love1012

Hannah is laid to rest but the culprits are still alive.

Better we not forget that. Let's have some real justice. Not the Bull we have had to endure. Not the face saving

that has gone on. Where is our government. We are the police who went to observe.

A young woman who was brutally murdered in the prime of her life.

R.I.P Hannah

This is not about face saving.. this is about BIG money and MASSIVE corruption... This is not about face saving,, it's about saving jobs and careers .. it's about saving lives of everyone involved in the murders, in the coverup, in the corruption... Don't be fooled...

No...............its about someone with a relationship with the police has paid big money to the right people to save his family after they have committed murder two times!! Murder is not the same to a Thai as it is to a westerner

More conspiracy theories.

................But you admit its possible given that you believe the Police to be corrupt?

JD I want civilly ask you one question - can you be intelligent and give me a straight yes or no answer. Here goes.................

Do you believe the Royal Thai Police Force has a problem with internal corruption?

Yes, as do the police in the UK and US and everywhere else.

OK

So number one - you believe the police in Thailand ARE corrupt

number two you believe the police in the UK and in the USA are AS CORRUPT as the Thai police?

I believe there is corruption. That was the question asked. I also believe there's corruption in all police forces.

OK I wont push the point that you didnt answer the second lot of questions - but let me ask you this

If you agree that there is a lot of money on offer and the RTP ARE corrupt what is your reason for thinking they are NOT covering for Thai familys - doing false dna tests and blaming innocent people just to close the case - about the murders on Koh Tao?

The only money I know that was offered was for proof that someone was guilty.

A tech from a non police aligned hospital took the sample and it was tested at 3 prestigious hospitals.

Oh come on - i sure i rate one more! - if you agree that the Thai police are corrupt is it not possible that money was offered by the family at the AC Bar? COULD that happen in Thailand? IF that money was accepted could the Thai police then easily send a fake sample in - just say they sent "The Stations cleaning ladys" dna in - the hospitals would not need to be corrupt would they?

JD I want civilly ask you one question - can you be intelligent and give me a straight yes or no answer. Here goes.................

You are dreaming. The UK won't put sanctions on Thailand and nobody else has any reason to. In fact, what basis would the UK have for sanctions? 2 cits died, they don't like how the investigation was handled? Certainly a possibility, though we don't know how the UK government feels. People die all over and often as a result of the actions of foreign governments on foreign land. Usually with no investigation.

If the UK did, how would Thailand respond? Would they toss out the ambassador? Cancel the visas for UK cits?

What people seem to forget is that no country has standing to interfere in domestic matters of another country.

Do you believe the Royal Thai Police Force has a problem with internal corruption?

It's only a problem when bloody farang start getting involved on websites.

I know what youre saying - but Im not farang and i personally know of two Thai men who are on murder charges against police who have been over corrupt with them!! believe me Thais KNOW what the RP is like - its a HUGE topic of conversation in inner circles!! Believe me they are JUST as corrupt with Thai as with farang!! In non tourist areas obviously far more!!

So you have a personal connection to 2 people that are accused of murder and blame the police. Do you think this might show bias in your posts?

No..............I said I know of them

By the way do you see how easily I gave you a straight answer then?

Can you do the same for me now?

JD I want civilly ask you one question - can you be intelligent and give me a straight yes or no answer. Here goes.................

Do you believe the Royal Thai Police Force has a problem with internal corruption?

Yes, as do the police in the UK and US and everywhere else.

OK

So number one - you believe the police in Thailand ARE corrupt

number two you believe the police in the UK and in the USA are AS CORRUPT as the Thai police?

I believe there is corruption. That was the question asked. I also believe there's corruption in all police forces.

OK I wont push the point that you didnt answer the second lot of questions - but let me ask you this

If you agree that there is a lot of money on offer and the RTP ARE corrupt what is your reason for thinking they are NOT covering for Thai familys - doing false dna tests and blaming innocent people just to close the case - about the murders on Koh Tao?

JD I want civilly ask you one question - can you be intelligent and give me a straight yes or no answer. Here goes.................

You are dreaming. The UK won't put sanctions on Thailand and nobody else has any reason to. In fact, what basis would the UK have for sanctions? 2 cits died, they don't like how the investigation was handled? Certainly a possibility, though we don't know how the UK government feels. People die all over and often as a result of the actions of foreign governments on foreign land. Usually with no investigation.

If the UK did, how would Thailand respond? Would they toss out the ambassador? Cancel the visas for UK cits?

