DoDoey

Why on earth do well-educated men ruin their lives over scamming bar girls?

Speculating perhaps but the odds are this is the fact

Sorry, but I missed the part where she was a bar girl. Shows where you spend your time - a..hole. RIP troubled man.

OK, I´ll bite:

Let´s say you open a coffee shop, at first you are not a threat or competition to anyone it all goes fine for a year or two. Then, some Thai person with influence¨ of some sort sees you are making money, so (as they do) they copy you. The trouble is they can not supply the same service as you and then wonder why they are not making money when you are obviously successful (NO comprehension of what is happening).

So he goes and sees cousin Somchai his police cousin, windows get broken, access gets blocked, your customers are being harassed (despite complaints to the police, nothing is done). You have a problem one night with young hoodlums robbing your shop, despite the timely phone call no one arrives from the police station for 2 hours!! You till has been emptied, you shop vandalized, your staff harassed and your customers have been terrorized to the extent they will not return.

Sooner or later you will be asking yourself, why did I do this?¨

If this doesn´t happen then your staff will be stealing from you unless you are there 24 / 7 and doing it all yourself anyway....

You forgot to mention greedy landlords who see success and decide to double the rent in the middle of your lease. If you say no thanks they they have electricity or water fiddled with etc etc. It all goes on. Or they want their brother cousin etc to move in and make money from all your good work. All this happens. Thais are very jealous people...even among themselves

BS , if you have a good contract they can't do that. Read the small print before you sign,

BS I saw both contracts and BOTH landlords, who I knew fairly well agreed with me and told him to dismantle the wall. They went with him to the police station and came back and said there was nothing they could do and apologized to me. It didn´t help the tennents I had who couldn´t get out of their rooms. I had to refund their money of course and they had to find other accommodation at 8pm.

It seemed to me the landlords had been warned off, their attitudes changed dramatically. This guy knew someone at the police station.

So how do you suggest it could have been rectified? With a prolonged court case? By the time that had happened, even assuming a win, it would have been all over and more money down the toilet !! Contracts are worthless unless you can enforce them and if the police will not get involved what hope have you got?

I have seen people get into yearly contracts simply because premises are hard to come by in good locations. The landlord plays the game and as soon as the business becomes profitable take it over. Yes buyer beware I guess, but isn´t that what this thread is about? NEVER assume it wont happen.....

EDIT to add :

I have also seen people win court cases and / or get judgements from the police. Guys with Thai wives even, they just stop paying!! What do you do then? Go to the police every second month? Pay the police every time it happens? NEVER EVER forget, they are Thai, you are not !! Thailand is for Thais !!!

I hope this is a reality check....

I have to call 'some' BS on this too. Since you insist on high-jacking my post and making it about owning a business in Thailand...

The facts, as you state:

You bought a guesthouse which was, admittedly, not well positioned to receive customers, unless they crossed a neighbor's threshold. Then, you started to have some success, and said neighbor decided to 'brick in' your customers. You, instead of fighting for your property, albeit rented, decided it was best to walk away even though you were in the right. You didn't want to fuss with all that litigation. I'm sorry, my friend, but unless you received this guesthouse for free, how could you walk away without a fight? I haven't seen a guesthouse anywhere in Thailand for less than 1,000,000, and even those seem sketchy. How much did you lose? Are you really saying your loss was inconsequential, and not worth any effort? Sorry, but I don't see Thailand being so corrupt that you wouldn't put in a law suit of your own, including lost income.

However, if, like the guy who bought property being serviced by a free water line who was surprised when his neighbor cut off said water supply, you bought a business without a legal right of way, then is the shame on you or is the shame on Thailand? Shame on you my friend. I'm glad you learned from your mistake, but I think you're misstating or omitting some key facts. No one walks away from a million baht, especially those to whom a million baht is not a lot of money.

I don't think it's mafia related. The news report I read on Bangkokpost.com was that a drunken Turkish tourist tried to get a bar to serve him after closing time. When they refused, he went somewhere to get a gun and then threatened the bar again. The security guard subsequently shot him in self-defence.

However, you have to wonder why a guard would be carrying a gun in the first place.

The way the article is written gives me the impression that guns are commonplace on the island which is a bit disturbing.

I can't link to Bangkokpost on this forum since it's forbidden, but here's the Google link to the story. You'll see the link to Bangkokpost on the opening page.

EDIT: Before you seriously consider opening a bar, read this article: http://www.retire-asia.com/thai-bar.shtml

Finally! Someone actually read the original post and responded! Thank you!

Some media reports on TV said he was turkish mafia and protected foreigners on Samui. Do you know anything about this? What could possibly be going on there, and how could a gun toting turkish mafia be running around on Samui? Sounds odd to me, but again, I haven't been there, and no plans go.

Again, for the last time, this post is not about owning a bar!

