mynextgig

To add to David's points, I am a relative newcomer to Thai but I also find reading the daily newspapers very instructive.

Apart from the sentence structure, there are slang words and nicknames, interesting ทับศัพท์ (Thai transliterations of foreign words) and so on.

To make it easier, I started with the sports pages, where, if I see a picture of Maria Sharapova, I'm confident of the general area of words I'm going to see (I think it's formally called domain-specific language).

So, today we find that โด้ (doh) is used as shorthand for the footballer Cristiano Ronaldo, ไอ้หน้าบาก is a fairly uncivil term for Franck Ribery, and นายกฯ หน้าหยก is a popular way to describe the current Thai PM, in op-ed pages.

Another interesting section is the cartoons; they're hand-written, so quite challenging to read, but the words are usually simple, and offer some insight into current Thai events:

So, from today's cartoon in the paper:

Kid: สีเหลืองแดงมีแต่ทำให้สังคมแตกแยกไม่เหมือน (Red and yellow colours only cause society to be divided), สีขาวดำสังคมมีแต่ความสุข (black and white colours, society only has happiness).

Skeptical dude: อะไรคือสีขาวดำ (What is there that is black-and-white?)

Kid: หมีแพนด้า (Panda!)

Thus neatly tying together the current political divide with the national obsession with แพนด้าน้อย, the $100-million ball of fluff at Chiang Mai Zoo.

Thai television news can be okay, because you get visual cues; I confess I can't concentrate on the Thai soapies, which some people regard as an excellent resource.

David and Rick, thanks for your responses, and definately agree with you that these sources provide a much more current view of the thai language.

I can understand most news and related television dialogue pretty well, but then my comprehension has always been considerably better than my reading ability and so when i try to read the newspaper i find myself dwelling on words that i dont know when if i were able to absorb the whole sentence in the way i do when listening it would probably make sense.

I would agree that the soaps are actually a good way to learn spoken Thai. That is if you can put up with the constant screaming and wailing and that fact that the plot will almost certainly involve an evil long lost sister and someone getting pushed down the stairs....

The simple fact is that i need to concentrate on my reading ability, which unfortunately i am less motivated by than speech and comprehension. We all learn in different ways !!!

David, i am always incredibly impressed at your level of understanding of the Thai language, obviously many years of effort to get to that level.

I wonder, you often use extracts from Matichon Weekly in your posts on here, how much of the paper can you read and understand without needing to reference some learning material ? In comparison to reading an english language newspaper, how much longer would it take you to read and understand a similar length article in Thai ?

Its been a while since i posted on here, but i have something of a learning block and wanted to know how other members have overcome this.

My Thai is reasonable, i have spent quite a lot of time living in an area of Thailand were i am one of only a handful of english speakers and am at a level where i can hold a decent lengthy conversation, do the shopping, sort bills out, book things over the phone etc

But i still struggle to learn and understand some of the more complex sentence constructions that i hear in Thai. If i hear a phrase that i can re-use it becomes part of my vocabulary, but dont really know why its said as it is.

An example of a complex sentence structure i learned a few years back is :-

เขาพาผมกลับมาส่ง - He gave me a lift back lit. he take me return come send.

I use this phrase now, but have no idea why its correct in Thai and certainly wouldnt contruct the sentence this way if i had to think on the fly.

Im not a linguist, i am simply a Thai language hobbyist, i couldnt explain why i say what i say in native English so maybe thats my problem here..

Thoughts ?

In terms of trading platforms - Ninja Trader is probably the best free platform out there and has broker interfaces to IB.

I use the Tradestation platform - which is a great platform but needs a really good internet connection - the TRUE SME package does fine & I'm using 70 symbols (stocks, futures, indices) on the 3 automated trading strategies I run. You can trade Forex on Tradestation.

I also use Strategy Runner which is also a good platform - but I use that primarily for discretionary futures trading.

If you want to trade Forex, is there a reason you want to use a Thai broker ?

Basically i am looking to teach some Thai people how to trade Forex and want to be able to introduce them to a Thai language based platform. www.fxthai.com is the only one that i have found so far, if anyone knows of any others i would appreciate it.

Thanks

Does anyone know of any online trading platforms available in Thailand ?

I am specifically interested in Forex trading and commodities.

Hi,

the best online trading platform for Forex is with Interactive Brokers. IB is an direct access platform (no trading desk that can trade against you).

