fidelio

please,

do somebody have trusted sources of informations or proof that PAD is paying protesters?

This is Thailand for Christ's sake.

Everyone, top to bottom , is corrupt to the bone.

So there are a few options to resolve the immediate crisis

1. Somchai decides to disolve parliment

2. Dems MP resign and force house disolution

3. Somchai resigns

4. Army disperses PAD with tear gas

5. Coup

number 4 seems the only option that respects the democratic process.

Actually all but #5 respect the democratic process.

To anyone with even an ounce of political education , democracy and military coups are irreconciable antagonisms .

You don't get it do you ?

Another ridiculous excuse to .. accchhhhm pad a budget to the max possible.

I think what is ridiculous is to pretend , as you have , tha the current crisis would be solved overnight if people all wore the same color .

I guess your don't do irony well do you...

Judging from your previous posts , I seriously doubt that you were kidding.

Seems to me you are wearing your yellow or now orange blindfolfds, 24/7 .

Another ridiculous excuse to .. accchhhhm pad a budget to the max possible.

I think what is ridiculous is to pretend , as you have , tha the current crisis would be solved overnight if people all wore the same color .

Thailand has 3G??!

Nope.

So the discussion is a bit pointless at the moment.

Expect to have 3G in selected cities/provinces second half of 2019.

That is if the providers won't cut their 3G commitment budget to zero

Government is searching for new location for Government's headquarters

BANGKOK: -- The Thai government is searching for a new location for the Government's headquarters, as anti-government protesters have shown no sign of ending their seizure of Government House, according to Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat.

Somchai said the protesters had seized Government House for far too long now.

He had no intention to prevent anyone from protesting but for security reasons, it would be wise to have a new Government headquarters. He added once the protesters dispersed from the current Government House, it would take a long time to renovate the place.

The premier had not decided on a location for his new headquarters, but it should be located in Bangkok. He said the current Government House could be used as a museum to feature the chronicles of the Thai government since 1932.

The People's Alliance for Democracy or PAD has occupied the Government House site since late August and refuses to leave until Prime Minister Somchai steps down.

-- TNA 2008-11-15

With the PAD memebers as exhibits, what a great museum that would make!

Yep, a true museum of horrors.

...Whatever happens, Thaksin has drawn a line, and everyone will have to decide on which side they stand.

Sorry but I think you're wrong.

You do not need to take sides.

...

I want to refer you to Anand's assessment given about two-three years ago - when faced with evil, it's impossible not to take sides. He said it was a duty of everyone, both as citizens and Buddhists, to confront evil.

As I am neither a thai citizen nor a buddhist, your reference clearly allows me to stay neutral.

Furthermore politicians who start talking about evil, remind me of a certain " axis of evil " , whom we all know was just a smoke mirror for a pure pack of lies.

Hmmm, you didn't really get it, did you? Anand wasn't going to cover all bases when he spoke to Thai public. If you are looking for an excuse to stay neutral you will no doubt find it - such is the human nature - find excuses for yourself is very very easy.

Maybe another quote (from Einstien) will make it clearer for you:

"The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil, but because of those who look on and do nothing."

Basically, there's no neutrality here - doing nothing is not being neutral.

Some of the things Thaksin has done to his own country are truly evil. Don't start harping about village funds or 30 baht scheme - that's not what he is being prosecuted for.

Your ability to disjudge what you just said before is amazing.

How about chewing on this other quote from Einstein : " Blind faith in authority is the worst enemy of truth".

...Whatever happens, Thaksin has drawn a line, and everyone will have to decide on which side they stand.

Sorry but I think you're wrong.

You do not need to take sides.

...

I want to refer you to Anand's assessment given about two-three years ago - when faced with evil, it's impossible not to take sides. He said it was a duty of everyone, both as citizens and Buddhists, to confront evil.

As I am neither a thai citizen nor a buddhist, your reference clearly allows me to stay neutral.

Furthermore politicians who start talking about evil, remind me of a certain " axis of evil " , whom we all know was just a smoke mirror for a pure pack of lies.

For those that actually live in Thailand ( i guess that will exclude the majority of posters here then!), take a look around, there are new condo and housing projects being launched on a daily basis - surely they cant all be wrong!

Oh LennyW you old rascal! Sometimes I think you are just having everybody on because I'm sure

you cannot really be that dumb as to say something like this and really mean it!

Ha ha, A lot of people just look at all the glitzy high profile developments and seem to use that as some sort of yardstick,(weather they fly or fail) look at the local developers here in Pattaya such as Eakmongkol, they are now on to something like project 17 or 18 (maybe more!), they never advertise, they dont employ real estate agents or pay commissions, people walk in on a daily basis and buy houses, same with Leng Kee and their shophouses, its quite amazing actually - the key to their success - PRICE, these people are charging fair prices, not the overinflated prices aimed at foreigners in the glitzy projects.

