tonydabbs

You are talking about taking a big jump in coverage. 1st Class coverage is hard to get for your sized bike. But, you may be able to get it if your bike is fairly new. First Class will cover personal damage to your bike and it will cover theft. Most insurers are afraid to take the risk with your size bike because the premium would have to be too low for them to justify taking the risk.

Compulsory gives you a small amount 3rd Party Liability protection if you kill or injure someone with your bike, nothing more. Therefore, it might be wise for you to at least move up to Voluntary 3rd Party Liability protection. It expands your Compulsory liability protection considerably, including liabilty protection for property damage - plus more.

There is a lot of good life insurance in Thailand. But, believe me, life insurance is not the answer for you unless you are only concerned about your dead body.

If you are more concerned about coverage for medical treatment, there is one Thai-based health insurance company that will give you the option of med-evacuating you back home for treatment if that is what you want. And, you don't need a work permit or special visa to apply.

What sort of insurance are you looking for?

I don't know of any companies that insist on work permits for general insurance.

Life insurance might be different.

Accident ... this is my first time so i am not well inform !

Just want to be safe in case of car accident etc ...

As madmich said, no work permit is required. Only life insurance requires work permits. This is because it is a financial product.

As Sheryl said, you have no options. Your only hope is to run, not walk, back to your previous insurer.

No health insurer wants to assume liability for guaranteed medical costs; particularly, no health insurer in Thailand.

Most health insurers provide a 30 day grace period for payment of premium. You have gone well beyond that.

Good luck!

Keep in mind that you are stranger in strange land here. Thais don't buy life insurance in order to provide financial security for their loved ones in the event of the death a "breadwinner". Thais buy life insurance to provide a savings program for themselves and/or for their close loved ones. These are actually Savings Endowments. Traditionally, Thais aren't concerned about providing financial security in the event of their death. They know that their relatives will take care of their family.

The Thai government encourages people to save money through life insurance savings indowments by offering a tax incentive for doing so. Offering kind of a win-win situation.

Prior to WW 2, life insurance companies came into Thailand trying to sell "death benefit" life insurance, but Thais weren't interested.

Meanwhile, the Communists took over China and tossed AIA out. So, AIA ended up here. AIA had been very successful convincing the Chinese to purchase "savings programs," not death benefits. So they brought the savings program concept to Thailand and have become very successful with it here also. Now there are more than 26 life insurance companies here using the savings program approach and seem to be quite sucessful with it.

Savings Endowments offering self-completion death benefits are much more costly than pure death benefit life insurance, but they provide incentive for people to build up savings. It's called "forced savings."

An important thing to understand is that there are many different levels of care in the Thai hospital system. it is not at all the case that "a hospital is a hospital". Many farang fail to understand this and go to say a district hospital with expectations that are way out of line with that level facility.

Starting from the lowest level on up, there are:

District Hospitals -- these are small, very basic places with often just 1 doctor on duty, usually a recent graduate. Will usually NOT have Xray or much in the way of a laboratory. Not recommended for anything more than basic wound care or a simple abscess. In a pinch, OK for a normal delivery but not the preferred place. By and large Thais simply bypass these places (since in truth they don't offer much), for which reason they are usually not crowded. one useful tip: most opf them offer traditional Thai massage of excellent quality. They are also a good spot for a pro forma medical certificate. Many of the bad stories you will hear about Thai government hospitals will be the result of someone going to a District hospital. Note that a government hospital in any city which is not the provincial capital -- and this include s Pattaya and Hua Hin! -- will be a District Hospital. In a few cases where th town is larger than most the District Hospitals are a bit more extensive but still a huge step below the next level up which is a:

Provincial Hospital. These are in the provincial capital town. for anything other than the simple things mentioned above, this is the lowest level worth going to. unfortunately as a result they tend to be very overcrowded. These have labs, Xray, surgical capacity and some specialists. Selected provincial hospitals also serve as:

Regional Hospitals - that means they have more areas of specialization, for example, dialysis, cancer chemotherapy, and other provincial hospitals refer to them. often but not always, they are affiliated with a medical school. The government hospital in Khom Kaen is an example of this level, ditto Chiang Mai.

Then at the top are the major tertiary care government hospitals in Bangkok, like Chulalonghorn, Siriraj, Ratchawithi, Ramitbodhi etc. These are the best, though among them some have particular areas of strength/specialization.

And completely aside from the system described above are the various military hospitals (army, navy) etc. these are open to the general public and generally offer a good quality of care, say better than a non-regional provincial hospital but a step below a regional one.

At all levels except the District Hospital, long waits and red taope are the norm. And by long waits, I mean that getting treatment will be an all day affair, and you need to arrive early.

