phloiwang

It's up to which perspective / norm you use to sort thing out.

In case of Tammaguy

Its Buddha image and church are created differently and uniquely. This style hasn't been imitated and accepted by other traditional wats. Tammaguy subject, its abbot has always said, was discovered by Luangpu Sod only, its official initiator.

In case of Asoke

Asoke has confirmed its ( partly ) different interpretation of the Tripidok as true. The way that Mahatera Society stripped it from that society is only the worldly way. But the society could not strip Asoke from Buddha's Dhamma in case Asoke has observed it in its unique own way. After Lord Bhudda's Parinippan, Is there anyone living now can recommend which linage of Dhamma is Lord Bhudda' s authentic and original?

Hi guy

IMO, perhaps there are 4 sects of Thai Terawat Buddhism, i.e., Mahaniguy, Tammayut, Tammaguy and Asoke.

The first one is the traditional sect to which the most wats in towns and villages belong. It seems to me there is occultism mixed in it but I don't know why and who knows. I just guess the magic should be influenced from Khmer, now Cambodia,which once was a power of the region. Actually, Thai society had been familiar with magic over time until a few decades ago when education in school was introduced. But some say the sorcery still exists now but very hard for outsiders to know.

The second sect, Tamayut is considered to be strict. As far as I know, King Monggut , while being a monk, was bored with monks in Mahaniguy. He then founded this sect to push more disciplines to monks. The Tripidok is what the monks of this sect always and seriously hold firm. Maybe most of Forest monks belong to this sect. The most revered master of them is probably Luangpu Man, who is believed to attain arahantship. The famous monk at present time are mostly Luangpu's disciples - first, second, third or even fourth generation after that arahant nippaned.

The third one, Tammaguy, was informally founded a few decades ago. This group is seen as new intellectuals coz many of its monks are bachelors, masters or even doctors in all branches. Luangpu Sod is seen as their master of Tammaguy subject. Thousands of lay men and women doing Tammaguy meditation in large hall is their prominent point. Their DMC channel is also interesting due to its well-organized programs. But the most stunning aspect, for me, is the way the monk is able to answer of where inquirers' late loved ones have gone to which realms, among other perplexed infinite inquiries.

The last sect, Asoke, is founded by samana Potirak nearly 40 years ago. The monk and their disciples introduced vegetarianism to Thai society. Their communities are like Thai ways of life in the past- simple,friendly,generous, helpful and yes- land of smiles. The monks are seen to be very strict but never go away to find peace outside human societies. Its prominent point is silas, precepts. The different point of view that sorts them out from other sects is chan - samati or wipassana meditation. According to the eightfold paths, their samati/meditation is resulted from practising first upto seventh paths. Therefore, they practise a little in ( eyes closed )meditation. If asked why, they will reply that the meditation practised around the world does not belong to Buddhism. True Buddhism samati/meditation automatically occurs when people practise first to seventh paths.

This is an outline of sects in my opinion. The details of each are your own duty, man.

The guy's account of meeting deva and naga was often mentioned by Thai ariya monks as well. AFAIK, beside Luangpu Man, Luangpu Kamkaning, Luangpu Nainkam and Luangpu Kao, for example, encountered these beings, and even more of other beings and realms, and taught dhamma to them. After listening to dhamma, these beings would prolong their lives in their realms longer, that's the reason why they like to communicate with monks with pure silas.

The difference between him and Thai monks is that Thai monks were unlikely to tell others (strangers, internet readers, for example) but Thai readers have a chance to know their accounts when reading books, perhaps written by one of the monk's disciple. It is (almost) impossible for monks to tell (show off) these incredible stories. The account should be called patjattang (personal, individual witness) , which often results in argument, insult or quarrel. People who argue, insult and quarrel will cause their own kamma unintentionally.

" Their community was semi-divine, their food such as yam and bean would manifest its taste depending on how the eater preferred it to be - sour, sweet, salty or whatever. Nain Kao was confused with the situation he was encountering and he was sure it was definitely not a dream. The deva folks offered him cooked rice and he noticed their rice kernels were much longer than that human consumed, and much more fragrant than whatever food he had smelled before. Finishing the meal, he left a little rice in his bowl, hoping to show it when he was back to his wat. He looked for and found a container nearby to load the left food. Back to his bowl, he saw no fragrant rice in it. All disappeared. A group of female devas told him that kind of rice could be eaten individually, not for everyone. And they told him to hurriedly see their revered master."

Concealed community, the Land of the Honest

Beautiful beings I encountered there gave me food offerings. Those secretive dwellers recounted why and how they had lived their lives.