My wife and i went to a small development near Ban Amphur just as construction was starting on the first houses, we were looking to buy one for the Son, priced at just under a million Baht and guess what - sold out!! Again, the key - very well priced for what they were.

A lot of the people that buy in some of these more western orientated developments see their purchase as being a better deal than in the west, however, for Thailand it is very expensive but they tend to overlook that.

IMHO if property is correctly priced then it will always be a sound investment, oh yeah and BUY NOW!!!

If you are not kidding, then I sincerely feel sorry for you.

"I think the prices need to start falling first. That's what I'm waiting for..."

As is bingobongo, and he has been wrong for years!

bingobongo, a long-term plan does not mean ignoring what is happening. It means that you keep a long-term outlook, rather than a short-term one. You're trying to run a marathon by looking at your feet. You have just enough time to avoid a pothole, every once in a while. But, more than likely, you get yourself tripped up...as you did when you recommended that "smart" investors should invest in Viet Nam real estate - only to have that market collapse a few months later.

Rather than look at your feet, you should keep your eyes on the horizon. You can see the potholes, and the opportunities... before you step into the holes, or miss the opportunities.

You are a seasoned idiot.

The face-saving attempts are utterly laughable. My wife was telling me on the news this morning people were saying the fugitive criminal could still travel to the UK using his unbelievably still-valid diplomatic passport.

Would love to see him try...

(off topic, but how can I qualify for a diplomatic passport?)

Where did you meet your wife ?

I wouldn't worry about surveys like this. The support numbers fluctuate widely with every new development. So far the govt offensive was rather subtle, but const. amendments, impeachment against Rosana, and Thaskin's free travel to Philippines to meet up with his MPs - PAD might become as relevant as ever in a blink of an eye.

For now it's just calm before storm, and there's some serious strom brewing, of biblic proportions by Thai standards.

In just a few weeks there will be annual Royal address, everyone will be looking for a reaction to Thaksin's plea/ultimatum.

Whatever happens, Thaksin has drawn a line, and everyone will have to decide on which side they stand.

Sorry but I think you're wrong.

You do not need to take sides.

A prolonged look at either side has convinced me that they are equally despicable, worthless , selfish power/money grabbers.

I will stand aside and observe the collapse of a system that has now become inevitable.

This is the end .

"I've tried in the past to get bingobongo to respond to a serious question...he simply has no interest in discussing anything...I assume that since bingobongo always repeats that same mantra 'don't buy' that he would say that there will never be a good time to buy a condo in Thailand."

bingobongo has his own agenda, which he admitted to in one of his postings: he promised to buy a home for him and his partner, and is now doing everything possible to put him off. Too, bingobongo uses the name "kokothemonkey" on another "do not buy real estate in Thailand" website, and he describes himself as: staright, married, and lost money selling a condo. Bingo bongo predicted that the strong THB would destroy the real estate market, then it was the strong baht, then it was "over supply" - his personal favorite, then it was Thaksin, then it was the coup, then it was Samat, then it was the impending coup, then it was Samat's departure, then it was the US housing crisis, then it was...Well, you get the picture. His consistency is remarkable, as is his inaccuracy.

Many TVers claim that they would buy property, "if only...", and they "if only" includes an Singapore-type infrastructure, a Singapore-type government, a Singapore-type <this>, and a Singapore-type <that>. Hey, you can get all of that in Singapore...and the real estate is considerably more expensive there. Accordingly, when you buy property in Thailand, you're buying it with all of the plusses and minuses that are evident in Thailand. So, when is it a good time to buy? It's always a good time to buy, and it is up to YOU to decide if the price of the property (along with the aforementioned plusses and minuses) fit your needs. Purchasing real estate is never a risk-free proposition anywhere, and that includes Thailand.

You should realize that the TVers who comment "never buy", are a rather select group of people: they don't own a home, they never have owned a home, and they never will own a home. Asking them for unbiased information, is similar to asking the Pope the best sexual position to satisfy a woman.

Of course , to know the truth , we should ask those questions to a real estate cheerleader like you, Mr.Pinnacle of honesty.

Tell us you have no vested interest in the Thai real estate market.

History has taught us that the foodgates of censorship can only last for so long .

It's a shame that such an historical event doesn't get its own thread (that's it largely deserves) but it's a reminder that when it comes to communication, Sondhi's boys are much more organized that Thaksin supporters.

On the other hand, it gives us the opportunity to compare PAD protests and Thaksin support rally.

- First, the HUGE difference of number of people who attend these rallies. It doesn't matter for PAD supporters who don't give a d@mn about democracy but for others it's a warm reminder that when it comes to count its own, Thaksin still come first, and by far.

