thykeeper

Has anyone here actually read the Thai posted? I got freaked out last yesterday and didn't really read it over completely but after I have I think the forum here is interjecting tons of extra information that does not exist in the announcement.

I don't know if even the moderators have read this well since they have told me specially about a single 30 day entry stamp referencing specific information without a valid source. I afraid the moderators who posted this may be fear mongering or not doing their research well enough.

The document does NOT say:

1) The document does NOT say you are limited to one entry of 30 days nor does it mention amounts of entires or days of each entry (these being entry stamps without visas).

2) The document does NOT contain ANY hard numbers. If anyone here is giving you hard numbers like 1 entry and 30 days they got this from a source which is NOT the official government announcement.

3) The document does NOT mention any new laws (these are simply guidelines).

4) The document does NOT mention specific kinds of visas.

5) The document does NOT mention specific kinds of travel like land crossing or airports.

6) The document does NOT mention "all nationalities" and in fact singles out "Korea etc...". I called the offices in BKK and they say it does apply to all nationalities but that information is NOT the official document.

The document DOES say:

1) From the starting date (the 8th I think) to the 15th of August they will start to write "O-I" (out-in) in your passport if they suspect your entry is not tourism related and then they will advise you to secure an actual visa (the entry stamp is implied here to be a problem but NOT limited to) the "correct" way.

2) After the 15th at the discretion of the officer they will decide if the person is doing a visa-run which is non-tourism related and if thought to be so they are instructed to refuse entry to that person.

So to conclude:

1) The focus here is clearly to limit "visa runs" of the "out - in" nature.

2) This appears to imply entry stamps only by suggesting to acquire a proper visa but abusing the tourist visa system is also a form of visa run. Living on visas from Lao for 2 years suggests your intention is not tourism and they specifically target this.

3) It is in fact very possible that if an official sees a person making multiple border runs without a visa they can on their discretion allow this person to pass if they feel they are a valid tourist. Nowhere in the document does it give clear details that people doing X number of X category entries are refused. This is ALL left to personal discretion of human beings on the ground.

4) The document does NOT suggest to start turning people away BEFORE August 15th. If this happened to you if was the confusion of the people on the ground getting bad information or commands from their superior. I was able to pass with a 30 day entry stamp in Mae Sai on the 11th and after asking was told I can do this 4 more times (my tourist visa expired on May 13th).

Please add to this list of actual information from the actual source if you want to help reduce the confusion here!

Can anyone confirm this apples to all nationalities? Me and my girlfriend read this over and we don't understand why it says "เช่น เกาหลี ฯลฯ" and specifically singles out Korea. We just called the Chiang Mai immigration office and they said we still get 4 entires x 30 days without a valid visa AND on the 11th 9:00PM at Mae Sai I was given 30 days (tourist visa expired on the 13th) and was told in no uncertain terms we get 4 entires at 30 days each. I'm getting suspicious this doesn't apply to all nationalities or they're profiling certain countries.

That seems to be unclear. The directive says something like "targeted nationalities", without telling what these targeted nationalities are.

It never specially says all nationalities and I don't see where it mentions "targeted nationalities" (I don't see the word nationality repeated ever expect in the context of "Korea etc..." at the top). They did make it clear they are targeting visa runners however but I don't see where is places restrictions on certain kinds of visas etc... My Thai isn't great and there are words here I don't understand but it seems like this could apply to buying back to back visas. I'm going to make more calls and read this over with my girlfriend to make sure our reading is matching what people are saying here. Is the original poster Thai of fluent and did they translate this correctly for all of us?

Can anyone confirm this apples to all nationalities? Me and my girlfriend read this over and we don't understand why it says "เช่น เกาหลี ฯลฯ" and specifically singles out Korea. We just called the Chiang Mai immigration office and they said we still get 4 entires x 30 days without a valid visa AND on the 11th 9:00PM at Mae Sai I was given 30 days (tourist visa expired on the 13th) and was told in no uncertain terms we get 4 entires at 30 days each. I'm getting suspicious this doesn't apply to all nationalities or they're profiling certain countries.

