Markphuket

Msrkphuket....the OP stated at beginning the HE DID NOT ATTEND CLASSES.

STOP TROLLING read my post where i stated how could the immigration officer know that?

jacksam is hardly trolling. The OP, by his own admission, was playing the game and got caught out.

The OP has been noble to the cause and taken it on the chin. Give it up.

He is, because if he simply read my previous post, i was asking the question how could an immigration be aware of the fact he wasn't attending lessons, the OP would not have stated this to the immigration at the time of arrival. Also as well documented through this thread school send attendance records that dont match attendance.... so the likely hood is the immigration would have had no knowledge of him not attending classes........ so stand by my comment

Msrkphuket....the OP stated at beginning the HE DID NOT ATTEND CLASSES.

STOP TROLLING read my post where i stated how could the immigration officer know that?

The only time when even Thais don't know how to write something and variations in spelling can occur are for foreign transliterations or transcriptions.

That's not true. Indic loanwords can present huge doubts. There are several different spellings of the common nickname 'Nit', depending on what the person's official name is. Live syllables with falling tones immediately offer two possibilities, and in many cases the current spelling is, etymologically speaking, wrong.

For a foreigner, the immediate problem is that not knowing the tone, or not knowing the basic tone rules, makes spelling guesswork. However, the relevant issue is then how Immigration would interpret the results of a spelling test. Would perfect spelling indicate that someone wasn't actually studying to improve their Thai?

Totally agree as also for every rule I've been learning there are equal amount of exceptions when it comes to the thai language.

And per my previous post agree with you again, i have people in my class who are doing thai to improve their level of thai language even thou they have lived here for many years previous.

If they suspect him of working they would need some proof to back this up also, The reason i say this is there must be many people here for many years in same situation who are going to be under scrutiny also next time they pass through immigration, There are a handful in my class who have been here for numerous years and just decided they want to improve their thai and doing the education visa route which is breaking no rules.

It's not a criminal case so the immigration officers don't need to prove anything. The burden of proof is on you to prove that the declarations you made on your visa applications are true. They obviously suspected he was working illegally and he had no way to convince them otherwise. Proof of income from sources outside Thailand and/or bank statements showing that no other money was going into your account and that money was in fact leaving your account in an amount expected of someone living here would be the kind of things that could logically convince them.

On another note I thought the 20k baht was proof of funds for a 1 month tourist visa. So wouldn't you need 20k per month of your intended stay if you were on an ed visa?

agreed its not a criminal case and the immigration officer is making a judgement. The OP was in Thailand for 8 years already saying he made his money from HK and not within Thailand. So there should be no record of him working in Thailand that 8 years, no record of visa abuse for the immigration officer to draw on. If he has been here for 8 years with no flags and no problems then you think he would have been thought less likely to have been working in Thailand with a clean history then someone who just turned up to Thailand.

That was just one of my point but ultimately my post was about how it doesn't make sense to me of how he could have been rejected. So either there is more to the story at the airport or to his background the immigration officer knew about that the OP didn't share...... or the immigration officer has acted in a shocking manner.

You should check with some of the visa companies.

They can help you, for a fee (20,000 to 30,000 Bt).

Why? As post #2 says and its only 5,000 baht and legal.

I was talking to one gentlemen a few days back in the same situation but not having enough for his retirement visa. He paid a fee to a company who sorted it all out and suddenly had enough funds and got his visa no problem.

Reading your story wish you good luck and hope you sort it out so you dont have to leave.

Ultimately i do agree that is was the right decision for the immigration officer to refuse him entry to Thailand if he states he did not attend class, that part is a clear abuse of the visa, this coming form a fellow person on a educational visa

This is my problem and question is how the immigration officer got to this decision, how did the immigration officer know that he hadn't been attending lessons as previously stated most school give in bogus attendance records. I cant believe this would play any factor into why he got rejected.

