PAD Lay Siege On Government House, NBT TV Station

[Tony Clifton]

PAD don't really have a leg to stand on because what do think is going to happen if they dissolve parliament and call another election?

They will lose again that is what will happen.

No, they won't. 65% of Thais voted for anti Thaksin parties in the last election. The PPP only got a bit over 35% of the vote, the only reason they won more seats (yet still under 50% of them) was because the anti Thaksin vote was split among several parties. People won't be as stupid this time around, they will vote for a single party instead of splitting their votes among many.

I hate to disappoint you. But Thaksin wasn't running in the last election.

This projected obsession with Thaksin is masking a much more sinister agenda by the elite class.

I hate to disappoint you but there is ample mention in news articles of his meetings with cabinet members and zombies flying to China, Hong Kong and the U.K over a period of two years, some even tried saying it was by chance they ran into each other abroad. He is still and wants to remain the Little Emperor until he gets his frozen funds back.

You are entitled to your conspiracy theories like anyone else.

The trouble is that while people like you are fixated on Thaksin, the bigger picture passes you by.

As stated before, this battle is not so much about Thaksin or Samak but more about a struggle between democracy and the old feudal system.

Conspiracy? The regularly flock to London, everyone knows it, you know it. He admitted himself giving adviceto the party because he just can't take a step back. I clearly remember one article was even accompanied by photos of them meeting in in China.

The battle is about Thaksin being the last to ever run the country the way he and Samak did, all glitter no content. The people have had it.

[sriracha john]

The end point being..

Were these weapons fired?

Yes.

Thankfully no one was hit directly.

[ando]

[quote name='blaze' date='2008-08-30 10:37:09' post='217960

And that's why it is received wisdom now that pretty much NOBODY would have voted PPP had they not been paid to do so.

Really. Is that so?

[ando]

PAD don't really have a leg to stand on because what do think is going to happen if they dissolve parliament and call another election?

They will lose again that is what will happen.

No, they won't. 65% of Thais voted for anti Thaksin parties in the last election. The PPP only got a bit over 35% of the vote, the only reason they won more seats (yet still under 50% of them) was because the anti Thaksin vote was split among several parties. People won't be as stupid this time around, they will vote for a single party instead of splitting their votes among many.

I hate to disappoint you. But Thaksin wasn't running in the last election.

This projected obsession with Thaksin is masking a much more sinister agenda by the elite class.

I hate to disappoint you but there is ample mention in news articles of his meetings with cabinet members and zombies flying to China, Hong Kong and the U.K over a period of two years, some even tried saying it was by chance they ran into each other abroad. He is still and wants to remain the Little Emperor until he gets his frozen funds back.

You are entitled to your conspiracy theories like anyone else.

The trouble is that while people like you are fixated on Thaksin, the bigger picture passes you by.

As stated before, this battle is not so much about Thaksin or Samak but more about a struggle between democracy and the old feudal system.

Conspiracy? The regularly flock to London, everyone knows it, you know it. He admitted himself giving adviceto the party because he just can't take a step back. I clearly remember one article was even accompanied by photos of them meeting in in China.

The battle is about Thaksin being the last to ever run the country the way he and Samak did, all glitter no content. The people have had it.

Oh yes, tha plot thickens. Do go on. Its all really becoming more relevant now I can see .

[fidelio]

The difference being that in France the army is under the control of the president and answers to no one else.

I'm not sure this is different - the Thai army ultimately answers to the Thai head of state (which is the King, not the Prime Minister).

As does the British Army.

Let me ask you 2 questions : who decided to send british troops to Irak : Blair or the Queen ?

If the Queen had been against it, could she/would she have been able to stop him ?

Now you should see the big deiiference

No idea what the outcome would have been if Tony B. Liar and old Lizzie had disagreed about grabbing Iraq's oil. I guess they both figured it was a bit of a goldmine to throw their lot in with GWB at the time. Ultimately though, the old girl would technically have the final say if push came to shove.

