AjarnPasa

Well, one of the most (only) efficient systems in Bangkok was sure to eventually attract the attention of Thailand's government. The BTS is a standard BOT mega-project in a developing country, and a successful one at that. Corruption in Thailand is an increasingly dire issue (I don't say problem because in Thailand, corruption is fundamentally how business is done, and the entire concept as a moral "negative" needs to be analyzed in amorally to be understood by Westerners who have been trained to think of it as automatically wrong). What Thais have failed to recognize is that this distorts economics, society, politics, everything. It cannot be perpetuated indefinitely without protracting Thailand's development indefinitely. Especially as other Southeast Asian countries show a greater predilection for law, order, and stability. Thailand will simply fail to attract those with a regional or global focus as opposed to a local one.

Come again? Are you being deliberately ambiguous in your post so to avoid chastising?

Corruption IS a problem in Thailand. It's a problem anywhere in the world and that's a fact. Will me or other non amoral 'Westerners' (excuse me, but I don't know the correct prefix for amoral - if there even is one) change this with our opinions? Probably not. It's domestic matter which is no business of mine. Maybe this is your point?

Again, your post is about as clear as mud. My opinion of course.

I don't think he is being unclear, or unreasonable. He points out that corruption is a business model, and that Thailand has functioned under it for centuries. What he also says is that other countries don't use at as their preferred business model because they feel, based on their cultural norms, that it is not a very good model.

So if Thailand wishes to be taken seriously and to play any significant role in regional or global economics then it needs to reassess whether it wants to retain the corruption model.

Personally I think Thailand becomes less relevant daily as a regional player because it chooses to be corrupt, and therefore stays still while others move away with the way they do business. But if Thailand doesn't care about that then that's up to it.

Oh, I see. The reason Thailand is developing and will be developing for the foreseeable future is because of corruption. And other countries don't use corruption as a business model because it's perceived as immoral. Not because it's backwards. That's PC gone mad.

I've learnt two things here; corruption is immoral (Western conjecture?), and Thailand is developing because of corruption.

No need for Sherlock Holmes then. Just someone who can write in layman's terms. Even if it is drivel.

You've completely missed the point.

Nowhere do either of us say that Thailand is developing. Nowhere do either of us say that it is moral (for a given value of moral). In fact, in my case, I state precisely the opposite when I say that I believe that Thailand becomes less relevant daily because it choses to enable corrupt practice. The corrupt model is counter productive if Thailand wants to be a regional player. However it still 'works' in Thailand at a local level. Is is just? No. Is it fair? No. Does it drive the country forward? No. Can Thailand exist in a ridiculous and protectionist dysfunctional way while engaging in corruption? Yes. Does it suck from my western point of view? Yes!

If you wish to wage a campaign of anti corruption in Thailand then more power to your elbow. I salute you. But when only 14% of respondents to that recent Suan Dusit poll say they are bothered by corruption then clearly, from a domestic point of view you won't be finding much support.

No worries...

The word for 'just' in that last sense would be เพิ่ง. While 'just' in English covers both meanings, you need different words in Thai แค่ = just as in only; เพ่ง = just as in a moment ago. So: ผู้ชายขเพิ่งโมยเงิน

For more on เลย and สิ have a look here http://www.thai2english.com/dictionary/1397063.html and here http://www.thai2english.com/dictionary/1407934.html

I get the feeling, and I'm going on observation rather than any hard knowledge here, that tones and vowel length do change with emphasis but that it doesn't matter too much as context clarifies any potential misunderstanding. Consider the use of ม้ัย in spoken Thai in place of the written ไหม. My guess is that this spelling came about to represent a colloquial change in pronunciation, rather than the other way around. More on colloquial spellings here http://www.thai-language.com/id/142459

Yes, in short, emphasis does exist in Thai. But I get the point you're making. Emphasis in English is generally created with a falling tone (and incidentally this very fact puts the lie to the idea held by some that speakers of non-tonal languages can't hear tones), and so to emphasise in the same way could change the meaning of the word being emphasised.

One of the ways this is dealt with this is the use of emphasis auxiliaries or intensifiers such as เลย and สิ

The other way to make this clear is through correct syntax. In English we can be sloppier with our syntax while speaking because the emphasis helps clarify what we mean.

I get the impression (and I am happy to be corrected here) that spoken Thai relies more heavily than English on correct syntax to ensure clarity. Much as your examples, as written, require explanation because the syntax is not correct for a written text in the first and third examples.

