Tod Daniels

I came across this phrase in a magazine article I was reading the other day. I took the meaning in the context of the article to be something along the lines of "vague, oblique", or "circuitous"; in a rambling fashion, without supporting your observation with facts. This can have the results of being 'thought provoking', or 'bewildering' depending on the topic and situation.

It even works in your example sentence;

Because he spoke so “vaguely, obliquely, circuitously", many people wondered what he did in fact say.

Off Topic:

Granted, the words oblique, and circuitous have their own thai equivalents, (with the last word being the new slang word ‘weng’ "เหวง" in tribute to Dr. Weng and his penchant for talking without making a point; in common usage "อย่ามาเหวง" or "Don't weng me!")

Back On Topic:

At first I thought Lexitron might have gotten the engrish definition wrong and they meant it to be "indistinct" rather than “indiscreet”. However, some further research lead me to believe it could also be a simple misspelling in the english definition (indiscreet/indiscrete) too. FWIW: I didn’t even know the engrish meaning for “indiscrete”, but it seems it could fit, as I found out it means something along the lines of; “not divided into parts, or appearing not to consist of separate parts”.

“RickBradford” and ‘tgeezer” seem to be on the right track with “indistinct” and “vague” being the best meanings offered out so far.

Okay, I can almost touch type anything in thai I wanna write on the p/c. I can do transcription (uhh, type what I see in thai from a page into a word document). I can chat on ‘M” no problem. .. But man, I just spent nearly 30 minutes tryin' to hand key the b/s thai language message thru my mobile phone; "How are you? I'm okay. Yes, I still live on Soi 12, visit me when you have free time. Take care, na. .."

Is it me or is typin' thai on a touch tone phone really that hard? I even had go out on the internet and find which thai characters were under which numbers on a standard touch tone phone keypad!! Still, even looking at that on my p/c monitor, it took me nearly 23 minutes to type in thai what is maybe a 45 second engrish SMS!

I can't be that stupid, can I? (FWIW: this is a rhetorical question, meaning no answer is wanted OR needed! )

If anyone else has a problem typin' thai language SMS's lemme know, but ONLY if you have an OLD model phone, not an I-fone, or something like that. My mobile is nearly a 5 year old Sony-Ericsson.

Actually, about the only good thing for my phone is; you can leave it on the table at any thai food court when you go piss, and NO ONE will steal it! While your gone, they might look at it (as in, when you come back it's been moved), but because it's SOO old, they just leave it on the table, lol. Go figure . ..

In other news; I went to Fortune Tower today, and a phone guy at a shop there said he'd give me 200 baht in trade for the screen but everything else on my phone was junk and he'd just throw it away!

Still my mobile works perfectly, has been repaired at the Sony shop many times, and is still going strong (okay, you caught me, it's still going medium, ok?.

Lemme know how you get on with typin' thai language SMS's? Easy or Hard?

All passports are scanned and entries added to the entry-database. Notice the machine-readable text at the bottom of your passports main page?

BUT the question which begs to be asked IS;

Did they have that technology 22+ years ago?

Hmmm, lemme think, one more second, (and while I could be wrong) I highly doubt they had MICR numbers on passports for South Korea way back in 1988-89 or when ever he actually entered the glorious "Land 'O Thais". (I could be wrong after googling MICR readers, but I don't think so).

I still say, get a new passport; take the OLD one, the new one, and a pile 'o money for fines out to thai immigrations at Changwattana. WITH a ticket outta the country he can sort this out easier than any b/s lie he makes up on the spot. Especially if he doesn’t show up and at least act like he’s there; “hat in hand”. He shows up with an attitude or like he's entitled to something and it won't fly, that is almost 100% guaranteed.

I don't believe for a second, he's gonna be able to arrive at Suvarnabhumi with a ticket for South Korea and skate out with the normal minute talkin' to and a fine; AFTER a 20+ year overstay! This is a VERY serious <deleted> up on his part!

This guy seems to not have the slightest clue about just how serious his problem is or how hard it can be made for him by thai immigrations should they choose the hard way rather than the easy way.

AS AN ASIDE: I recently found out Changwattana has records of entries and departures for easily the last 23+ years from EVERY border crossing; should they care to peruse the microfiche files and find 'em for you.

Good luck to him, let us know how it pans out, will you?

Remember, knowledge is power!

P/S; to answer the topic of the O/P's post the maximum overstay fine is 500 baht a day but it caps out at 20K baht, so 40 days or 40 years overstay, the fine is technically the same. It tops out at 20,000baht!

You just repeat บ่าย--so it's ชาติหน้าตอนบ่ายบ่าย.

I've had the same problem with not knowing how much to repeat; I guess it's just a case of copying what you hear.

Thanx for that, I had never heard the phrase before, so really didn't know how much to repeat.