Technically maybe, but practically no.

Has she ever overuled one major policy decision from one of the many prime ministers who have served her ?

[h90]

PM to be granted an audience with HM the King at 5pm Saturday

5:15pm Saturday

ASTV just announced Samak said he is not resigning.

A woman who sometimes appears on stage, we call her The Chemo Lady (treated for cancer), has reappeared. She looked awful tired a few weeks ago hairless and could hardly raise her now cartoonish voice. Glad to see she is still hanging on strong and fighting for her brothers and sisters as well as for her own life. x<----Tony Jr tapped the keyboard and gives her a single kiss

He said that not resigning before he visit the king (at least I read it that way)....not that it get confused.

[Tony Clifton]

Hmmmm...

You have a Protest leader, who owns a police station, which constantly airs free service announcements against Child Labour, against family violence, against sex slavery. A station that educates people about AIDS and other things

You have protest leaders who have been keeping large masses of people demonstrating peacefully. Protest leaders who know how to organize defensive moves to hold their ground at the government building

Lots of intelligent people supporting them....doctors, teachers, University Students, Pilots, etc....

while they are leading a peaceful, civil disobedience protest...

...and you call them bad

Then you got Samak and his corrupt government, who only got elected, because they bought the votes, who have less than 50% of voter support in Thailand (even after spending billions of Baht trying to buy it), who use force to deal with peaceful demonstrators, beating on old men and women, etc....

A government that tortures innocent hilltribe people to admit to crimes they didn't commit. An illegal government under Thai constitution, because of it's leaders being involved in vote buying..

and you they they are good????

Give me a break.

I openly support the PAD, so does my Thai wife and we are proud of it.

For 24 hour coverage of the demonstrations here is the ASTV link...

http://www.thaiDUMLOOK.tv/

I seriously doubt that you are what you claim to be.

Why do you find it necessary to post nonsense (now Samak is "torturing hill-tribe people.....") at regular intervals just to constantly post the link to ASTV?

Yae ASTV the opium of the Minorities!(Arethey Chewing Beetle Nut or something while Glued to that crap?)

KURTGRUEN: My THAI WIFE translates EVERTHING those Thugs are saying! WAKE UP and SMELL THE COFFEE MAN!!!! Sondhi and Loonie Gang ONLY Want YOUR MONEY! They Despise You and ALL of Farang who aint "CHIN"! They DON"T want Democracy.THAT is "YOUR FARANG POISON".

I have heard Him and Other PAD Leaders speak and These quotes are QUOTES!

"Motherf...ing farang Dogs". "F..king Kwai Farang Come to Thailand and Think they can Force us to elect leaders to suit their pillaging of Thai Economy"( Kwai= Buffalo =stupid)"Stupid Isan Dogs Who Voted for This and the Previous Govt""If SamaK(yes the Elect Prime minister of this nation) comes To the South WE will Kill him" Quotes From PAD ASTV and Sondhi.

KURTGRUEN: If You support Xenophobic KNOWN criminals who Hate You and ALL You stand for and Talk OPENLY about it,

They WILL take Your Business,Land,Home and Right to Be Here when they are ruling! You/ We are screwed on that day!You as many others love to be an open book and talk TOO much about that which should be private.What stops THESE thugs Near to us From Popping up and Evicting You and Your Wife? (No Tabien Ban! No Tanot No Work Visa for The Coffe shop!That's Mine and I'm Taking it! Try going to the Police They'll just laugh!)PAD IS SICK BRAIN POISON!!!I wish You see that and Save Your Plight!

Wow. I wasn't aware of that- can anyone confirm this. I don't doubt it but this is an element that the media has not touched on- certainly not the English speaking media.

Go helterskelter ..... tell it like it is. My thai is good enough to follow most of what is said and my gf fills in the bits I miss. I can confirm that these ARE REAL COMMENTS actually beind said by the PAD leadership ( Chamlong excepted , he usually refrains from such gutter language )

1-So, how do you translate m*th3erf*^%er in Thai?