You can leave by land at Laos and get a tourist visa there.

Official document here: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/725053-final-crackdown-for-border-runners-new-strict-immigration-regulation-in-force-from-today/

first post gives the new rule in Thai.

Thank you, I appreciate your time helping.

You had a visa and when you just left and returned that was your first visa exempt entry, which is confirm the new rule of only 1 visa exempt entry.

The informaiton regarding you being able to do it 3 more times is probably uncorrect. (they might not have yet informed all officials about the new rule).

Yes I think you're right. I don't trust this information either.

Just to confirm can I exit by land to Lao to buy a new visa or are we forced by to fly out by land?

Also where is the official document to reference? I'm trying to explain this to my girlfriend but she doesn't believe it because we were just told by the "official" we have another 4 entires.

Can anyone explain what happened to me?

There has been some speculation that Saturday's incidents in Mae Sai were due to overreaction on the part of Thai immigrations officials to the new diktat. It's possible that things had returned to some semblance of normal by the time you passed thru yesterday.

That's a good possible explanation but I'm really confused about the nature of the 4 entries he claimed exist. According to the "Final crackdown for border runners" post we're allowed to enter once from the border without a visa and that would be the one time but I'm setup now for a possible serious problem.

Has anyone asked them at the Chiang Mai immigration office what the policy is? Is this the best place to ask at this point so I know what to really expect?

Can we still buy visas in Lao or maybe they are restricting buying back to back tourist visas also? That would essentially be another back door to living on tourist visas which I think they would close at this point.

What?! My story totally conflicts this account.

I was JUST in Mae Sai Sunday morning (the 11th) at about 9:00 AM with a 3 entry tourist visa that was expired and I got 30 days (I'll post a pic if you want to verify). The most confusing part is I explicitly had my girlfriend ask him (the official) in Thai how many times we can do this and he said 4 times for 30 days AFTER the visa expired (I confirmed this 4 times also by speaking in Thai to him to avoid confusion).

This was on the 11th and a full day after people reported being not allowed to exit Thailand. Can anyone explain what happened to me? I was expecting to go back once more before going home (I'm from the US btw) but I'm freaked out now and probably going to fly out of this tourist trap (literally!) ASAP.

What other "chemicals" is thai food loaded with that are so dangerous?

I still eat Thai food on a daily basis but the cheapest possible grade palm oil little street vendors use is like cooking with wax. It's basically the same crap all cheap pastries use here also and I don't consider it food.

I have terrible allergies in Thailand (not in the USA however) which causes nasty asthma to the extent I need to take respiratory dilators and use inhalers often. Certain times of year are worse than other and the less vegetation around the better. When I lived in the actual city they were better but now I live in Mae Rim and they're worse. Being in Pai is brutal for me and I need to take multiple pills every day just to get by. Mold is also a big killer in Thailand since it's everywhere most of the year and don't forget the general high level of pollution we suffer through.

Others have this also I have talked to and the only real solution is to take shots once a week for a year (which I need to commit to soon). Good luck with your condition.

This doesn't annoy the locals until the full implications are realized when you're passing through a green light and almost get killed by a person breaking the law. Don't forget that people often jump the greens early also and just as often there is person speeding to fly through a just-turned red light.

People are either not annoyed enough, lack the means to affect change or just don't care because they haven't known a person they love die yet. From talking with Thai people about this they just aren't at a point in their collective history with cars where they're aware of the risk and ready to take on the challenge. The effort involved with making other people care and getting the laws/police to function properly is insurmountable so mae pen rai it until tomorrow.

As for parking people are more than often too lazy to walk literally seconds and no one ever complains so why care? There just isn't a mechanism in society (as far as I know) that allows Thais to communicate and affect change upon themselves. For example in the US I don't do rude things even when I the law isn't present because I'm afraid I'm going to get called out on it in public and have troubles.

