pacharaphet

Too bad we never read anything about these top wealthy Thais and their charitable foundations and giving back to their communities. The one notice in this newspaper several months ago cited piddling amounts by the top ten Thais on the global list.

Most of the wealthy Thais are quite altruistic but never draw attention to their philanthropy. Would you prefer that they hold a press conference to announce their next donation? You really should try better to hide your envy and jealousy of Thai folks who are better off than you.

Maybe he's/she's not jealous, in fact, I'm not sure how your comment points out their "jealousy" at all. You do make a good point, that philanthropy hasn't become nearly as much of a "look at me, I give money to the poor" kind of affair as in the US or even in Germany (the other places I've lived). However, to look at it from the other side, not advertising philanthropy means you do not, as a society, try to motivate people who are not loaded to give money to the poor as well....giving money to temples is not really the same thing, as most of us know. But even with that being said, in the end your donation to many a "help the poor" group may end up with your money being used up by those on top...so in this case, you can idealize and ask why Thais don't like philanthropy and then be disappointed because the answer is basically because the public feels a large part of the "donations" get intercepted by those for whom the money was not intended.

Or you can say, well there are lots of altruistic Thais, don't be jealous. Yes, good for them, but what does their altruism do? And if your point is, lots and lots, we just don't hear about it, then why not?

I feel the poster's question to whom you were responding was a valid point, and you made some too, but just calling them jealous made absolutely no sense, except within the context of: "I am a Farang who has been in Thailand a long time. I, therefore, know Thailand better than every Farang who disagrees with me, even if they have been here as long or longer than me. All who ask questions of such an Anti-Thai nature must be poor and jealous of the elite class, end." Or from the other side, "all who side with the elite are just puppets of their governments, blah blah blah..." It may not be like this at all, but this is sure how it feels, both when arguing with Thais about such issues, and with Farangs. Think about it, maybe there are other explanations as well and I'm just not coming up with them right now.

Seriously, I just have to wonder, is it that hard to step back and evaluate the situation without ending in a personal attack? (above are not personal attacks, as I said...no wait, as I read, it kind of is a generalized personal attack, so I guess I have the answer to my question...haha...)

for my part, issan get can all the polluting industries from around bangkok ... so we could breath some cleaner air

It's funny that you are in Thailand...I'm pretty sure the west did this about 50 years ago towards the end of formal colonialism. "Our people don't like seeing polluting industries all around, so we'll send them over to those countries in the east who don't really care about their population's well-being". It's called neo-colonialism. If you relocated the industry from Bangkok to poorer regions, it would just be more crypto-colonialism on Thailand's part.

Why do I say it's funny you are in Thailand? Because if you support these kinds of practices, your best bet would have to been to stay in/return to the West...maybe not the US though, hahaha, although even they have increased their regulations in the past 10 years, just not the way Europe has.

Now, you may have moved to Thailand before realizing all this, and that's a fair enough argument as well, I suppose.

I want an argument/discussion, not a diss-fest, please.

In my area the Monks begin the daily Alms rounds early. In my area we begin our house hold work early to avoid the heat of the day. In our area we work up until 10pm most nights (again to avoid the heat) which means bedtime around 11 or midnight. In my area we do not sit in a bar drinking until 3am, sleeping in until 2 in the afternoon. But these are just some of the reason why normal people get up early, get work done, sleep during the hottest time of the day and then start again.

Sometimes I truly miss my bar hopping days as a tourist.....

I'm sorry but I really don't know which country you are from but in the West,normal people don't get up at 5:00am!

Normal people in Western countries work from 9:00am-5:00pm,they don't get up when it's still dark and fall asleep on their feet for the rest of the day!

Last time I looked we were not in the West. Have you ever once thought that your in a different country, a different continent with different traditions and practices? There is a school of thought (not practiced much on Thai Visa admittedly) that not everything in the West is a perfect template for the rest of the world to copy.