What people seem to forget is that no country has standing to interfere in domestic matters of another country.

Do you believe the Royal Thai Police Force has a problem with internal corruption?

It's only a problem when bloody farang start getting involved on websites.

I know what youre saying - but Im not farang and i personally know of two Thai men who are on murder charges against police who have been over corrupt with them!! believe me Thais KNOW what the RP is like - its a HUGE topic of conversation in inner circles!! Believe me they are JUST as corrupt with Thai as with farang!! In non tourist areas obviously far more!!

You are dreaming. The UK won't put sanctions on Thailand and nobody else has any reason to. In fact, what basis would the UK have for sanctions? 2 cits died, they don't like how the investigation was handled? Certainly a possibility, though we don't know how the UK government feels. People die all over and often as a result of the actions of foreign governments on foreign land. Usually with no investigation.

If the UK did, how would Thailand respond? Would they toss out the ambassador? Cancel the visas for UK cits?

What people seem to forget is that no country has standing to interfere in domestic matters of another country.

JD I want civilly ask you one question - can you be intelligent and give me a straight yes or no answer. Here goes.................

Do you believe the Royal Thai Police Force has a problem with internal corruption?

Yes, as do the police in the UK and US and everywhere else.

OK

So number one - you believe the police in Thailand ARE corrupt

number two you believe the police in the UK and in the USA are AS CORRUPT as the Thai police?

This complicity must go right to the top! Outrageous really that a country can stick two fingers up to the international community & get away with it. Only sanctions from the UK, and a tourist blacklist will make these creatures take any notice

I'd prefer to see full international sanctions against Thailand for that matter. It would hardly affect us who live here, but it would certainly affect KTao and this pair of corrupt, ugly, lying bastards, and the son, for that matter.

You are dreaming. The UK won't put sanctions on Thailand and nobody else has any reason to. In fact, what basis would the UK have for sanctions? 2 cits died, they don't like how the investigation was handled? Certainly a possibility, though we don't know how the UK government feels. People die all over and often as a result of the actions of foreign governments on foreign land. Usually with no investigation.

If the UK did, how would Thailand respond? Would they toss out the ambassador? Cancel the visas for UK cits?

What people seem to forget is that no country has standing to interfere in domestic matters of another country.

JD I want civilly ask you one question - can you be intelligent and give me a straight yes or no answer. Here goes.................

Do you believe the Royal Thai Police Force has a problem with internal corruption?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/8815241/What-the-way-you-walk-can-reveal-about-you.html

The unique way someone walks can betray who they are with almost as much accuracy as fingerprints, scientists have found.

The way Nom Sod walks is unique. The two videos show a person with the same gait.

Case closed.

I've been asking this allover and tried to find it on google:

Is it possible that close friends or relatives mimmick the same walking style of an alpha male? Subconsciously perhaps?

So IF the person seen running on CCTV in Koh Tao and Nom Sod have the same walking style, is it not possible that they simply mimick eachother or a third alpha male in a close group (family,friends,whatever)?

*edit* *spoiler alert* I do think it is possible,, As a youngster I found myself mimicking the walking styles of some rapper I liked ... One of my friends pointed it out to me because I was doing it subconsciously...

I think the saddest thing is people don't even realize how out there they sound and even go so far as submitting proof through a link that clearly states technology is not currently available to determine a person by their walk and certainly the facebook morons not using such technology and ignoring the fact that such idiotic internet detective work is not needs as it has been investigated and confirmed the kid wasn't on the island and they have matching dna to the two suspects in custody and this kid now has volunteered his dna in hopes it will stop such lunatic gossip and rumor based on idiocy.

From the link provided above ...

But despite more than three decades of research, using gait analysis as a biometric has never taken off. Until now, perhaps. Recent advances in the accuracy of automated gait recognition suggest the technology could soon form the basis for a new generation of security systems.

fitup fitup fitup!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"Pol Gen Somyot, however, made clear that the DNA test on the son would have no impact on the police case file which has been finished with all circumstantial and forensic evidence submitted to the prosecutor for indictment of the two Myanmar suspects."

What? Not even if it's a match?

It cannot be a match when it has already been matched to the suspects in custody. It is an impossibility he could also match unless he is an identical twin of one of the Burmese in custody for the crimes.

It would be like looking outside for you car when you already confirmed it was in the garage. Of course this is being done to try to help the silly and ignorant claims by conspiracy theorist but to do so one needs to do stupid things like perform a test for which the answer is already answered before realizing the conspiracy nuts will never stop and just get more outlandish and silly in their theories.

