TimTang

This may be a little OT but since you're on the forum I would like to utilize your expertise in banking while I can.

I'm wondering if you can explain the logic behind the governments restriction on paying interest to the bank accounts of foreigners.

This seems to me like a disastrously stupid financial decision. Imagine how many rich foreign retirees and business people that maintain the absolute minimum of savings and investments in the country due to this practice.

In most countries this would be considered discrimination. Isn't the main purpose of a bank to attract as much money as they possibly can regardless of the source? How does this help?

Just curious!

Ian

Hi Ian,

I posted earlier that I had applied for online banking but never received one of the two necessary items to log in. I can't remember if it was the ID or the password.

Someone mentioned that you can do this on the ATM.

Is this true? and if so how do I do it, or where do I find the instructions to do so?

Thanks in advance for any assistance you can provide.

You had a permission to stay transferred into a new passport (the time remaining on your stay) - not a visa I suspect. Only the information from the original visa would be entered - it could not be used for entry into Thailand (which is what a visa is for). A lost passport replacement would get the same type entry.

Yeah that seems about right. The visa transfer takes up a full page but is not really a visa. the original visa actually expired about 5 years ago, but I'm still extending that visa every year, even though it's not physically in my passport.

So if someone has their passport stolen what do they actually bring to the airport when they leave the country? I'm just curious; I hope it never happens to me.

With an extension of stay in their new passport I suspect they would have to re-issue a new TM6 as well.

All passports are scanned and entries added to the entry-database. Notice the machine-readable text at the bottom of your passports main page?

Canadian passports issued at the Bangkok Canadian Consulate are not machine readable. It even says at the bottom of the first page "this passport is not machine readable". I've never understood WHY!

You never get a visa entered into a new passport and immigration has a record of every entry/exit and do not need a passport to see it. The passport itself is read and computer record made and the entry/exit card is a permeate record and it is also entered in computer records. The time saving comes with knowing the exact date and place of entry if prior to computer records as it may save looking in a lot of boxes.

Disregarding the Korean guy all together, what would immigration put into your new passport in the event that your passport was stolen.

A few years ago I had my visa Non-O transfered from one passport to another, because my passport had less than 6 months remaining before it expired. I've never lost or had my passport stolen so I don't have any first hand knowledge of the procedures involved.

I know the computerization of immigration has improved over the years but I'm not sure how accurate or how far back their records go. 20 years may be a little iffy.

...he thinks all he has to do is show up at the airport, buy a ticket and go home. Even with my limited knowledge of the immigration service, i kind of think he's in for a rude awakening...

If I were him I'd try doing a border run first, like the two guys in my previous post. It might be easier than doing it at the airport. Then he'd be able to leave the airport on a 1 month tourist visa complete with his TM6 departure card. No one would even blink and eye.

Here's a hypothetical situation:

Suppose your passport was stolen. what would you do?

First you file a report to the police that your passport has been stolen.

Then you take the police report to your embassy and get a new passport.

Next you go to immigration with your new passport and the police report and ask for a new tourist visa similar to the one you get on entry to the country.

If there are no records of this Korean guy for the last 20 years, how would they know if he entered 20 years ago or 2 weeks ago?

If his passport was supposedly stolen there would be no record of his immigration status. His name wouldn't even be recorded in any computer system.

I remember on one of my border runs there were two guys on the bus that were overstayed for 5 and 7 years. They happily went to the overstay office paid the 20 grand and on our returned they both got a 1 month tourist visa.

I remember thinking WOW, over the years I've stayed here, I've probably paid hundreds of thousands of baht to remain here legitimately. Visa fees, legal fees, motorcycles, taxis, buses, trains, planes, hours of wasted time; if you add that all up it gets pretty expensive.

Yet these guys just plop down 20 grand and viola there clean again. This happened a couple years ago, so I don't know if it's still that easy.

...For me internet banking is set up with a user name emailed and a password sent via thai mail system. I have never received my password via the mail...

...None seemed to know about opening a online account via ATM...

This is exactly the same thing that happened to me. I received my user name but never received the password. I waited for months until I eventually just lost interest.

I never heard anything about opening a online account via ATM. Maybe I should try that. Does anyone know how it's done?

I could probably go back to the bank and repeat the entire process but it will probably take months again, with no guarantee that it will ever work.