The much bigger problem is the infrastructure in Chiang Mai simply doesn't exist to allow for cars parking properly. I pardon people for this because there is literally nothing you can do often. This country was never designed for cars so we can all expect the problems to get worse every single year.

Pai changed dramatically over the course of one year. I lived there in 2005 and you could still drive down all the streets with speed because there were no street vendors. After they made that stupid love movie (which I suffered painfully through) I think the government allocated an increased tourism budget and began advertising. The next year it was totally overrun with Bangkok folks and street vendors, which is the state it remains in today. It's a total carnival for suburban city dwellers now and 100% tourism oriented which makes it really uncomfortable to do even simple things.

The weather in winter is great though if you like it cold like me. It's a total shame it can't be enjoyed though anymore...

Funny, that was the first leg of the ride. My Garmin battery was on its last bar so I saved what I had and started it up again. Below is the last part. It was scary single single track that would have been fun 15 years ago but not at 45 yo.

http://connect.garmi...ard?cid=1087943

The roads after the campsite above Doi Pui are not going to be fun on a road bike. I had MTB with slicks and have a semi rigid frame and it beat me up. After the village with the school at the highest point in the village, I dropped down "STEEP" single track. I have a messed up heel from running that I think is fractured so it suffices to say the ride sucked.

I'm a runner the last 13 years after a horrendous biking accident. Came up here to run the marathon last week but my feet quit on me 15 days ago and hence the biking. 13 years ago I was able to do the Zoo to Doi Suthep in 36 minutes on my MTB and having fun trying to get back to that point. Still wearing the same bike shoes (1998 model).

Who the heck is that young kid that motors up to the castle without a shirt? I shiver with my thin jacket on the way down. He reminds me of the Kenyans I race with here. Just bones and a little flesh but they can move.

That's what I thought about the road quality.

Small world! That's actually me you're talking about. I get really hot even in winter and most the year it's too hot to think about shirts so I enjoy the nice cool air when I can. Last year I was in Pai for a few months in winter and the road out to Chiang Mai and to Mae Hong Son were pretty cold but I don't think CM ever gets cold at that time of day (in the morning probably though). I'm 30 btw.

To the east, head out past Mae Kamphong to the top of the road before it drops down towards Jae Son (or Chae Son) NP. Highest point on the road about 1500m.

Where is this exactly? The only high points I know out east are the road out to Wiang Pa Pao but I didn't think that was that high.

Here is my Garmin info with elevation profiles on the bottom of the page above my heart rate info. Looks like the highest point around Doi Pui is about 5,400 feet.(1645 meters). Did the same ride yesterday and coughing up gunk today. Still a nice ride but what a shame.

http://connect.garmi...ivity/253476762

I ride up Doi Suthep a few times a week but I usually stop at the helicopter landing or in the summer baan phu ping when the days are longer. I have a road bike and after that point the roads start getting bad but I see you passed all the way over the peak and down the other side (I think that's what the map shows). How are the roads for biking?

I'm 30 also and from the US, not sure where you're from. It's pretty impossible to meet people here who actually live here and are your own age, nationality let alone have similar interests. I basically program and bike ride with all my time (quit drinking) but you can email me if you want (or do I need to post my address?).

har har har. Why are people still trying to marry prostitutes when they're hordes of nice girls all over. That Thai script looked pretty messed up also but I wonder how someone so dedicated wouldn't know any better. He could find anyone better anywhere.

this is a huge increase on a bottle of beer, consider the current cheepest in pattaya is 35baht this will almost double that, are they crazy or what, and to try to tax foreigners even more is just about the cazyest thing i've heard yet

Thai people get so screwed on the cost of booze it's sad. If they knew how drunk they could get if they lived in America for doing the same stupid jobs they'd be rioting in the streets. Getting drunk after a long pointless day of labor is most peoples prime objective in life and Thai people are getting the shaft on that one. Boo!