- A peaceful rally. From the BP : "Security fears fade : Good-natured supporters of Thaksin Shinawatra ...". Where were the heavily armed thugs who populate PAD rally ? I'm sure Sondhi's boys who are never short of pictures to tell us "their" side of the story will have already published them. Or maybe it takes longer to "photoshop" a peaceful crowd in a hostile mob. Honestly the easiest way would be to take a picture of a PAD rally and "paint" the yellow shirts in red .

- A legal rally. When PAD thugs highjack government buildings and turn peaceful neighborhood into war zone, Thaksin supporters rent a stadium. When PAD thugs, like a plague of locusts, trash whatever place they say, Thaksin supporters "were camping on the football pitch and running track, which were covered for protection." Then after the rally, the place weas returned to the public and the crowd peacefully dispersed. Definitively NOT a PAD rally.

It's exactly the PAD's definition of democracy.

It's OK to illegally occupy the Government house and paralyze a country's executive power .

It's unacceptable to peacefully and legally demonstrate in a stadium.

Fascists.

Oh --- hang on a moment: "Under PAD proposal they would come from non-political, professional and socially active circles."

Now I feel a whole lot better ---- the new politics government appoints these paragons of virtue who are no doubt selected (partially at least) because of their independence of thought and now all is well with the world.

When in the future the people are disatisified with their government and are unable to change them at the ballot box as they are 70% self appointed ----- what do you imagine might happen?

These selected/appointed MPs will represent their sponsors, they don't need to be paragons of virtue or have independence of thought (quite the opposite, actually) - they have to protect and advance interests of the group that sent them there. No more no less.

In a way it is simply redefining the constituencies - instead of geographical borders they will be "social unit" based.

The advantage is that work of both the government and the parliament in the modern age is driven by those social units anyway, not by geographical locations. As I mentioned so many times earlier - there's no Ministry of Isan, there's a Ministry of Transport instead, but we don't have representatives of transport industries, we have representatives of Isan. That's a big management issue, a clear mismatch between personnel and job descriptions.

Another advantage is that the traditional backdoor behind the curtain lobbying will be brought out in the open and, for example, MPs selected from small retailers would have to present their case on the parliament floor against MPs selected from superstores. Right now they fight these battles on the streets or in unnamed offices. Just yesterday Thai Retailers Assocciation pulled out from negoatiations regarding the Retail Trade Bill because they were completely excluded from the process, despite earlier promises. This bill has been in the works since early junta days, and not once the warring sides had a chance to debate it in parliament because they are not represented directly, they only control a certain amount of proxies (village based MPs) who don't have any knowledge of the subject and are told to vote for or against as directed by party wheeps.

This makes a complete mockery of "representative" democracy - the MPs don't represent anyone, they are in full service of their parties. On both sides of the isle, I might add.

Actually it harkens back to the European Guild Systems of several hundred years

successful service to their countries and peoples. The Kings ran most stuff,

but the guilds dealt with specific areas, and also had representation in courts,

and dealt with politics relevant to their guilds sector in the economy.

Not perfect democracy, but a working system none the less.

In other words , the middle ages.

What I find funny is the PAD sleep in the Government House and did some more wrong things and if the red pulls them out, they (the reds) are blamed for using violence.

which wrong doings? Which court told that they are wrong?

I only heard the EC telling that PPP did vote buying.......

Don't tell me the Democrat Party didn't buy. Their problem is they can't buy enough to win.

koo82: I'm pretty certain that this kind of irrelevant nonsense shall be treated with the ignore it deserves. The fact that there was money flowing from both sides has absolutly no place in this discussion. I don't think you really understand the purpose of this thread.

Following the PAD philosophy of replacing a faulty voting system with one which is absolutely guaranteed to deliver a government free of interference from the electorate is a unique & brilliant concept. This is obvious ! The well educated, sage & caring leaders of the anti-Thaksin movement are far better suited to lead Thailand into the future ---- and forever --- than any government which may be elected the people in any future election.

The entire population of this country (except the anti-Thaksin movement) has proven itself incapable of voting correctly and thereby delivering a government of the correct "people". It is therefore required to ensure that they NEVER get the opportunity of voting in such a stupid manner ever again.

You should seriously reconsider your position and throw your support behind the logical solution to the current problems ---- by the government appointing 70% of the lower house of Parliament they ensure only the correct people govern Thailand. People of integrity and vision.

People who do not simply want their turn at the trough.

Delusional delirium is a serious condition that is the direct result of brainwashing . You obviously are a case study for that sickness.

His post is not the expression of brainwashing or delirium- rather, it is expressing a political philosophy that was very popular during the 1920s and 30s particularly in Italy, Germany, Romania and Spain- wherein the governing of the state would be left to a very small number of (ultimately self- appointed)good and heroic individuals who embobied and exemplified all that was great and good the so national soul.

