AllanB

Not so sure about that, it does soak up grease to some extent, but cartridge filters are easy to clean, I can't remember the name of the fluid we used. I often found the sightglass was clean and then returned to a bit dirty on "run" and had to be switch to backwash again. Never ever managed it in anything like 2 minutes, used to get the kids to do it in the end, but they made me clean the plantroom, as and when. Anyway maybe with practice, it is possible.

With regards the planroom, a plantroom isn't required with a small compact cartridge filter and pump arrangement, just a discrete plastic box cover. It is an additional piece of equipment required to house all the bulky and untidy equipment, associated with a sand filter system. But it appears you are suggesting all this stuff is left out in the open, making the garden look like a rubbish dump.

I know Thai people have untidy gardens, with washing machines and old bikes all over the place, but I cannot live like that.

I have seen a dozen or so pools so far here in Thailand, half of which I would not use at all and only one I can remember being really clean, so I am sure standards are different here. They also seem to empty their pools here quite often, another indication of poor water quality management. The reason I raised the question in the first place.

Just had a thought, how do you degrease the sand?

At last some real facts, but I am not 100% convinced about the cleaning times or costs. I remember spending a lot of time getting the backwash finished on some occasions and even then wasn't sure it was clean, the pump often seemed to be working hard, costing me money, I suspect. The cartridge cleaning seemed a lot quicker and you could see when it was clean too, making everything more efficient.

Then the pump room had to be cleaned, had all sorts of critters living in there, horrible job, cobwebs in my hair and about 2 hours every month or so, the cartridge filter and pump just had a lid over the plyth, swept off in 10 seconds.

I am looking to buy a Wave, I had a bottom of the range 90cc for 2 1/2 years and nothing went wrong. I see nothing wrong with drum brakes and a kick start, not that I am a cheapskate, which I am, but have other reasons.

Drum brakes are less efficient in the wet, to me that is good, I fear a front wheel skid in the wet. Kick starting a small bike is easy and less to go wrong.

I would rather spend the extra on a good helmet...anyone know which is the coolest in this hot climate, the cheap ones are unbearable?

"I cannot fathom why any guy with enough clues to accumulate a reasonable nest egg, would not have the brains to keep it separate to any Thai union/marriage. There are so many cases similar to this, why dont the guys think with their brains.

I tend to agree with the post above...best step is not get married to start with. Play them at their own game.

Surely most guys now know, in the Thai dictionary "Love" is spelt M O N E Y"

The problem is that it takes a single minded person to accumulate wealth and with the mind on only one thing, life happens.

I have a lady here, one who I chased, not one who chased me, she is very dear to me and I really trust her, yet I keep my overseas finances as my own own business. If she would ever start asking me about them, I would become suspicious, since I draw ample funds to live on here.

When ever anyone approaches me and money is the subject, no matter where I am, I ask why?

There is nothing wrong with getting married, but keep you bloody mouth shut lads, woman here have a ton of secrets and most don't want us to learn Thai for that reason.

I assume that the daughter does not have access to his money, if so move it, if there is anything left.

Just because most people use sand filters doesn't mean it is right, most people thought the earth was flat. So we live and learn.

The reason I ask this question is because.....

1. I had a pool built in France where they supplied a sand filter, it was a real pain, the water never really felt clean. and backwashing was a real chore too. I had to build a plantroom for all the gear, which would not have been necessary with a cartridge filter system.

2. I had a pool in Australia with a cartridge filter, washed it out every week, which took 2-5 minutes and in two years never changed it, water was always sparkling clean.

3. A friend of mine lives in Queensland, has twin cartridge filters and does the same as I used to, he says all his friends have cartridge filters and most think sand filters are a joke.

I think this is another myth designed to mystify the public and increase servicing costs. Rather like cam belts on cars, but the public are now wise and manufacturers are switching back to chains.

Someone please convince me otherwise with some facts.

PS. PD...What University do you go to to get a Phd in swimming pools?

Can anyone explain to me why one would choose to use a sand filter, as opposed to a cartridge filter. Having read a lot of stuff on the web, the only answer seems to be cost, that they are cheaper to instal and maintain. One the other hand there are very many disadvantages that I can see.

