Loeilad

1 minute ago, FitnessHealthTravel said:

 

Not sure why you are apologizing for your post. Why...It's not Political Correct to speak your mind. Mate, it is what it is.  The photo you posted is the far south side of Lamai beach and it protected geographically this time of the year from direct storms. The swell and winds change. There are certain places that 'collect' the trash such as South Chaweng. You will also find that just past that rock in the background of your photo the sand disappears almost completely due to the tide and swell direction changes. So parts of the island are beautiful, South Lamai is this time of the year.  Thanks for the pic.

 

 

The beach at Lamai is cleaned - sure - but where do they put the rubbish?? We know they have problems with th incinerator and also the landfill.....on Samui - so in effect all they are doing is saving up the problem for later.

2 minutes ago, maddermax said:

If you watch the Thais around town you can see that they have no pride in their country as they drop rubbish anywhere and everywhere.  Some years ago the UK Government had a campaign, telling people to 'Have pride in your country' and 'take your rubbish home' which were very successful.  A similar scheme here would be very timely.

If you were around in the 60s in US or Uk will remember exactly the same - it took some massive yet very effective national campaigns to change the public's attitude towards littering. (see the relevant picnic episode of Md Men).

However  unsightly littering may be it isn't the sum total of the problem - although a change of attitude might go a long way to convincing the authorities that they have a responsibility to do something (if they too are litterers how can we expect change?)

41 minutes ago, johnny49r said:

Some people mentioned that folks should simply take their trash to a bin instead of tossing it on the ground.

Anyone seen a bin lately? And if there was one, who would empty this magical bin?

Even the big metropolitan places like malls and the airport have precious few disposal bins. 

 

Thai culture also prevents proper disposal and recycling of trash. I have seen countless adults and children simply toss their trash on the roadside. 

Thais apparently see beauty in a landscape choked with plastic waste. Perhaps I just need attitude adjustment!

not so much "Thai Culture" they simply don't hae a garbage collection infrastructure - which requires taxes.

32 minutes ago, bkkgriz said:

However, not a single person will lift a finger and actually do anything about it. All talk, no action.

Garbage disposal needs paying for - paying for it means taxes.

It is good to check out the Swedish model for this - some reports exaggerate the whole process but the reality is that countries like Sweden are getting more and more of their energy needs by burning rubbish. Installation is costly but the end results pay for themselves over time and of course the spin-off is good for tourism and other industries that rely on a clean environment.

1 hour ago, notmyself said:

 

 

 There are a couple of questions you could ask yourself here.....

Is all the garbage you see on beaches from locals or even Thailand - simple answer -  NO!

why do people throw their garbage away like this? - Simple answer - there is no proper refuse collection system and disposing of it in any other way would be too costly.

May I suggest that next time you are on the beach you take some time to examine the rubbish - it's quite fascinating......firstly you nature of the rubbish will give you some idea of what caused it - lots of vegetation etc is usually run-off from the land after a storm.

Plastics are the big giveaway though as they often retain their labels - e.g language and country of origin -  this isn't dropped by tourists it has often come thousands of miles across seas or been dumped illegally in these waters.

other rubbish is overflow from the inefficient disposal of rubbish particularly on islands.

Think about what happens is you conscientiously put your garbage in the bin (why did you accept all that packaging in the first place??)

the bins ae then collected - usually too infrequently by the local rubbish collector - the operatives mange to lose/spill quite a bit which then gets blow about again.

the rubbish on many islands is take to incinerators - these don't work so it is then dumped in landfill which allows even more rubbish to escape at get blown back into the general environment - then water draining through the land fills seeps back into the water table or into the sea and you can swim in it....NICE!

So don't be surprised if while you are swimming something brushes against your body and it turns out to be the ice cream wrapper you carefully placed in a bin 5 days ago.

Here's yet another thread for an environment forum.

welcome to paradise - sorry about the Rubbish

5 minutes ago, DinoSabanovic said:

There is no money in it so why should they clean? Thai logic no?

Of course there is money in it! If the beaches are dirty the customers will go elsewhere..