Yes it can if the police didnt fabricate the burmese dna - stop being such a nonce!!! There was also a third persons dna on her nipple which you brush away. thjats another garbage made up police police police post - from a mafia apologist whos desperate to supress peoples rights and free speech!!! Your own childish gibberish will continue no doubt..police.police..police!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If the police could and did fabricate the DNA in the other case then they wouldn't allow this test or would fabricate this too if it was possible. So, no the DNA from these suspects cannot match even if you believe in Santa and vast conspiracy theories taking place for not reason.

Another nonsensical effort to sound authoritative when you have no credibility

They take a swab throw it in the bin theyre innocent when they issue the paper - \DNA tests mean NOTHING in a corrupt society!! Therefore they can and have even if you support corrupt mafia apologists who answer peoples questions by calling them "nuts"!!! Your garbage statements dont break through intelligent peoples views! please dont talk to me - your views and your choice of language is distasteful and disrespectful of 2 murder victims!!

Woraphan, who was also briefly considered a potential suspect in the case, has threatened to press libel charges against anyone who attempts to link him or any of his family members to the killing of the two Britons."

There goes 90% of the Thaivisa membership!!

Add to that the CCA violations.. But I doubt that they will go after foreigners.

But you are not sure. That is why you have been hedging your bets here!! Smart guy!!

Nope. Have not hedged at all.

That being said, I am not stupid enough to publicly state that someone cleared by the police is guilty.

If the police decided tmw that the 2 Burmese men accused of being the killers have been cleared, I wouldn't revise my position that I thought they were guilty.

no why wold you see the need to start to introduce facts now at this stage of your TV posting career!!!!!!!!!!

you cannot criticise us we are corrupt but you cannot tell us..............only a baby brain would support and follow these people!!

Guess that means we are all going into hiding now;)

Just the ones posting nonsense and lies.

so you found a good hiding place then?

Some people just don't get it. It's not the Burmese DNA profile that us 'conspiracy theorists' are questioning, IT'S THE DNA PROFILES TAKEN FROM THE FEMALE VICTIM. Even though we've heard UK officials were SUPPOSED to have taken samples from the victim, WE DON'T KNOW WHETHER THEY DID. Therefore, all there is for comparison are samples taken by unqualified Thais (Ms Porntip said as much). The same unqualified Thais who have an agenda to shield the headman's family. That's also why the DNA press conference (with Nomsod) today was moot.

WE DON'T TRUST THE DNA TRAIL CRAFTED BY THAI OFFICIALDOM.

Have the Brit experts packed up and gone home? If so, that's a sad day for the victims' families and friends, and for the Burmese scapegoats. Even tho the Burmese will likely be let go for insufficient evidence, it's still been harrowing for them. They should be compensated Bt.10,000 each for each day they were falsely incarcerated.

You do realize that the semen would also have been collected during the autopsy right? I am not even sure if they would have even collected any of this from inside the victim at the scene but even if they did they certainly wouldn't have collected it all. They generally collect what they can at the scene because they can't collect and test it elsewhere.

Why would the Brits leaving be a sad thing? They will leave when they make their conclusions. I find it odd that you want to pay these two suspects money when even other conspiracy theorists actually are not so far gone as to admit they may be involved.

I can almost guarantee you the two will plead guilty because it is their only hope of seeing freedom again given the evidence against them.

One of the biggest problems in the early days of the RTP investigation was their persistence in releasing statements to the media. They made accusations about many suspects, who were later cleared. However in this plethora of released statements and information there were some good intentions namely the CCTV clip of the KT 'running man'. The then RTP Chief asked the media/public to examine the clip to identify the 'runner'. Well, surprise, surprise this is exactly what the media/public did, and what the RTP have have apparently so far failed to do, which is take a much closer look to make a positive identification. Maybe you and jdinisia should take a peek outside the 'RTP box' occasionally, and you'll find DNA isn't the only defining factor in proving the innocence/guilt of anyone. As you seem to base your postings on the RTP 'party' line do you have anything to say as to why the RTP have never made their findings known about the CCTV KT 'running man'? Unless the RTP clear up this aspect of the investigation they and not the media/public will appear to have been party to the conspiracy theory.

