Godders

Faz kindly posted this section, taken from a UK/THAILAND DOUBLE TAXATION CONVENTION SIGNED 18 FEBRUARY 1981

Article 23 Elimination of Double Taxation

(1) In the case of the United Kingdom and subject to the provisions of the law of the United Kingdom regarding the allowance as a credit against United Kingdom tax of tax payable in a territory outside the United Kingdom (which shall not affect the general principle hereof):
(a) Thai tax payable under the laws of Thailand and in accordance with this Convention, whether directly or by deduction, on profits, income or chargeable gains from sources within Thailand (excluding, in the case of a dividend, tax payable in respect of the profits out of which the dividend is paid) shall be allowed as a credit against any United Kingdom tax computed by reference to the same profits, income or chargeable gains by reference to which the Thai tax is computed.

Clear as mud. But one thing does seem pretty clear - that this portion of the Convention appears to refer only to income from sources within Thailand. whereas the point at issue is pensions income emanating from the UK.

Before I settled in Thailand, the UK tax experts I consulted said ALL and any income (including pensions) remitted to Thailand was liable to tax.

Now I know many UK pensioners living here do not declare their (net) pensions to the Thai tax authorities. And some say that their efforts to do so have been rejected by local tax offices. But this does not mean they are not liable.

My understanding, from what I have read of other postings on this vexed subject, is that the Thai tax authorities tend to turn a blind eye, for tax purposes, to income brought into the country by foreign residents. However, as we all know, Thais are generally averse to increasing their daily workload more than necessary and their laid-back attitude may be at odds with official policy.

With Thailand's future in the melting pot and a new administration clearly looking to increase the tax take generally, it would be helpful to know definitely what one is and is not liable for - not least to strengthen the case against the Osborne Plan to rob non-resident pensioners of their Personal Allowance.

Under Thai Tax Laws only income received in Thailand from employment Overseas is taxable.

Pensions from overseas are not employment related and are not subject to taxation

Any income you make here should be taxed (above the thresholds) including interest payments from investments, as it is treated as receiving an income from Thailand.

If the interest is below the thresholds for tax allowances then this can be reclaimed.

I am automatically taxed on the interest I receive from my Fixed Bank Account, but because it is below the tax allowance, each year I can reclaim the full amount.

Pensions from overseas are not employment related and are not subject to taxation

I repeat, all UK pensions income remitted to Thailand is taxable here because pensions were specifically excluded from the double taxation agreements made between the two countries. Check it out.

Taken from; UK/THAILAND DOUBLE TAXATION CONVENTION SIGNED 18 FEBRUARY 1981

Article 23 Elimination of Double Taxation

(1) In the case of the United Kingdom and subject to the provisions of the law of the United Kingdom regarding the allowance as a credit against United Kingdom tax of tax payable in a territory outside the United Kingdom (which shall not affect the general principle hereof):

(a) Thai tax payable under the laws of Thailand and in accordance with this Convention, whether directly or by deduction, on profits, income or chargeable gains from sources within Thailand (excluding, in the case of a dividend, tax payable in respect of the profits out of which the dividend is paid) shall be allowed as a credit against any United Kingdom tax computed by reference to the same profits, income or chargeable gains by reference to which the Thai tax is computed.

Under Thai Tax Laws only income received in Thailand from employment Overseas is taxable.

Pensions from overseas are not employment related and are not subject to taxation

Any income you make here should be taxed (above the thresholds) including interest payments from investments, as it is treated as receiving an income from Thailand.

If the interest is below the thresholds for tax allowances then this can be reclaimed.

I am automatically taxed on the interest I receive from my Fixed Bank Account, but because it is below the tax allowance, each year I can reclaim the full amount.

Pensions from overseas are not employment related and are not subject to taxation

I repeat, all UK pensions income remitted to Thailand is taxable here because pensions were specifically excluded from the double taxation agreements made between the two countries. Check it out.

Presumably, they are hoping to fund the increase via the Osborne plan to make UK pensioners living in overseas countries like Thailand ineligible for the standard tax allowance (currently 10,600 pounds p.a. and predicted to rise to 12,000 pounds), effectively reducing their pensions income by 20 per cent.

I suppose it's understandable that some people feel sore about the election result, but that doesn't justify propagating outright lies which might alarm some of the more vulnerable. The last government's consultation document about restricting personal allowances specifically stated that it did not intend to reduce the allowance of expat pensioners. I replied to the consultation and received the same answer, as did Sir Roger Gale MP who is very active in representing the interests of UK expats in Parliament.

Try reading the consultation, particularly Para 6.6

https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/restricting-non-residents-entitlement-to-the-uk-personal-allowance/restricting-non-residents-entitlement-to-the-uk-personal-allowance

I read the consultation document when it first came out and made representations to which I never received a reply. Believe me, nobody could feel more "vulnerable" and "alarmed" than I am at what I believe is being proposed. Let us look at some of the evidence you have presented.

For example, in section 6.6: "many non-resident UK national pensioners do not have any other income (i.e. employment or property) which is taxable in the UK and would not be affected by losing their Personal Allowance".

How could people like myself not be affected? Since leaving the UK to retire to Thailand I have only paid UK tax on that portion of my UK pensions income which exceeds the Personal Allowance. As I understand it, under the Chancellor's proposals, I would be taxed on the lot - and at a stroke lose a fifth of my entire pensions income.

I would also draw your attention to the following paragraph, a little further on in the same section:

"The government does not intend to raise taxes on vulnerable groups or in situations where the UK is the principal taxing authority and an individual has no recourse to relief as a result of the UK having sole taxing rights under a tax treaty. If the government were to restrict non-residents’ entitlement to the Personal Allowance, it would intend this to apply to types of income which are taxable both in the UK and overseas (such as that from immovable property) but to retain the Personal Allowance on income that is taxable exclusively in the UK.