Asking outside my apartment gate out on the soi straightened me out very quickly. Those thai guys I drink with don't take my spoken thai mistakes all that easy, and are more than happy to correct my errant ways! That's a good thing for me because no one loses face be it speakin' engrish or thai, it's a language exchange, and a drink-fest combined. AND yes, sadly the quality of languages being exchanged goes down in proportion to the amount of alcohol we drink, but still good fun all around. What's that thai idiom for "in one ear and out the other"? Isn't it เข้าหูซ้ายทะลุหูขวา, yeah, we have that a LOT!

Thanx again.

Tod Daniels

<SNIP>

Dear Sir, this is a standard practice all over the world that language schools charge fees upfront.<SNIP>

I beg to disagree , but I believe this information could be erroneous.

Almost EVERY big name engrish language school out there and MORE than a few private thai language schools here accept payment via installment plans.

Some private thai language schools have a plan where you pay in 90 day increments. After youve paid for and attended your first 90 days of schooling; when you need to receive your paperwork to extend your ED visa, you pay the school for another 3 months of class time, get your extension paperwork, go extend your visa for another 90 days and keep on studying!

They don't charge more for this, they just spread the payments out so it's not a chunk 'o cash up front. So do they charge up front, technically yes, but not for a frickin years worth of class time, just 90 days worth at a time. This can make it much more attractive to people who are more cash conscious or who possibly aren't sure if they're gonna be here for an entire year.

FWIW: Language Express doesn't charge any percentage for accepting payments via credit card either and their year long 'standard' class offered in the morning has the best price point currently out there in the market, and I've scoped out 25+ schools at last count .

WHILE SLIGHTLY OFF TOPIC:

As far as good bang-4-the-baht; I believe Language Express (a forum sponsor) and their premium thai course is the proverbial 'bar' by which other thai language schools should and most likely will be measured by in the very near future.

I said it before but I'll say it again; I've never ever seen such well put together high quality thai language materials like the books they have for that course. And I've got the text books from 8 or 9 different well known private thai schools littering my apartment.

The difference in price-point between a 'basic' year long thai language program at any one of the thai schools out there (all pretty much in line price wise) and the 'premium course' offered at Language Express is negligible indeed. In regards to quality it's almost like comparing crab apples to fresh picked oranges . Textbooks, learning resources, motivation of other students attending the classes and quality of their teaching staff is truly outstanding. Go sit a free class and take their in house computerized thai language level testing!

(BTW, if you didn't figure it out yet; I'm certainly NOT affiliated with ANY thai language school . Feel free to go to whatever thai school that floats your banana boat or bamboo raft . I just want people interested in studying thai to get good bang-4-their-baht;))

I recently picked up Andrew Biggs' third book in his series called ภาษาอังกฤษง่ายนิดเดียว.

In it I came across the idiomatic phrase ชาติหน้าตอนบ่าย ๆ. I thought the answer was so good I had to post it here.

Here's the question he received;

สวัสดีค่ะ คุณแอนดรูว์

ช่วยกรุณาบอกดิฉันว่า ชาตินี้ ชาติหน้า ชาติที่แล้ว ชาติหน้าตอนบ่าย ๆ จะพูดว่าอย่างไรเป็นภาษาอังกฤษ

ขอบคุณค่ะ

Moo (หนองคาย)

His answer was this;

ชาติหน้าตอนบ่ายหรือ... คงต้องแปลว่า late afternoon in my next life ใช่ไหมครับ แปลตรงตัวอย่างนี้สนุกดีสำหรับคนไทยเรา แต่ฝรั่งฟังไม่รู้เรื่องเลย..

โดยรวมฝรั่งไม่เชื่อเรื่องหลายชาติ ชาวคริสต์เชื่อว่า เกิดมาครั้งเดียว และต้องสะสมบุญตลอดชีวิต พอสิ้นชีวิตพระเจ้าประมวลว่า มีความดีมากว่าความชั่ว หรือ ความชั่วมากว่าความดีซึ่งเป็นบ่งบอกว่า จะใช้เวลานิรันดรที่สวรรค์หรือนรก

อย่างไรก็ดี ชาติ ใช้คำว่า life หรือ lifetime เช่น

Buddhists believe you spend many lifetimes learning valuable lessons.

(ชาวพุทธเชื่อว่า คุณต้องกลับมาใช้หลายชาติเพื่อสะสมบุญและความรู้สำคัญ)

ดังนั้น ชาติก่อน คือ in my last life แต่ใช้ past life ได้เหเหมือนกัน เช่น

Maybe we knew each other in out past lives.

(บางทีชาติก่อนเราได้รู้จักกัน)

Do you remember anything from your past life?

(คุณจำอะไรได้จากชาติที่แล้วไหม)

ส่วน ชาติหน้า คือ in my next life เช่น

We'll meet again in our next life.

(ชาติหน้าพบกันอีกที)

แต่ที่ข้อยกเว้นครับ นั่นคือที่ผมพูดตั้งแต่ต้น ชาติหน้าตอนบ่ายๆ ไม่ควรแปลตรงตัวครับ คำแปลที่ถูกต้องคือ NEVER หรือที่ฝรั่งใช้สำนวนว่า แม้ 1 ล้านปีก็ไม่ทำ เช่น

When are you going to fall in love with me?