IB has offices in Hong Kong, USA, and Europe. With them you actually get the delivery of the currency. I use IB for all my daytradings in Forex

and Futures. The account opening is $10,000 which is high, but you can be 100 % sure that nobody from your Broker is trading against you and

does Stop Loss hunting. Unfortunately, Forex is an unregulatated market and many retail brokers like (Forex.com) trade in a big way against you

to get your money. IB only earns the commission from you and offers the realtime interbank spread. This means it is variable depending on the

volatility at the moment. If you do not have so much money to invest, the best retail automated broker is Oanda (Oanda.com)

e

I've heard several people say what you say about Oanda, so they must be good. Personally, I ended up going to FXCM. I think Oanda's charts aren't very good and their "Trades in Progress" (to thickies like me) are in Martian. But the biggest turn off for me was that they rejected my passport twice and driving license once which I sent on the internet. The first passport was too dark and the second was too light. The driving license was also too light. After that I gave up, I was getting internet fatigue. I felt as though it was me trying to win their business rather than the other way around. FXCM accepted the proof of identity documents first time.

I've heard people complain about FXCM, but then, I've heard people complain about all dealers. I personally am very happy with them, although that could change with time of course.

Thanks for the responses, but i am interested in Thai based brokers with platforms in Thai language. I found www.fxthai.com which covers the FX market, but cant find any others. Anyone know of any others ?

Does anyone know of any online trading platforms available in Thailand ?

I am specifically interested in Forex trading and commodities.

I agree, just a single misplaced word can get you into a fight. I would say such a book should only be for more advanced learners and with the guidance of a Thai person when and how to use each, if ever.

This was about my same sentiment. I would imagine that some people would make the argument that they would buy it in order to know when someone else was using these words against them. But then again, maybe not knowing too much can be a good thing in a situation like that!!

Either way though, I found that article Phil mentioned and it piqued my interest. I'm going to give the book a try. I'll probably write a review up on Amazon too, since no one who has actually read the book yet.

Cheers!

Scott

This forum is full of posts asking whether certain words and phrases are bad, rude, inappropriate Thai and most of the time the conclusion is that these phrases are 'gutter talk' etc, although you will continue to hear them in everyday speak.

In my experience there are only a handful of words in thai that said in any context or situation would be considered vulgar, but there are thousands that when said in context can be either very demeaning or simply playful and unless you are fluent enough to use them appropriately then as per the other posts, steer well clear.

You only need to look at some english examples - 'Idiot', not a particularly rude word.

Situation 1. Playing cards with a friend who puts down a poor hand, 'Oh you idiot' = playful and joking.

Situation 2. Someone spills your pint in a bar, 'You Idiot' = probably going to get nasty.

I am sure there are thousands more examples.

I seem to have started something which all my Thai friends have been talking about for quite some time now.

I asked them to translate the name of the shop 7-11 into Thai, it can't be done!!

ร้านเสะเฝน is generally understood, not sure if thats how you would spell seven in Thai...

I do not think its the tone rules, grammar, sentence constructions or any other language constraint that makes learning of Thia difficult. Its the attitude of the Thais towards farangs who wish to learn that is the problem. Many employ outright rudeness and humiliation techniques to making any progress in learning the language as difficult and as unpleasant as possible. Thais simply hate falangs learning 'their' language. They have several well worn techniques available, denial and humiliation being one of the most popular. The goons in Tesco Lotus are particularly adept at this. Rather than having the digital checkout display thrust in my face when its time to pay I prefer to try a smile, followed by a polite สะหฺวัดดีคฺรับ and เท่าไรคฺรับ. (I cant read the display anyway without my glasses). If Im lucky I get a reply like "sebenhundatahtafor" or some other incoherent rambling that is presumably based on English. The Kasikorn bank is another haunt where falangs are prohibited from speaking Thai. I once conducted an entire transaction with one of their goons with me speaking Thai and the goon returning kind of burbling noises more reminiscent of an 18 month old baby which, once again, was presumably based on English.

To me this is the greatest obstacle in making progress as it is disheartening and morale sapping and makes one really wonder if its worth the effort.

Not sure of the OP's native language, but as a native english speaker we grow up listening to the huge variety of accents and dialects that the english language throws up and so its second nature for us to understand instantly what is being said, even if its the most appalling sentance construction and pronounciation. When spoken in Central dialect, Thai has very few differences in the way its spoken other than the formal and informal and therefore Thai's are only really used to hearing it spoken in a particular way.

I found that the better my prounounciation became the less inclined Thai's were to switch to english and so its definately worth spending time learning to sound Thai because if those 1st couple of sentances are correct then the Thai person you are speaking to will be much more confident in continuing the conversation in Thai, i think often its more a case of trying to avoid an embarrasing situation than just being rude.