Like you said, that school of thought doesn't have much clout here...but if we don't walk away from Thai Visa and try to represent our own views in high enough numbers, maybe things would change? I know, I'm an idealist, in my dreams, blah blah blah, you negative, negative people you. But I'm exaggerating, plenty of people on here expressed their understanding of cultural relativism.

I've lived in Andalusia,Spain in summer where it's 45 degrees and they water the sidewalk to keep the dust down,they also have a siesta in the middle of the day and stay open later at night but they're not stupid enough to wake up at 5:00am and spend the rest of the day falling asleep on their feet!

Would you stop insinuating how stupid Thai people are? Let me ask, why the hell are you here (on Thai Visa) and what makes you so interested in Thailand?

I have never had a high opinion of English Teachers in Thailand but this chap is barely literate in the language.

How on earth could someone like this get a job teaching?!

Patrick

barely literate? I don't know where you have the proof for that?

Left out an article or two in order to make his message more clear to the Thai reading it/save space? Possible.

Conjecture and ranting...status quo at TV

There were multiple factors. The drunkenness and their large overwhelming numbers. They were definitely FRIENDLY but with all that booze, friendliness can turn. I suppose some people might say I'm American but I don't support my governments actions towards your country. But in my case that would be a LIE and I didn't even have the energy to play the Canuck card, much less lie about my politics.

Again, I'm sure many people are going to label this paranoid behavior. What would the American embassy advise, do you reckon? I'm sure they would advise: AVOID potential conflict of this nature to the best of your ability and that's what I did.

If you support the war, keep your mouth shut. It's not paranoia, it's legitimate fear.

I'm American as well, don't support the war and I'd probably still keep my mouth shut.

If you told people why you wanted it translated and didn't just post a context-less chat (and indicated who is speaking when, as this is seriously tedious work to do for you, for free), then maybe someone would at least summarize it.

Yes, it was the rain's fault.

Actually not so much directly the rain's fault. Rain water displaces petroleum products accumulated in the road's surface causing them to come out. This dynamic occurs primarily because the water is heavier than the petroleum and because the oil is not soluble in the water. The problem is also exacerbated when there has been little recent rainfall as there will have been a greater quantity of petroleum product set down over time.

Fascinating! So it was the Petrol!

A post with overly derogatory comments toward Thais has been removed as well as a reply.

This entire thread is rather derogatory towards Thais. Please consider this.

500 baht? You must be getting a hair cut in some up market mall?

I get the 80 baht hair cuts with a shave and a nice shoulder and head massage, then give them 200 baht feeling pretty happy about it.

Just try a little road side place.

Way to continue the stereotype that farangs will give outrageous tips...I'm sorry but they set the price that way, a little tip is one thing, but I feel like a 120-baht tip on an 80 baht haircut is like saying: look how much money I have, I can afford to give u twice what the other people here do.

80 baht is a good price, give them 100.......or do you feel like your calling in life is to donate to the poor underprivileged people of Thailand "and feel happy about it" ......if you wanna pay 200 baht, go pay 200 baht somewhere

I know, I know, I don't understand how hard these people work, blah blah blah...but I have friends who have gotten large tips that sometimes express the ridiculousness of it, "meuan guu kaao yaak maak paeng loei wa" (as if I were totally poverty-stricken) or "ruuseuk meuan bpen kon kaw taan" i feel like a beggar..

I know your intentions are good, I really do. But just think about how other people might interpret your actions, and then think of what that that might mean, and ask yourself whether you should just simply feel good about it.....maybe your own view is indeed more complicated than your post indicates, and if so, then I'd be interested to hear more.

I'd call the police to evict them, many school kids here carry a weapon and won't hesitate to use it.

<deleted> they are just kids hanging out after school. Where do you want them to go? Bear hunting like my "ole

Granpappy" used to do? This is the 21st century. Kids hang out all over the world. Do you think this is exclusively a right of the western kids and eastern kids should be at home after school?