2- I'm also curious about how "F..king Kwai Farang Come to Thailand and Think they can Force us to elect leaders to suit their pillaging of Thai Economy"( Kwai= Buffalo =stupid)" is possible when murdered tourists families have to fight like hel_l to get a fair trial or even a decent investigation and their respective Embassies just about have their hands tied.

Quite the little Smart Alec, aren't you?

Pity you can't give an honest answer to a simple question - How do you feel about Gen. Panlop's involvement in PAD?

You've been asked enough times, but wriggle out of answering in your usual smug, flippant way!

There are two questions I asked above that remain unanswered.

&lt;deleted&gt; does Panlop have to do with what I am asking???

It's the first time you ask me directly about Panlop, I'm not going to get drawn into this right now, I admit that I don't know enough about the man yet (who has time to cover all the side players involved), although I can tell you a rough estimate how many thousands died under Thaksin.

Edited August 30, 2008 by Tony Clifton

[blaze]

What you said has merit, but now let's talk about the real world as it relates to Thailand (this is a Thai forum after all). The last two elected governments have been thrown out (OK, the second one is on the way of being thrown out). The first one by the military and this one by the people. So, what kind of democracy is this? Perhaps a different one than we are used to and therefore one requiring a different structure until it develops further.

My "modest" proposal would help us get there. It forces education to become a priority while for the time being, mitigates the threat of power groups seeking to overthrow the next government and then the next government. The value of education gets elevated in the eyes of local village headman and heads of families as it creates a brand new incentive. If you can vote you can elect people that further your needs.

I realize the quality of education is a completely different issue, however, the more people get their minds around getting an education, they more they will learn about the type of education they should seek.

Nothing is perfect, but this elect a government - remove a government BS is getting old. Finding things wrong with proposals is fine, but come up with other solutions instead of saying this won't work and that won't work. What we have now doesn't work, that I can say for sure.

You are failing to understand the concept of democracy, and on top of that you are making some sweeping value judgements about the less educated.

If you keep the common man from voting, it is feudalism even if you dress it up like democracy. Fuedalism is the ball and chain keeping Thailand in this banana republic identity; when by now, it could be competing with progressive Asian nations.

The reason for this recent protest is that the big money Thais, can't accept they are equal in rights to the farmers, so they keep shaking the tree until someone that will look after their personal ambition ends up in power. It is not because less educated people choose badly. They are choosing very well because by their experience the TRT and the PPP have made some effort to consider what they need. Were the last two elected governments corrupt? yes of course, but they all have been corrupt, so the point is moot.

Put in a condition of education requirement to vote and you will ensure Fuedal policies and exploitation of the lower classes for another 50 years.

Thailand needs nothing more than lift it's self deluded head out of bronze age policies and start a massive education and integrity initiative. Wouldn't it be great if diligence and integrity were considered values here instead of face and geneology.

Oh, I forgot. There was also an election that the courts dissolved. One by the courts, one by the military and one by the people. That is strike three. Time for a change.

"Time For Change"!???

Meanwhile the reports are comming in from Isan via "Jungle Telegraph"(Relations in Law) That People are paid 500baht a day and given free Bus Journey to Bangkok.To "Enjoy" The Free Festival Hosted and Sponsored by the PAD!(Political Attention Deficient)(Later "Religious Chasms will split these "Waco" Texas style PAD leaders up in the south!Bring on the "Cool Aid"!F..ing Sad For Beautiful LOS and the "Majority" of Peace Loving,Hard working,VOTING Thai Peoples!My Heart is Heavy for Bangkok and all the small enterprise focused on Tourism!

very improbable....most probably another lie

I do want to say I am pleasantly surprised by so much thoughtful analyzes. I really expected the immature rants and raves, but instead this was a very mature discussion.

OK, it is so easy to knock down someone else's ideas, so I challenge you all. Democracy as we know it is isn't working here. If tying education to voting privileges is not the solution, then what is the solution?

