friend in Mae Chan (a small business owner and MBA student) has just told me that 500 acres were just sold there to build a Central Festival North Chiang Rai complex that will include a Central Department store, the usual mall stores, a Tesco-Lotus, a Tops, a major cinema, a Sofitel hotel, and more. The slated opening date is in December. Mae Chan is very central in terms of Chiang Rai, Mae Sai, Chiang Saen, Mae Salong, etc. It will be reportedly the largest mall in Northern Thailand (much larger than the Central Airport in CM).

It makes sense to me as I think the CR area is vastly underserved when it comes to upscale shopping. This could make the CR province a much bigger tourist destination and make it more attractive for expats. I know the Central Festival in Phuket and that is a very nice mall IMO. It would be great to see something similar or better in the CR area. This project, if carried out, could also make it a good time to invest in this region.

I hope it happens.

I'm wondering why you are not considering using a part of your savings to open a business in CM? A decent business would have startup costs that would equal only a small portion of your savings and that could take care of your needed monthly income and could also allow you enough of an income to even leave your savings untouched for a number of years (both the principal and the interest). You seem smart enough to do the research and to put together a solid business plan. As an American, you can qualify for Amity, and you have a Thai wife who can partner with you and help grease your way in Thai society. There is always a risk in business, but there are plenty of farang in LOS who have created a good life for themselves by running their own business. Seems to be to be a smarter alternative than teaching for low wages.

With a profitable business you could then focus on starting a business you might really love doing such as planning and leading mountain bike tours in SE Asia. You say you need to work, so why not work at something you love doing? Your capital allows you to start a business to pay the bills that could set you on the path to having the extra funds to create a vanity business for yourself without needing it to be an overnight success (or even turn a profit).

If it scares you to invest some of what you've already saved in a business then spend an extra six months working in the US and with the extra 2-3 mill baht, you would have enough for a decent business startup that you could build upon and within a year (or less) could be earning the minimum monthly salary you say you can live on in LOS.

I do realize there are many who have no stomach for owning a business and the risks involved, but you seem to have the background, the ability, and a couple of intangibles (a Thai wife to grease the wheels and American citizenship to qualify you for Amity).

Pete

It seems according to legal advice by Sunbelt that I would have to be convicted of a crime to get on the blacklist.

So, the hotel has to press criminal charges against me on a bill I have already paid and have a reputable Thai witness to my paying. The alleged owed amount is about 20k baht. I checked out of that hotel three months ago and have been back in the US for over a month now. How would I even know if they filed a criminal complaint?

Like some of you, my Thai friend who was with me when I paid is also incredulous at this because obviously I had to pay at checkout (or the police should have been called then), so it seems like such a stupid assertion for the hotel to make so many months later.

From what I understand if they do press charges against me and the charges are dismissed, I could sue for libel. I wish I could just ignore it and it all go away, but I need to protect myself. What a pain in the butt.

Thanks again for all the comments.

I was in LOS for four months last summer, and a number of times, I had to produce my passport for police at road checkpoints. However, if one does not travel by car and stays in a major tourist area, I can see how people can go for years without having to produce a passport.

However, on second thought, I also had to produce my passport for hotels, wire transfers, domestic flights, to get into a couple of clubs, and some payments by credit card. I'm not sure any of those people looked at the dates stamped inside, but if they did, they could have turned me into the police or blackmailed me.

I'm not so sure how one just overstays for a long period. Seems like one would have to lead an underground, fretful, and maybe even boring life in order to get away with it (boring because the area in which one can travel is very limited).

Pete

Thanks for the replies.

However, I still wonder if anyone knows the procedure immigration uses for blacklisting. Is there one? I am in the US, so I wouldn't be aware of any proceedings involving me which is why I'm so curious as to the actual process. I'm guessing from comments that the complaint by the hotel's lawyer would be dismissed out of hand by immigration, but does anyone have working knowledge of the procedure that can tell me with some degree of certainty?

Thanks.

I stayed in Thailand four months last summer, and at one hotel for three of them. When I checked out, I paid part of my bill with a credit card and part with cash later that same day. Now three months later, the hotel has emailed me, and denies I ever made a cash payment, and they said their lawyer is starting legal proceedings to have me put on the immigration blacklist, so I can never enter Thailand again. I always wondered why the hotel was always so insistent I pay in cash (now I know), and I never got receipts for any of my cash payments. Thankfully, my Thai companion was with me when I made the payment they say I never made. Also, the hotel owners are Europeans who have been in Thailand for only a short time and who are already in litigation with the former owner of the hotel because they have not paid him in full for the business.

I understand this is most likely a bluff or shakedown on their part (or else their employee pocketed the money as no one else was around when I paid) and have been told this by other posters and by a lawyer at Sunbelt. However, I am in a relationship with a Thai and would like to open a business there next year. So, I'm still nervous about this as TIT. I could ignore it, but would rest easier knowing the procedure for blacklisting.

Can a business get immigration to blacklist someone over a disputed 20,000 baht hotel bill? Does the person subject to be blacklisted get any notice or right to defend themselves? Can someone be blacklisted who is not even in the country and has no idea of their blacklisting? How does the blacklist work and the procedure for placing someone on it?

My Thai friend who was with me when I paid is mad as hel_l because he thinks I am being shaken down. He is an MBA student at a top Thai University and has a cousin in the police in Phuket where the hotel is located. He wants me to report the hotel and cause problems for them. I just want to steer clear of any immigration problems in regards to this, and for me, mai pen rai. I'm not going to give the hotel any money though, and just want to be 100% sure that there is no danger of being placed on an immigration blacklist due to my simpily ignoring the issue.

Thanks.

BTW--I did post about this on the travel forum, but as I had specific questions about immigration and the procedures for blacklisting, I thought the immigration forum might be a better fit.