Small monthly donation to the local police by your bar....you need assistance...you call them and problem solved.

This is how it works in Thailand - several years ago my wife sold her bar/restaurant and the guy who bought it didn't pay the police for protection (my wife did) and 6 months later the police raided his bar and closed him down.

How much did you wife pay every month?

This post was supposed to be about the supposed foreign mafia in Thailand, but it's been hijacked into a discussion on what a bad idea it is to open a business in Thailand, and probably by people who have never owned a business here. I simply added the bit about musing over a bar for context.

Answer the questions at the top of the page please.

OK, I´ll bite:

Let´s say you open a coffee shop, at first you are not a threat or competition to anyone it all goes fine for a year or two. Then, some Thai person with influence¨ of some sort sees you are making money, so (as they do) they copy you. The trouble is they can not supply the same service as you and then wonder why they are not making money when you are obviously successful (NO comprehension of what is happening).

So he goes and sees cousin Somchai his police cousin, windows get broken, access gets blocked, your customers are being harassed (despite complaints to the police, nothing is done). You have a problem one night with young hoodlums robbing your shop, despite the timely phone call no one arrives from the police station for 2 hours!! You till has been emptied, you shop vandalized, your staff harassed and your customers have been terrorized to the extent they will not return.

Sooner or later you will be asking yourself, why did I do this?¨

If this doesn´t happen then your staff will be stealing from you unless you are there 24 / 7 and doing it all yourself anyway....

Is this story based on fact, or is it the fiction it appears to be? If it's not fiction, then please state some facts. Who did this happen to? What city? When? What was the final outcome? Sounds like TVF Thai bashing to me. This is what I want to figure out, is there any reality to "mafia" or "protection" claims? Or is it the product of a bunch of bitter farts?

Thanks for the advice. Buying a bar in Jomtien is not likely, only something I've pondered once or twice. My questions are about the supposed mafia; Russian, Turkish, whatever. Reading these posts, you would imagine Thailand is like the wild west, or Chicago in the 1930s. I just don't see any of that here in Bangkok, and wonder how real it is. I haven't seen it in Jomtien, or Chiang Mai for that matter. Could some of you locals of Pattaya, Phuket, Samui kindly explain the reality of the foreign mob here in Thailand? I could easily imagine Thai mafia, but I can't see Thai mafia putting up with foreign mafia. It would be too easy to get rid of them, one phone call to Uncle hiso policeman.

Now, I have seen plenty of thuggish Russians. They're loud and drunk, and I steer clear of them, but that doesn't make them mafia. Are these the 'mafia' so many speak of? Simple tourists?

Greetings TV Forum members. I posting these questions after reading about the recent shooting on Koh Samui involving a Turkish man, who was reportedly "mafia who protected foreign business owners". My questions are not about this particular incident, but rather the shady underside of owning a business in Thailand.

Why would a farang business owner need protection, and from whom? I can imagine a disco or go go bar needing this, but does this extend to small business, like guest houses or pubs? Granted I've never been to Samui or Phuket, but I live in Bangkok and have visited Jomtien a few times. I've often thought about buying a small bar, like the ones you see near the beach on Jomtien, do those kind of places need protection, or are they hustled by mafia? If so, to what extent?

On Samui, why would a security guard at a pub carry a shotgun? I've never seen this in anywhere in Thailand.
Thanks!

Yes.

Thanks Don, can you offer any details? Which banks, typical terms, qualifying? Thanks again for your reply.

I know this question has been asked over the years, but I can't find a recent thread. The latest I could find was 2010.

I'm a foreigner working legitimately in Thailand; work permit, Visa, paying taxes, etc. Married to Thai national with no income. Are there any banks offering mortgages to individuals under these circumstances? We're looking for a condo in BKK.

Thank you.

Hello, I'm posting this for a friend.

He is here as an intern working at a hotel in BKK. He has a Non ED Visa that will expire about the same time his internship ends. He wants to stay in Thailand for a month and travel around.

His question is will he have to leave Thailand to get the tourist Visa, or can he get it here in BKK at Chaengwattana without leaving the country?

Thank you!

BULL......I remember the Thai government said the same... 3 years ago about Vietnam.....they would sign a agreement to let Thai cars drive into Vietnam...on the 1 of Januari.......Bla bla bla bla.....the usual .....bull...shitt......when I got to the border between Laos and Vietnam round February...they would not let Thai cars in....no agreements were signed......!!!!

I could go because I had a VISA....My Thai wife could go for free because they have agreements in Asean comunity......but my car could not......and Once back at the Laos side I had to buy a new Visa into Laos.....a waste of money.....

They just good in talking..... we gonna do this we gonna do that....nothing ever happens.....!!!!

Is English your native language?

What difference does that make? Obviously no, but at least he can communicate well enough to post on an English site. Let's see you post something on his native language site. Are you British?