I do want to add that I bounced my idea off of someone today who is very, very senior in Thai society (yes, one of those elites you read about), and his take was that although education is extremely important, it isn't the answer to keep corrupt politicians from gaining control.

This is the jackpot question OMR. What is the purpose of democracy in THailand? Is it to provide clean and efficient government- democracy can't guarantee that. Is it to provide basic human rights? You don't need democracy for that. Is it to lift the standard of living of the entire population? No need for democracy there. Is it to protect the nation against the abuses of non-democratic systems- systems which are ultimately not answerable to the population? Then yes, democracy probably is required. Is it to reflect the principle that each member of the society shares an equal stake in the rights and responsibilities that go with citizenship? Probably democracy is needed. Is it to ensure that either directly or through representatives each individual has an equal opportunity to shape the direction the nation takes? If so democracy is definitely needed.

Can you take a stratified society that operates in large part according to the medeival principles of nobless oblige- wherein those with power 'take care' of those with less in return for blind obedience- and expect that society to embrace the essential principles of democracy? Or understand them?

Can you take a society which values social harmony above all and expect people to operate on the idea of personal principle?

Can you expect checks and balances to work when those doing the checking have lived all their lives in awe of the very powerful positions they are intended to check?

And what is corruption? Good people are generous aren't they. And grateful people are willing to reward that generosity with kind deeds....

And the rule of law? What the hel_l is 'law'- in a society where for a thousand years you have obeyed 'the man'-

I don't know- just my musings- but I think your friend is right and it is an uphill battle- but by no means unwinable.

[animatic]

Well on this one I must note

PAD tries to go up there, but are met with bands of

PPP or TRT sympathetic thugs who violently beat them until they leave.

These bands actively prevent PAD from talking up there.

JUST TALKING is enough of a threat. Information control to control the populace.

EVERY time I have heard of a PAD trip up north it has ended this way.

As recently as this summer

And this is why PAD has guards with sticks. Self defense posture.

They want to be able to talk with out beatings.

Since they are now armed as such, the PPP sympathetic bands

now are not showing up like before. Cause and effect in both directions.

OK. Firstly you should understand that PAD is NOT a political party and that can NOT offer the poor people of Issarn anything.

PAD is a political activist organization whose only interest in the Northern Provence people is to recruit dissidents who will actively oppose those politicians offering a better deal in life for Issarn people. PAD has absolutely nothing to offer the people of the North East and couldn't deliver anything they might promise since they are not a part of government anyway. PADs foray into the North was with nothing more than intent to create diviseness among the people. And as such was treated with contempt and disdain.

I am sure PAD was looking for trouble when it went into the North as the organization is certainly portraying itself as a professional victim in the hope of enticing the military into this conflict.

So if they were so harmless, since the offered nothing but talk,

Why run them off with beatings?

Because they are dangerous to vested interests control.

The INFORMATION they delivered is what was the issue.

And informed electorate makes decisions based on what

they can hear or read, and make up their own minds.

So PAD wasn't offering themselves as a solution,

but explaining that the ONLY solution being offered

might not really be to the best benefit of the average person.

So look for another solution, you will be better off.

The TRT /PPP influencial people want NO DISSENTING VOICES

It makes it COST MORE to buy the vote then.

I was in Chaingma for the 2005 election I saw money passed out from

guys in TRT vests from TRT trucks walking the out-lying quarters.

A couple hundred baht and a bag of rice. All smiles from the older women.

I saw this first hand they didn't bother hiding it.

I made no difference to their calculation.

[cloudhopper]

He said that not resigning before he visit the king (at least I read it that way)....not that it get confused.

According to the BBC he made the announcement after the meeting.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7589504.stm

[ando]

The difference being that in France the army is under the control of the president and answers to no one else.

I'm not sure this is different - the Thai army ultimately answers to the Thai head of state (which is the King, not the Prime Minister).

As does the British Army.

Let me ask you 2 questions : who decided to send british troops to Irak : Blair or the Queen ?