If it because he started a educational visa after 8 years. There no phrasing when applying for an educational visa that says after "x" years you should be able to speak/read/write thai to a certain level and no longer eligible for this Visa. Unless there is a direct rule anyone is entitled to apply for a education visa to learn thai after 0 years or 50 years up of living in Thailand already...... People or an immigration officer saying he should be fluent already and doesnt need to be on a educational visa, that a personal opinion and not a official law or rule that is being followed that I'm aware of.

If it was down to him not being able to read that thai language after 6 months, the changes to the language school syllabus has only just been a recent change, year one students in my school this happen no more then 1-2 months ago. Also lessons being only 2 times a week at present it could be understandable that if he had no written or reading skills already, that they could still be at a basic level. So unless he could show zero understanding on the thai alphabet then at best it was very harsh to turn him round and refusing him entry.

If they suspect him of working they would need some proof to back this up also, The reason i say this is there must be many people here for many years in same situation who are going to be under scrutiny also next time they pass through immigration, There are a handful in my class who have been here for numerous years and just decided they want to improve their thai and doing the education visa route which is breaking no rules.

If he couldn't show the immigration sufficient funds entering Thailand as was stamped, i could find this plausible as it is a condition when you are filling in your education visa application that you have to prove funds for your stay. If he couldn't do that then he would have been rightfully rejected, but it isn't clear from the OP that happened.

I hope people are right who think there is more to this story, because without more information i find it worrying how the immigration officer came to the decision to refuse his entry since he had the correct paper work to enter and the true reason he got rejected entry, even thou it was the right decision.

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Very interesting thread. Makes me wonder which group of expats will be next to face stringent crackdowns. Retirement maybe? All those alcoholic wrecks living on pensions in Pattaya and elsewhere, it wouldn't surprise me at all if the financial requirements are raised significantly in the near future.

Can see this happening in the future as even the Retirement visa gets abused as i have met people working on a retirement visa's without a work permit and people who have paid companies to sort out their retirement as they didnt have the correct amount coming into their account each month or the correct lump sum.

Just stands to reason it seem to be the only visa they haven't yet cracked down on and believe will be next. That will be a fun day on this forum when that happens.

Where do you get the information that the class attendance should be 10 hours / week in Phuket?

According to that post:

“We will go after foreigners who never come to class. Those people are likely to be breaking the law,” he said.

However, Col Sunchai added that his office will not be enforcing a mandatory minimum number of hours that any foreign student must attend each week.

The info of 5 days/week attendance is a must requested by the immigration officer at the desk if you want everything going smooth at this stage and this was confirmed by a meeting that school owners had last week with the Ministry of Education.

My school went to the same meeting and confirm the above is what my school reported also. The new hours have yet to go into effect at my school yet as they said they are in the process of updating their syllabus.

I think its time something official was released about these change as it seem to be one set of hours for phuket, another for bkk and at present going by just wallen school website for reference the rest of Thailand is unchanged so far.

no solution really, you going to have to either man up and meet the requirements for one of the visas or move on

sucks but unfortunately thailand is no longer the visa push over it once was

maybe finish your course, grab a double entry tourist visa then head to somewhere more suited your lifestyle like cambodia or philipines?

Actually that is my current plan as a double entry visa i think are my only option after my course finishes up next year, its sucks agree as i made a life here.

furnished my house I've been living in 5 years. Invested time into friendships and people, which is not easy to throw away however much people say just live somewhere else.

Not all us Education visa people are scammers. Some of us have an income and not working (I'm not a digital nomad) and just want to live here but as you said we have been living in the rules and now they keep changing the rules and rightly if cant stay here long term anymore i have been exploring my options.

These post always turn into one side against another and miss the real point of these posts sadly. Where the real problem is people look to these visa as there isn't a viable visa which suits their situation........ reality there are people who are under the age of 50 that are already able to meet retirement, with me being one of these people.

