rastlin

Having recently completed the 2 series vaccine series in the U.S., suffice it to say I was very disappointed in the new quarantine rules recently released.  As I understand the rules:

-Fully vaccinated travelers *within 3 months*=7 day quarantine.

-Fully vaccinated travelers *done 3 months prior or more*=10 day quarantine.

-Non vaccinated travelers with negative test=10 day quarantine.

-14 day quarantine if from Africa.

And before I start complaining, I understand:

-This is Thailand

-Their country, their rules. (see above)

-There is understandable reluctance regarding new strains and the remote possibility of someone vaccinated still being dangerous.  And of course, a government would want to protect its citizens.

But geez....

Where does this whole 3 month rule on vaccinations come from?  Are they serious?  Unless someone books a trip right after immunization (and most tourist plan international trips more than 3 months in advance) it is a 10 day quarantine.

Why would the rule treat unimmunized tourists the same as immunized greater than 3 months?  There is no doubt some risk-reduction benefit to being vaccinated!

And where does the 7 day quarantine come from anyway?  Why not 3?  Or 8? Or 1?

Like I said, Thais can (and will) do whatever they like.  But until they waive the quarantine requirement they can forget about most tourists.  Being locked in some roach motel for 7-10 days (and do they actually lock you in?  If so, what if there is a fire?) is not how any tourist is going to want to start a holiday. Tourists will just go to one of the ever growing list of countries welcoming in vaccinated tourists.

Hopefully, once these rules fail to generate significant increase in tourism (yacht quarantine, you gotta be kidding) they will relax the rules further.  I understand it is a risk-reward situation.  And I also understand maybe they want to wait a while and make sure the vaccines really do work.  But the evidence grows clearer every day that vaccination works.

A tourist boom awaits Thailand as soon as they get rid of that dratted quarantine.

Lets hope it happens soon!

Hello, I read what I thought was an interesting first hand report of a quarantine experience from a Thai returning from abroad via the airport.

I thought I would share it as I found it an interesting read.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/10GsRLntAI78fv2A1jCJ4HUJqcrHTbtqavGDCDQmhtbY/mobilebasic?fbclid=IwAR0DpRDdiCkpV6aiRijw-JcNBbnf_OVJHg9gfQFCsA_EJ031dQ5fpInL6zU

What a disorganized mess!

Talk to a Visa agent and get a retirement visa.

1 minute ago, parafareno said:

I have to make a corrrection here.....he asked me for 20000 bht to show.....I told him I have 200k on my bank but he did not want to hear about it....luckily I had few thousand euros as a cash...if I would not bring it I would be f....ed....this is new Thailand....if you come from EU you better stay for 10 days or less or there will be trouble......I will never forget the angry face of thai immigration lady and her angry voice....

That is what upset me too when I was questioned.  It was not the fact the lady was asking me questions, it was she was so obviously angry.  It really did bother me even though I was stamped in.  

I have been questioned by immigration when travelling into the U.S.  And while such situations are never fun, the fellow that questioned me was polite, not angry and very professional.  

I think a big part of the problem is the lack of clarity as to just what the rules are and how they will be enforced.

I have no problem with the concept of immigration questioning those who would enter Thailand as this is their job.  I also have no issue with rules being enforced and those who are not tourists being required to get a different sort of visa, of which there are many.  What I do have a problem with is not knowing exactly how a "tourist" is defined.

I had thought the rule was you were allowed up to 180 days in a year on either tourist visas or the 30 day permissions to stay granted on arrival in the airport.  I had thought the rule was if you were staying in Thailand less than 6 months in any given year you were a "tourist".  But honestly I am not sure this is really the rule.  And if it is not the rule what exactly is the rule?

This poster, for example, had spend 90 days in Thailand and returned for another Visa on entry.  O.K., why exactly is he not a tourist?  He has spent a few winter months in Thailand for the first time in 8 years.  Now, after *this* stay, he would be around 6 months.  If he came back *again* then that would put him over 6 months in the year.  But that is not the case as of his current arrival.  He had spent 3 months in Thailand and returned.  

I had planned on spending 6 months in Thailand every year.  I had planned on using one tourist visa for a 3 month stay and 3 one month permissions to stay spread out over the year.  But I also was "questioned" although less aggressively and decided to just get a retirement Visa to avoid the hassle. 