Some of the tertiary level hospitals have established quasi-private wings where you can get appointments, choose you doctor etc, costs more of course but still usually a bargain compared top the private hospitals. I know they have this at Chiang Mai and Chula, and Siriraj plans to open one soon I(though run or has it, it will be very pricey).

Sheryl, your replies are a pleasure to read, I always look forward to them And seldom, if ever, disagree with them. Thanks.

Since they won't pay directly to a hospital in Thailand, if you are planning to stay here for a few years, I suggest that you buy low cost local coverage to supplement your coverage back home. This is what many people do who come to Thailand from countries that provide health insurance.

Replacing a lost hospital card is quite easy. People lose their cards all of the time and get them replaced. The fact that you have filed a police report makes it even easier. So I don't understand the problem you are having.

You did right in trying to contact the insurance company directly, when all else failed. I suggest that you e-mail the insurance company and explain the problem.

Otherwise, send me a private message and I will help you. What you are going through is totally ludicress.

Tony

AIA is a Life Insurance company. Most of the health insurance companies in Thailand come under the category of General Insurance.

The rules for buying life insurance are formulated under the idea that life insurance is an investment (a way of building up savings). AIA brought that idea to Thailand and has been successful with it. Now, they also sell health insurance; but are still governed by the rules for Life Insurance.

There are many General Insurance options for health insurance in Thailand and they don't require any special visa or a Work Permit. All you need to do is provide a copy of the ID page of your passport (no one asks about your visa).

From what i researched and know, they CAN NOT.They can increase/decrease the premium, but can they actually change existent policy inclusions?

You are probably talking about home insurance, but even if you aren't, yes they can. But, they can't make any changes until renewal time. At renewal time, it is up to you to accept or reject the changes. You accept by renewing. You reject by by switching over to another insurance company that provides the coverage the way that you want it. Your insurance company must have experienced some high losses this past year, as did many others.

i know there is The Office of Insurance Commission, but how active is this office?

The OIC is always worth a try if you really think that you have a legitimate complaint. But, in this case I really don't think that you do. No harm in trying, though.

(Note: I am assuming that you are not talking about health insurance, which can come under General Insurance or Life Insurance and has a different set of rules)

Contact the Office of Insurance Commission (OIC).

Bupa Crystal used to be for Expats, also. I guess Bupa had a lot of problems with Expats who didn't want to play by the rules. The rules not only excluded coverage outside of Thailand, they also excluded coverage for treatment at Bumrungrad, The Bangkok Group of Hospitals, and most other "5 Star" hospitals popular with expats and medical tourists. Expats can be a bit demanding at times. So, I guess that Bupa got tired of putting up with it. The coverage is low, but quite good for use at private hospitals that are popular with Thais (and many expats). It's a shame that some expats tend to be so pushy and demanding that they just distroy the options for the rest of us.

There are no other private health insurance plans sold to expats in Thailand that exclude coverage outside of Thailand. But, there are many plans whose coverage is so low that you wouldn't want to use them outside of Thailand. It's foolish to focus on buying health insurance that povides coverage only in Thailand. I suspect that bad advice came out of a forum. This is only the 3rd time I've ever seen this request and all 3 this week.

If you are looking for Thai-based insurance, you should be focusing on coverage and cost, that's all. Quality of the local insurer is only a matter of opinion. If you have problems with the insurer, you can always turn the OIC (Office of Insurance Commission). But, don't be like the expats that caused you to lose Bupa Crystal as an option.

Also, In-patient coverage is included with all health insurance plans. It is outpatient coverage that is always optional.

As far as I am aware only the foreigner making the SS contributions is entitled to care, not their family.

You need a private insurance for your kid but insurance companies won't provide cover for a child akone and one adult will also have to be covered.

No quite corerct - insurance comapny will insure a child for medical insurance by themselves.

Two health insurance companies in Thailand will insure a child alone, without insuring a parent.

You can also buy life insurance for the child and add a health insurance rider.

Since you say that you are not interested in cheap plans, I assume that you are looking for comprehensive coverage. But I note that all the plans in the attachment is with no or limited out-patient coverage, which normally means that cancer treatment is not included since it is mostly done on an out-patient basis. From my understanding cancer treatment can be very expensive, so make sure that the policy you choose covers you for this.

Unfortunately, out-patient care normally more than doubles he premium.

Sophon

Out-patient coverage is costly because you can just walk into the hospital and see a doctor for any complaint. In-patient coverage requires that you be admitted to the hospital by a doctor for cause. Some quality insurance plans will cover you for cancer treatment even if you don't pay for out-patient coverage. Check. Don't assume.

Tony Dabbs,

As a respected and reputable professional insurance agent/broker in Thailand...

May I ask:

What advice do you give the OP inzman regarding his misfortune with car repairs?

What should he do??