Well the initial cost may be slightly cheaper, but after you have added that spaghetti juction valve and the extra pipework to match, they are much more expensive. A cartridge filter will last a couple of years, if kept clean (which is easy) so ongoing costs aren't much of an issue either, especially if consider labour in the equation.

So please you gurus out there???

Go back a few years and the answer would be the Merc, but now the build quality is terrible, they are a laughing stock ( ask the guys at Top Gear). I had a C class and that was just a peice of junk, got rid of it PDQ and bought a Saab 9-5 tid (fantastic). On the other hand BMW's have risen to the top fo the tree, I hate to admit it.

Bit like Toyota really (especially their small cheap cars), just rubbish...how the mighty fall.

Go for the Beama mate....did I say that out loud?

What a bunch of moaning old farts you guys are.

Is it costing you anything now? No

Is it hurting you to have someone smile at you? No

Would it hurt you to smile back? No, unless you have just had an abdominal operation.

Can't you find enough trouble in the world to complain about, without inventing it?

Chill out and enjoy something ....just for a change.

I think it's a great idea.......have any of you flown Aeroflot lately? If not I think you should, join the other poe faces.

First of all I don't like overflow pools, they fill up with dirt during the rainy season and they are complicated. I don't think they work in Thailand unless you have an acre of paving around them. We have one here in our village, they have someone dedicated to lokking after it and it is always dirty at this time of the year.

I am a great believer in simplicity, expensive tiles aren't a problem, should look nice and add no compiication.

With regards to Chinese mechanicals, I don't think that is a major issue, based on my experience with their hydraulic componants, but I may be wrong. People used to slag of Japanese stuff, then Taiwanese bikes and look what happened there.

Thanks for your comments, hope I am not too blunt.

Where are you? I would like to see it when you have finished it.

I am in Khonkaen and thanks for your interest, but I need some comments.

You know there is something about Thailand (probably other backward facing places too), everyone is scared of exchanging information, they think competition is bad. Don't they know competition is good, the better the product, the better the price, the more people will buy pools. In Australia and the US everyone has a pool. In Thailand no one has one, why becuase they are either crap, or overpriced, or both, so there is no manufacturing here.

We have a lovely climate here, I have a girlfriend with a body to die for and I can't go swimming with her. So I am getting unfit, fat and lazy like many Falngs here and I want to change things. So please let me have your comments, tell me I'm right, tell me I'm wrong, but why I am wrong too......

I don't believe this is difficult, I am sure there are a few out there who would like to make us think it is, in order to protect their buisness. But you don't protect your business by using scare tactics, you protect it by being good. The more pools there are, the more people will want one, so competition is good. It has happened with TV's, cars, computers, air tickets, burgers and Pepsi, it will happens with pools too. I have been in Engineering and marketing for 35 years.

There have been a lot of lookers and only one reply to this topic....add you two penneth.

Here is a question.

Why can't I use the blue water tubing sold here, is the chlorine problem or a pressure/vacuum prolem? I can't find any spec on it.

I dont want to be a troublemaker, just build simple swiiming pools, at the rate of just 2 or 3 a year.

I am worried about Thai people changing their minds and/or misinterpretting their requirments. For these reasons all my pools will be eaxactly the same, all 9m x 4m x 1.5m (filled to 1.3m) and all built in Khonkaen. The price will be low and will have a 3 yaer warranty, tied in with a service contract.

I am quite happy to exchange ideas with people doing the same in other towns and would appreciate comments on the following design details.

Preparation

Prepare dimensional drawing.

Sink 2 or 3 boreholes 1.8 metres, check ground conditions and water table.

Choose a spot and mark out 4 borders.

Dig hole using JCB, allowing 1 day.

Construction

The pool will be of concrete blocks 9m x 4m x 1.5deep (filled to 1.3m) 2/3rds in ground 1/3 out to prevent flood water vingress, maybe insects and other critters too.

12cm slab and filled cavity block walls, incorperating a full "basket" reinforced cage 12mm bar on 30cm matrix, should be strong enough to withsatnd 2psi water pressure.

Finished in flat pebbledash, I hate tiles, they are for toilets, they crack and fall off. This is fast and Thais are dam_n good at it, should flex with the pool too.