" Once we lived on plain. An epidemic of smallpox drove some of us to move to the other side of the Kong River. The rest immigrated into Pu kwai, praying and promising we would strictly observe five precepts. We begged sacred thing for supernatural power. If we survived from the disease, we would observe precepts and practised vegetarianism forever. Due to our faith on Lord Buddha and his dhamma, we refrained from all kinds of meat, no stealing and lies. Also, we fulfilled samati-paowana meditation until our minds were improved enough and resulted in attaining dhamma. Realising we succeeded, we kept praying not to involve with other human beings, we pleaded dhamma power to conceal our community, not to let the outsiders know and behold it, except one, with merit and virtue, could come in our dimension. In addition, permitted individual must be related being from the past as well."

In moderate time Jo Kam came back.

" It's time to meet him, our revered master".

" Where to?", asked nain Kao.

" Close your eyes and pray. I'll lead you".

Nain Kao closed his eyes. Again Jo Kam covered nain Kao's head with a robe. For a moment, they arrived at an open space over a cliff called " Tam puprapadang", on the other side of Pu kwai, overlooking the Ngum river in front. Jo Kam asked nain Kao to worship two rock Buddha images nearby. While he was worshiping the sculptures, a layman in white garment came to him and asked him to have a meal. Following him to the venue, he saw a crowd dressed in the same white clothes welcoming him.

" Where are you all from?", asked Kao.

" We all live at the foot of the montain below. We are looking forward to you, master", replied the folk.

Kao was surprised to be called a master. And he didn't notice any community existing down there.

" I'm just a samanain, not a master", he said.

" You are right you are a nain at present. Actually you are our master. We have been waiting for you for several thousand years. It's good you finally come here".

Jo (samanain in Lao) Kam Visited Him and brought Him to See the Master

At night, Jo Kam, wearing long hair, visited nain (Samanain) Kao.

" Master, The revered master would like you to see him", said Jo Kam.

" Who is he? I'm just a nain, not the master", said nain Kao.

" Well, I'm willing to call you master. Let's go and you'll know him yourself".

" How far is it?", asked nain Kao.

" Just close your eyes. I'll bring you there".

Nain Kao mindfully closed his eyes. Jo Kam caught the rim of Kao's rope, covered it onto his body and led the way. Nain Kao was aware of not too many paces of walk when Jo Kam told him they both arrived at Lord Buddha's footprint. (Later he realized the distance between two locations was 200 kms.)

When Nain Kao opened his eyes he was standing on black rocks at the foot of a mountain called "Pu kwai", surrounded with sparse trees and breeze.

" Where are we?", asked nain Kao.

" It's called Prabat Aewkan. You stay here. I'll come back when it's high time".

" In comtemplation of your mind, focus it with a single temper, together with silent uttering "put-tow". On contemplating of corpse, envision its natural state, from its head to toes, and vice versa. The tripidok or dhamma is our body, speech and mind.", said Luangpu.

Later, samanain Kao would like to go tudong(pilgrimage)and paid respect to Luangpu Waen Sujinno, at Wat Doi Maepang, Prao District, Chiangmai, a famous monk at the time. He asked for a permission from his abbot.

" If you dare go tudong, you mean to kill yourself. You are just a small, ignorant, newly-ordained novice.", said the elderly monk.

Nobody could object against his determination, the 13 year-old novice went tudong through forests, mountains and the Kong river. He finally crossed that international river to Laos. While he was at Purikamsai district, Laos politics was changed from democracy into communism( 1975 ?). Its people as well as monks were in trouble. The tudong small samanain decided to hide at a lao wat.

The Pali Canon does not include everything Lord Buddha knew or told Pra Anon (Ananta). The well-known quote like " Anon, my Dhamma informed to you is like a handful leaves, but the rest I don't tell you is like all leaves in the forest."

Luangpu Teplokudon is a mystery in Thai society. Only a few people know or interested in his phenomenon. I think I'll go visiting Luangpu Kao ( the boy mentioned above), an abbot of a wat in Sakonnakon province within a few weeks. Keep on reading, there are lots more supernatural or amazing events of his. What a hard job!

Hi Camerata

I never read that book before. What I know about Tibatan is its Wacharayan Buddhism being popular among westerners. Perhaps, IMO, because Tibetan monks can communicate in English. As fas as I know, their sect evolved after a thousand years after Lord Buddha nippaned. In addition, it mixed with Tantra philosophy of Hinduism.

Since the day Kao had been transferred his past virtues, his still mind was activated like an appliance was powered or a rusty iron was pounded. All his own former/pastlife competency, such as divine perception, appeared. Luangpu Teplokudon, in his divine body, regularly and mercifully instructed Dhamma to him.

Although his external manners were weird but actually his inner mindfulness was full. Completing grade six, Kao arranged Kant 5, five pairs of lotus, a candle and joss stick and one wah-long white cloth to offer sacrifice to make him recover from abnormal manners.

" Why did you make me look abnormal?", asked the boy.