(คุณจะหลงรักผมเมื่อไรล่ะ)

Never in a million years.

(ชาติหน้าตอนบ่าย ๆ)

Anyway sorry for shamelessly typin’ this right outta his book, but I'd never heard the idiom ชาติหน้าตอนบ่ย ๆ before. Thought you guys might find it of interest.

The one good thing about his books is they’re written at a low medium level and anyone with even marginal thai reading skills like myself can make their way thru them pretty well. Seeing as they explain idiomatic thai expressions in engrish, you can usually figure out new vocab you don't know by word elimination between the thai and engrish you do know.

I did have one question about the use of the ๆ character. In the idiom ชาติหน้าตอนบ่าย ๆ does the ‘repeat symbol’ mean to repeat both words like ตอนบ่าย ตอนบ่าย or do you just repeat the word บ่าย twice? Sometimes with word compounds I don’t know how much I’m supposed to repeat when I see that symbol.

Also apologies in advance if there's errors in the thai script. My desk lamp just burned out. It's tough for 'old eyes' to make out the small thai font in the book.

thanx Tod

I still say if the O/P had exited and re-entered the country before TODAY (as they indicated their visa had a "must be utilized by" stamp on the visa dated today) they'd a gotten a new permission to stay stamp good until about April 13th or there abouts. That would have afforded them MORE than enough time to sort out the extension of stay paperwork that their school supplies them.

The year long, multi-entry ED visa (secured in another country prior to comin' to thailand) held by the O/P is good for about 15 months of stay in kingdom if you work border runs and dates right. It's the same as any other Multi-entry year long visa of what ever category O-B-ED, makes no difference; each entry is good for a 90 day stay. If you run-4-the-border and re-enter just before the visa itself expires; you get another 90 day permission to stay until stamp.

There were some rumors last year on this forum (and a topic too which I am too lazy to look for) that people were being 'tested' out at Changwattana during the process of extending their ED visas for another 90 days. Now being the nosy type of person, as well as having assisted all too many people with this routine extension; I went and spent several hours in the ED visa extension area at Changwattana. I sat right in front of the desk area and must have watched 20+ odd foreigners go thru and get their ED visas extended for another 90 days. NOT a single person was 'tested' or taken away to be 'grilled' in thai about their language acquisition skills.

Now did the thai immigrations officials attempt to converse with the students? Yes, of course they did, after all youre supposed to be studying the thai language so possessing some modicum of thai language skill might not be all that far fetched, huh?) What I overheard was mostly the same old b/s conversations you have with any run-o-the-mill-thai. Things like; Cam you speak thai, What's your name, What country do you come from, Where do you live in thailand, How long have you lived here, How long have you studied the thai language, Where do you study, Do you like thai food, Can you eat spicy food, Do you have a thai wife, g/f etc. In the entire time out there, I didn't see a single person who couldn't answer these questions being denied their 90 day extension, NOT one!

Never having been to Jomtien Immigrations I couldn't comment on their 'vetting' of people who extend their ED visas at that location. However, I'm reasonably sure the poster known as "macwalen" (BTW; the owner of the Walen School 'O Thai) who NOT coincidentally has a Pattaya branch could certainly enlighten us as far as the experiences their students have had when extending an ED visa down there in regards to any alleged testing.

Dont confuse casual thai conversation while an immigrations officer processes your extension to be any sort of official testing. Immigration really wants your support documentation to be in order. If you have the paperwork provided by your school, the appropriate copies, forms filled out, photo, etc, there is a 99.9% chance youll sail thru quickly and without the slightest hiccup in the process.

Then again, if youve studied thai for 9 months and are on your last extension of the year, yet still cant manage to spit out; My name is Somchai", in thai; well, if I were an immigration officer I might look at you with a slightly more critical eye too.

I wholeheartedly agree with "Badbanker", this is NOT the sort of overstay you can blithely show up at the airport a little before your departure and 'sort out' with the 20K baht fine, the small red overstay stamp and possibly a firm talkin' to by the officers. This is a COMPLEX overstay compounded by the fact he hasn't even kept a valid passport nor in the 20 odd year overstay bothered to sort this out before now.

He WILL need the original passport's entrance stamp as the likelihood of Immigrations going to the trouble of checking their microfiche of entrances into the kingdom for 20 years back is about as likely as pigs flyin' outta my arse.

It will take HOURS at immigrations if he's not combative and possibly the entire day if he cops even the slightest attitude. HE knowingly broke the law, not by a slight oversight, or an "I forgot", but deliberately for oh-so many years that it’s not even funny. Any attitude that he is somehow 'owed' something because he has a thai spouse, half thai kids, a house, contributed some way to thai economy, blah-blah-blah isn't gonna play at all. It is my experience that Immigrations officers tend to take a “been there, done that, heard that crap before” attitude with this type of ‘excuse’.