Single 40mm drain at one end of the pool, routed through slab and walls to avoid fracture should the pool move a millimetre, everything else at high level and sand burried.

No piles, plastic pools don't need them.

A 40mm vertical pipe in the centre of the slab running to a gravel sump, closed off with a simple tapered plug, my version of a hydrostatic valve when the pool is emptied, just take the plug out. If it has silted up, you will see and can give it a poke. Better still don't empty the pool.

Simple block built skimmer returning in 65mm pipe and t'd into common 65mm (maybe 80mm) return pipe. Should handle the 18m3/hr flow.

Pool backfilled with 20cm of gravel, containing 2 simple vent tubes, all to prevent pressure build up under the pool.

Pump, filtration and dosing

Pump and cartridge filter from Global all pre-mounted on a plith, 1.5hp Chinese pump delivering 300litres/min = total water movement in 3 hours. About right and a low cost set-up with 5 year warraty. No planroom needed, just a cover and easy access..

Supply pipe 40mm (maybe 65mm) on the borderline. Located at the other end, high level possibly out of the water, for good end to end water circulation, almost an "Endless Pool".

No automatic dosing system, everything done weekly, by hand. Automatic stuff means trouble and is expensive, training a guy to follow and fill in a checklist will take a day.

Electrical system

Waterproof enclosure mounted on the house wall containing:-

10amp trip switch isolator. aren't they cheap here?

24 hour timeswitch (Good quality Panasonic, with battery backup) who needs a plantroom?

Additional Equipmemt

Pool will be fitted with a sail type canopy, to keep water tempertures lower, reduce evaporation, keep the water slightly cleaner, reduce rain ingress and it means you can use the pool all day long.

Weekly Maintenance.

Clean the pool, filter and strainers, adjust water levels with a hosepipe, check and dose for chlorine and adjust ph levels. 100baht plus materials/other work.

Okay, I have read a ton of stuff on the subject and this is my design, with reasons why.

Preparation

Prepare dimensional drawing.

Sink borehole 1.8 metres, check water table.

Choose a spot and mark out 2 borders.

Dig hole using JCB, allowing 1 day.

Construction

The pool will be of concrete blocks 9m x 4m x 1.5deep (filled to 1.3m) 2/3rds in ground 1/3 out to prevent flood water vingress, maybe insects and other critters too.

12cm slab and filled cavity block walls, incorperating a full "basket" reinforced cage 9mm bar on 10cm matrix, should be strong enough to withsatnd 2psi water pressure.

Finished in flat pebbledash, I hate tiles, they are for toilets, they crack and fall off. This is fast and Thais are dam_n good at it, should flex with the pool too.

Single 40mm drain at one end of the pool, routed through slab and walls to avoid fracture should the pool move a millimetre, everything else at high level and sand burried.

No piles, plastic pools don't need them.

A 40mm vertical pipe in the centre of the slab running to a gravel sump, closed off with a simple tapered plug, my version of a hydrostatic valve when the pool is emptied, just take the plug out. If it has silted up, you will see and can give it a poke. Better still don't empty the pool.

Simple block built skimmer returning in 65mm pipe and t'd into common 65mm (maybe 80mm) return pipe. Should handle the 18m3/hr flow.

Pool backfilled with 20cm of gravel, containing 2 simple vent tubes, all to prevent pressure build up under the pool.

Pump, filtration and dosing

Pump and cartridge filter from Global all pre-mounted on a plith, 1.5hp Chinese pump delivering 300litres/min = total water movement in 3 hours. About right and a low cost set-up with 5 year warraty. No planroom needed, just a cover and easy access..

Supply pipe 40mm (maybe 65mm) on the borderline. Located at the other end, high level possibly out of the water, for good end to end water circulation, almost an "Endless Pool".

No automatic dosing system, everything done weekly, by hand. Automatic stuff means trouble and is expensive, training a guy to follow and fill in a checklist will take a day.

Electrical system

Waterproof enclosure mounted on the house wall containing:-

10amp trip switch isolator. aren't they cheap here?

24 hour timeswitch (Good quality Panasonic, with battery backup) who needs a plantroom?