Ive read many times there are the rules and people on education visa should not feel entitled to stay in Thailand. The same argument if your visa lets you stay in Thailand you should not feel a sense of entitlement also.

Philipines have a retirement age of 35 which is much fair and promotes far more equality then the current visa system here.

Im actually on a ED visa at the moment and it will expire next year, which i have no intention to renew as from what i have been informed by my school are going to be cut from 1 year to 6 months with a total study period of 1 and half years and no longer 3 years.

I generally love Thailand and want to stay here, but what the fact is the uncertainty on and visa you are currently on is going to change at any point.

People say TE but i won't invest 500,000 into a visa upfront when i could get married and become a wasted investment or i have to leave Thailand for whatever reason and again becomes a wasted investment. But ultimately same most people i can think of much better ways to spend/invest 500,000

But the great idea i have........ retirement visa are dropped to age of 35, but make it a requirement now also as you are living here long term to mandatory take thai lessons and or being able to pass a test in thai. I for one want make my life here and have been learning thai as i want to and because i want to live here.

Because its ironic some of the people "not all" that can speak only a little amount of thai are preaching to actual student who have a much larger thai vocabulary then them.

And doesn't one have to deposit 20k USD as a surety/ deposit for this visa in the Philippines ?

Yes you do, very correct....... but that money is still yours after 5 years, big difference

These post always turn into one side against another and miss the real point of these posts sadly. Where the real problem is people look to these visa as there isn't a viable visa which suits their situation........ reality there are people who are under the age of 50 that are already able to meet retirement, with me being one of these people.

Ive read many times there are the rules and people on education visa should not feel entitled to stay in Thailand. The same argument if your visa lets you stay in Thailand you should not feel a sense of entitlement also.

Philipines have a retirement age of 35 which is much fair and promotes far more equality then the current visa system here.

Im actually on a ED visa at the moment and it will expire next year, which i have no intention to renew as from what i have been informed by my school are going to be cut from 1 year to 6 months with a total study period of 1 and half years and no longer 3 years.

I generally love Thailand and want to stay here, but what the fact is the uncertainty on and visa you are currently on is going to change at any point.

People say TE but i won't invest 500,000 into a visa upfront when i could get married and become a wasted investment or i have to leave Thailand for whatever reason and again becomes a wasted investment. But ultimately same most people i can think of much better ways to spend/invest 500,000


But the great idea i have........ retirement visa are dropped to age of 35, but make it a requirement now also as you are living here long term to mandatory take thai lessons and or being able to pass a test in thai. I for one want make my life here and have been learning thai as i want to and because i want to live here.

Because its ironic some of the people "not all" that can speak only a little amount of thai are preaching to actual student who have a much larger thai vocabulary then them.

There has actually been or going to be big change regarding the ED visa, Im in phuket and its been confirmed by my school that the visa they are doubling the hours you have to study from 4 hours a week to 8 hours a week.

Also that the visa is going to be cut in half from 3 years down to a year and a half. You will get a 6 month visa each time and not a 1 year visa now when you apply. I dont believe this is official yet but if you check wallen school you will see that for phuket and bkk they only offering 6 months visa not a whole year. But the rest of thailand they are still one offering one year visa according to their site.

Im in phuket and my school didnt know when the change are going to be made official so depending where you are, this is something you might want to query with your school what the hours are going to be and the situation regarding the visa as they might tell you everything fine right now knowing right its all about to change.

personally cause of this change the visa going to 6 months has become as good as a double entry tourist visa to me and if you not wanting to learn thai holds no advantage as after 6 months you would have to leave Thailand to renew your visa same as the tourist visa.

Someone who worked their asses off for 40 to 50 years as opposed the guy who worked 10 years,.... is that another example to show another form of self entitlement or am i wrong?

If you have 800,000 baht shouldn't matter age, everyone get's to that figure in their own way working hard or can be getting it handed to them which is the honest truth...... just being devils advocate for fairness sake fellas.