The results of this 'political experiment' were so disasterous that most of the world embraced representative democracy, flawed and vulnerable to abuse though it may be.

Yes and that ideology was called fascism.

The more projects going ahead is all good for the local economy especially in these unpredictable times. Good luck to them going ahead.

Very local economy...

For one families economy

Exactly how can infrastructure, roads benefit only one family???. Hmm okay so when you drive on the new roads and use new facilities then you are not benefiting? Seems like trolling again coming from the regulars.

If you buy roads with a 50 % corruption, it benefits the corrupt family only. The "normal" guy paid does not get the straight for free, he paid the double price for it.

or where do you think the money comes from? It is taxpayers money.

Whose money do you think paid for Paris,London or New York's Metro lines???

Thanks S.J. for that and for making the important, respectful comparison of Queen Elizabeth and Queen Sirikit.

What splendid selfless contributions and sacrifices both have made for their respective countries and the world in general.

How sad and yet predictable that YH has to once again posted what i consider a double edged, mischief making comment.

marshbags

Quite apart from the fact you are (a) flaming and ( in clear breach of forum rules, I have no idea what you are talking about.

Neither does he ...

What I find funny is the PAD sleep in the Government House and did some more wrong things and if the red pulls them out, they (the reds) are blamed for using violence.

which wrong doings? Which court told that they are wrong?

I only heard the EC telling that PPP did vote buying.......

Don't tell me the Democrat Party didn't buy. Their problem is they can't buy enough to win.

koo82: I'm pretty certain that this kind of irrelevant nonsense shall be treated with the ignore it deserves. The fact that there was money flowing from both sides has absolutly no place in this discussion. I don't think you really understand the purpose of this thread.

Following the PAD philosophy of replacing a faulty voting system with one which is absolutely guaranteed to deliver a government free of interference from the electorate is a unique & brilliant concept. This is obvious ! The well educated, sage & caring leaders of the anti-Thaksin movement are far better suited to lead Thailand into the future ---- and forever --- than any government which may be elected the people in any future election.

The entire population of this country (except the anti-Thaksin movement) has proven itself incapable of voting correctly and thereby delivering a government of the correct "people". It is therefore required to ensure that they NEVER get the opportunity of voting in such a stupid manner ever again.

You should seriously reconsider your position and throw your support behind the logical solution to the current problems ---- by the government appointing 70% of the lower house of Parliament they ensure only the correct people govern Thailand. People of integrity and vision.

People who do not simply want their turn at the trough.

Delusional delirium is a serious condition that is the direct result of brainwashing . You obviously are a case study for that sickness.

If they plan to walk from Wireless Road to Emporium, that's a long walk and Bangkok will be paralysed all day. What a bunch of inconsiderate nit wits!

They have the right to demonstrate......remember the Tolpuddle marchers of 1834..

Perhaps it is you that is the "inconsiderate nit wit" as you seem only concerned with your rights and not the rights of others.

I also remember Mao's long march.

"They have the right to demonstrate". I agree with you. Let exercise our right to demonstrate by doing it on the runway of Phuket airport AGAIN. Also Had Yai airport, Krabi airport, and last but not least DON MUANG & SUWANNAPHUMI airports.

There was piece on CNN yesterday where they interviewed one of the PAD demonstators.

When asked why she was demonstrating , she said, I quote : " Thaksin is worse than Hitler" .

Someone stupid enough to say such a thing deserves no respect whatsoever.

I hate Thaksin as much as you do, believe me, but as Bob Marley sang : " Don't let them fool you " .

I'm afraid you 've been fooled and brainwashed beyond rescue.

I feel sorry for you , as obviously you need to look up the definition of a few words in a dictionary .

Let me enligthen you.

Military government = dictatorship/end of democracy .

Democratically elected : from a majority of the people's votes .

Now maybe you don't agree with the majority of people's votes, but you know hwat : this is what democracy is all fuc_king about.

I'm not going to comment on your points about wealth creation.

A few people who control Toyota Motor here create as much business and wealth for the country as a million of farmers. Yes, sure, farmers are important in more ways than I can possibly count, but it's not the issue here - the issue is that Thaksin's return is opposed by relatively few people who really make this country work, on a day to day basis, by people who are expected to stand up and save the country from effects of global crisis. The government cannot afford to fight them, and pretend it's on behalf of the farmers.

>>>

Don't confuse support for Thaksin as a person and support for what will happen if he is allowed to return to power.

Plus ,

Sorry Plus, I used to enjoy your posts, but since you put on your yellow blindfolds I can't stand them anymore.

You just forgot one simple principle .

They day Toyota thinks it's no longer worth investing a satang in Thailand they will walk away from this land in a second. Do you think 1 million farmer could do as much ???

Jasreeve17 ,

Thank you, thank you and thank you.

And like Bob Marley used to sing : " Don't let them fool you "