Additional Equipmemt

Pool will be fitted with a sail type canopy, to keep water tempertures lower, reduce evaporation, keep the water slightly cleaner, reduce rain ingress and it means you can use the pool all day long.

Weekly Maintenance.

Clean the pool, filter and strainers, adjust water levels with a hosepipe, check and dose for chlorine and adjust ph levels. 100baht plus materials/other work.

Now I am sure there will be a lot of comments about this, I have cut it down to the bare bones, too much? KISS

Won't please the pool doctor.....

Yes, there does seem to be a lot of scaremongering in Thailand, for just about everything, so why when we leave the west is everything so difficult?

The answer I get is "the structure has be totally sound and very strong to withstand the huge mass of water 54 TONNES, in my case", cobblers! it is the pressure that matters and 2psi is bugga all, about the same as blowing up a ballon.

I know 3 guys in the UK who built there own pools, the newest of which was 4 years old and they all worked okay. One guy made a bit of a balls of the tiling and the pool was not perfectly square, oh and the wiring was a bit of a dog's dinner, but safe and the pool worked fine. Most of the pro built pools I have seen here would have come third, behind the two other non-pro UK efforts, one would have come 4th, behind the dogs dinner. As would the pool I had built in France by Desjoyeaux, what can I say.. maerd!! Pardon for the spelling, it was deliberate to get through the censor.

I have heard a lot of talk about the need for piles on a concrete pool and the only reason I can find for this, apart from follow the leader, is that when you empty the pool you don't need a hydrostatic valve, nor backfill with gravel. Fibreglass pools don't need them, can't have them, so why do concrete? And why do Thais keep emptying their pools anyway, is this like cambelts, just a roose to charge money for nothing, keep the dam_n thing clean, surely?

But the main thing that gets me is the prices, how can a pool cost the same as a house build, it doesn't anywhere else in the world it cost about 20%, or less? Follow the leader again.

Someone made a comment about Chinese pumps, well our oriental friends are getting pretty good at it now, as with everything else and most large companies build their posh labeled stuff in China now, heven't you heard? The one I am planning on using comes with a 5 year warranty at a 1/4 the price of a Danfoss, or 10% of a Desjoyeaux. I had been using Chinese hydraulic pumps and motors in the UK for 5 years and had the same amount of failures as the US and Danish made pumps, none. It is not exactly a crucial piece of equipment either, mounted in an inaccessible location, you simply unbolt it and chuck it in the back of a puckup.

I have floated my ideas around a bit and read a lot on these forums, learned a lot too, especially about pool care, but no one has mentioned pool canopies. I went for a swim at the Khon Kaen University pool a few months ago and it nearly killed me, I guess the water was around 40c, maybe more and it took my breath away when I dived in, horrible. My calculation is, that you could drop this by 10c with a simple sail shade and not only make the swim much nicer, but the water safer, as chlorine doesn't work at this temperature and use the pool during the day, when you want to. Reduce costs too, with less evaporation and less chemicals.

So who could make me up a polyester sail or two, need the check out the UV resistance of the cloth first, but don't want to import one.?

Many thanks to the positive guys.

One final question, can someone tell me waht a sand filter is for, apart from filling up your plantroom. or building a plantroom in the first place?

Is nothing sacred? What if Kwanchai had another Big Mac attack, he could have been killed. Stop with the bombs we all deserve a break today!

That will teach you to eat MacCrap LOL

Yes, every cloud has a silver lining.......... I'm lovin it!!!

Pretty good what you can do with an SMS message all the way from Montenegro. "Dial a kidnapper" ...he's in the book. Taksin is a sly old fox, just give the poor man his money back.

Yes, I am interested in a pool, but I live in Khon Kaen. I may also be interested in getting involved, as there is very little sensible competition here. Pools available here are more expensive than in France which is ridiculous, given the difference in labour rates and the guys selling them know nothing. For a small pool I was quote 1 million Baht, which is more than my house cost to build.

I am a qualified mechanical engineer and have had my own engineering business in the UK for the past 20 years, I also have 14 years experience in control systems, which will help.

This is not rocket science, it is a hole in the ground with a few rudimentary mechanical components all available from China.

If you are interested email me on [email protected] Allan