So would you say it would be fair for these people on ED visa for anyone to stay here regardless if they can show they have 40,000 a month income or a bank balance of 800,000 baht?

Apparently heads of language schools in Phuket were meeting with immigration today to discuss the new rules.

Anyone hear from their school about the results of the discussions..?

This is not fact will know for sure tomorrow when i go to school but I've had a conversation with a friend of mine who works at one of the language school who filled me in.

As i said not 100% but what she said is yes the visa is going from 4 hours to now the 5 times a week 10 hours........... BUT also the visa is going to be cut in half from 1 years to 6 months. So guessing you can only study now for a total of 1 and a half years, instead of before 3 years.

She said something that there would be a weekly test but she was a bit vague about that.

Also i mentioned earlier in the thread but the post got deleted i dont know why that there is now a end of year test that happens at the ministry of education in Phuket on top of the all ready test you do end of year in your school. We had students in my class sit this already so know this is already happening.

She didnt know when these other changes are going to happen, but tomorrow will be talking to my school to get this all confirmed if correct and when its going to kick in.

Think is bad news for us genuine students and fewl sorry for my school who has great teachers as i can see schools closing down because of this as i won't be doing my third year if its just 6 months.

My Visa up in April so hope for some positive changes to visas by then as not going to complain and will just look most likely to Philippines instead like others here in phuket who are in the same situation.

Im sure news will get posted before, but if i get more information tomorrow i will post it here tomorrow.

Just back from school and for the people interested I can update further regarding this matter

I went into school this morning and asked them first did they attend the meeting yesterday, at first the didnt even want to acknowledge that there was a meeting yesterday, but when they understood how clued up i was about the situation they were honest and told me the following.

Schools will have to go from a 200 hour year teaching thai to now a 400 hour year and a year. They also confirmed that they believe that the visa will be cut in half from 1 year to 6 months because of the effective doubling of the hours..... This makes it a little confusing what correct 5 lessons a week as the original story or what i guess correct will be same bkk 4 lessons a week.

I could see how upset the head teacher at my school is because who i talking to she looked like she wanted to cry about how angry she is about the changes. I can understand this as i go to a good school with good teachers in my class where all the students actually turn up to lessons.

There talk they might have to set up a union to fight these changes, they talked they may have to absorb the cost and only make the course a little more expensive as they are scared to scare away the remaining or any new students.

So this is how it stands at the moment, they didnt have any time frame or date when this was going to all become official. They said at the moment they where working on restructuring the teaching syllabus per the changes coming.

Ultimately i just feel really sorry for my teachers before any thought go to myself as they can see their jobs and business are in jeopardy because of these changes.

Im at the stage it stays like this i dont think i have a long term visa option now to stay in Thailand as i was approaching starting my 3rd year of learning thai next year. But if I'm only going to get 6 months and with no real good options now long term same a lot of people i know the future gone very bleak for people like me trying to make a life here.

Will just hope something change for the better soon.

Apparently heads of language schools in Phuket were meeting with immigration today to discuss the new rules.

Anyone hear from their school about the results of the discussions..?

This is not fact will know for sure tomorrow when i go to school but I've had a conversation with a friend of mine who works at one of the language school who filled me in.

As i said not 100% but what she said is yes the visa is going from 4 hours to now the 5 times a week 10 hours........... BUT also the visa is going to be cut in half from 1 years to 6 months. So guessing you can only study now for a total of 1 and a half years, instead of before 3 years.

She said something that there would be a weekly test but she was a bit vague about that.

Also i mentioned earlier in the thread but the post got deleted i dont know why that there is now a end of year test that happens at the ministry of education in Phuket on top of the all ready test you do end of year in your school. We had students in my class sit this already so know this is already happening.

She didnt know when these other changes are going to happen, but tomorrow will be talking to my school to get this all confirmed if correct and when its going to kick in.