First;

Tell him to go get a new passport

Second;

Tell him to purchase a ticket OUT of thailand

Third;

Tell him to show up bright 'n early one morning at Thai Immigrations at CHANGWATTANA, with: the original passport, (the departure card if he still has it), the new passport, the confirmed ticket outta the kingdom, 20K baht for the overstay fine, possibly 1900 baht for the emergency 7 day visa (although if he sorts out the overstay on the exact day he's supposed to fly out, sometimes they don't make you get this).

IF this guy can't speak enough thai to carry on a conversation about why he overstayed so long, &lt;deleted&gt; was he thinking by doin' this, and to listen to the mandatory lecture (which I'm quite sure will come with this long of overstay), he better take a well spoken thai with him.

Who even knows what visa rules, restrictions etc regarding Korean nationals were in effect 20 odd years ago when he entered the kingdom? I sincerely doubt even the Immigration staff knows without having to check old records.

While I don't know if he'll need legal representation out at Changwattana, he'll most definitely need someone who knows their way around the system out there. Perhaps his embassy in Bangkok can advise him on the best course of action.

As far as his wife getting into trouble for not reporting his overstay, I say that's highly unlikely. I'm sure where ever they've lived in nakhon nowhere thailand, the village headman and in all likelihood the entire village has known about this 'issue' for years and years. You can't keep secrets of this magnitude in small villages EVER!!!

Currently there is no reward offered by Immigrations for turning in overstayers (or believe me I'd be a billionaire here!). Conversely, there is no penalty for a normal run-o-the-mill-thai not turning an overstayer in either. Although FWIW: the person in question would probably do better NOT takin' his thai wife with him to Immigrations, as she'll most definitely get a stern talkin' to from the 'powers that be' out there.

The O/P's story is quite the sticky wicket. The korean guy would do well to tread very lightly sorting this out. Perhaps in retrospect, Badbanker's idea of legal representation isn't too far off the mark. Showing up with someone who knows immigration law regarding other S/E Asian nationals can't hurt in the least.

I believe the real key to sortin’ this issue out as easy as it possibly can be is having the old passport with the original arrival stamp (even though it's 20 years old). At least it is valid PROOF of when he entered; versus just showing up with nothing and being charged with illegal entry and residence for 20 years, which is FAR more serious than an overstay.

Surprisingly I won this program in a contest from the "Women Learning Thai (and some men too)" website a while back. Thanx for the heads up about the up graded version, I just downloaded it.

Believe me I do not give out praise lightly, but this is one slick program! The choices you have to display what ever way you can read phonetics is outstanding, as is the clarity in the audio for the words. I use both it and thai-language dot com many, many times a day

They really put some time into this and my hats off to Benjawan on this endeavor. Really top notch!

Oh, and to answer the poster known as klons, I just looked at Paiboon Publishings website and it would appear that it is NOT a mac dealy at this time. Then again not being the most computer literate person I could be wrong, so heres the link;

Paiboon Publishing

Go to Walen. SNIPPED

Sadly this sounds all too much like yet another "shill post" for a school which shall remain nameless .

Last time I checked (which I do periodically ), the TOPIC of this thread is about C/C payments not being accepted at private thai language schools.

How in the heck did it morph into another one of the (n)ever popular and "(un)insightful methods to teach thai" threads?

Even more mind wobbling, how did it become a discussion about any school which has a method that "magically" makes the student begin to THINK in thai from day one, be it AUA or who ever . As a new student, sitting classes at ANY school that speaks ONLY thai for hours and HOURS, yields far more frustration than fruition early on.

Thinking in thai, when you can't even ask, "Where is the bathroom?" It's sheer madness to even entertain fanciful thoughts of that nature and you my posting friend are smoking something stronger than กัญชา maybe ยาบ้า!!

BACK ON TOPIC:

I called 5 other private thai language schools at random, which I just pulled outta my thai language school favorites folder, and they all will accept credit cards; IF you pay the percentage (which varies from 2-5%).

Anecdotally AND TOTALLY OFF TOPIC:

Several years ago I purchased an airline ticket from Honey Sun Travel (coincidentally a forum sponsor and a business which is under the "Walen corporate umbrella"). I was told in no uncertain terms I'd hafta pay a percentage to use my C/C to pay, but either a bank transfer to their account or cash would waive said percentage.

So, because enquiring minds (like nosy people such as myself) wanna know;

If a potential student elects to pay for their yearly tuition via C/C at Walen, is there an added percentage by using that method of payment? OR WHAT?

MODZ: please know I am NOT downin’ Walen or his sponsorship, only asking a genuine and quite valid question. ..

(In other words: PLEASE don't ban me! I already know I am close to the line.)

According to the letter of the law, wiping your own arse is working, in fact thinking about wiping your own arse would also fit.