Western kids get kicked out of McDonald's as well...in my home town (Cambridge, Ohio, USA), it became quite a regular occurence at our McD's, before the cops starting busting people for: stealing multiple rolls of tp, ketchup, straws, napkins, selling drugs, "overly boisterous conversations" when buying only a drink (this happened to my friends and I ten years ago).....one of my friends resisted arrest, "accidentally" elbowed a cop and was in jail for two days.....

However, I agree the "many kids carry a weapon and won't hesitate to use it" sounds very dramatic, Western supremicist, and even a little racist....almost all of my friends carried knives of some sort (mine was in the legal range, and I never once used it, but I had it to fit in haha...stupid childhood days)....but maybe we're overloading the poster's usage of the word "here" ?

I've seen this frequently in America, once in Amsterdam, and also almost saw it once in a small village in Germany, but only in America have I seen it escalate.

Go to the library if you wanna sit around and not order anything. Oh wait, then you have to be quiet.....plan B anyone?

Not being 100% legit has to be the understatement of the century. This whole deal stinks, criminals in prison, plus upfront Thai names, illegal ownership and an illegal properties renting business, I can assume is the case.

You must have some part in this, justiceFT96, otherwise you would not have been approached and asked to assist with this matter. No one would take on such a task of caretaking for properties and becoming involved with the eviction of tenants for a friend of a friend of a friend purely out of goodwill.

So in order to be able to advise you, please can you explain in detail who are these people, what parts they play in this and what exactly is the real deal here.

I cant explain in detail who these people are, if I knew I wouldn't be posting the questions would I? Whilst at a funeral a few weeks ago I was speaking to a friend who I dont keep in touch with that well but I know him well enough. He said he had been offered a job to work in Thailand looking after houses but he didn't want to go there and leave his family behind. I said I would be interested, bare in mind before I met with this other guy I assumed they had built a small village and wanted to rent it out for income and they wanted a manager to manage the houses, keep them cleaned and maintained etc.

I only found out once I met with this other guy that the actual owner of the property was in jail, I assumed the guy who I was meeting was the actual owner of the properties. The full story came out and I said I would ask about it and what would need to be done which I did here. After thinking about it all I have decided that if they want to evict people etc they will have to find someone else to do that, I am not getting involved in something like that. If after they have removed the people and everything is OK I would be more than willing to help with the properties, rent them out, keep them maintained, deal with any problems tenants may have as long as I can get a cut of the money. If I need to get a work permit I will.

So just to clarify, Friend A I have known for about 9 years, Man B I have met for about 10 minutes the other day, Man C I have never met nor will I ever meet.

Well, if you're staying out of it, good, although it woulda made a good "I told you so" thread indeed (which is gross, cmon people, seriously?)

Quite honestly, this sounds like the preamble to a newspaper story whereby some foreigner is discovered in five separate bin bags in a rice paddy or rubber plantation, or buried under the concrete foundations of their business associate's new house.

Amen to that...seriously Justice, give it a rest.

*Her* two pennies worth.

If you read my actual post, in which I talked about 'other countries', it should be obvious to you that I was not only talking about PTP.

In addition, you laughingly say that bridge building standards should be no concern of central government.

Obviously this is an absurd statement by your good self. Central government is there to pass and enforce laws, including national safety regulations. That means that regardless of which firm builds the bridge, a government agency inspector must check the work, s/he is accountable to the PM, and s/he in turn is accountable to the electorate. By this system, the blame for needless tragedies falls on the Government.

What you clearly don't understand, is that becoming a PM does not just mean you get a car-upgrade and 5-star lunching. It means you take responsibility and that means you shoulder the blame when things fail. There were no adequate safety regulations (laws) in place, no reliable bridge inspectors appointed and vetted by the government. The bridge collapsed. Ergo the government failed to do its job. Ergo they are to blame. And for your precious PTP, they have had two years, and an enviable tourist income to spend on critical infrastructure work, regulatory overhauls, and yes corruption null. They have not produced any of those things. People who criticise them for this, are doing a public service. Sorry you don't understand that.

What you clearly don't understand is that you don't really get to tell Thai politicians what it means for them to be a PM.....I mean in theory world organizations and national governments (as well as maybe the Thai people, I don't know) should have that right....but do they really give a damn?