I would render each as follows:

Just the man stole the money. แค่ผู้ชายที่ขโมยเงิน

The man just stole the money. ผู้ชายแค่ขโมยเงินเลย *

and

The man stole just the money. ผู้ชายขโมยแค่เงิน

* Even though this is syntactically correct it still has me wondering whether the man just up and stole the money, the cheek blighter without so much as a by your leave, or whether he only came by the money through theft and did not legally acquire any part of it.

Anyway, that was a very roundabout way of saying that emphasis exists in Thai but syntax is important too :-P

Older Post articles appear not to be stored online.

If you search "TOO MUCH FETMOT AND YOU'RE DET-SA- MOLE-AY" you'll see a link to the article, but this re-directs to the Post's search page.

Andrew Biggs' blog appears to be dead too, so sorry, can't help further than that.

It has a very strange provenance

"When the the moon hits your eye like a big pizza pie - dets-a-mo-lay"

It's nonsense. Someone heard the word 'dead' in "That's amore" and a new idiom was born.

Andrew Biggs wrote an article about it in The Post years ago. Of course I can't post the link here, but if you search for "Too Much Fet Mot and you're Det-sa-molay" you might find it.

Yes, in mee khai the noun is implied or has already been stated earlier in the exchange.

I learned the rules for mid class first which was pretty straightforward with a little drilling with Anki.

Then I did the high class which, having nailed mid class, was really easy because they are exactly the same, with the exceptions that live syllable with no tone mark is rising not mid tone. Also simplified further by the fact that high class never uses the third and fourth tone marks (and neither do low class for that matter).

Low class took a little longer because there are a few more permutations to the rules. But, given that by that time I barely had to think about applying the tone rules for mid and high having drilled and internalized them with Anki, it just meant sticking at it until they clicked.

Keep at it, it'll come.

Nearly 24 hours and no views and no comments. Says it all about Android?

Ha ha .. yes, Fox and George, apparently.

Could all this Thai be making me forget my English ?

My SO, who used to work in hospitality, says there is special phonetic alphabet used by hotels and travel agents and the like which seems to be the one you are referring to. Apparently the airlines use the more familiar (to us) alpha, bravo, charlie etc. but it's able, baker ... etc. for stuff internally. She also says that the international phonetic alphabet for hotels is different to the one she learnt for use in Thailand. Though who knows, maybe each country has its own version.

As far as she can remember the version she learnt is as follows:

able, baker, charlie, dog, easy, how, item, jamie, king, love, mike, nan, oboe, peter, queen, roger, single, tare, uncle, victor, william, X-ray, york, zebra

Gigabytes

นี้มีกี่กิ่ก = this has how many gig(abytes)

Panic over ;-)

Cheers, must brush up on my Isaan

No he meant เปล่า but when spoken it's usually said like เป่า or ป่าว

Mind you, it'd carry pretty much the same meaning if it was ถูกบ่ wouldn't it?

I think I'd translate this as "How did he come to be wrongfully arrested?"

... or perhaps 'mistakenly' arrested to reflect the 'ผิดตัว' bit? Not much in it, perhaps.

I agree, possible that 'wrongful arrest' is a more 'technical/legal' term. I suppose context would help sort that one out.

Just to add a few comments:

(2)Tense is signified by auxiliary words, commonly ja (will) yoo (at present) and leaw (already).

So, ja bpai = will go, bpai yoo = going, bpai leaw = go already

There are other auxiliaries, but these are good ones to get your head around first.

dton or dton tee is another way to talk about a place in time: dton tee pom bpai tieow Phuket (when I went to Phuket).

(4) 'ao maa' is closer to 'bring' than to 'take' (proong nee ja ao maa hai - tomorrow I will bring it for you [lit. tomorrow will bring (and) give]). Ao bpai would be 'take'. e.g. ao torasaap pbai - take a telephone. The key is in the bpai (go) and maa (come). So ao bpai is literally like saying "take go" and ao maa is like saying 'take come'. From that you can work out the take/bring association. It will depend on the time and position of the speaker and context. Some examples:

I will take my shirt: ja ao sueah shirt bpai.

I will bring my shirt: ja ao sueah shirt maa.

I have brought my shirt: ao sueah shirt maa (laeow).

I am (at this moment) taking my shirt: ao sueah shirt bpai yoo

(5) the question of where are you from: you might be hearing khun pben khon prathet arai (lit. you are a person of which country?) or, less common, khun pben khon chart/san-chart arai (lit. you are a person of what nationality?)