I've had a Bangkok Bank account for about 12 years and apart from this online banking fiasco I've been quite happy with they're service.

when the slice of processed cheese is actually THICKER than the meat paddy, can you still legally call it a hamburger?

Could be the skyrocketing price of beef here.

You mean to say they actually use BEEF?

If they are using beef it must include leather, fur, lips and ar$eholes because it doesn't take like beef to me.

This maybe a little OT but I think I would be performing a public service for those who might make the same mistake as me.

I was walking through fortune town the other day and while passing the McDonald's I noticed they were promoting a Triple Cheeseburger.

I haven't eaten at a McDonald's for ages but I hadn't eaten all day and the burger looked delicious in the poster.

I ordered a meal set and when they brought the wrapped burger it was about 1/2 and inch thick. I asked, are you sure that's a triple burger; she said yes. When I sat down I opened the wrapper and sure enough there were actually three patties.

I can remember in the early 70's when the very first McDonald's opened in my home town. The Big Mac came in a cardboard box and when you open it the burger had a cardboard ring around it to keep it from falling over. You actually had to squeeze it just to take a bite.

Obviously things have changes a lot at McDonald's over the years. I'm just curious; when the slice of processed cheese is actually THICKER than the meat paddy, can you still legally call it a hamburger?

Best seller at McDonald's China

That reminds me of an experience I had in Phuket a few years ago. It was after midnight and I was heading back to the hotel to crash. I passed by a street vendor with a huge wok, deep frying chicken. It smelled great so I glanced into the wok an thought "great! drumsticks", so I ordered 4.

When I got back to my room I could hardly wait to chow down one of those delicious drumsticks. I grabbed one from the bag and it nearly scared the $hit out of me. I was staring eye to eye with a chicken; beak wide open and with the appearance that it had experienced a horrifying death.

Needless to say I ended up throwing them out. I don't know who eats those things and I wouldn't even know where to start or what parts are actually edible. Now I'm much more careful to make sure I know exactly what I'm buying from a street vendor.

I think it's easy to understand the spirit of the law here: don't do anything that can take a job away from a Thai. Moreover, if what you are doing results in money being made from another country but being spent here, all the better.

Kudos! Well Said, I agree with everything you've presented.

Good story....what do you think would have happened if messers Vinai and Vichai had not turned up with the cash ?

We probably would have spent more time in jail, then kicked out of the country. One of the architects was Robert Browning. About 3 buildings on the Hong Kong harbour are his creations, so I think he would have been able to pull a few strings.

The Australian form-work guys were intoducing Slip-Form to Thailand, which at that time was a new technology, so they probably had a few strings to pull as well. The reality was they evetually just decided to leave us alone until the buildings were finished.

That's the development currently on Sukumvit Soi 26. The four sky-scrapers on the corner were actually supposed to be the four NASA space shuttles and each building was named as such. Then they realized that people might avoid buying in the building named after the one that exploded, thinking it would be unlucky, so they renamed all the buildings. But if you look on google-earth from above they still are shaped like space shuttles.

Let me tell my story. First I would like to qualify that I do not condone or recommend any one follow my example because things have changed drastically over the years.

Prior to my pension I worked in Thailand for 15 years and never, ever had a work permit. I did not elect to work without a work permit, the companies I worked for just thought it was a waste of energy, time, and money to do so. I was faced with a choice: I could work without a work permit and feed and support my family, or I could leave and abandon them. Naturally I chose the former.

My first job was in 1992 with President Park. I worked in the Architectural department with about 20 other falangs. None of them had work permits. There was also a team of form-work specialists from Australia, they didn't have work permits either. During the 8 months I worked there we were raided by immigration twice. Each time the entire office was loaded in a paddy wagons and hauled to jail for about 4 hours.

Then Vinai and Vichai (at the time the 3rd and 4th richest men in Thailand) arrived with a briefcase full of money. The next day we were all back to work again - no work permits.

Many companies simply refuse to provide work permits. The key is to be discreet if you are working on the sly, while trying to legitimize yourself in the mean time. Don't devulge any thing about your status that you don't need to and what ever visa you're on, try your best to abide by the rules of that particular visa.

THe OP's example is writing for a Bangkok based magazine.

But what about the case of a British writer, resident and registered for tax in the UK, who is commissioned by a British magazine or publisher to write an article or a book on, say, something to do with British history (in other words NOTHING to do with Thailand).