Your criticism of the PTP isn't necessarily wrong, but at the same time, cmon the rebuilding was funded by the Dems....and you can't expect central government to ensure the enforcement of safety regs every all the time...I mean you could, but tell me how that fits into Thai politics historically? I suppose you could argue that it would make the people respect their govt. more yadayadayada...but I would argue that Jom Phol Por, Sarit, Thanorm, and many others were not really so interested in this, as Keynesian politics never really thrived in Asia (what I mean is they weren't interested in improving the quality of their peoples' lives, they wanted to accrue power..Sarit's politics are a great example of how infrastructure got used to consolidate power). Populist policies worked to get the reds on the bandwagon, but even still, you really think the central government needs to be held accountable because they're in office? Even if they had allocated portions of the budget to infrastructure, I highly doubt they'd have made it to the bridge in question by now. I admire your vigor and desire to stick it to the woman, but I really don't think you are taking the specifics of the situation into account. Universalism is a really dangerous card to play: "this worked great in my country and it will in others too!". There are reasons, many many reasons, why that bridge was in poor enough shape to collapse after 30 years. We could look back to its building 30 years ago, its maintenance since, and the repairs done....or we can say: down with the current government.

While I too would like to see more money spent on ensuring the peoples' safety, I think there is much more to this situation than you purport.

Don't think they would ever get a visa and if they did then blame might be levied on someone causing a loss of face.

Things will never change in a country like this.

I have been to lot's of funerals here like many other westerners I'm sure but very rarely seen anyone really upset unlike funerals in England where people do get upset and show it, makes me wonder if Thais view life as precious as us because if they did then perhaps they would make things change view of life is that it is as precious as it is in England, and as anywhere else. Don't take

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another tragic accident,health and safety are on their way.

Don't think they would ever get a visa and if they did then blame might be levied on someone causing a loss of face.

Things will never change in a country like this.

I have been to lot's of funerals here like many other westerners I'm sure but very rarely seen anyone really upset unlike funerals in England where people do get upset and show it, makes me wonder if Thais view life as precious as us because if they did then perhaps they would make things change.

Thais view life as precious, just as people do in England, and elsewhere. Do not mistake a public show of grief at a funeral as anything other than what it is. As for Thais desiring to change their country for the better, most do want this, but political power resides in the hands of those who profit from the current arrangement, not those who suffer. Worksafe changes occurred in the west due largely to trade union action, over decades. That is needed in Thailand.

You are aware of the results of most attempts at trade unions in Thailand (and even often in the West, although the mass movements do have potential and have created social shifts in the past as you point out), right? The organizers pocket huge sums, then back out once pressured too much from above (usually they are paid to give up, or threatened, or sometimes worse). I once was all about expanding trade unions in Thailand but after seeing what has happened with some attempts to form unions at Tesco Lotus, I'm not sure the West's "path to success" is always such a foolproof plan.

Thailand is becoming more and more like a police state

Freedom of speech an freedom to assemble are gone ... unless you wear a red shirt

I agree with the first half....however the second half is problematic....

Let them all starve, then close it down

Why is this kind of stuff allowed? Are you seriously that against a fair trial...not that I think these people would get anything close to a "fair" trial regardless? Do you have that little faith in Western judicial systems that you must insist all individuals be starved to death, regardless of what info there is about them on file?

Pattaya is what it is, no use trying to sugar coat it.

Why is there a problem with stating the truth these days?

so what is the truth? I'd say the truth is Pattaya is international town, where it is ridiculously cheap to live. What other place even compares? If you don't like Pattaya, you just maybe tired of living.

Many of us like it well enough, but don't get carried away. It ain't for everyone.

when did I say it is for everyone?

Im happy it isnt for everyone, if it was, it would be a boring shi_thole.

you equated not liking Pataya with being tired of being alive....I'd say that someone reading "everyone should want to live in Pataya" out of your post is quite sensible.....