That said, i have also been laughed at and ridiculed for very minor mistakes from the Thai people that i know well and who have no qualms about embarrasing me. You do need a thick skin to learn this language, but it is definately worth the effort and when you are able to confidentally hold a conversation in Thai with a Thai that wasnt expecting a farang to have mastered the language beyond a couple of words its pretty gratifying.

Dont give up !

Hi everyone

I tend to do a bank transfer in pounds sterling every month to my girlfriends bank account and iam over there in march to see her, i sent tuesday last week and still has not arrived normally 3 days, my bank lloyds tsb and her,s is Bank of Ayudhya all here details and mine are ok my banks saying its been slow in thailand has anyone had the same problem.

cheers

mick

Sometimes the banks here have a problem with transfers and they end up in a head office holding account and they dont do anything to track down who the cash belongs to...

I transferred $US 20,000 from my account in Singapore to a business account in Thailand and the money disappeared for 26 days..checking with my Singapore bank, money had left the account, account details, branch in Thailand all ok, but cash never arrived in the account...

After a lot of frustration and p*ssing around with the Thai bank....they finally owned up that the money was in a head office holding account and they had f*kced up......but I believe if the issue hadnt been forced they would have just left the money sitting in the holding account...

The simple truth is that international money transfers between banks in different countries dont have a particularly robust system. Each country has a clearing house that uses the relevant code for that country to track where to send the money. For the UK they use SWIFT Codes, but in Thailand its simply the name and address of the bank and so if there is a slight problem in the transfer details your money will sit with the clearning house for upto a month before they decide they dont know what to do with it and return to sender.

I have found the best way to transfer money internationally is through a money transfer company as the funds then go through their own system.

BKK Forex is a pretty reliable one for transfers to Thailand and they tend to give you a better exchange rate than your bank because of the volume they are dealing with in Baht.

Yes, I also remember it's on the CD as a PDF file. I found Rosetta stone not useful for beginning student of Thai language because really everything is in Thai and there's no explanation about the Thai writing system. It's also not useful for the advanced student, because there's nothing in it an advanced student wouldn't know.

I agree, the language sample's are very formal and you are unlikely to hear many of the phrases used in everyday Thai and when you are learning you want some usable dialogue, not just to be able to point to things and say what they are or what they are doing.

Additionally, to a beginner learner of Thai that cannot read Thai script, its very difficult to make out the the sounds of what is actually being said and so you are totally guessing which parts of the sentance relate to what.

Stick to some of the other more rounded learning materials if you want to actually use what you are learning.

I will say, take with a grain of salt ANY compliment from a thai about your ability to speak their language. If I had a baht every time a thai said, คุณพูดภาษาไทยเก่งมาก, I'd have a million baht. Sadly (for me anyway) it also seems the country is populated by 63 million thai language experts, who are more set on correcting a slightly mispronounced word that actually trying to understand from context what you are trying to say. I accept second rate, appallingly spoken, and poorly constructed engrish every day from the thais, yet I have never corrected them if I can work out by context what they are getting at.

I couldnt agree more, the times i have said something in Thai which is obviously clearly understood by everyone listening and they either fall about laughing or repeat the phrase i have just spoken, giggling away. When i then check out why what i said was wrong it will have been near perfect with maybe a couple of words in the wrong order.

Additionally, most Thai's that can speak even a bit of english will immediately want to switch to talking in English, even though i speak better Thai than most of them speak English.

You need a thick skin to progress in Thai and a great deal of motivation.

Hey,

I am just wondering how long it took people to learn thai, i don't mean perfectly fluent but enough to hold a conversation with someone, i have been learning from books, internet and tgf and when i move to Thailand in 2 months for a year or so, i will do lessons/school, i have been picking it up ok but would like to know how long it took others, please mention if you did lessons etc,

Thanks in advance,

Bailly

if you do some preparation (eg. learn the alphabet and some vocab) and then immerse yourself fully in thai for 6 months (ie. speaking little to no english), then you should be able to hold quite a good conversation. adjust this 6 months guesstimate down if you're young (under 18), an obsessively driven learner or just have a knack for languages. adjust it up if you're older, going to be learning thai but mostly speaking english, and so on.

of course, the lines between "fluent", "able to hold a conversation" and "able to get by" are fuzzy and dependent on your own expectations. suffice to say, you can make some very personally rewarding progress within 6 months if you want to.

good luck

I learned Thai originally from the Colloquial Thai book while i was living outside Thailand but visiting most weekends, it took me about 6 months of constantly listening to the recordings to the point where i could identifiy and understand every single word in each of the 15 or so dialogues and would pick out bits from these during my trips to Thailand. I was encouraged that when i spoke Thai i was generally understood but couldnt then understand the response from whoever i was talking to.