If the Queen had been against it, could she/would she have been able to stop him ?

Now you should see the big deiiference

No idea what the outcome would have been if Tony B. Liar and old Lizzie had disagreed about grabbing Iraq's oil. I guess they both figured it was a bit of a goldmine to throw their lot in with GWB at the time. Ultimately though, the old girl would technically have the final say if push came to shove.

Technically maybe, but practically no.

Has she ever overuled one major policy decision from one of the many prime ministers who have served her ?

Who cares. Queen Lizzie is just a rubber stamp these days, all be it a very well paid one! Unlike Thailand's Monarch who still holds ultimate power over the politicians. Nuff said there. No further comment on this one.

[h90]

He said that not resigning before he visit the king (at least I read it that way)....not that it get confused.

According to the BBC he made the announcement after the meeting.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7589504.stm

from the nation

Samak vows to stay

Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej said he would not quit and he will stay on.

Samak said that he didn't want to touch upon politics but he wanted to inform the public that he would continue working. His speech and the ceremony at Rajamakala Stadium was broadcast live on NBT channel. Some cabinet members were present.

He ended his speech by saying that he has got to go, hinting that he would seek an audience with "Jao Nai".

end quote

So for me it seems it was before.

[younghusband]

Kent State University was a pivotal site in the history of American protest. My father, who was an alumnae was saddened by students who, even when he revisited in the 1990's, were unaware of the significance of its role. Times change... students change... history changes... and nowadays we have busloads of university students arriving at critical points in the week and whose arrival were no doubt inspirational to those already in attendance. It speaks of its relevance to PAD as yet another faction of society being represented. The whole arena of academia is very well represented in PAD.

What's missing, as it to be expected in a brief article, are specifically who the "statement" came from and how much of the student body do they represent. The terrific thing that justifies Thomassat's reputation is the diversity of thought and variances of opinion.

For all we know, the statement was from a group that is not representative of a majority or prevalent opinion of the students or the faculty.

Dishonest and muddled thought processes as we have come to expect from this "bloodied grandmothers" poster.

As Wesley Hsu pointed out in his letter to the Bangkok Post today "the current PAD protests are not ideologically aligned with the student protests of 1973,1976 and 1992.The PAD is a rightist royalist movement having declared its distrust of elections and preference for appointed leaders and military oversight of civilian bureaucracy.Despite its yellow-clad nationalism and insistent focus on Thaksin's genuine corruption, the current anti-government faction is a reactionary cultural movement whose principles are anathema to genuine political progressives.

Student activists for all their naivete are not likely to mistake backwards for forwards.The fact that neither the army nor the police have fired a single shot at the PAD in contrast to the delirious suppression of past student protests highlights the ideological alignment between the PAD and the existing power structure that gives orders to the men with guns.

The students in 1976 demanded pluralism, wealth distribution and systemic change and were shot for it.Today's PAD demands oligarchy,submission and the end of majority rule by poor people insufficiently "Thai" to accept their lot as karma."

[animatic]

Yes there is a PAD connection with the older order structures.

But there is also a clear connection with the country peeple

which can't be discounted either. Most people in the middle

class do still have strong connections with the old villages

This is the transistion from feudal to modern shaking itself out

one more time, not likely to be the last either.

But they will have to find a THAI way to do it.

Our conceptions of democratic rules are not necessarily

the way they CAN go. Even if they desire it.

We must wait and see.

Edited August 30, 2008 by animatic

[Gary A]

Samak was NOT elected. He was appointed buy the PPP which was elected. As far as being paid to vote, that is bullshit too. That is just another crutch that is being used by the People AGAINST Democracy. Some people here are just as disillusioned and the people who follow these anarchists.

[Insight]

Wonder why Samak didn't make the meeting with HM yesterday?

Must of been busy...

[Gary A]

Samak was NOT elected. He was appointed by the PPP which was elected. As far as being paid to vote, that is bullshit too. That is just another crutch that is being used by the People AGAINST Democracy. Some people here are just as disillusioned and the people who follow these anarchists.