You are right a grainy video showing no crime of somebody who can barely be made out is much stronger evidence than an DNA match to semen in the victim, especially when the person in the low quality video turns out not to be who people thought.

police police police

JTJ keeps asserting the police line that Burmese DNA matched that found within victim.

There's one big hole in that assertion. If there is a frame-up (which many think there is) then it's easy to skew the data. For starters, who actually has the hard data showing the profile of the DNA found in the victim? Answer: COPS and only cops.

All they have to say, starting the day after arresting the Burmese, is: "their DNA matches." Who is going to go to the police and demand to see original results? Possibly only the prosecutors, but they've already sent the police report back 2 or 3 times for revisions (read: make the frame-up look more convincing). Plus, the prosecutors are working hand in hand with officialdom.

Another easy way to skew the DNA data: Take the Burmese boys' data, make a copy of it (it's probably on paper cards), and rename it: "Semen taken from victim." Doing that would also safeguard Nomsod, and would explain why he and his shielders were so nonchalant about submitting his DNA today, some grinning in the background.

Original samples were tested in Singapore. This was before implication of the two Burmese. They should have the original record. Trust nothing from Thai police. Send all new samples to Singapore for comparison.

I seemed to recollect that the RTP said they would be sending the samples to Singapore, but instead sent them to BKK, who distributed them to hospitals in Chiang Mai. While I could be mistaken on which hospitals tested the samples, it wasn't Singapore.

I'm going to answer without going back and finding the links to verify, but this is my understanding based on police statements over time (I'm sure I'll be quickly corrected if I'm wrong):

The initial tests to identify the DNA found on Hannah's body must have been done in Thailand--probably the forensic hospital where the autopsy was performed (I'm guessing)--because they were quickly able to compare samples from the initial 12 suspects against that first test (and I believe this happened before Singapore was mentioned as an option).

Afterwards, the police said they wanted to use the DNA to identify race but were unable to do so with their own technology, so they were going to send a sample to Singapore. They did identify the DNA as belonging to an "Asian", so it may well be they sent a portion of the original DNA sample to a Singapore lab at that time in order to determine race, not to do matching analysis.

After that, the police said that they had a backlog of DNA matching tests to perform, so they sent a portion of the original DNA sample (or perhaps just the results of earlier tests?) to several places in Thailand, including Chiang Mai, to perform the matching analysis.

So it's possible the the original sample was divided up and sent to several different places, or at least that the test results from the original sample was sent to several different places.

Nobody in the public knows the facts, so anything we say about this is pure speculation ... I don't even think reasonable inferences from what is known are possible here.

But both the prosecution and the defense should want to verify that any and all tests that were performed met the proper standards for reliable accuracy. That means tracking and verifying that the chain of custody was maintained and the proper standards were adhered to in gathering, handling, testing, analyzing, and storing all samples and test results.

Again, this would be true in any criminal investigation and prosecution, anywhere in the world, not just Thailand.

OK...............a sensible conclusion to a sensible post............but lets suggest that the Police want to protect the sample. Would they send a sample of the real DNA or would they send false DNA and misrepresent the results? Do we have proof they actually sent DNA? ............This is not a legitimate police force we are talking about here...........these are people that spend their Saturday mornings collecting 100nbaht from scooter riders and getting involved in any money making scam they can!! PLEASE stop giving RTP legitimacy - Thai people dont!!

If the father is angry, he should direct that anger at the police who identified and named his son as one of the prime suspect in the initial days of the 'investigation'....not at internet posters such as CSILA who seek to pursue and test that information. Have the police apologised for the "name and shame"? Probably not.

Prbkk...........Do you believe it is likely that these two are innocent and the Burmese boys are guilty? The mafia apologists have not shown one shred of evidence for this in 17pages of postings - only insults, name calling and repetition of police statements!! There is NOTHING to convince people of their innocence given some of the other strong proven evidence against them

Dear god, yap yap yap, has anyone bothered to click on this link http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/one-tourist-murder-suspect-now-arrested-another-run/ of todays date saying the police have already arrested Mon, the headman's brother and they are now seeking the headman's son who has fled to Bangkok

Head lines from said piece..................................One tourist murder suspect now arrested, another on the run

in General |September 23, 2014

(14,149 views)

History....they have been cleared since...................

Things in the past are history but the terminology of the statement cannot be changed.

"evidence which police collected were examined and proved he was involved"

" both suspects were captured by CCTV cameras and the police have gathered enough evidence to implicate them in the murders."

What changed? How can a Police Commisioner use the words "evidence," examined", "proved", and then state they were caught on CCTV and then these statements brushed aside.