It would be nice to have a clear cut rule that people could then follow.  This not knowing exactly what will be enforced is very stressful and makes for difficult planning. 

23 minutes ago, wahpiangeh56 said:

i'm a clueless as the guy next door. I, too have a Condo unit purchased in 2019.Now with all this mumbo jumbo confusion, it has left me with a bitter after-taste and regretting having done that. Please do give me your 2 cents worth what my next step should be. Retire in Thailand or cut loss and bit the bullet. BTW, I'm from Singapore.

My advice, for what it is worth (you asked for my 2 cents) would be to stay where you are happy.

If you are happy while in Thailand, stay there.  If you are not, leave.  I would not worry to much about the Visa nonsense.  I look at it this way:  Yes, it is a real pain to get a Visa these days.  But when you compare that to what a Thai person has to do to get a Visa in the States and it is nothing.  I have one Thai friend recently turned down for an Irish visa.  Another friend took over a year to get a U.S. Visa.  

All in all, relatively speaking, the Visa headache is just one of those things.  It takes some time-and some money.  

But go where you are happy.

Life is to short to do otherwise.

None taken.

My purpose was to inform regarding my recent experience and to suggest to others in a similar spot as me (frequent travelers to Thailand but within the posted "rules" for entry) that getting a retirement Visa might be better than counting on immigration to enforce the rules as posted.

Sorry if the post is not worthwhile. 

I decided to apply for a retirement Visa based on my most recent experience at the airport.  It was not a horrible experience, mind you, but I took it as a "hint" it was time to make a change in the way I am doing things.  For background, here is my travel situation:  I spend 6 months a year in the U.S. and 5-6 months a year in Thailand.  Of the 6 months in Thailand,  I have one 3 month stay via a single entry tourist Visa which I get (easily) back in the states.  The other three months are one month stays each, via a 30 day permission to stay obtained at the airport when I arrive.

As far as I could tell, this should pose no problem.  Three one month stays-spread out over the year (April, July and November) and then one 90 day stay (winter months) seemed well within the posted rules.  (If I am wrong on that please let me know!)  And for the record, I do NOT work here at all nor do I run any business or do anything that could be construed as work!  Also, for the record, I have never had any overstays or other such problems.

When I arrived at the airport this time, after stamping through scores of people ahead of me quickly, the immigration agent came to a full stop when she took my passport.  My last stay was 2.5 months prior and that stay was on a 60 day tourist visa which I had extended an extra 30 days.  It had been almost 8 months since my previous 30 day permission to stay was issued (April 2019).  But as I said, she came to a full stop.  She spend a few minutes (seemed like hours) looking at the computer screen.  I presume she was reviewing my travel history.  While doing this, she had a frown on her face that almost touched the floor and she even shook her head "no" once!  She then asked me the following questions:  1) "Why you come Thailand"  answer:  Holiday, Happy New Year.  2) Where you stay Thailand?  answer:  I have a condo.  (I did have that address on the entry form, but did not have any other documentation.) After this she continued to stare at the computer screen for about another minute or two. Just as I thought I was going to be rejected, she stamped me through with no so much as a "Welcome to Thailand" coming from her lips.  She did not ask me to show money or a return ticket by the way.

Now, I know, compared to some of the horror stories posted here this is nothing.  She looked at a computer screen, asked a few questions and stamped me through.  Big deal, right?  Heck, I get more of a 3rd degree coming back to the states than this.  Indeed, I hesitate to even post this story knowing some probably think I am over reacting.  But the thing is it really did *feel different* this time when I came in.  In all my years coming here I never had to stand there for 5 plus minutes while the immigration agent thought things over.  I honestly got the sense she was looking for a way to reject me and was bracing myself for bad news.  And I stood there much, much longer than anyone in the other lines around me.  (To the chagrin of people waiting in my line.)

Based on this experience I have decided to get a retirement visa with a multi-entry stamp.  I am over 50, already have health insurance and the bank account requirements, so I figured there was no major reason not to other than the hassle.  

It is my hope with the retirement Visa future entries into the country will be a little more smooth.  Like I said, I took my recent experience as a warning.  I'd suggest anyone over 50 who comes here more than once a year or has ties here (property, family, etc.) should just get the multi entry retirement Visa.  That's my opinion at least.  

40 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

Thank you for sharing this story about what is an obvious scam.  The really worrying thing for me is that it seems that also INSIDE the Immigration Office they are playing along with this scam.