[Samuian]

Technically maybe, but practically no.

Has she ever overuled one major policy decision from one of the many prime ministers who have served her ?

Yes but she did so at least once that I know of.... many years ago intervened in Australian (Commonwealth) Politics (Constitutional Crisis) and sacked the Premier Gough Whitlam!

[Insight]

Samak was NOT elected. He was appointed buy the PPP which was elected. As far as being paid to vote, that is bullshit too. That is just another crutch that is being used by the People AGAINST Democracy. Some people here are just as disillusioned and the people who follow these anarchists.

Gary, personally think you should clarify that one with your missus a bit more...

[Artisi]

Thai riot police prepare before clashing with the supporters of People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) inside the Government House in Bangkok August 29, 2008.

REUTERS

The PR value of the picture of the policeman pointing a rifle at a protestor at point blank range is very high

The rifle is there in the picture in the first place and I highly doubt the safety is on. There's no defending it by any stretch of the imagination.

another...

They had barrels pointing in all directions...

The second Image Has Been Manipulated.If you look Carefully The angles of Eyesight are of 2 different Trajectories.Crowd/Police Suggesting that Photoshop has been used (or simular) To cut and join a foreground and background clip together.

The "Weapons" seen Here are Tear Gas Rifles and if fired at point 0 at a living being could prove fatal.That said One is usually trained to NEVER "Pump" a Teargas round into the chamber unless one is commited to Firing it right away.(Swedish and UK Police have helped arm and train the Police in Bangkok and nationally.Also Immigrations Police for bomb and drug detection at Airports)

Sondhi owns/presides over (manager.com)These days Digital technology makes it very difficult to rely upon the validity of a photograph.Video is still OK and Eyewitnesses are best.

I totally agree. I am a professional user of Photoshop, and these pictures are sola obviously manipulated - they haven't even bothered to resize the pixels of the gun properly in the second photograph, you can see the jagged edges of the larger pixels overlapping the background, and the following two, the guns are in sharp relief, ie 'selected' and pasted into another image. If it is one of Sondhi's graphic designers, I would have thought he might have considered the damage to his credibility in circulating these crude images when they're accusing the PPP aka Taksin of so many 'dirty tricks'.

tin foil hat time again....

Did Sondhi also manipulate Rueters?

It's about time this was put to bed as it has been flogged to death - who cares if he says, she says etc - the big question is and the only one worth considering IS - why were there armed police in among the protester anyway. Frightened of being hit with a hand bag or a hand clapper or someone speaking badly to them.

Edited August 30, 2008 by Artisi

[TAWP]

This is the jackpot question OMR. What is the purpose of democracy in THailand?

/.../

Is it to protect the nation against the abuses of non-democratic systems- systems which are ultimately not answerable to the population? Then yes, democracy probably is required.

Is it to reflect the principle that each member of the society shares an equal stake in the rights and responsibilities that go with citizenship? Probably democracy is needed.

Is it to ensure that either directly or through representatives each individual has an equal opportunity to shape the direction the nation takes? If so democracy is definitely needed.

No, democracy isn't needed for any of the above. There is in fact a hybrid-model that could be used. Of course elections would still be a part of the formula, but not in a way that permits the dictatorship of the majority to trample of the rights of the minority.

And one thing Thailand needs is a system where being a politician isn't a shield. Remove immunity for MPs!

Anyway, slightly off topic, better for a 'political theory' forum.

[plachon]

Samak was NOT elected. He was appointed buy the PPP which was elected. As far as being paid to vote, that is bullshit too. That is just another crutch that is being used by the People AGAINST Democracy. Some people here are just as disillusioned and the people who follow these anarchists.

Gary, personally think you should clarify that one with your missus a bit more...