Many posters complain about people using theories and insist posters use proper news and police statements to confirm or bolster their posts. This is from a commanding officer using words that accuse people of crimes and claims to have evidence to support it but now its brushed off as history.

How could a statement delivered to the press be so wrong? Maybe saying we believe or its possible then I could understand the confusion.

Maybe the "Evidence" they had in the beginning that the commander was so confident about should be observed by the UK Police.

If you accept "proved" here, surely you have to accept proved in other statements, as well as disproved

How can I accept it on both statements? That would mean both parties did it? Are you throwing your own conspiracy theories out there? Or they both didn't do it?

Please be a bit clearer in your statements. Maybe your too clever for me but it seems you just threw a quick retort out rather than answered my questions!

Exculpatory evidence disproved that statement. There were statements before and after. You are being disingenuous in taking only one as immutable.

exculpatory exculpable police police...............................you have no proof that that the Burmese did it - unanswered questions prove your fiends involvement. You have not posted one link that these two are innocent - http://mikeestravels.com/2014/09/25/the-dark-side-of-thailands-island-paradise/ someonw who knows far better than YOU!!!

Police taking kid's, they already cleared, DNA and now allowing Suspects in Custody DNA to be retested without even a demand from the defense. Will this satisfy conspiracy theorists, not a chance. It will just make them go at it harder. The more confirmation and evidence against the two in custody, they more they are convinced their is a conspiracy happening.

police police police conspiracy conspiracy conspiracy police police police - what comes next TVF posters?

It is nothing about conspiracy there a thousands of people who want to see evidence that he was not involved so that they see that this case is being handled honestly.

DNA is one thing but maybe some proof of phone records to show where he actually was at the time the crimes happened .

Why is it unfair to ask for to ask for this type of evidence.?

Maybe somebody else was using his phone or maybe they paid off the phone company to alter records ... exactly to what extent should a suspect cleared of a crime, a crime which two suspects are already in custody, have to go to prove his innocence to Internet Conspiracy Theorists who have absolutely no proof to even logically accuse him of being involved. DNA is not good enough but you somehow think phone records will be. Others have suggested things like airlines need to publicly release their passenger manifests.

If you mean 2 or 3 hundred thousand people who see a problem with this investigation and don't want to see innocent people jailed for life unless they are the real killers.

These 2 or 3 hundred thousand people have raised doubts so the proof should be shown to erase all doubts .

Not like you and your 2 mates who are happy to see these 2 accused burmese men put to the gallows as quick as possible.

Have a trial with a vigorous defense.

Not only are building a straw man, you are doing it poorly.

following a police lead i think its called

Many ask for evidence, proof, where's the link etc.

Forget about DNA, phones Sean and the rest.

Is there any disagreement that one of the most crucial factors here is the credibility of the RTP.

The UN have described them as a criminal organisation, the weight of history is against them.

Time after time it is the RTP who are revealed as the criminals involved in so many incidents in Thailand, it is not without reason they are despised by law abiding Thais.

They serve only one master, Greed. Justice is not on their agenda.

No. The UN has never said that. A person in no way associated with the UN used a UN definition and applied it to his opinion of the RTP.

if the UN did say that, you will have no problem providing a link.

where as YOU have a problem providing ANY links - they are not for the simple are they though!!?

BBC's Jonathan Head take on it:

"Bizarre performance as # KhoTao boss son has v public DNA sampling and blood test at police HQ Bangkok."

https://twitter.com/pakhead

Looking forward to hear some more details on the BBC about the "bizarre" statement

It is bizarre. Have you ever seen a person who is not a suspect show up with press to publicly give DNA?

Logic is not conspiracy theorists strong point but coming up with bizarre theories is.

whereas police apoligists only spout garbage!!

Ok, we can agree to disagree. I'd like to assume both of us would like the REAL criminals to be nailed for this horrendous crime.

However, to believe the 2 stills from the video evidence are a sound alibi is a reeaaaaally big stretch. Come on John, admit it.

There are 6 yr old Thais proficient on computers who could dispel that ruse.

Video is now available

Just because you didn't have it earlier doesn't mean that the investigation didn't.

video is now available that the son of Tuwichien did it

Just because you didn't have it earlier doesn't mean that the investigation didn't.

I assume you know that rumor mongering is against TVF rules?

so why do you do it? See TWO posts back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Stop breaking TVF rules JDJ JTJ