" My son, are you aware of people's mind now? You are living in human society, will you be respected if you are mentally-ill? To create perfections or virtues, you have to behold the cause and effect. No cause, no effect. This is only the lesson I would like you to experience situations to comprehend human mind.", explained Luangpu.

The boy decided to ordain as promised. Samanain (novice)Kao was regularly instructed dhamma, particularly samati or paowana meditation. He saw and conversed with Luangpu with his physical eyes, not in an eye-closed nimit.

Kao was tested several times. His relatives and neighbors doubted as he became strange, wierd manners and habits. They all assumed that the boy was mentally ill or even insane. He was often seen dressing in white garments and meditating in the paddy field and forest. Sometimes he located herbs and brought back home to heal patients. His mom was unhappy about this so she brought him to various wats to have monks sprinkle holy water onto him. She was moody that he was the cause of making her poorer and poorer, loosing all her rare saving amount of 15,000 baht.

While Kao was in the rite of sprinkling holy water, he was able to utter the prayers at the same time as the monks was praying. " What an easy prayer. I can do it myself", he said. And he started his healing job when patients came to him after the doctors at the hospital could not heal them. Finally the police was reported about this quack and would arrest him. " Let's capture me, I have never asked any patients to come to me. They all came here themselves. And I 'll never charge them one baht or two". Not only did they not arrest him, the policemen also learned patients could recover from their illness.

Kao's Life Has Changed Forever

From that day on, Kao's perception has changed, sensing distant people's conversation clearly, viewing remote events, understanding and communicating in animals' language, knowing herbs to heal patients, being able to pray by ownself and perceiving other people's thought and thinking.

But the most amazing phenomenon was the way he could not consume every kind of meat anymore. He would vomit anytime he smelled cooked flesh. When he just saw and smelled fish or chicken tomyam, he would instantly vomit, have diarrhea and suffer. Later, his relatives planned to prove if his phenomenon was true or not. They prepared Isan popular dish called goi, a raw beef salad, and persuaded Kao to eat it. The boy instantly responded " you all need not tell me to eat "goi", I'll never eat that with you". How could he know the dish he had not seen or smelled before?

The monk then stretched his hand out and touched the boy's crown of the head, praying and transferring his mental power to the boy's body. Kao trembled from head to toes as if he had got an electric shock. He felt an unknown energy infiltrated into him. He was about to suffocate, wriggle and drain away. After half an hour, the monk muttered incantations.

" All of yours and what you wished has been returned to you. Let's pretend you are mentally ill from now on".

" Sadhu", the boy said. He feared he had got black magic, asking.

" Who are you? What's your name?"

No reply but the monk showed one side of his bag that read " Luangpor Prakru Teplokudon Uttratera", he then walked away.

" Kao, my son. Do you recognize me? I came to you when you were 8 or 9 years. Don't go hunt any animals today", the monk said.

Kao was so surprised that this stranger knew his name and where he would go that day.

"What a monk, he must be crucial".

" When you complete the school, ordain for me", asked the monk.

" I'm illiterate, I'm not interested in studying".

" It doesn't matter. Just promise me you'll ordain".

" O.k. sir", the boy said unintentionally and grudgingly.

Luangpu Teplokudon Looking After and Passing on Charisma and Virtues

For many years, Sakonnakon residents has rumored about virtues of ariya monks such as Luangpu Man Puritatto, Luangpu Fan Ajaro and other revered ones. A boy, Kao Praikamnam, acknowledged these stories and thought " if I ordain, I hope I can practise myself as eminently as those monks. Actually, we are not different, I have two hands and two legs, and so have the monks. I will take after them".

When the boy attended grade one at school, he was just a rural, poor student. One day a gigantic tudong (pilgrimage) monk, with large hand and feet, clean and yellowish complexion, visited him. The monk tried to talk to Kao but the boy paid no attention to.

Kao was like any other rural boys. He was not interested in schooling because of his dull brain. His study results were poor and often criticized. When he was in grade five, on full moon day at nearly year-end, he was persuaded to hunt a flying lemur in the jungle. There he encountered the same large monk who looked like a Tibatan-Indian race. And the monk greeted him.

(continued)

dear readers

I'm leaving for Bkk and will cuntinue my writing after coming back. I'm not sure I can make sense to you. You can correct it where my vocab is wrongly used. But the content is just my translated version. Thanks.

Buddhism and Luangpu Teplokudon

The story about Luangpu Teplokudon is a mystery for us filled with defilements. Most recounts are often from those who have been his disciples and learnt with him in visible physical body, such as Luangpu Wai Jattalyo from Wat Kaopanomyong, grandpa Tone Lamprae from Thai traditional house in Taklee District, Nakonsawan. Indirect disciples that Luangpu gave his loving-kindness to by teaching them (jeto) samadhi through nimit (vision while meditating) and provided them with various dhammas, depending on individual luck and virtue. Hence, readers don't have to believe the things presented here. The truth should be found out through your intellectual reason, or "prove it yourself before believing".