The writer will be paid in the UK into his or her UK bank account.

The writer decides to take a long holiday in Thailand and write the article or the book.

Should the writer be getting a Thai work permit?

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say NO!

Maybe other experts here may disagree.

First of all the odds of getting caught are as astronomical as getting caught wiping your own a$$ (as per a previous example).

Unless you go from bar to bar bragging to everyone that you are writing a book, no one could possibly know what you are doing in private. I don't believe keeping a diary or writing your own biography would be considered work, if it was you could be arrested for writing a post card in a park.

Needless to say, I wouldn't be too concerned.

...I just supply the clients...

That's work.

If you are doing this locally then you need a work permit from the company you represent or you need to create your own consulting company to provide your own work permit.

The reality is that with the type of work you are doing it is highly unlikely that you would ever get caught. You should keep a low profile and never aknowledge or let it be known that you don't have a work permit.

You only have to pi$$ off one person, Thai or expat, to jeopardize your status.

Append:

Sorry I missed your response. If you're based in Australia you should be OK with a Non-B visa.

...But I know it when I

see it...

That's right up the with Bill Clinton's infamous "That depends on what the definition of is, is."

Cop 1: Is that falang over there working?

Cop 2: That depends on what the definition of is, is. Thirsty? Up for a beer? Let's go see if he's got a work permit.

...problems with your post....

1. please dont bring logic in this discussion...

Yeh I know! I've used the word twice in the forum alone.

What was I thinking????

I promise I won't let it happen again.

Can some one help answer this.

If i rent a house and i want to pain the house or put pictures on the wall would that be work aswell ?

Technically yes..

According to the letter of the law, wiping your own arse is working, in fact thinking about wiping your own arse would also fit.

Typing this post.. thinking about typing this post..

Its a ridiculous catch all law, that wouldnt stand unchallenged in any country that wanted a clear legal framework. Its my impression however that Thailands power brokers dont want a clear legal framework, they want a lose collection of locally interpretable offenses so that those with power can abuse them and / or use them against those without power.

Good response LivinLOS!

I've heard of a case where a bar owner is sitting in the corner and some customers come in. He looks around and notices that the bartender or waitress has gone to the bathroom or something like that. He walks over to the customers and asks "can I get you some drinks?" He serves them their drinks and BANG! working without a permit.

Another case: A musician steps on the stage to sit in for a couple of songs with the band, to show his friends how proficient he is on guitar. BANG! working with a permit.

While these cases are rare they do happen. They usually get off by paying a bribe to the boys in brown. Some police see it as a way to make a quick 1000 baht.

Can some one help answer this.

If i rent a house and i want to pain the house or put pictures on the wall would that be work aswell ?

As stupid as it may seem, if you got caught, yes it would be considered work. I've heard of similar incidences.

I'm not sure what the logic behind it is; possibly they may determine that by painting your own house you are denying employment to a Thai which you could pay to have it done.

I wouldn't worry much about hanging pictures but I would wear a disguise if I was outside painting the house.

The one I find curious is profiting from investments while in Thailand.

Example 1. I buy an equity position while outside of Thailand. I fly into Thailand, the equity position rises, I get richer, I fly out of Thailand and sell it. I made that money while in Thailand.

Eg 2. The same example as above but now I sell it while in Thailand, now I have actually realized gains within the country.

Eg 3. I both buy and sell the equity while here in Thailand. This interests me as you dont need a work permit to buy and sell another asset, be it a house or a car, yet both can make money.

Eg 4. I sit at a desk all day, day trading the international markets with high leverage, making 100's of k USD a year and not paying any Thai income tax.

These scenarios are all on a shades of grey scale, I think it would be hard to argue that 4 isnt working and shouldnt pay income tax, but you cant pay income tax in Thailand without a WP and you cant get one for the kind of work I am talking about. Option 1 however is essentially the same thing, but would be totally wacky to think every tourist owes taxes on any equity rise during their time within the kingdom.

The law in Thailand is badly worded and vague (for a start it uses the word it is defining in the definition !!) and a catch all. In a sane country it would be challenged and defined, but thats not going to happen, its just used as a blanket rule to throw at people and gain tea money payments sometimes. But I would be interested in legal opinions on the above.

Logically I can't imagine any of these scenarios as being classified as work. Your investments are outside the country, you are not actually making money, your investments are. As long as you maintain the necessary balance in the bank or receive the necessary monthly income from abroad you should not be concidered working.