The term "vulnerable groups", which I have underlined, is a phrase commonly used by politicians to raise hopes - but these are dashed, so far as UK expat pensioners living in Thailand are concerned, by the contents of the underlined sentence which follows. This clearly states the intention to deprive non-residents with income taxable in their respective countries of domicile (UK in my case) and residence (Thailand) of the Personal Allowance.

A number of double taxation treaties between the UK and Thailand exist, but not prevent pensions arising in the UK being taxable in BOTH countries. The UK automatically takes its pound of flesh at source and Thai tax law says that pension money remitted here (whether net or gross is irrelevant) is income and therefore taxable.

I would be delighted to be proved wrong, of course. Over to you.

Prayut Chan-o-cha Urges Asean Members to Cooperate Together

Dreadful tautology - and ominous when one considers the official language of the ASEAN bloc is supposed to be English.

Unless and until the Red Shirts are made a banned organisation, they have every right to be represented in the public forum. The fact that so many Thai Visa posters from Western democracies think otherwise simply shows how effective the leaders of their own nations have been in eroding hard-fought-for freedoms and rights won by their more perceptive and courageous forefathers.

the media need to stop trying to sensationalize everything and writing the truth before anyone can take them seriously. The last thing we need is the media causing divisions like the red tv has been doing till they were shut down last week, the current leaders might not be perfect but there is a lot less of the problems Thailand was facing before they took over. When we see the media continually writing there own biased version of events or simply making it up to sell more papers or gain viewers what can they expect. Instead of printing the garbage being propagated by biased journo's they need to be honest, only have to see what some of the sh*t they write in here says to see that. I always thought journalists were supposed to write the truth not make it up to suit themselves,the thai media has a long way to go before they can call themselves professionals.

If I were you, I'd stick to sniffing the franjipani.

"After his stay at Mass General, he went off kratom cold turkey. The fascinating thing is that his only withdrawal symptom was a runny noise."

- Scientific American

A runny noise? Who the hell can they be talking about? Surely not someone we all know. . .

Nothing to worry about, then.

What Thai children need most is protection from parents and relatives who ferry them around like sacks of rice.

How many times do we see young kids, toddlers and even babies carried under one arm, perched precariously between the driver's legs and holding on to the handlebars, or standing on the pillion seat between two other passengers?

Of course crash helmets should be compulsory to reduce the brain damage caused by young heads hitting the ground in accidents. But what is one to do about their adult supervisors who appear to be permanently brain damaged before they even get on a motorcycle?

Three questions:

1 Are we to assume the photograph accompanying this article was taken during a break in NLA proceedings?

2 If not, where are the other 260 or so other unelected members of this body with the nation's destiny in its hands?

3 If this is what "Thai-style" democracy is going to be like, does anyone other than the privileged owners of the bums warming the benches really want it?

Monks in glass houses. . .

No big deal. Just about all banknotes are counterfeit, in the sense that their face value bears no resemblance whatsoever to their real worth. It has been reliably estimated that only three per cent of fiat currency now circulation is actually backed by a tangible asset.

Not only that, but many of household name banks are technically bankrupt and kept afloat only by massive injections of cheap digital money created - literally out of thin air - by the big central banks.

Hence the contemptuously low interest rates offered to savers and the ballooning derivative bubble inflated by zombie bankers frantically playing pass-the-parcel to justify their obscene bonuses.

When the music stops and this bubble, estimated at around a quadrillion dollars, finally bursts the only practical use for old-fashioned banknotes will be to paper the walls or wipe our well-kicked asses.

Now you understand why China is buying gold like there is no tomorrow.

Well, to borrow from Mandy Rice-Davies, they would say that, wouldn't they.

It will take, as it always does, action by the labouring classes to turn "quasi" democracy into the real thing. And by the real thing, I don't mean "Thai-style" democracy of the kind which is being hatched by the unelected elite currently running the show.

The former abbot was accused of using dead infants or foetus to make magic medication.

Another nail in the coffin of Thai-style Buddhism. How much deeper can the depravity go?

The military preaching peace? Sounds a little incongruous, to say the least. If the administration is serious about ending the violence, it needs to tease out and tackle the root causes of this destructive and dangerous rivalry.

Knowing some of these kids, I am convinced the apparently mindless anger they direct at one another is frequently related to feelings of low self esteem and frustration at being on the bottom rung of the education ladder, with the low-level qualifications they receive at the end of years of training offering little promise of a decent, well-paid career.

The only good thing which might come out of this Navy lark is if the kids from the various v.c. colleges get their heads together and realise that they are not the enemy, but victims of a cynical and wasteful educational model designed to produce more failures than successes (for reasons, in a greedy and corrupt capitalist society such as that of Thailand,, which needs no explanation).

I feel nothing but sympathy for these youngsters and their situation and, having had two years of National Service in Europe, hold out little hope that military style discipline (i.e. bullying) will change their attitude. It certainly won't change their plight as bottom feeders.

Looking ahead, the future of US ties with the region's oldest friend continues to face obstacles.

The US doesn't have friends. It has vassals. Unfortunately, the same can probably be said for China.

Great idea. Now please drum this into the heads of arrogant head teachers and their staff who clearly believe that the role of parents is to pay up and shut up.

Rotten to the core.

Too busy rearranging the deckchairs and lilos.

I can hear the official rebuttals now. Boil 'em all down and they will amount to: "Ah well, you can't make an omelette. . . "

Hate to say it, but the Thai penchant for importing cheap, immigrant labour from the likes of Lao, Cambodia and Myanmar isn't exactly going to help stamp out malaria, which is becoming increasingly resistant to available prophylactics.