Thank you,

tj

(a retired insurance professional from USA)

At this stage, he is on his own. He can go or call to the insurance company and scream at them. I don't like this approach; but I have seen it work on numerous occasions. This is because many Thais believe that Expats are crazy (farangs bah!) and would prefer to just appease them. If this doesn't work, though, the final and best resort for any complaint against an insurance company (and even the agent) is the Office of Insurance Commission (OIC).

A word of caution regarding insurance companies.For years I was a customer of a big insurance company,which had an office in Chumpae.One day I got a letter from headoffice,telling me,that I was 6 months behind payment.I responded,that I paid in time and had a receit from the Chumpae office,as always.To cut the story short,it turned out,that the manager of the local office had never sent the money to headoffice and now he had bolted,taken all the money with him!And,the big company was not responsible,because the manager was "just an agent,not employed by the company"...! It took them 6 months to contact me about the missing payment,because they "used to give the agent some time to send it in". 6 months,driving without insurance!End of the story and many negotiations with authorities taking part,I got the insurance;When it had only a few days left on it!Well,that were more than "one word",but I want to warn people against "agents" who you think are representing a company.

Ok. Reality time! He was he was an authorized Agent for the insurer; but, he wasn't their employee. He was an independent, self employed businessman earning his income by assisting people with the purchase of insurance. The insurance companies pay him for the customers he sends them. But dealing through him doesn't add any cost to your insurance, unless, of course, he decides to use the premium that you pay him for his own financial needs. Unfortunately, that happens sometimes.

In order to take advantage of the free advice and assistance of a knowledgeable independant agent/broker, I recommend that you purchase through him or her, then pay directly to the insurance company's bank account. You can do that. But, fax or e-mail a copy of the proof of payment to your agent/broker so that he or she can make certain that the insurance properly credits you for payment.

TIT, my guess is the agent wanted a bigger commission this year and insurance company complied by raising your rates.

My guess is that he didn't get the insurance through an independant agent/broker or he wouldn't have needed to start this thread. He should have gotten help from the agent in dealing with the insurer. Or, the agent/broker should have gone shopping for quotes for him from other insurance companies and then placed him with that insurer. If this was an independent agent, then he should be seeking advice on finding a better agent. Yes, TiT. But, I really don't believe that the "agent" and the insurance company were colluding together to raise to raise his premium. There is not enough profit and neither would stay in business very long.

Have a look at allclear insurance.com based in Romford, UK there is no age barrier and they specialize in pre existing conditions.

That is travel insurance. They will only cover you for up to one year. If you leave out mentioning a condition, though, they can cancel your coverage; just like any insurer.

But there are other renewable for life (or to age 75, at least) health insurers that will cover pre-existing conditions up to a fixed limit per year or for a fixed lifetime amount.

Wonder how easy it would be contacting th em while living in Thailand.

Should be fairly easy. They have direct payment with some major hospitals in Thailand.

If you sign up for US$2,500 deductable plan and list your place of residence as Thailand, you don't have to pay the deductable (excess) if you seek inpatient treatment at a hospital in Thailand.

On your first point I can't answer for the provisions in your policy.

On the second point the insurers work on the basis of Uberrima Fides, which means "utmost good faith". If you do not notify your new insurer of your newly developed condition you can guarantee that you will void any claims in any way related to that condition, and in most cases, you will void your entire policy, even if your claim is unrelated.

I strongly advise full declaration.

I agree. Regarding the provisions of the policy, it doesn't matter who the insurance company is. All Thai-based health insurers have up to 2 years to find and exclude pre-existing conditions (or refuse to renew your policy). After that, they have to cover the pre-existing condition they didn't discover, unless, of course, you are guilty of blatant fraud against the insurance company. By refusing to renew your coverage they were protecting themselves, within the time frame legally allotted to them, from having to pay a future claim. They must have been quite concered, because normally they would just exclued that medical problem and let you continue with the coverage.

Rbi Premium Membership http://www.rbipremium.com offers family packages at the following cost:

Main Member USD 2200 Spouse USD 800 Child USD 350

Haha they throw you out at 65 - useless !

RBI is a form of group insurance. There are many Thai-based plans that will cover the family under one policy. Bupa and AXA give a 10% family discount.

I sometimes wonder if some people have taken the time to read the English language policy they are considering. With regards to Mr. "meand": He is misinformed regarding Mr. "op's" claim that you need to be covered for 2 years before an insurance company will pay claims. This is not true. I've read my health insurance policy, I've made claims and not had any run around. Both BUPA and Thaivivat cover motorcycle accidents. The wording that causes lots of concern is under the Personal Accident benefits of each policy. BUPA only pays 50% of the sum insured if a customer is injured or dismembered or dies by motorcycle accident. The medical costs are always fully covered 100%.