"everyone is not tired of being alive" therefore "everyone should want to live in Pataya" .....except for those with a death wish of course, they're exempt

Take responsibility for what you say and stop acting like other people just have you all wrong....if you didn't think it's for everyone, then why speak in hyperbole on the internet, where sarcasm doesn't come through at all unless you make an effort, which it doesn't seem you did.

It's because most of us use "View New Content", where the forum the post comes from is not really highlighted.

You just see the post title and reply if the title interests you.

Yes, but the question was more about Pattaya HATERS than people who don't live in Pattaya, I think. Are you suggesting most people who don't live here are Pattaya HATERS?

Pretty much.

If I liked Pattaya, I wouldn't be living in CM, now would I!

I don't buy that. I LOVE CM but there are a few things about it that make it unlivable for me compared to Pattaya.

Like what? I'm enthralled by this claim!

Thaksin is the problem, if he wasn't pushing the agenda then the Yingluck coalition could get down to fulfilling their mandate of improving the lives of the poor, unifying Thais and bringing democracy to Thailand.

This is super super sarcastic, right? Just making sure....

Neither do the majority of Muslims!

As for Christians blowing up kids; remember Warrington, for example.

You quote one example of a few, YET many lives world wide are lost via a peaceful religion every day. I feel sorry for you and your perspective on stuff.

Yes, you as a foreigner living in Thailand (or at least being quite involved with Thailand) should have NO PITY and NO UNDERSTANDING for someone who tries to make cultural relativism and suspended judgment part of one's common practice....what a madman, attempting to look at things through more than one lens.... as if the West has just always left people alone in the rest of the world... ha ha ha

I saw it; I enjoyed it. It is not the sophisticated cinema some of us enjoy of course, but it is a fun experience to watch with a Thai audience. I actually liked Laddaland a lot more, it was scarier and much better imo. I recommend seeing it one in the theater as well.

It did have some funny moments that had me chuckling, but it wasn't scary, wasn't particularly well made or acted.......so why is it breaking all box office records and may surpass Suriyothai and King Narusan as the biggest grossing Thai film ever.

This is the point I would like to understand, not particularly the quality of Thai movies, which in general is very poor.

I think some Thai horror is actually very good. "Alone" was probably my favorite. This is the same directors. I think they are sophisticated enough artists, but money talks. It is just what the Thais want to see; fun, unsophisticated mediocrity. I don't really know what to say, I feel the talent is here, but like many places, not properly utilized.

The reason this is grossing so much is probably because all those 200 baht a day workers just got a huge raise. Didn't they?

As you say, it's what the public wants. Bit like the rubbish James Bond films that the UK produces.

Nice parallel with James Bond. I love how so many people act as if this is like some Thailand only business. Every film market produces the same filth that its people want to see because the numbers don't lie and people know how they can make money. This one seems to be better produced than previous slap-sticks (which I feel people throw around as a term with very negative connotations, which isn't really fair considering the amount of junk Western TV produces that grosses millions).....

Yes, that all goes without saying, but why has this version suddenly become a record breaker, up there threatening Suriyothai and King Narusan for the number one spot?

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Serious, long, dramatic, tink-too-mutt historical epics vs ghosts+comedy with popular super-stars?

And you're surprised?

Your quote says to me: Thai people are dense and just want to laugh....right, and that someone explains why "they" loved Suriyothai and Naresuan...

It just reeks of cultural superiority. Why be in Thailand if Thai people are so dumb and simple to figure out?

The Thai press (it's on the front page of one of the big dailies) says they were refused entrance to Hollywood and started abusing the guard, almost causing a fight, then went directly opposite to the Kangaroo Bar, split open the American's eyebrow with an ashtray, slapped a bar-girl, started hitting other customers with a chair and even started assaulting other people on the soi.

Eventually, other tourists (of no specified nationality) had had enough, surrounded these two knuckle-draggers and gave them the kicking they so richly deserved. I hope they weren't too drunk to remember the lesson they were given. Enjoy the rest of your holiday, low-lifes.

Can you provide a link to the Thai page?