Current evidence in the annals written by Luang Boribanbureepan, a specialist in ancient language translation from Fine Arts Department has mentioned the propagation of Buddhism from India into Suwannapoom (mainland Southeast Asia) in 235 B.E. (308 B.C.) King Asoke the great presided over laymen in the third revising of the tripidok (tripitaka). And Pra Mokalleebuttissatera was invited to preside over monks. They finally considered to send missionary - Pra Sonatera, Pra Uttaratera, Pra Chaniya, Pra Pariya and Pra Muniya and their working group to first propagate at Nakon Si Thammarat and laid the foundation of the religion, such as ordination, monk's deed and residence. And Wat Mahatat became the first temple built there.

As history mentions, Pra Sona tera, its chief, had spread Buddhism in Suwannapoom for 29 years. He nippaned (died) in 264 B.E. The annals in Sri Lanka did not note down or mention about "Pra Uttaratera" who accompanied the mission. Where was this monk? Where did he disappear? If we believe that Luangpu Teplokudon meant to refer to " Pra Uttaratera", it means he must have been living over two thousand years of age. In logic, that's impossible. According to Guinness Book of Records, the oldest man ever recorded is only over a hundred years. But if we have been told about rishi or hermit in India who can live up to a thousand years, why don't we investigate about this to find out the truth.

(continued)

Perhaps its shortest article is one whole page of A4. As I told you before most are miraculous phenomenon. So the vocab used is new to me. Is it better to send you my version and after you have editted it, you then post it here? This is good for every party. I'm afraid my uneditted version will confuse everyone - you and other readers. If O.k., pls give me your e-mail address first. Thanks.

Hi camerata

O.k. my pleasure. But I know my English is not that good and some articles there are too long. Can you help me with your correction of my translated version in order not to distort the meaning its author wants to convey? This is a hard job but challenging.

hi camerata

Thanks for warning. I just want a farang who can read Thai to find a good Thai website and Buddhism information they can't find here.

Actually I have read many, many of your posts and threads and finally I sum up you have profound knowledge of Buddhism and appropriate to be this site web master. This is from my sincere mind. Always admire you job. Thanks.

A website called " palungjit.com" is what I mean. If you understand Thai script, no disappointment. An in-depth and super informative one among several other similar websites. It also claims more members ( over two hundred thounsand) than any other Buddhism websites (in the world?). IMO, that's possible.

Hi all

I'd like to recommend a Thai Buddhism website which can satisfy one who is very very interested in (Thai) Buddhism. If you can read Thai you'll find (almost) all its forums are relevant to the (thounsands of) questions you are encountering to access Buddism.

Here are some of the topics it has satisfied my curious mind.

List of arahant monks is introduced and recommended.

Is Luangpor Cha Supatto an arahant?

Miracles or magic some famous monks have recounted.

Images of pratat (burnt bones) from the late arahants.

Thai Buddhists who have profound and incredible knowledges of the religion.

and so on.

Only you can read Thai and a curious mind. Sorry if anybody here has introduced this website before.

Hi all

I just find a website called palungjit.com is informative and perhaps covers all of interesting information for those who are super curious about (Thai) Buddhism. I also found my in-mind questions I had looked for years answered there. The only problem for you may be the Thai language. For those farang living and having a family here, with some basic Thai language, the site may help you learn the written language better. Sorry if anyone here knows it already.

hi living

According to the tripitaga, there are only four types of (ariya/noble), should be considered as, monks. From sodaban(sotapana) up to arahant. The (negative) monks you have encountered are called sommutti (supposed/assumed/conventional)monks. They are believed not to be different from common people (people with defilements / unwholesome minds) we see in our daily lives. Actually, this type should not be called monk at all but rather a man in yellow robe or a bogus monk. But if we tend to think positively, each / some of them may develope himself to the level of ariya monks some days.

And again, according to the tripitaga, people ( and monks) who do good deeds are said to go to good realm when they die, but evil ones ( including monks) will go to the opposite / evil realms. (kamma law)

And from the same tripitaka, people in normal dress (like you and me) who has a mind of ariya monks , the four types mentioned above, is actually a monk. The word "monk" in ultimate sense is the one with ariya/ noble mind, not the one in yellow (uniform) robe.

Hi ram

Here's its information.

Tel. 077-531100 / www.wattham.org / www.boxboon.com

You can join the retreat any day you wish, at least three days. Just find out from a Thailand map to identify where Sawee District, Chumpon province is. Bring white clothes with you to wear daily. I'm quite sure monks can speak some English.

You don't have to pay for anything but there are many donation boxes there. So in order not to exploit the wat, consider how much you consume its accommodation and give it back as you wish. Learn to follow its rules and daily schedules.