The last time I checked ‘arse wiping’ WAS a thai only trade and included in one of the 37 odd trades foreigners are prohibited from working in. (I think it's right after driving a tuk-tuk on the list )

I did some further checking though, and it would appear, in the field of "arse wiping" foreigners can work, but ONLY as ‘consultants’!!

Sorry couldn’t resist.

And now back on topic.

I guess the difference is that I can pronounce Micro SD card.

Probably they understood you because you pronounced those words with a thai accent "microo et-di gard"

I have heard ไม่ทราบว่า used quite a lot by native speakers. However I mostly hear it when the person asking doesn't know who someone is or where a particular place is located, not generally in regards to if a particular product is carried in a store.

For constructs like that I hear most often hear

มี-what ever you're asking for (possibly with the classifier)-มั้ย Which is just; "(Do you) have blah-blah?" I've had that work 10 outta 10 times with things I'm tryin' to find in shops.

Please understand I'm not doubtin' your wife’s native thai speaking ability or her assertion that it 'sounds more polite'. It's just not something I hear thais use when askin' about things. Like I said, it's mostly facts, who, locations and directions to some place. Nor am I saying it doesn't 'play'; just that it sound kinda artifically pretentious to me in the context you're using it in .

Then again I'm most definitely NOT a native speaker. But then again, neither are you, lol...

You'd be better off stickin' with

มีน้ำขวดมั้ย or ขายน้ำขวดมั้ย Have bottled water? Sell bottled water?

Strangely enough; I was at a Siam Commercial Bank branch the other day when an old thai lady came wobbling in with one of those medium sized green heavy paper Robinson's shopping bags. She placed it near an empty chair, walked over to get a transaction slip and queue number from the service person.

As I'm the nosy sort and it was my turn to be waited on, I walked past her still empty chair and glanced down into the bag. It was full to nearly the top with bundles of 1000baht bills!! I mean, there had to be hundreds of thousands of baht in that bag. It was just sitting there whilst the old thai lady tottered around to and fro inside the bank seemingly without a care in the world or even a second thought about leaving that kinda money sitting on the floor in the general seating area in a shopping bag. Even when my transaction was finished, the old lady hadn't made it back to her seat yet.

Sadly stupidity knows no borders, no nationalities, and is something you find everywhere in the world. Now is the 'thief' a bad guy, dunno. However if I saw a well stuffed envelope lying around with no one looking after it, I too might be tempted to pick it up (if only to see if I could return it to its rightful owner ).

I will concur “Opportunistic Person Pockets Envelope of Cash a Stupid Customer Left on the Counter", just doesn't have the same sensationalistic spin to it, nor does it do much to elicit sympathy for the moron who left it sitting there in the first place.

FWIW: I hope they never catch the opportunist .

I apologize in advance that this is a LONG post, but none the less, I think the O/P will find it of some marginal value

I cannot short sell how important it is to be able to read thai. It is NOTHING but word after word memorization. So much so, that when you see a thai word written in context you know what it means.

I already know we will have the thai language purists who will come out in droves, saying no, no, no! But recognizing a spelt word in thai is worth VOLUMES! I know some people who can pronounce a word perfectly in thai, tones and all, yet have abso-tively posi-lutely NO idea what it means. To me, that aint worth shit . If I can see a word and know its meaning, well, that means MORE. .. Even if my pronunciation of that word is total crap, I know what it means.

If you learn to recognize thai words as they are spelled in thai, when you see that word you know if it's; enter, he-she-they, white, rice, mountain (same as he-she), news, horn of an animal, a human knee, or a very bad smell, etc. Reading is KEY. But really, reading is mostly something you do in context of what's written. It's not that hard.

Yes I know thai has 44 consonants BUT they make only 21 sounds, so you cut it by more than half already. I know thai has 32 vowel sounds, but if you combine the engrish vowels we have nearly as many sound combinations. (In fact I think there are only three vowel sounds we dont have in engrish.)

Long ago, I stopped tryin' to do low-medium-high toned words because I listened to thais and when they spoke they just blurred 'em all together. Instead I concentrated on either falling or rising tones in high frequency words I would speak in a normal day like tiger, shirt, (although I rarely talk about tigers) But I remembered those words because shirts (at least for me) I pulled DOWN over my body เสื้อ (seuua^F) a FALLING tone, whilst tigers เสือ jump at you (seuua^R) a RISING tone.(and yes I know that mats lie on the ground, thanx). Those falling/rising toned words are the ones that will get you off script FAST!!

Once I concentrated on the rising or falling tones, the understandability of my spoken thai went up by volumes! I'd tell you FORGET the low, medium, high toned words and try to get the rising or falling tones on words you speak every day to match up with what thais say.

