Leelas

Comparing foreigners in Thailand (and their critics) to new immigrants to the US / UK / EU (and their critics) is inherently fallacious.

Immigrants to the developed western nations are, most often, not there by choice. They're there out of pressing necessity, be it economic necessity (they can't make enough money to live in their home country) or something more pressing still (refugees).

By contrast, western foreigners in Thailand are almost universally here by choice, unless you consider that Pirate Bay guy they arrested last week in Cambodia a refugee.

An Iraqi immigrant in the US or UK has no home to return to, so it's in very bad taste to tell them to go home... especially seeing that it was the US and the UK that got them into the mess they're in in the first place. By contrast, a Brit or American in Thailand can go home any time they want... but then they'd have to say goodbye to Soi Cowboy.

Get the difference?

I don't know why this is so difficult to understand...

There is no double pricing in Thailand based on nationality. There is double pricing based on residence.

For the personal example, I have held three types of visas to Thailand - a tourist visa, a non-B, and a non-ED visa. With my non-B visa I would show my tax ID card and pay the Thai rate at any national park, or other government-run attraction (museums, the Grand Palace, and such). With the non-ED visa, I can show my student ID card, and it's the same. I've gone to museums and parks all over the country and have never had a single problem.

The only problem you may have is if you're here long term and are still on a tourist visa. In which case, the solution for those who hate the double pricing is simple - get off the tourist visa. Surely you have a legitimate reason to be here. Get a non-O, non-B, non-ED, whatever you qualify for... then you'll have a means of not paying the farang price. Until then, som nam na.

Doesn't work. i have a non-O and even a stamp in my passport that my residence is Bangkok.

Always have to pay farang price.

Show a Thai drivers license, work permit, or tax card and it will work nearly 100% of the time at national parks, the aquarium at Siam Paragon, and most other places. It will NOT work at the Grand Palace, Lumpinee Boxing Stadium, etc.

For the record, my student ID (from a major Thai university) gets me into the Grand Palace for free every time I have family and friends in town.

Maybe this is an issue of the student price, though, not the taxpayer price.

Farang is not a racist word, and there is nothing racist or unusual about asking people who don't pay taxes to pay extra for access to taxpayer funded attractions.

Anyone who thinks Thai people are racist should go back to their comfy European or North American homeland and compare the way their neighbors treat people of color to the way they are treated in Thailand. I can guarantee you, Thai people are among the least racist people in the world.

Thats funny.

If I were as racist in the UK as most Thais are in Thailand, I would have spent most of my life in a UK jail.

How many times have I listened to a Thai person call an Issan person ugly because they have dark skin.

How many times have I listened to a Thai person call hilltribe people thieves, not proper Thai, etc.

Racism between Thai people and Isaan/hilltribes/etc. is none of our business and as the world's dominant race we don't have a right to comment on it.

Thai people have every reason to completely despise white foreigners, considering how pig-headed and entitled most of us act in this country. The fact that they don't indicates a degree of forgiveness and tolerance unheard of in most parts of the world.

But what has it got to do with race? It's based on citizenship/residency, not race.

At the door, Asians cheap rate, Caucasians expensive rate.

That seems like charging by race to me.

When they ask everyone to show official nationality ID to get the cheap rate, I'll be happy with dual pricing.

I have never seen this occur nor heard of it occurring. All the Koreans and Japanese have to wait in the farang line at the Grand Palace, every time. Have you actually witnessed this? On more than one occasion? Or, is this just something you read on the internet?

Farang is not a racist word, and there is nothing racist or unusual about asking people who don't pay taxes to pay extra for access to taxpayer funded attractions.

Anyone who thinks Thai people are racist should go back to their comfy European or North American homeland and compare the way their neighbors treat people of color to the way they are treated in Thailand. I can guarantee you, Thai people are among the least racist people in the world.

This leads to another question. Do farang residents have to pay extra on the trains? When my Thai gf traveled for free the other day I had to pay for a ticket and the guard/ticket man wrote 'farang' on the ticket.

It depends on the line. A lot of the local trains in central Thailand allow Thai people to ride for free. I reckon it's the same as with the parks, though, and all other government services - if you have a Thai-issued ID card, you can probably ride for free as well.

I don't know why this is so difficult to understand...

There is no double pricing in Thailand based on nationality. There is double pricing based on residence.

For the personal example, I have held three types of visas to Thailand - a tourist visa, a non-B, and a non-ED visa. With my non-B visa I would show my tax ID card and pay the Thai rate at any national park, or other government-run attraction (museums, the Grand Palace, and such). With the non-ED visa, I can show my student ID card, and it's the same. I've gone to museums and parks all over the country and have never had a single problem.

The only problem you may have is if you're here long term and are still on a tourist visa. In which case, the solution for those who hate the double pricing is simple - get off the tourist visa. Surely you have a legitimate reason to be here. Get a non-O, non-B, non-ED, whatever you qualify for... then you'll have a means of not paying the farang price. Until then, som nam na.

I once visited a museum and the prices were listed as Thai and tourist. I said I wasn't a tourist and could prove it. They said it didn't matter because I was a farang, so I would have to pay the tourist price. So doesn't work everywhere.

I'm not saying it never happens, just that it's not government policy, and that it doesn't happen often. I'd say the odds are very low if you really aren't a tourist, and reduced to just about nothing if you can speak enough Thai to argue about it, or if you have a Thai friend with you who's willing to argue on your behalf. You also have to have your ID in hand and ready to show them. The only times I've ever paid the tourist price were when I left my ID at home.

Of course, I think buying your tickets through 7-11 will remove that problem entirely.

...leads to thousands not even bothering to go to the parks because they have read about the dual pricing on the internet.