In my opinion we should not just let it go just because Rastlin stood his ground and escaped from the scam.  I am pretty sure that the majority of tourists coming for an extension of stay, would fall into this trap and pay the scam-money.

Possible actions to escalate the matter are:

- Sending several copies of this whole story to the Jomtien Immigration, so that they can investigate (after all Immigration is part of the Thai Police).  Several copies < e-mail / regular mail > to ensure that it reaches the appropriate level;

- Sharing this story with the local press, so that they also can investigate (a nice scoop);

- When no response or interest to investigate from Jomtien Immigration nor local press > inform national Immigration Office.

Would be good if there are ThaiVisa Forum members wtih access to higher Immigration officers, so that they can share this obvious corruption.

Note: I am not living in Jomtien, so would be difficult for me to escalate this further, but I am enraged that this takes place and hope that a TVF member reporting to Jomtien, will take it up!

I have to say that I did not really "stand my ground".  I was prepared to pay the "fine"  if it came down to it.  I am here on a Tourist Visa and my choice would have been either to change my flight and leave a month early or pay 2,000 baht.  The reality is that it would have cost me more to change my air ticket or arrange some sort of a Visa run so I would have just paid  up.  I am no hero.  I was just playing dumb tourist and refused to admit to anything that could be construed as a violation of the rules on my part.  

And as I said-I was never asked to pay anything other than the 1900.  So I am not really sure this would be a scoop or something from which an investigation would be fruitful.  After all, the immigration officer could just say I misunderstood the situation as again, at no point was I ever told anything other than 1900 Baht which is the proper fee.  This was at the very end and I was holding my breath as to whether I would have to pay more or even be able to get the 30 day extension.  But I certainly agree it seemed like a scam was in the works especially given what was said to me at the shop next door.  But suspicion is not proof.  Had they asked me to pay a fine and I paid said fine it would be another matter.  I would have made a very big fuss about that.

Having said all this, the fact is holders of TOURIST VISAS should not have to deal with this reporting nonsense at all.  Clearly it is the hotel that is required to do reporting on tourists not the tourist themselves. The very form they gave me said as much in that they list the fine for "hotel managers" who do not comply.  My guess is they deal much more with folks who are on other types of Visas as my guess is not a lot of people come to immigration to extend the 60 day Tourist Visa obtained in their home country.  So mostly they are dealing with people who actually do have some sort of obligation to report themselves. 

The complaint against how Tourist Visa holders are being treated I think is a very justifiable complaint.  

Thanks everyone for all your comments.

2 hours ago, ukrules said:

This is the strange part - how would the shop next door know whether the hotel you're staying at had filled out the TM30?

 

Hotels do these online every day, it's a very simple process and I've done it myself registering myself in the past on behalf of a half witted owner using her immigration account when she couldn't get her computer to work properly.

 

This I also found strange. 

I went to the shop to get a photo and some copies.  Inside, I was greeted by a Falang worker with a German accent who gave me a run down of various fees.  Some of the fees were fairly straightforward-5 baht for a photocopy, 50 baht for a photo.  Other fees included 200 baht (or maybe it was 250 I do not recall for sure) to fill out the forms they had given me.  There was also a fee-4,000 Baht I remember that most clearly as I almost fainted-where they would "take care of everything".  I  was told I could go have some breakfast and they would come back in "30 minutes" with my Visa extension.

I declined everything except the photo and some photocopies.  I told the fellow I would take care of things myself but come back if "I had any problems".  He then told me-even writing it down-that I would pay 1900 baht for the fee and 2600 baht for the fine.  Yes, I have read that the maximum fine is 2,000 Baht.  But that is what he said-2600 Baht.  It was not clear to me if the 4,000 baht fee to "take care of everything" included the 1900 Visa fee and the fine of 2600 Baht or whether that would be on top of these charges as I dismissed paying any fee out of hand.  I'd just leave the country before I would pay all of that!

And again, as I have said before, after filling out the forms myself, with the various copies and photos attached, I ended up paying 1900 which is proper amount for such an extension.  But it seemed clear to me that *something* was going on.   I had the feeling that everyone was trying to shake me down for some money.  But I just kept my mouth shut, did my own paperwork, denied every "leaving and coming back" to the immigration officer and stated the hotel did report me.  And that worked.

But as I have already said, it left a bad taste in my mouth.  I won't be going back to immigration any time soon!