Yes, I know the normal word for 'dog' in thai is หมา (maa^R) rising tone, but if I use the "real" word for dog สุนัข (soo^L nak^H), no one confuses it with a horse ม้า (maa^H) high tone. Just like I know the word for "ride" is ขี่ but a LOW tone (khee^L) and the colloquial word for "shit" is ขี้ a FALLING tone (khee^F) and I remember that one only because shit falls out of your ass towards the ground! It's the same as I can remember the difference between white ขาว (khaao^R) and rice ข้าว (khaao^F) because white clouds are in the sky and rice grows outta the ground. (rising and falling)

You can learn this language, and EASILY be understood, IF you forget high, medium, low toned words and just concentrate on falling and rising tones.

As a thai gurl who sells "tickets' would say; COME ON MAN. Sorry that is my slang; ผู้หญิงขายตัว (phuu^F ying^R khaai^R dtuaa^M) = girl who sells her body, BUT ผู้หญิงขายตั๋ว (phuu^F ying^R khaai^R dtuaa^R) = girl who sell tickets, lol. Then again do you want 'one way', 'round trip' or 'express' service? See my slang might work, huh?

You can crack this nut! I am FAR from the sharpest tool in the proverbial shed, and I almost have this nut cracked!!

Then again, maybe not

Ahhh the perils and pitfalls of trying to write what we think we hear a thai say but using engrish. (I'm NOT knocking the O/P because I do karaoke engrish/thai all the time too )

Without more info from the O/P it's a total crap shoot if anyone has really gotten it or not.

Note to the O/P (and really to ANYONE who posts threads like this): the things that will help posters figure out what you're on about are;

CONTEXT; what was the topic of the conversation preceding and following the phrase you're asking about?

WHO was in the conversation? Was it people you know very well like family and/or close friends, were they relative strangers, was it in mixed company (men & women) or with just guys, etc?

WHERE did this conversation take place; a beer/go-go bar, at home watching t/v, in the bedroom, in a restaurant, out on the street, in casual conversation, in an office or more formal environment? Did you hear it in the city or were you up-country in Nakhon Nowhere?

WHAT dialect were they speaking? Were they speaking bangkokian (central) thai, issan thai, northern thai, southern thai? This often overlooked factor does come into play as well.

These small tidbits of valuable info can go a long way in deciphering what ever it is you thought you'd heard. Especially once you factor in there are way too many native engrish speaking accents which could yield different pronunciations. I don't know if I should I say it like a kiwi, an auzzie, a californian, a midwesterner, a new yorker, a floridian, or a hillbilly from Tennessee. Then again maybe it's more like a brit, scotch, or irish person would say it. They'd all sound different!

Still, I think the O/P has some definite possible answers to what they heard. Dunno until they weigh back in and let us know who's right.

As An Aside:

The first correct reply will then be presented (at their own expense ) with the highly sought after, yet rarely awarded; "I can decipher engrish spelled thai stuff" wall plaque . (Some restrictions apply, read the fine print. ..)

Good Luck

Given the thai penchant ESPECIALLY in print news and colloquial speech to use abbreviations known in thai as คำย่อ (kham^M yaaw^F); Benjawan Becker came out with this a while ago. It's got a lot of the most common ones you'll hear whilst out and about.

I actually think it's available as a c/d which is one of Benjawan's "Speak Like A Thai" series that she's got out.

Here's the video;

At about 1:53 or so in the vid, the term you're asking about comes up. Listen for it to get the pronunciation down clearly (even though it's sang in an awfully high falsetto voice! )

FWIW: thai abbreviations are something really worth learning!! You can hardly make heads or tails out of a thai language newspaper if you aren’t dialed into the incredible amount of abbreviated terms they use.

Why do all the hassle when they are giving out 2x Tourist VIsa from Cambodia so easy now ! .,

Poipet 2h from BKK then let the agent take the passport then w8 2 night at the casino Hotel then done ! . ,

How do you know who to trust your passport with in that town?

Im seriously interested but who do you trust?

Do they send the passport to pnomphen?

With more and more reports on the T/V forum about the thai embassy in Vientiane cracking down on issuing visas to ‘perpetual-tourists’; there are more than a few visa run services which do this type of ‘run’ to Cambodia now.

You take a mini-van (or bus depending on the number of foreigners) to Poipet, stay at the casino hotel two nights, your passports are couriered to Phnom Penh where they get the visa and are then brought back to you. Transportation, meal vouchers, rooms, Cambodian visa, etc, all included for a single price.

They seem to be doing it without a hitch, as I know a few people who’ve used them and it works.

It could be a good option. Dunno really.

Then again as this thread is titled "Vientiane Denying Tourist Visas Now?", my post is more than a little off topic. Still I hope you find it of interest.

Yes อ้อม is the key word. You can say may tong pay om, may tong pha om, may tong krap lot om na... (ไม่ต้องขับรถอ้อมนะ)

Indeed the critical word is อ้อม which means to approach by a round about way like a ทางอ้อม..

I wouldn't use ไม่ต้อง in this sentence construct as it implies more an "it's not necessary" quality. I'd also forgo the นะ at the end, as that just is a useless particle to slightly urge agreement or to make the sentence less a command and more a polite request.

