eJai

2. pom jaay ngern seep naa thee laeo = I paid ten minutes ago

- jaay ngern laeo meuua 15 naa thee goon ( จ่ายเงินแล้วเมื่อ 15 นาทีก่อน )

3. pom jaay ngern meuua waan = I paid yesterday

- jaay ngern laeo meuua waan nee ( จ่ายเงินแล้วเมื่อวานนี้ )

6. yang mai dai ngern thaawn leuuy krap = I have not recieved my change yet.

- yang mai dai rab ngern thaawn yuu ( ยังไม่ได้รับเงินทอนอยู่ )

Just some suggestions.

This may help you to understand their usage:-

in a negative ways

ได - ไปไม่ได can't go, not free.

เป็น - ว่ายเไม่ป็น can't swim, don't know how to swim.

ไหว - รอไม่ไหวแล้ว can't wait any longer, can't bear to wait any longer.

Thank you for your advice Jupha, do you have the ISBN for the "

introductory linguistics 101" textbook you mentioned?

Thanks.

First of all, I would like to thank withnail, wasabi, expatwannabe, Johpa, meadish_sweetball, sabaijai, mangkorn, CSS and finally Richard W for your contributions to this thread, it was indeed very educational for me.

Thank you CCS for posting the 'Wonderful_Tone_Rules.doc', it was very generous of you.

mangkorn was right, I'm not a linguist, I'm just learning Thai as my hobby. Well, for someone who is asking about Tone Rules isn't it obvious that I'm just a beginner? I must admit that I do consider myself as being very fortunate to be in the midst of linguists even though I had problem following your discussions. Really look forward to learning a lot more from your guys in the future.

Correct me if I were wrong, without going into too much technicalities, can I assume now that the BLACK section of the chart was indeed correct? Thanks.

Thank you all for your input.

Please allow me to ask the question in a different manner.

Referring the chart provided below, I think we all agree with the tones shown on the left & right branches of the chart. What's bothering me is the one in the middle with BLACK branches. Can anyone please verify the validity of this particular section?

(Please don't ask me where I get it from because the person who gave it to me has also forgotten the source of it.)

Thanks.

Hi, does anyone know of a reference in the internet or be kind enough to explain on the subject that covers the "Tone Rules" for word cluster that ends with only either short or long vowel without Live/Dead syllable?

Thanks.

I was told once that เธอ should not be use with ผม, can anyone please shed some light on the pairing of pronouns such as ผม / คุณ, ฉัน / เธอ or others.

Thanks

Thank you khun yoot for your input. ขอบคุณมากครับ

Thank you so much withnail for your feed backs. Meanwhile I'll do as what you suggested, to sit back and wait to see if there is any response from our native members.

Thanks

By the way, I think เธอ is undoubtedly an excellent choice.

Just a thought, can I add การ as a prefix to กอดรัด to turn it into a noun? การกอดรัด

Would that be acceptable for practical Thai usage?

Thanks.

Verbs are more important in Thai than nouns. Don't think that because the English phrase you're thinking of requires a noun that it is the same in Thai.

Thanks withnail, I do realise this is the case due to cultural differences, but more than often the habit is hard to beat when we have been using English for so long, especially in this particular case where I try to translate a letter written by someone else to express a phrase which said "I want to send you a hundred hugs..."

Is there anyway I could express in Thai to that effect? Thanks.

Hi, does any one know the nouns for a "Hug, embrace" or equivalents written in Thai? I've found verbs for them only so far.

Thanks.

With all due respect, as for being Chinese-Thai and can speck Teochew dialect, I would like to tell you that both words you mentioned แป๊ะ and เจ๊ก with high tone are considered as offensive for Chinese-Thai people. But if you can pronounce them correctly with low tone, then you will get what you want to say.

IMO, it's useless to address anyone as "Hia", "Jehk", "Bpae" or whatsoever you don't really know how to use it correctly and appropriately. The best term is "Khun" in most cases or "Taan" only with the ones you know that they are in high rank, if you don't know, no need to use it either.

Hi Yoot,

Thank you for clarification. So, can I assume that these terms pronounced with low tone are in fact originally spoken by the Teochew to show respect for their elders and the high tone pronunciations are derived by native Thai for derogatory means.

Correct me if my assumptions are wrong. Thanks.

However, the different in age can make a lot of difference. If he is much older than you but younger than your father, you should address him as เจ๊ก (jehk - with high tone

My goodness eJai, you can't be serious!

If you are Thai you know how difficult it is for Farang to get tones right!

To address a Thai / Chinese as "Jek" could cause great offence – and the Farang will have little opportunity to say "whoops, sorry, wrong tone"!