(6) 'man' just means 'it' and, as in English, you wouldn't really call someone 'it'. Although in actual fact (when not being used intentionally derogatorily) 'man' is used in casual conversation among friends - not nearly as much though as goo and mueng, which, particularly for teenagers, passes perfectly adequately for 'me' and 'you' without being rude. They are just too informal to use in polite conversation and can send the more 'proper' members of society into an apoplexy if heard in close proximity to 'the public' (regardless of whether they use them themselves when behind closed doors). Like much of this, the social minefield is such that it makes sense to stay away from them unless you are really confident that you can use them correctly.

The only way you can really know is by being around the language and listening really carefully to how people speak to each other. Books on the subject are destined to fail in adequately explaining the subtleties.

As for learning the language, your best teachers are the people you speak to every day, but getting someone knowledgeable about the fine tuning of the language is a useful tool. Google learnthaifromawhiteguy he's pretty good.

Brilliant!

I think I'd translate this as "How did he come to be wrongfully arrested?"

As far as I am aware it's not against the rules to place a link to your website in your Thai Visa profile, then direct people who are interested in helping/beta testing/etc to there.

Please do, because I'd like to have a look, and can't seem to find the url on this topic

I used it and liked it. The lack of any translation is a positive - it means you learn the language by associating an image with a sound, pretty much the same way as you do with your first language, and you don't get hung up on trying to make literal sense of grammar and syntax which follow different rules to that of English. You'll need someone to help you learn the alphabet and reading rules though to make the best of the script.

Good luck with it.

The lump goes on the windscreen immediately behind the rearview mirror - and stays there, except in system snafus (see below).

You drive through the easy pass lane, leaving 5 metres between the rear of the car in front and your car. Don't keep the lump in your handbag and wave it out of the window as you reach the toll booth. Not only will it signal to everyone who is watching that you are a tight-wad who, presumably able to buy numerous cars, is too stingy to splash out on more than one easy pass between them, but will also be too late as you will have passed the sensor by then. You will then have to hold up the line of cars behind you for an interminable length of time while the dude in the box sorts out the mess you have just made, thus rendering the easy pass lane utterly counterproductive for all the people in line behind you!

The card is used when you want to top up the your credit. You can do this at a couple of high street bank chains. Alternatively, while driving, pass through the 'Cash/Top Up' lane where you hand over the cash and your card and wait while you're topped up. You are sometimes asked to pay the toll as well. For example if you hand over 1000 baht they credit your EasyPass with 1000 baht, but then you need to pay the toll for the crossing that you are making. Sometimes they credit your card with 955 and keep the 45 for the current crossing, or whatever. Don't try doing this in the easy pass lane. See previous answer

Sometimes, through no fault of your own (i.e. not waving your pass out the window, not leaving it in your handbag, not driving too close to the car in front, and not not having any credit left) the system malfunctions and you will have to hand over the lump to the toll booth dude. He does some magic on it and you're good to go. But you have held up the easy pass lane and now everyone behind you is irked because they think you did it on purpose.

An LED display tells you how much the current crossing has just cost you and shows you the balance of your credit. This, being the Fisher-Price-cheapest-option-toll-road-automation-system, is sometimes wrong - keep your receipts.

And finally, don't forget to wonder why the heck you ever bothered with Easy Pass at all as you sit 20 cars deep in the single easy pass lane, waiting for the person at the front to fish their easy pass out of their handbag, watching cars whizz by your left and right in the normal lanes just to see them cut in at the head of the queue.

Oh, and don't try to use it on any toll roads that are not operated by EXAT.

I guess you could but it might look a little disjointed e.g. an english equivalent might look something like

Pick up and drop

off point No

parking

if you get what I mean.

Best thing to do would be to print it both ways and ask the condo manager to say which he thinks is most clear.

จุดรับส่งผู้พิการ

ห้ามจอด

This means:

Pick Up/Drop Off point for disabled persons

No Parking

Hope it helps

Exhaustive http://www.f0nt.com/

OK, this is a total guess but it kind of makes sense:

ซ่า (zaa) means fizzy, as in coke or sprite. It is also used to mean naughty/cheeky. You'll find it listed in Longdo as 'show off'.

Now, far be it from me to get into gross stereotyping, but I can think of at least a handful of gay friends of mine for whom any of the above would be a fitting simile ... and I don't think they'd mind me making that connection.

A non-gay friend, who is certainly a bit of a bubbly character, calls herself Toonzaa on her fb profile. So I guess it could well be used for people happy to present themselves as effervescent.