Instead I'd try something stronger like อย่าไปทางอ้อมซิ (DON'T go the round about way!). At the end I'd throw in a ซิ (or perhaps a สิ as I get those two mixed up in speaking, lol) to indicate this is NOT a polite request, but an imperative. Then I'd probably say ไปทางตรงดีกว่า which is just 'go the direct way is better'. I have found by using อย่า (DON’T) you change what you're saying from an indirect type of polite request into something that carries a LOT more unspoken emotive qualities than by using ไม่ต้อง (Not necessary).

It is my experience that the stronger you voice an objection to something the better results you often get. Telling a taxi driver it's not necessary to go the long way doesn't compel him to go the direct way, nor does it convey your displeasure to the overly circuitous route he's now taking.

Then again, I speak super blunt direct and to the point thai, just like I speak english. Of course not being thai I’m neither obligated nor bound to following their indirect, overly polite sentence constructs either. I need to get results, I don’t mince words, and if they’re doing something incorrectly, I certainly want them to know about it. Quite surprisingly, I’ve never ever had thais comment on the bluntness of my speech and most of the time I achieve my goal(s) too. Go figure, who-da thunk it?

Now you mileage may indeed vary.

If I understand you correctly, your current multi-entry type ED visa has a ‘must be utilized before’ (or an expiration date) of the 14th of January. So about another 10 or so days.

Now, if you were to say ‘run for the border’ on the 13th of this month, you’d get another 90 day stamp when you re-enter thailand. (That's the way multi-entry non-immigrant visas work, each entry gets you a new 90 day permission to stay stamp, so if you time the runs right you get about 15 months out of the visa.) That’d give you until about the middle of April to sort this all out. It's a thought.

You need to get the paperwork and stuff hashed out from the school when you still have a month or so left on your last permission to stay until stamp.

And NO I’ve never ever seen in Bangkok for attending a private thai language school a student get anything more than a 90 day extension.

If you’re gonna leave the country after you got the extension of stay you’d need a re-entry permit. But as re-entry permits are only valid for the current extension of stay (so in the case of you receiving an in country permission of stay for 90 days, any re-entry permit you’d buy would only be good for the same amount of time.)

I usually advise people if they think they’re goin’ outta the country, just pick up a single entry re-entry permit for 1000baht when you get the in-country extension of stay at Thai Immigrations.

I hope this wasn’t too confusing. It’s certainly not as complicated as I make it out to be. Feel free to send me a P/M if you have any questions.

My "Utilize by" date on Visa is later in January

And there my thai visa posting pundits is the critical sentence in the above poster's post. As long as he exits the country BEFORE his "must be used by" date stamped ON the original visa at what ever thai embassy they got it at; the second entry will activate without a hitch.

It is the mixing up the two dates; One is how long the entire visa is valid for and is stamped ON the visa at the Embassy where you got it. The other is a permission to stay until stamp and is a seperate stamp you get inside the country at Thai Immigrations when you do a 30 day extension of stay. That stamp does NOT lengthen the original visa's validity by a single day!! It only lengthens the time allowed in country on that particular entry.

Given most double entry tourist visas that I have seen have a validty of 90 days, if people cut it to the last day of their first 60 days before they get their extensions, and then burn up all of those 30 days too before running for the border; sometimes the way the calander works out you come up a day late and a dollar short.

I hope this isn't too confusing. ..

That type of visa (a multi entry Type ED) is good for stays in country of up to 90 days at a time and usually has a validity of one year from date of issue.

AM I wrong to assume you've been runnin' for the border every 3 months to garner another 90 days stay in country? (Please, DO correct me if I'm wrong.)

With this type of visa IF you border run one last time before the "must be utilized by" date (NOT to be confused with the current “permission to stay until” stamp), you can get another 90 days and in total nearly 15 months out of this visa.

Have you done this already?

If you continue to study the thai language and your school is registered with the Ministry of Education, they can provide you with supporting documentation which would allow you to secure an 'extension of stay' at Thai Immigrations.

Now normally with private thai language schools in Bangkok the extensions given at Changwattana Immigrations are for 90 days at a time. So you'd need to do this every 90 days at the cost of 1900baht each extension. The school will usually give you your new paperwork a few weeks early, but it is your responsibility to know when your extension runs out not theirs.

Also remember once you get an extension of stay, the re-entry permit part of your old visa expires when it does, and if you leave the country without buying a new re-entry permit your extension of stay dies when you exit the country and you're back to less than square one.

One last thing in this too long already post, is. ... Once you get an extension of stay, you must report to Immigrations when you stay in country over 90 days.

This has NOTHING to do with your extension or visa and everything to do with the law that foreigners who reside in thailand longer than 90 days need to report their address. (90 day reporting is free though!)

Hands down, this is clearly the number ONE reason foreigners who have double entry tourist visas write on this forum and complain about losing their second entry.