Think Gary's missus has been seeing no evil, hearing no evil and speaking no evil when it comes to TRT/PPP and Samak's rise to power, which has rather brushed off on Gary who took her prognosis of a "clean" election at face value. The lad needs to get out a bit more round election time methinks. Or just read the Isaan Forum where there is regularly a rush of admissions from posters about how much their respective mias made from the last round of handouts at elections. Or maybe Loei is so far from such shenanigans, that the politicians are all white as the driven snow in that province?

[h90]

now 18.38: what is with Samak? Did he go to HM the King? Is he still there since 1 3/4 hours?

Any news somewhere?

[ando]

Technically maybe, but practically no.

Has she ever overuled one major policy decision from one of the many prime ministers who have served her ?

Yes but she did so at least once that I know of.... many years ago intervened in Australian (Commonwealth) Politics (Constitutional Crisis) and sacked the Premier Gough Whitlam!

There again just a rubber stamp for the Australian Governor General. But all the same, it was her signature that carried the act and for that she must bear responsibility. Ultimately , the Queen over rules everybody else in English politics, but in reality its just a farce as she has no real power except for the rubber stamp thing.

[ClaytonSeymour]

The difference being that in France the army is under the control of the president and answers to no one else.

I'm not sure this is different - the Thai army ultimately answers to the Thai head of state (which is the King, not the Prime Minister).

As does the British Army.

Let me ask you 2 questions : who decided to send british troops to Irak : Blair or the Queen ?

If the Queen had been against it, could she/would she have been able to stop him ? If she'd tried, may I suggest that the next letter she signed would have been her abdication. For all their faults - at least the English royalty know their 'place'.

Now you should see the big deiiference

[Samuian]

Technically maybe, but practically no.

Has she ever overuled one major policy decision from one of the many prime ministers who have served her ?

Yes but she did so at least once that I know of.... many years ago intervened in Australian (Commonwealth) Politics (Constitutional Crisis) and sacked the Premier Gough Whitlam!

There again just a rubber stamp for the Australian Governor General. But all the same, it was her signature that carried the act and for that she must bear responsibility. Ultimately , the Queen over rules everybody else in English politics, but in reality its just a farce as she has no real power except for the rubber stamp thing.

Didn't want to argue about the "rubber tamp" issue, but that she did...well doesn't really belong here - does it?

[h90]

from the nation:

Senior Democrat MPs visit protesters

Senior Democrat Party MPs visited protesters at Government House Saturday evening.

They included Trairong Suwankhiri, Alongkorn Pollabutr and Arkom Engchuan.

They reached the Government House at 6:13 pm.

The Nation

[Samuian]

Technically maybe, but practically no.

Has she ever overuled one major policy decision from one of the many prime ministers who have served her ?

Yes but she did so at least once that I know of.... many years ago intervened in Australian (Commonwealth) Politics (Constitutional Crisis) and sacked the Premier Gough Whitlam!

There again just a rubber stamp for the Australian Governor General. But all the same, it was her signature that carried the act and for that she must bear responsibility. Ultimately , the Queen over rules everybody else in English politics, but in reality its just a farce as she has no real power except for the rubber stamp thing.

Didn't want to argue about the "rubber stamp" issue, but that she did...well doesn't really belong here - does it?

[Gary A]

Samak was NOT elected. He was appointed buy the PPP which was elected. As far as being paid to vote, that is bullshit too. That is just another crutch that is being used by the People AGAINST Democracy. Some people here are just as disillusioned and the people who follow these anarchists.

Gary, personally think you should clarify that one with your missus a bit more...

My missus is a deluded anarchist who refuses to see the facts. She absolutely refuses to accept the fact that People AGAINST Democracy are another bunch of duped citizens who believe in their insane leaders.

ADDED - She was actually disappointed that she was offered nothing for her vote. I did ask her that if she had taken money if she would have voted for the person who paid her. She emphatically told me that she indeed would take the money but she would vote for whoever she wanted.

Edited August 30, 2008 by Gary A

[h90]

There is the rumor that the audience with HM the King is at 7pm and not at 5pm.

Anyone can confirm that?