I then lived in Thailand for about a year in a town in which I was probably one of half a dozen english speaking foreigners and so to communicate i had to immerse myself in the language and get out of my comfort zone and thats when my progress seriously improved. I also read through 'The Structure of Spoken Thai' by Higbie and Thinsan and although there is no audio with the book, I started listening out for words and sentence structures on television and everyday chat and so my overall dialogue improved also.

The biggest mistake i made was not learning to read Thai at the beginning, i was able to hold a pretty reasonable conversation in Thai but still didnt know the alphabet and so I made the decision that whenever i was outside of Thailand i would focus on reading and when i was in Thailand i would focus on dialogue.

There is absolutely no question that if you can read Thai before you understand a single word of it, your learning curve will be significantly improved.

You will remember the tones of the words after a while or you'll compare words with other similar words of which you already know the tone. In the beginning it's important to think about the tone of each individual word (don't ignore the tones to "save" time).

I agree, i posted this same question maybe 5 or 6 months ago and someone was kind enough to put a chart on the thread that nicely consolidated the tone rules into a single page table.

I then spent maybe 20 mins a day reading Thai text, not worrying about the meaning etc and within a few days i had the chart imprinted in my mind and after a couple of weeks the tones just started coming naturally without needing any reference.

Remember that you can read Thai without having a clue what any of it means so i suggest you split your study into reading/writing and comprehension and over time you will start remembering words in Thai rather than transliteration

The expression can be used also to ask how something went, i.e if someone you know was in a competition or had an exam etc you could say เป็นอย่างไรบ้าง exam/race/etc เมื่อวานนี้/สุดสัปดาห์ที่แล้ว etc. This wouldnt be too formal.

But as a general greeting to someone you dont know very well i wouldnt recommend it as per some of the other posts.

I feel sorry for Gordon Brown as he is caught in the middle of a what to do to help the uk economy at a time of a very bad world resestion, would people of the uk like him & his government to do nothing like the conservatives? I don't think so, Its a difficult job to make the choices that he has done but to do nothing would have seen total bankruptcy of most of the banking system in the uk. Millions of jobs would be lost and a lot of company's going Bankrupt. This would have led us to the worst Depression since 1930. When most countries in the world are doing the same as Gordon Brown trying to kick start there economy's by injecting large amounts of money into it and trying to save there banking systems so they can get money moving again in the economy. I am not a expert in this matter but to me doing nothing is not the way to go, I know that if the bail outs do work then this resestion will not last as long as it would if we did nothing. Now its down to wait and see if the Governments policy"s work or not only the future will tell us that. I will do what a lot of posters have said tighten your belt and ride it out. Good luck to everyone.

Regards

Scotsman

Agree that Gordon Brown is busting his chops trying to turn this around, but lets not forget that he was Chancellor of the Exchequer under Tony Blair and therefore was overseeing all the rules around banking regulation and allowing asset prices to spiral that have got us into this mess in the 1st place so its ironic that he is having to sort his own mess out now.

Lets not forget that this whole thing has been created out of a huge bubble in asset prices, primarily property which has now collapsed around us and spread to the real economy.

House prices in the UK have doubled every 7 years for the last 30 years making everyone think they are rich and therefore borrowing against their properties on the belief that it will last for ever, which is evidentally hasnt.

Gordon Brown watched/let this happen and so he dam_n well should pull his finger out and try and sort it out.

My view, and it is only my view, is that GBP will drop significantly over the next few months against the Baht due to its weakness against the dollar and those people living in Thailand and relying on monthly GBP income will get hit hard, the global recession is only just starting to spread to Asia and i believe that a UK and US recovery will start while Asia is still in the midst of possibly a 1997 style depression.

Singapore, being one of the most economically sound Asian nations has just announced that it is officially in recession, the majority of their GDP is generated through exports of electronics and non essential consumer goods to the west and so the effects the downturn in consumer spending from the states and Europe has taken a while to take effect there. Thailand exports more essential goods such as rice and fruit etc which has kept the country in business but also a heavy motor parts industry which is already suffering with reduced working weeks etc.

This is definately a global recession coming in a wave starting from the US across to Europe and down into Asia and is going to be nasty ! The question is how long is it going to last !!!