I'm surviving on a pension plan. A pension plan is nothing more than an investment whereby the pension company handles all the funds with the intention of providing the best possible interest on my remaining balance.

I receive interest and compounded interest on my pension so while I am actually making money, it's my pension that's doing the work; not me.

I can't see how your case is any different. How could they even prove that you are making money unless they actually accessed your overseas investments; that would be illegal.

If you are already in Thailand, is applying for a one year "Extension of Stay" based on retirement an option? Then there would be no need for a new visa, or to leave Thailand.

Yes!

You can get an extension of stay every year, unless the immigration laws change; and they DO!

In order to qualify you need to provide proof that you have maintained a balance of at least 800,000 baht in a Thai bank for a minimum of 3 months prior to your application for extension.

I'm not sure if there is an option for a minimum monthly income, like there is for supporting a Thai. Perhaps someone more knowlegable about Non-O pension visas can clarify.

Just a small-ish point, but with regard the getting an 'O' as a UK pensioner, and needing to show the OAPension being paid through the bank account - I'm (just) a pensioner, but have taken the option of leaving the weekly cash with the UK government for as long as I can manage ( so-called 'deferment of pension'), so there's Zero going through my bank account from the Uk pensions people even though I'm 4 months into pensionhood. I wonder if a simple Pension Forecast letter from Newcastle will make the Hull folks happy.

I'm not sure if I can be of any help to you because I'm from Canada, not the UK so circumstances my be different.

I've been extending the same 3mo Non-O visa for 4 years using my pension as source of income supporting my daughter (a Thai citizen). For the financial requirement to extend a Non-O visa supporting a Thai you have two options to choose from: 1) provide proof from a Thai bank that you have at least 400,000 baht savings. 2) provide proof that you are receiving at least 40,000 baht per month from your pension plan.

Obviously option 2 is the best because leaving money in your pension plan as long as possible until you actually need it will generate more interest on your remaining funds. Having 400,000 baht in a Thai bank that doesn't pay interest to foriegners is just plain stupid.

When my visa comes up for renewal I calculate how many Canadian dollars (at the current exchange rate) per month I require to slightly exceeding the 40,000 baht minimum, which this year amounted to $1,400 Canadian. I then contact my pension organization and request that my monthly payments be ajusted to $1,400 Can and please provide an email confirming this as my montly pension payment.

Once I have received the email confirmation that I receive $1,400/mo I then take this email to the Canadian Consulate and request an affidavit to provide to the Thai immigration. This costs 1,500 baht but it may be different for the UK. The Canadian Consulate has a pre-printed form made specifically for this purpose so I would imagine the British Embassy has the same.

When filling out the form I use the baht amount (43,000 baht) and not the Canadian amount ($1,400 CAD). This will protect you if there are any big deviations in exchange rates during your visa extention process. If you use your home currency instead of baht, the immigration officer will waste about 10 to 15 minutes calculating and recalculating the exchange hoping that the calculator will eventually show a figure below the minimum 40,000 baht. Believe me it's happened to me twice.

In my case I have a flexable pension plan whereby I can request as much or as little as I want, at any time. If your pension is fixed you'll just have to pray that the exchange rate for the Pound Sterling remains strong, and your monthly payment exceed 40,000 baht a month.

I hope this helps.

Oh! and I forgot to say; I'm as mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore!

For those of you concerned about this despicable behavior (and I'm sure there are many) please write your local political representative and possibly we can stop this heinous "Ketchup Conspiracy", once and for all.

Power to the People!

Just a little off topic here...I wonder what percentage of the purchase price of a pizza bought from The Pizza Company goes towards the 15 to 20 or so, packets of Ketchup that they deliver with each pizza.

They must spend millions of Baht every year on these useless packets of Ketchup (that's Tomawwwwwto sauce for the English out there.

I've never seen anywhere else in the world where people put Ketchup on pizza.

The tomato paste is one of the most important fundamental ingredients to a good pizza. It's the first thing placed on the crust; Why cover it with Ketchup?

What ever you put Ketchup on ultimately ends up tasting like Ketchup.

Why don't they just make "Ketchup pizza" for the Thais and stop delivering to and charging expats for the tons of ketchup that just ends up in the garbage anyway.

They can probably knock-off about 20% of the price of their pizza.