This isn't about the government being illegitimate or not, the result the will always be the same. Arrogant classist Thai society is learning a lesson on what happens when they let the balance slide too far. Even an outsider like me can see you live in Bangkok and rise to the top or go broke trying to compete. I would personally be rioting also if I was taught me whole life to be proud to be Thai but have the government and every arrogant jerk from the city look down on me because I didn't own a nice house and fancy car in Bangkok. Totally necessary conflict. Good luck to the people here trying to reclaim some dignity and respect even though they may be poor.

And the trouble spots are?

Mobs of angry red shirt wearing Thai people. These things are easy to avoid and the warning over hyped but it's the governments responsibility to at least inform people.

I stopped diving in Pattaya because of the close calls i had had with speedboats etc. One time at Kohlarn the owner of the diveshop told another boat to be careful there were divers down there. And the reply was do you own the water. After the japanese girl was killed a few years ago by speedboat something was supposed to be done about this. Obviously not enough has been done if anything and more innocent people are dead. There is a boat sinking or capsizing in Pattaya almost every week aswell and the captains usually do a runner, the authorities need to really do something this time. I certainly hope so for the good of Pattaya.

Totally pathetic the regard for safety is here. One more person killed in a totally avoidable accident and this will not the last. It's 2010, let the blood flow!

Great news for drunks all around. Compared to beer prices in the US for similar pissy looking beers like beer chang the price here is outrageously high. A 7-11 worker in the US could afford to a buy one 6-pack (or more for dirt cheap beer) of various beer brands with quality comparable to beer chang per hour (~$8/hour). Compare that to a Thai 7-11 worker making 25/baht per hour can only buy ONE can of beer chang!! The US 7-11 employee is getting at *least* 6x drunker than in Thailand! Why is beer so much for this poor people?

In general I support that "Society for Online News Providers" - they should get their royalties for reposting their content, which is not free to produce.

That's what Bangkok Post should try to negotiate - share of the revenue for reading their articles on TV or anywhere else. But if they chose to forbid reposting and even quoting - it's their choice, I just hope they eventually realize that it's not the way to move forward. They might hurt themselves, but, on the other hand - no one here, on TV, would be happy if they go bust, or if the quality of their reporting deteriorates - that's not what we want to see in Thailand.

For now the ban is a ban. Hope they still allow links. That was not clear from George's announcement.

Are they ok with posting links to their articles?

I don't think anyone can claim ownership of a link, it's public domain. That would be like trying to ban people from speaking your name or gaining access to your address after you clearly posted it on your front door.

I think the change maybe a good thing because there are many legal ways to stay without using a tourist visa. I do not think the new rules will affect any true tourists.

I have plenty of money, I dont need to work.

I am young, I stay in hotels and eat out every day all year

helping Thailands declining tourism industry.

Explain to me how to stay here for 2years.

I dont want to work, I dont want to marry some thai citizen,

I dont want to study.

I want to relax by the hotel pool by myself with my laptop,

eat out and keep enjoying my tourist life, I am happy.

Is my lifstyle forbidden in Thailand?

People keep saying get the proper visa...

What proper visa??????

Yes! Where's this guy's visa?! Poor guys like this are being judged by the lowest common denominator once again. Thailand's POOR thy don't they want these guys??

This is the bottom line: you can't compare USA and developed countries with Thailand, we don't need/can't support more people in our economies. Some people have $10,000 and want to stay in Thailand for a year or over because that's how they choose to spend their money. Not working, just spending money. Doesn't Thailand need this? Maybe the governments too proud to admit it's poor and needs foreign investment?

Why all the talk about "just follow the law"? What law can they follow? Where's their visa???

Now people with this plan REALLY risk being rejected and should consider choosing another country. My only regret is wasting the time to learn to read and write Thai which is useless outside the country. Bad news this is....