Aside from the family and friends of the victims it seems that the whole tragedy of zantika is already being forgotten...

I went to high school in Thailand and have recently returned hoping to work here but currently enjoying a vacation and I love Thailand. The last couple of years Zantika was the place to go for my friends and I on a Friday or Saturday night(yes at the time we were all underage), in fact we were going to go on new years as it was the last night but luckily decided to go with a larger group to Narz. After the fire I realized how much danger I was in each time I went there for fun, without even being slightly aware of it. Now I am going to places and only seeing the lack of safety (narcissist is deathtrap, that main dance floor; which i have seen with easily 200+ people on it, has a fence around it with a two narrow entrances both up several stairs....) After the fire I was hoping to see some changes that would restore my personal confidence in safety here for when I am out having fun but now it seems to be becoming an issue of the past already. I am concerned with the lack of follow ups or investigations into the current laws or maybe I am just poorly informed I am not sure, hence posting.

It is all well and good prosecuting those responsible for the tragedy but I would like to see more about safety laws and actually making businesses compliant.

Anyone able to alleviate my concerns? Or have an opinion on what they think will happen or not happen as a result of this tragedy?

I am surprised that it has taken so long (to be forgotten)

Things might (big might) improve in the short term but in the longer term it will go back to the same old, same old way that things get done (have always gotten done) here in Thailand.

Proprietors of places of entertainment, hotels, theatres, malls, etc., etc., are only motivated by one thing and one thing only, and that is money.

I dont think it has been forgotten as much as you think, if you watch the Thai TV Channels they are constantly resurrecting the story over and over, interviewing those injured and struggling to pay hospital bills, victims family members complaining about the paltry compensation offers etc.

I am sure much of this coverage is being sponsored due to the insane level of interest Thai people seem to have in these sensationalised television programmes but its certainly maintaining this issue in peoples minds which can only be a good thing right ?

To put it another way, the vowel ไ ใ (-ัย, etc) always ends the syllable in Thai, and is never followed by a consonant. So Thais don't natively "know how" to say a consonant after this vowel (diphthong, actually). In English such combinations are common, of course (bike, time, fight; also commonly followed by consonants clusters, which are extra difficult for Thais to pronounce: heist, bikes, files).

I'm not sure exactly what you mean with respect to the glottal stop, Mangkorn. Do you mean an unreleased stop? Anyhow, you're right that among Thais, this is part of the nativized pronunciation of foreign loanwords. Since there are no such ไ + final consonant combination in Thai, foreign words like these which "break" Thai phonological rules are simply adapted into the system.

One way around this particular issue is converting the vowel to สระอา. Sometimes you'll see/hear, for example, "time" written/pronounced "ทาย์ม" (pronounced ทาม, of course).

Thanks Rikker, that explains many of nuances i have experienced in Thai's pronouncing only the 1st part of loan or foreign words.

You want some Lai = You want some Rice

Its in the How = Its in the House

etc etc

Another interesting translation i have seen for an english word is ไบค์ for Bike.

Is this a mid or low tone ?

But my point here is why silence the ค when many Thai words end with the k sound.

Jay Jay why do you assume the OP was talking to a working girl?

you started ok with the กลับบ้านเถอะ and than just carried away in an imaginary conversation with a young girl....mmmmm,,,,,

I dont think he was inferring that, i thought that would be a funny rhetoric in any situation. I told my gf and she laughed her head off.

or maybe

ค่าตัวพี่แพงนะ.. จะซื้อชั่วโมงเพิ่มมั้้ย? - kha tua phi phaeng na - ja seu chua mong poem mai? - My rates are quite expensive - would you like to add an extra hour?

Nice ! My sides hurt after reading this...

When foreign words are written in Thai, how are the tones decided.

Some examples :-

กะหรี่ - Curry (Ga)L (Ree)L

เป็ปซี่ - Pepsi (Pep)F (See)F

I personally wouldnt put these inflections on these words in english so is there some system used for the translation that defaults to a particular tone ? Otherwise why use tone markers for any foreign word.

If it matters in the Thai language, then i guess any translation will do, the best one being the most general one - we live in exile.

If you insist, I can give you one.

We live in exileใ - เราอยู่อย่างถูกเนรเทศ

Yoot

Why do you use ถูก before เนรเทศ ? Is this a modifier here ?

A question for the advanced members, how well do you think this list relates to spoken Thai as opposed to the written Thai that provides the source ?

I would say that ก็ has to be number 1 in terms of spoken Thai surely !