Considering how in touch with the reality on the ground a lot of the posters on this thread seem to be, I'd say you're spot-on there.

I don't know why this is so difficult to understand...

There is no double pricing in Thailand based on nationality. There is double pricing based on residence.

For the personal example, I have held three types of visas to Thailand - a tourist visa, a non-B, and a non-ED visa. With my non-B visa I would show my tax ID card and pay the Thai rate at any national park, or other government-run attraction (museums, the Grand Palace, and such). With the non-ED visa, I can show my student ID card, and it's the same. I've gone to museums and parks all over the country and have never had a single problem.

The only problem you may have is if you're here long term and are still on a tourist visa. In which case, the solution for those who hate the double pricing is simple - get off the tourist visa. Surely you have a legitimate reason to be here. Get a non-O, non-B, non-ED, whatever you qualify for... then you'll have a means of not paying the farang price. Until then, som nam na.

For something different and awesome, Pala Pizza Romana near BTS Asoke. Authentic Roman-style pizza al taglio. Makes an absolutely kickass afternoon snack for anyone who lives, works, or commutes in the area.

I'm a born and raised Washingtonian and a proud supporter of Seattle Sounders FC. This is a wonderful time to be a Sounders fan, as we look forward to our fourth consecutive year in the playoffs (sucks about the open cup though...).

It's also lonely, however... with an ocean between Bangkok and CenturyLink Field, there's nobody to share the joy with. And with the playoffs just around the corner, that's quite unfortunate.

I'm not sure about the feasibility of finding a place to watch the Sounders live together, but if anyone's interested, we can see about doing just that, especially for the Cascadia Cup match vs. Portland on the 15th of next month, and for our inevitable appearance in the playoffs.

If it all works out, it can resume next season.

So, any other Sounders fans here in Bangkok? Any fans of other Seattle teams? Other Cascadian teams? Even Portland fans are welcome.

This seems to be happening in Pattaya every week... some drugged up farang goes haywire and murders someone over a trivial perceived offense.

Keep it classy Pattaya.

DLock,

Out of curiosity, did you try playing with a towel shoved in the bell? A quick google search identified this as a possible solution (#3 at http://www.bestsaxophonewebsiteever.com/9-tips-for-practicing-saxophone-without-getting-shot-by-your-neighbors/). How did that work? Or are we on some sort of a watch list, and even playing recorded music at too loud a volume is likely to get another complaint?

I am also fortunate enough to have a car to practice in, so that's another option if the towel won't soften the horn down enough.

Of course, it's #1 on the above link - talk to the neighbors - that was the original reason I posted this. As nice as it would be to get to know my neighbors better, I suspect an unsolicited knock from the neighborhood farang would be almost as offensive as the practicing itself. The mere suggestion sent my significant other into full-on "phuat hua" mode, though she was fine complaining about the complaint up until that point. Although she wouldn't elaborate on any cultural problems with that, I suspect that it would not be well recieved, judging by her reaction.

That's what I originally posted this topic for, although if any other musicians can give me tips on how to keep up your chops and not get evicted, that would be much appreciated as well.

Also, SC - I practice for 30 minutes to an hour a day, never play the clarinet after 9, never play the sax after 8. As I said, I've been playing exclusively clarinet for the last month, as the sax has been at the shop for a long time, and didn't get any complaints.

Hi all! Not sure where to put this, because I don't see a music forum, but music is my hobby, so for now, it goes here.

I moved into my current condo 5 months ago, and about a month and a half ago, I came back from the US with a saxophone and a clarinet. I've been practicing the clarinet every night for the last month - prior to that, I practiced the saxophone every night for the two weeks after I got back, then sent it to the shop for repairs which were finished today. Until today, I didn't get a single complaint.

Anyway, long story short, yeah, I got a complaint. I got home today, and I was so excited to bust out my saxophone after an entire month that I didn't wait until my normal practice time (which is any time between 4 and 9 usually) and just started playing at 2:30 PM. It took about 10 minutes for a security guard to come to my door and tell me to shut the hell up.

Now, it baffles me as to why they chose to complain now - the saxophone's louder than the clarinet, sure, but the clarinet's still loud. Maybe the neighbors didn't like the sound as much, maybe a particularly irritable neighbor was home right now who goes to work later in the day, or maybe this was the last straw after a month and a half of pent up annoyance. Maybe if I just attempt to play softer, the irritated neighbor will be fine with it.

If this were the US, I'd just go knock on some doors, politely ask if I'm bothering, and if so, ask what time people will be away at work or school, so that I can schedule my practice accordingly. However, I'm not sure if unsolicited knocking is acceptable here in Thailand...

Thoughts?

Tanin is known to historians of Thailand as the most extreme right wing Prime Minister in Thai history, a guy who oversaw the summary executions of anyone suspected of having communist sympathies. In short, a fascist.

Okay, so suppose that's the case, if I attempt to leave the country, would they be able to tell I'm not working anymore? Seeing as one surrender's one's work permit when one finishes their job, how can they leave the country without immigration assuming overstay?

I'm a USA national, and I'm 26 years old. I've been teaching English here for a year and a half about, and recently I decided to go back to school. I started studying a month ago, and I haven't been working since then.

My visa is currently a non-immigrant B visa. I'm wondering - do I really need to change it to an ED visa? How illegal is it to study on a B visa? Assuming this is all completely illegal and I'll be in deep water if anyone finds out, my B visa is valid for at least another year - would it be possible for me to leave the country and get an ED or tourist visa in, say, Singapore or Vientiane? What are your thoughts on this?

I'm a fan of major league soccer and I'm wondering if anyone knows where to watch it in Bangkok. I know, the American league really isn't the most popular, but as a football-loving American, I must get my fix somehow. Can anyone help?