My own firm advice is NOT to use that word at all.

Patrick

Hi Patrick

There is really no cause for alarm when I brought up the word เจ๊ก (jehk). I was merely explaining how those terms are being used within the close knitted TeoChew community. The word เจ๊ก literally means uncle, you can look it up from this link http://www.thai-language.com/id/143590 , then again if it was used by someone from outside that circle, it could take on a different meaning. It could be a two ways sword.

I wasn't sugguesting anyone using it, especially farang, that's why I ended my post with a note urging topfield to steer clear of these terms.

Cheers

Thanks all.

I had been calling a Thai Chinese businessman I know Hia Pornchai thinking he would appreciate the respect I was showing for him, but clearly as I am not Thai Chinese nor close to him, he might in fact have found it insulting !

The word you're refering to is เฮีย ( hiia - pronouced with mid tone) which literately means elder brother in the Teochew dialect (Chinese).

Note that the wives of the older Teochew generation also address their husbands by the word hiia.

I think you shouldn't worry too much about it. If the Thai Chinese gentleman you addressed was Teochew, he would certainly understand that you meant to be respectful and would apprepriate it.

However, the different in age can make a lot of difference. If he is much older than you but younger than your father, you should address him as เจ๊ก (jehk - with high tone), if he is much older, for example, older than your father then you should address him as แป๊ะ (bpae - with high tone), anything less than that is considered as disrespectful. This status hirarchy business hold true for the female counterpart too.

Incidentally, it is not a norm for business associates to address each other with these terms, even amongs the Teochews. On top of that, do remember this, not all Chinese are Teochew and that Chinese of different dialect origins usuallly CANNOT understand each other verbally.

So, The bottom line is, steer clear of it if you ain't too sure.

Is there a way to only increase the size of the Thai font in your internet browser (and not the Roman font)? I am using firefox and IE on windows and konqueror and firefox on linux.

There is a plug-in written by Mike of www.thai2english.com to increase the display of Thai font in Firefox 2

Right Click Here for the plug-in

Then select "Save Link As" to save the file largethai.xpi to your harddisk

Installation instruction

-------------------------

1. Select FILE from pull-down menu

2. Select Open File

3. From Open dialogue: Pick largethai.xpi you downloaded.

4. Wait for installation to complete.

5. Click Install Now button in Software Installation dialogue.

6. Restart Firefox.

7. Click RIGHT mouse and select Increase Thai Text Size.

You should notice an increase in the size of all the Thai fonts where the rest remain the same.

Enjoy

At the American Alumini collee between Gaysorn/Erawan and Silom, they beleve that listening is the most important first. For conversational Thai I tyhink this is so, despite how much you want to be able to talk to other people. This is how baby learns first, by copying what they hear other people say.

Totally agreeable, that's what the Pimsleur Approach's courses are promoting, that is to learn like a baby by listening repeatedly. The only difference is that being an adult, we have already acquired the learning skill through years of experience, which render us with better learning ability than a baby.

Further more, even if you can speak some of the language, it's often that a conversation is only possible when you can comprehend what the other party is saying, because the other party could be using vocabularies other than what you know, or different word order due to cultural differences. This is particularly true when dealing with a tonal language such as Thai, the tone, the pitch and even the intonation could make all the differences. You can only reproduce what you heard and understood.

So, whenever I lack the time to engage myself in passive learning such as reading or writing, I just listen to my MP3 as revisions time after time, I might even try to repeat after the speaker if the condition allowed. It helps.

I know my approach sounds rather technical, but that's the only approach I can afford as a lone learner. (I don't live in Thailand and I don't have a Thai spouse or anything related to Thai, I do it just for the sake of my interest in learning a new foreign language)

Also, billd, never get someone you are in a personal relationship with teach you anything. Father, mother, wife, husband, sister, brother whatever. The teacher takes it personally when you don't learn right away and the student takes it personally when getting shouted at. I learned this valuable lesson in high school when my sister tried to tutor me in chemistry.

I have to tell you, my worst teacher is my husband, so be grateful your wife won't do it

Well, should I consider myself a lucky one?

There is a plug-in written by Mike of www.thai2english.com to increase the display of Thai font in Firefox 2

Click Here for the plug-in

Installation instruction

-------------------------

1. Select FILE from pull-down menu

2. Select Open File

3. From Open dialogue: Pick largethai.xpi you downloaded.

4. Wait for installation to complete.

5. Click Install Now button in Software Installation dialogue.

6. Restart Firefox.

7. Click RIGHT mouse and select Increase Thai Text Size.

You should notice an increase in the size of all the Thai fonts where the rest remain the same.

Enjoy