Great, a super-highway through Kanchanaburi.

"He served a 10 yr prison term to be be released early (3 years) on condition that he return back to Thailand not to return to the USA."

Flat out false. No American court has the power to do this to an American citizen. This is 2014, not 1714.

@OP,

Couple of comments.

The US does not honor your Thai marriage. So you coming over with her and being married in Thailand means very little. You need to complete the process in the US. It makes EVERYTHING way easier.

TravelerEastWest stated she can immediately come and work in the US. That is not true. She cannot. She does not have a SSN and greencard in hand and both are absolutely required to work legally(I used the term "legally")

As for tax purposes. You cannot claim your wife or child until they have a SSN. You need to apply for all of that once you have immigrated here. That is part of the naturalization process. While the US is noted for just giving out money, they are not going to blatantly just allow people to claim dependents on your tax return with out some sort of number. If they did expats would claim they have a family of 20. This is why my wife and I married here in the states and did not in Thailand. It had no benefits whatsoever to get married in Thailand. Eventually when we move back we will do a Thai wedding to appease the Thai family side.

Best is to apply for a Fiance Visa and start the process. No lawyer needed. Just us the US Gov process.

Best of Luck

I went through the fiancee process too, and if he says they were married in Thailand, and backs it up with photos as the OP is planning on doing, he will not qualify for the K1 Fiancee Visa. Regardless of whether it's registered or not.

I haven't read all the replies, sorry if I repeat some information. I did the same thing about 8 years ago. Buddhist wedding in Thailand, brought Mother and Step-daughter to the US. Visajourney is an excellent resource. I never used an attorney and did all the paperwork myself with help from the VJ forum.

You may want to consider the K1, or Fiancee Visa. It takes less time to process than the Marriage Visa, at least it did 8 years ago. It took 6 months from application date to my fiancee's arrival in the US, and Marriage Visas were taking up to a year, and sometimes more. If you go that route, do not mention on any Visa application that you've done the Buddhist wedding already. Once you declare that you've been married already, even if it's not registered at the Amphur, you won't have a choice which Visa route you choose, only Marriage Visa. VIsajourney has a neat tool where you can see the current processing times for different Visas. With a K1 you can still bring daughter over, but I believe the daughter is on a K2 Visa. With the K1 Visa, your 'fiancee' has 90 days to marry you in the US, and then you can apply for the green card, but I believe she can work upon marriage to you. We got married at the county courthouse a week after my fiancee arrived.

Good Luck!

After 8 years, we've moved back to Thailand, but that's another story!

My situation was that I was in the US, and was bringing by fiancee over. It will be different if you're living in Thailand and filing from here...

first step would be to register your marriage at u.s. embassy married abroad get that do. do you file taxes yes start to file married joint returns get your wife a TIN number and file. go back and redo your 3 three years from when you were married you get some cash back. you have to get her a green card only way drop your thailand lawyer you dont need him. get a great immigration lawyer in Cali takes about 1 year to 18 months. cost about 5000 plus lawyer fees only way even if she has no intention of working- americans think everyone comes to work in american.

or just set up in a nice part of thailand not anywhere in the south , with great international schools raise and live with your family there wife is close to family daughter learns english

You can totally do this yourself, no lawyer. But, you seem to be a man of means, so it might be better to go that route. It all depends on your personal situation. If 5 or 10 thousand doesn't make you shy, then go with the lawyer. Personally, I found the experience rewarding to do it myself, and never had any issues. No documents returned, no requests for more proof, etc. But be aware, if you're not detail oriented, it would be a confusing endeavor. There are lots and lots of USCIS horror stories out there. But, like I said, it can be easy too.

You can get some Great information here at Thai Visa. I think it would be best to go to the U S Embassy They will get you on the right path so you can take your family back to the U S Best of luck. I know from experience it will be a real shock to your family and will take adjustment to the American way of life. With a lot of work on your part helping them. Culture shock will be something to overcome. It will just take time.

Great point about the culture shock. Consider where the local Thai Temple is when you're looking for a place to live. You'll be surprised, there's one in almost every major city. I was surprised when we went for the first time that there were two Thai monks. Although we lived in a state capital, it was pretty small as cities go, yet there was a place we could go and feel like we were back in Thailand for a few hours.

Consider the locale of Asian, or even Thai, grocery stores. Try to find a home central to all. In San Diego, I'm sure there'll be a Thai Temple and plenty of Thai markets (grocery stores), so no worries there, but be conscious of it.

Don't know how much TV your wife watches, but there's a website with all Thai programming on demand, and it's very cheap. This could be a double edged sword, my wife ended up watching all Thai TV online, and very little American (English) programming, and I think that hindered her adjustment some, in hindsight.