Plastic is the sea is a worldwide problem - it isn't just generated by the beach you are one it comes from all over the world. it is then shifted around by wind, tides and the great currents of the oceans.

Many people don't realise that every time they eat seafood they are also ingesting micro plastics that have come through the food chain.

Of course you ca tackle the problem to some degree locally.

you ca clean beaches - but this isn't solving the problem, it is just sweeping it under the carpet.....where do you put the stuff you've cleaned? Into the over filled over stressed garbage facilities that eventually end up dumping a lot of it into the sea - and then where does it go?

Another regional problem is enforcement - there ae thousands of ships plying the seas looking for places to dispose of their garbage - and this costs - so if you find an area where you can dump and get away with it, so much the better......of course the seas around S.E. Asia are full of ships, but also full of corruption and a lack of agencies set up to pursue these polluters.

Finally - it is very unpleasant to see garbage floating in the sea and on a beach, but remember a lot of the most serious pollution is invisible - it can be in land se or air - only a chemical  or detailed analysis of the water will reveal the most sinister pollutants - and can you rely on the Thai authorities to do this???

Thailand is undergoing massive changes - Tourism, industry and extension of cities....wildlife trafficking, flooding drought etc are all major issues that the country is facing yet there is still no forum to discuss these issues that actually affect the very circumstances in which we live  in Thailand.

Wildlife trafficking

De-forestation

Dam building

Road development through the last remaining virgin forests

163 new species identified along the Mekong

Proposed Railways and their ramifications on locals and the countryside.

walkways along the Chaopraya in Bkk

the Tiger Temple scandal

Irrigation - micro and Macro

Island eco-systems

Trash/garbage Dumps

Water supplies on islands

Animal cruelty/rescue

the state of National Parks

Sea pollution

the Pollution caused around industrial estates.

Coal-fired power plants - e.g the one in Krabi

Steel plants in Prachuap kiri Khan and along the gulf coast

Deep-water ports and their infrastructure.

are these really suitable topics for the "pets" forums as suggested by Thaivisa?

Sadly most of it is about "spelling reform" which is NEVER repeat NEVER gonna happen.

11 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

I was talking about one particular issue; whether or not the rights of EEA citizens already living in the UK and British citizens already living in other EEA states will be maintained after Brexit.

"Be careful what you wish for! Switzerland and Norway are both small countries with specialised ‘niche’ economies: Switzerland with its often-criticised banking system, and Norway with its massive oil reserves. 

But their industries have to follow EU rules as that’s their main market. As non-members, they have no say over the adoption of those EU rules. They cannot defend their interests. They have, effectively, lost sovereignty through their isolation — as the Norwegian government itself admits."

16 hours ago, EnlightenedAtheist said:

 

Is this your take on spelling and spelling reform or the view of David Crystal? If the latter, I assume you endorse this. Right?

Correct...it is a bit long to read but I think my gist is clear 

"there, it is because the English Empire spread to many countries whose population had to adopt it or so an interest in doing so (financial)."

this shows a fundamentally flawed understanding of why EL is used on a world scale 

On 18/12/2016 at 5:28 PM, 7by7 said:

 

Errr, as the EC (European Commission) is the executive body of the EU, same thing.

 

Of course, just as, for example, the British civil service proposes and drafts legislation for the British government, the commission does the same for the EU. But the civil service cannot make law, and neither can the commission.

 

To become EU law, proposals have to be agreed by the European Parliament and/or the Council of Ministers.

 

In this case; both: EU freedom of movement and residence

But we're splitting hairs.

 

 

If you say so, I can't be bothered to search through the agreement.

 

However, I think it's safe to say that whatever agreement the UK and EU come to on this issue will be accepted by Norway, Iceland, Liechtenstein and Switzerland as well.

I think not..if interests like oil and fishing overlap there will be problems 

4 hours ago, EnlightenedAtheist said:

 

Is this your take on spelling and spelling reform or the view of David Crystal? If the latter, I assume you endorse this. Right?

Correct...it is a bit long to read but I think my gist is clear 

It's quite clear that some not only are totally unaware of the child removal practices of successive Australian  governments right up to present day...but also feel they are able to make sweeping assumptions about the state or behaviour of the respective parents.