In their endeavor to max out the days they can stay in the glorious Land O Thais, they neglect to pay attention to the Enter BEFORE date (sometimes it also says must be utilized by). They inevitably get a 30 day in-country extension on the first entry and then put off running for the border until the very last day of the extension. Then when they show up at the border, cross over and come back theyre told visa finish already. Usually depending on nationality, the best they can get is the 15 day visa exempt stamp for a land crossing.

I have had all to many tourist call me and ask if this "can be sorted out" at Changwattana. The answer is always NO, as their original visa expired already. It is just an end of story type of problem.

I think this is a good post and should be mandatory reading to anyone here on a tourist visa while also playing the in-country extension game to max out your stay here!

I just got an email response from PRO Language, and indeed they don’t accept credit card payments for tuition. They do however accept bank transfers .

I have in the past, went into a thai bank, used my credit card, and had money transferred into a company’s thai bank account. You might check with your c/c issuer and see if this is a possibility. It would be a shame to forego the quality of thai language education PRO Language offers.

Then again, I’d say call some of the schools I recommended in the other post and see what they offer in terms of payment plans or methods. I have seen the ‘pay as you go’ plan becoming a LOT more popular in the thai language schools I’ve visited and reviewed.

(Shameless plug )

Interested in my “take on a thai language school” here in Bangkok? Read the pinned thread at the top of this forum called appropriately enough; “Best Thai Language School”.

BTW: I’m NOT affiliated with ANY private thai language school, and only offer out the reviews for anyone who is sincerely interested in learning thai.

Good Luck

(Sorry this is long)

Sadly there is no P/6 exam given by the thai government anymore for foreigners . It's another type of proficiency testing, but. ..

Be that as it may; I know a LOT of private thai teachers who might meet your needs.

The question is; what (other than improving your 'effluency' <sic> sorry meant fluency in thai) do you want from the classes? If indeed your thai is at the level you self-assess it to be , you probably want a more custom tailored class than the bais stuff. Also there are more than enough P/1-P/6 practice test books out there at the government bookstores to self test and see what your strong areas are and what things you need to work on.

Never the less;

Here're a few questions which need to be gotten outta the way first. Questions which any potential thai teacher would need to know to 'custom fit' a class for you;

*Do you have your own study materials, or expect the teacher to provide them?

*How many hours a week and at what times are you intending to study?

*Where is a convenient location for you to meet and study?

*Do you want conversation based only, reading and then question/answer stuff to gauge your comprehension, writing exercises or a combination of all of it?

*Would you be interested in studying with a small group of foreigners with similar desires in language acquisition and a similar level of thai, (a LOT cheaper), or do you prefer one on one (more expensive)?

*After a sample lesson would you be willing to buy 'blocks' of time (say 10 hours at a whack at a discounted price) or do you prefer to pay hour by hour?

I couldn't even begin to recommend a teacher without getting those questions answered. Then again even perusing the T/V classified ads yields no shortage of alleged thai teachers, and Im sure a quick Google would turn up even more.

Strangely enough (or not ), rates vary widely. I've seen 'em as low as 150baht an hour up to a mind wobbling 750baht an hour! While in the US, a higher price point usually means a higher level of quality, I have not found this to be the case here by any wild stretch of the imagination.

In fact, some of the most expensive private thai teachers I've met here have abso-tively posi-lutely no business even attempting to teach thai to foreigners. (Theyre about as qualified as the plethora of foreigners here who have no business teaching engrish to the thais, yet do anyway). Seein as there is no vetting of ability or standardized teaching in the private thai language sector, (as most do it under the table as far as taxes, companies, etc) anyone, including their uncle Somchai and/or his pet soi dog, can simply teach thai to foreigners by handing out cards, or making flyers.

My research has shown that the privately taught thai language sector is by far the most sketchy area in the entire niche market of foreigners learning the thai language. Bang-4-the-baht varies wildly, quality of materials is haphazard at best, and there is even less recourse than offered at a welll known private thai language school (which is next to nonexistent) if things dont work out and you want customer satisfaction. Even hooking up with a known private thai language school is no guarantee that youll get quality results. It really is a crap shoot out there as far as finding a thai teacher whose ability, personality and teaching materials mesh with your goals.

The best private thai language teachers Ive met operate almost 100% by word of mouth, their current and former students refer others to them, and if they advertise at all its very little. The best ones also have prior experience in the teach thai to foreigners field, something I feel is a necessity if a thai persons gonna get into the business.

Good Luck. ..

In reading the other post by the O/P, it would appear those muggers could have stolen his rose colored glasses too!

Outside my office building I just saw two foreigners with a couple of Heinekens in hand. I walked towards them and thought do I hit them or ask them if they have another?

As an aside;

"bkkjames I may have just inadvertently walked past your office, but I don't drink beer. ..

You sure it wasn't a guy with a cane, in a KISS t-shirt carrying a bottle of SangSom?

Just checking. I always like to err on the side of caution, lol especially around the more illustrious posers <sic> err posters here on T/V.