It's rough for people who apply for insurance at an older age, however Both BUPA and Thaivivat offer renewal for life if you join before the age of 61. Be aware that BUPA and Thaivivat cover medical claims at ALL HOSPITALS IN THAILAND and most countries around the world. They have contractual agreements for claims procedures at approx 200 private hospitals around Thailand, but you can still use the facilities of the government hospitals which in many cases are better equipped and have the same qualified doctors.

The post by Canopus1969 caught my eye as maybe I was not looking at all the possible to ways to cover my family. However ACS insurance by Allianz. I just checked on this and find out it is an international insurance, group scheme. It should cover you at the same hospitals as BUPA or Thaivivat. The premium is also much more expensive than BUPA or Thaivivat. ACS has two main types of plans, you can choose from 500,000 or 1 million USD cover. This is more than BUPA or Thaivivat.............it is obviously going to cost more to offer higher levels of cover..........if someone is stating ACS is cheaper, they are dreaming or they perhaps they are not in my age bracket. Good luck for them if that cover costs less than BUPA Platinum. You can meet face to face with a native English speaking insurance broker, you can read the English language policies prior to spending any money and in my case an experienced licensed broker explained in writing in great detail any questions and concerns I had prior to selecting a health insurance company.

Interesting as I have just checked this ACS/Allianz. Example BUPA 41 to 45 is 39,000 Baht and ACS 22,000 Baht. BUPA 56 to 60 is 67,000 Baht and ACS is 44,00 Baht. And those figures are for BUPA's cover of only 5m Baht where ACS/Allianz is 15m Baht which is far more realistic in this day and age. Please explain how you can say : if someone is stating ACS is cheaper, they are dreaming or they perhaps they are not in my age bracket - so just how old are you ?

Another more worry point is that BUPA stops showing premiums at 65 where at least ACS/Allianz shows to a more realistic 75 !

Yes, Bupa stops showing the premiums after age 65. I asked them about that and they said that they increase the premium by 10% per year after age 65. LMG Pacific Healthcare only shows their premiums to age 65, also. When I asked them about it, they sent me a list of premiums calculated out to age 80. LMG Mega Series is my favorite Thai-based coverage; but, Bupa Platinum would be my second choice. Bupa Personal Care, though, is only so-so.

In regards to policy Terms and Conditions Exclusions, all Thai-based (Bupa is Thai-based) health insurance plans are the same. It is only their cost and coverage that is different.

I am a bit surprised that 'kamalabob2' is not associated in any way with the marketing of insurance. Frankly, I find his replies thoughtful and impressive.

i used to use the previous Thai Visa insurer brooker, it was with AXA, i switched to AXA direct and found it a great insurer. also no 3% charge for using UK credit card as Broker wanted. exactly same price less the 3% saving.

Who ever the broker was, it sounds like they were collecting the credit card payment themselves and then sending the money on to the insurance company. They may have been using Paypal.

Even if you use a broker, you can still pay directly to the insurance company yourself. Just tell the broker that is what you want to do. They should e-mail you a copy of the insurer's credit card form.

It should not cost you any more to deal through a broker. If it does, change brokers. There can be a lot of advantages in dealing through a broker over dealing directly, and it shouldn't cost you any more to do so.

Blame the Office of Insurance Commission (OIC) for the 1,000 baht you have to pay. They do it out of fairness to the insurance companies. (Sometimes they help them. Sometimes they help you.) Had you had an accident where you weren't at fault and knew who was, you wouldn't have been charged that 1,000 baht. The insurance company would have had to collect cost for the damage themselves. Whether they could collect the money from the guilty party, or not, is not your problem. You did your job by directing them to the guilty party. (Ok. You need their license plate and/or a copy of the police report identifying the scratcher). The point is, you only have to pay if you are considered to be at fault. You are considered to be at fault if you can't identify the person who is. The Terms & Conditions of all auto insurance policies now have this clause. It doesn't matter who the auto insurer is.

Health Insurance For Farangs?

Most health insurance based in Thailand is for both Farangs & Thais.

Health insurance sold in Thailand tends to be much cheaper than International insurance.

This is because the focus is on paying to Thai hospitals, which tend to be cheaper.

Also, Thai health insurance lacks many of the expensive "bells & whistles" that many International plans offer.

Thai health insurance is very good for the cost. And, instead of just complaining on the forums, you can contact the Office of Insurance Commission (OIC) to complain. They really work on your behalf. I have seen it. In one situation, it was very difficult to tell which one was right, the insured or the insurance company. So, the OIC decided to error in favor of the insured.

Many International plans have features you won't find in Thai plans, but you are paying for them. Just keep in mind: Don't make yourself insurance premium poor so that you can be insurance coverage rich. Consider the cost, the coverage and your budget.

Take the advice you get on the forums with "a grain of salt."