There is no mitigation for the attrocious acts committed upon the various indigenous  nations of Australia..

These members should should be ashamed of themselves 

interesting to read the posts by racists trying to mitigate this crime - "RANT"? - I ask you!

If named the school will probably sue the parents, namers etc.....

3 hours ago, jpinx said:

No-one is denying that the decision has yet to be made on how Article 50 is enacted, and then what the timetable will be.  Meantime the rest of the EU is squabbling about who should sit down to negotiate with UK.  It's all moot, subject to the various elections across Europe anyway.  Hollande has backed out and Merkel is not guaranteed a majority and the Dutch have to decide what they want.  As I keep saying, it's all to play for yet.  2017 is going to be interesting

Feeble excuses...clutching at straws...Brexiteers simply had no idea and now are groping around for lame excuses to mitigate their blunders .  You can't blame the news on others    . .you started it

More evidence that Brexiteers simply  didn't  think things through ..

UK faces Brexit settlement bill of up to £50 billion,

It seems that along with most Brexiteers - new convert Theresa May hadn't got a clue when she seized the chance of becoming PM what the job entailed........

Brexit deal could take 10 years and still fail, UK ambassador warns 

Where There's a May, there's a mess!

This is how Brexiteers are seen to be dealing with Brexit.....

34 minutes ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

That famous or infamous banking secrecy that was at the heart of Switzerland.... is already compromised and will further be eroded if not unmasked completely in many cases by 2018.

 

They already have agreement with the US which requires sharing of information (FATCA 2013/14) on US citizens having accounts in Swiss financial institutions.  Basically any country that wants to do business with US citizens have to comply with the same regulations or be barred and potentially fined heavily in the US.  If you are a US citizen, the bank will ask for your Social Security Number and they have to provide account information as well as do withholding of tax on accounts -- it is phased in so each successive year there are more requirements that must be implemented .... basically until they are pretty well providing all the information that any US domestic bank does.  If they did not do that, they would have lost access to do any business in New York or the US as a whole.   This FATCA reporting is likely going to be extended between more than just bilaterally with the US.... as more countries end up with the same requirements (most western countries are progressing that way).  

 

The EU have also started applying pressure and as of 2015 Switzerland agreed to align Swiss bank practices with those of EU countries.  By 2018 both Switzerland and EU countries will be required to exchange information on financial accounts on each others residents.  Failure to compromise would have lead to a similar situation with the EU that Switzerland was facing with the US.

you still miss the point! I make a point about pork pies and you tell me everything you know about umbrellas....

1 hour ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

Switzerland negotiated to be part of EFTA but a referendum failed to confirm it so it has just sort of sat there.

 

The politicians then turned around and negotiated a sector by sector agreement (basically implementing everything in the EFTA by sector - or mostly) - which included full free movement of EU citizens and labour.  Since 2014 when the citizens basically have abrogated the agreement by voting for limits on free movement and voting for preferential treatment of Swiss citizens when it came to labour - the relationship has been strained and frozen.   Also since all those agreements are static - they are in the process of becoming unwieldily to manage (120 such sub agreements) - which will also lead to a further schism .... this will lead to Swiss actually regressing and will eventually fail (IMHO).    The EU project has been about basically creating a United States of Europe and associated territories (similar to Puerto Rico and Guam) and thus they ideals behind the project cannot allow for immigration controls between states .... just like they don't in the US.  If a state is not well managed or is poorer labour migrates to better off states in search of job opportunities.  What is missing is a stronger enforcement of a common border and controlling uncontrolled migrations from outside the EU, and better management of skills and family based EU immigration.

THat's not the point - Switzerland has maintained a strict neutrality for centuries - their economy is based on this - e.g. holding everyones gold and financial assets during times of war.......being part of the EU would violate this status. however they WANT to be as much a part of Europe as they can to the point of overriding eons of historical precedent. B ritain is alone in wanting to move AWAY from EU......even Iceland and norway with their tiny populations are "joiners"

I think it is now established that nothing good will come of Brexit, but Brexiteers assure us that everything will be  OK and nothing will actually change.......so why vote Brexit in the first place?