Think is bad news for us genuine students and fewl sorry for my school who has great teachers as i can see schools closing down because of this as i won't be doing my third year if its just 6 months.

My Visa up in April so hope for some positive changes to visas by then as not going to complain and will just look most likely to Philippines instead like others here in phuket who are in the same situation.

Im sure news will get posted before, but if i get more information tomorrow i will post it here tomorrow.

I couldn't even change the time of my private classes a few months ago because my school is at full capacity and they didn't have spare teachers to change my hours. How they're going to do so many more hours is beyond me. Simply not gonna happen.

Majority of students do go to every class, I have missed a few due to sickness but not been skiving.

There's a few schools in Rawaii known for taking your 30k and then letting you never show up again, they're in favor with the Tiger Muay Thai workers but my school is more legit.

Sounds about the same as my school, chances are we may even be at the same school in Phuket from what wrote. Pretty much my class everyone turns up every week and only have 1-2 id say who are abusing which is a small minority compared to the rest of the people who make up my class.

This hasn't been thought through because of the impact on the schools, as said mine so busy it will need new teachers for extra classes along with new premises to accommodate classes.

The other impact is its not one set of classes these school run..... they run Thai for year 1, year 2 year 3 in their school maybe more along with english classes for thai/none english speakers and many other languages. How they going to run these classes with out the free class room space.......... Just proves how badly thought through and bad the idea of the change in hours is.

Now I'm no expert, but this looks quite nice: http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=GBP&to=THB&view=1M

Up to 44.9 from 43.5 on the 21st.

Yea i just clocked onto this today as up to 45.3 now, so i transferred abit more money across to my thai account just in case its a false dawn of a recovery.

But here is hoping that this recovery keeps going and we are sitting a bit more prettier in a months time.

and the Baht keeps marching on... strong.

Yup i try not to look at exchange rates anymore as its always bad news for me at least. Dont know what happened 16/17th but now its nose dived under 44baht to 1pound

Same deal, Me i had thought though the rule was that rain = no internet and that was just the way it was in Thailand and had lived with that actually a couple of years

But after a real heavy heavy session of rain my internet went completely even after the rain had finally stopped.

Got a friend to ring up 3BB and they said they would send an engineer when one was available (I was thinking okay im going to be with out internet for a while)

Next day engineering rings, they come round fix my internet and same as story fault was at the pole.

But best thing was next lot of monsoon rain that came my internet worked perfectly all through the rain now..... i was as happy as a pig in mud after that

At 320k yea id do it myself also.

Just take a walk around index mall (its like an asian IKEA) and you will see how far your money will go, there no way you need to be spending that kind of money in my opinion, unless you want to.

I rent a house unfurnished, so i had to do it myself also and its pretty easy as everywhere seems to deliver. Plus when they deliver they will assemble your furniture and put it where ever you want it to go at no extra cost.

lastly you will have your pad looking how you want it to look. Feeling like your own home, so a no brainer to me.

Walen over in Chalong, about 200 before the roundabout, left side, going to roundabout.

And a few cheaper options a bit further on. Pier road half way down on the left side and just a little way along viset road is linga plus language school who teach the same course from the same books as patong language school but they also teach reading and writing with it. I recommend linga plus over patong as I've been to both, about 100 meters, if that, heading towards Rawai from the circle on your right. There's also a lady called Joy who comes to teach at your home but I've lost the number, think you can find her with a google search though.

Good to hear, as that where im starting at in just over a months time

Love stupid threads like this people make to show there prejudices against something they don't like in this case people who have tattoos

Well id like to go on record as saying im a Muay thai training, tattooed covered........... fluffy scaredy black cat owner

Maybe that means............. im a passive aggressive then?!?!?!

Would love to know my social profiling according to this thread

I pretty sure i know the answer already, but you are okay to come into Thailand with a multiple entry 1 year visa - with just a one way air ticket??

I just want to double check first

Thanks