The major difference for my wife was the social interaction we Westerners have. In Thailand you can simply go downstairs and buy dinner on the street for 50 baht, and chat it up with your friends for a while. Thais will leave the front door open and socialize with people as they walk by, granted most doors have the iron bars and lock. This is completely different is the states. People come home, they go inside their homes, and they lock the door. You'll be lucky to get people to say hello, let alone get to know you. For a Thai, the silence of being home alone can be deafening, hence the Thai TV online. Good luck and PM me in you have any questions.

I haven't read all the replies, sorry if I repeat some information. I did the same thing about 8 years ago. Buddhist wedding in Thailand, brought Mother and Step-daughter to the US. Visajourney is an excellent resource. I never used an attorney and did all the paperwork myself with help from the VJ forum.

You may want to consider the K1, or Fiancee Visa. It takes less time to process than the Marriage Visa, at least it did 8 years ago. It took 6 months from application date to my fiancee's arrival in the US, and Marriage Visas were taking up to a year, and sometimes more. If you go that route, do not mention on any Visa application that you've done the Buddhist wedding already. Once you declare that you've been married already, even if it's not registered at the Amphur, you won't have a choice which Visa route you choose, only Marriage Visa. VIsajourney has a neat tool where you can see the current processing times for different Visas. With a K1 you can still bring daughter over, but I believe the daughter is on a K2 Visa. With the K1 Visa, your 'fiancee' has 90 days to marry you in the US, and then you can apply for the green card, but I believe she can work upon marriage to you. We got married at the county courthouse a week after my fiancee arrived.

Good Luck!

After 8 years, we've moved back to Thailand, but that's another story!

"It's renewable for life pending they don't just uproot the program one day." - who are the "they" you are referring to? Thailand hasn't even got a Government at the moment.

It's an unstable country. Who knows what will happen here.

When's the last time Thailand has ever done anything for the benefit of farang here?

"uproot the program one day" - definately a possibility.

It survived massive losses since 2003 and it's still here. Two coups and guess what, it's still here.

It's not going anywhere as people are buying in. Many people.

Think about this for a second.

My friend scuba dives and works instructing. It costs him 6000 baht a month to maintain his work permit and jump through all the hoops that goes with that.

On the other hand, for a little over 8000 baht a month you can have this elite card and no hassles at immigration or yearly visits.

It's well worth the 500k.

Why does it cost your friend 6000 baht a month to maintain his work permit?

Perhaps backpackers are finding cooler places in the world to travel to. Koh Chang for example, was a cool place to visit 30-40 years ago. No paved roads, no access to White Sands beach other than by path through the jungle, villages like Baan Bang Bao virtually inaccessible. Waterfalls such as the one at Klongprao had to be discovered, no signs, hardly anyone went there. No ferry. A fisherman would take you in his boat for 40 baht.

Would be hugely disappointed to go now though.

I was in Phnom Penh last weekend and it was busy busy busy. Hotels and restaurants were brimming with tourists. Seemed like mostly young Europeans and Australians, but a bit more upscale than backpackers for the most part. Plenty of dirt roads and hidden/undiscovered places over there. Everything - food, beer, hotels, shopping, was very inexpensive.

@DoDoey

The US is a Constitutional Republic. It is not a Democracy!

You are correct, but you see my point?

An astute and balanced assessment of the situation by one in the know (as evidenced by the below quote).

"Chalerm said the controversial "blanket amnesty" brought an end to the Yingluck government because it (finally) provided the PDRC with a valid reason to overthrow the government".

And just think, if the Yellows had let democracy run it's course, Thaksin would probably have been legitimately voted out of office by now.

The people have the democratic right to protest.

When a govt is trying to pass an amnesty bill for criminals and corrupt politicians because their leader is both they are especially entitled to do so.

The right to protest inept govt and corruption is part of democracy.

"The people have the democratic right to protest."

True, except when their protest includes physically preventing other citizens from exercising their right to vote (the core of what democracy means).

The protests were a fundamentally non-democratic--actually, anti-democratic--in aim and action.

No.

What suthep did in blocking elections was wrong.

The protests themselves were a democratic expression of anger at the arrogant lords and ladies of misrule that was the last PT govt.

Oh give it a rest, Bluespunk. You can't back peddle out of this one. The right to protest and the definition of democracy are two different things. The ability to protest is a "right" in some countries. it is a right of the people of the United States, which is also a Democracy. Note the word also. A democratic nation may or may not allow it's people to protest, and still be considered a democracy. China allows forms of protest, but that doesn't make it a democracy.

Why does Chalerm even make these statements? "Chalerm believes there are only two scenarios that could lead to a Pheu Thai defeat: Thaksin dies or quits politics."

Didn't Thaksin assert that he was finished with politics? Or, is was this a lie?

A better question is, why is Chalerm allowed to make these statements, given the current structure of government. Surely, Chalerm measured the consequences of making this statement, and he decided to so no matter how agitating it might be.