DMasut

Today's Bangkok Airways Flight 266 that skid and crashed into the Samui Airport Tower is not new for this aircraft.

A couple of posters stated this aircraft French made ATR 72-500 is safe. Actually it is plagued by a history of problems.

American Eagle and Delta Airlines grounded their whole fleet after a few problems and then removed all of them permanently from service in any temperate climate routes.

The ATR 72-500 has a history of failure and accidents related to:

-Fuel Exhaustion and accidents caused by malfunctioning fuel indicators

-Engine and component icing problems even in areas with warmer climates. (icing more a condition of humidity and altitude than just location.)

The real question is how do the little coppers get their uniforms so tight. Like a cross between the original star trek crew and bratwurst....but with guns and whistles added.

That's TOO dam_n funny!!!

THANK YOU!!!

It is what everybody thought ...but somehow couldn't articulate.

Now you put it into words...Star Trek and Bratwurst

Though I think it is more like Star Trek 'The Next Generation'...theirs fit tighter.... or maybe Terminator 2... the Mercury Man...not to be confused with the Thai movie of the same name.

I always thought their uniforms must be flame resistant because they don't burst into flames from the tightness and friction when moving...but then again...they never really do move very fast... this could be the reason.

What will we be charged for next in Thailand?!...

BREATHING 200฿

EXHALING 400฿

with overstay fine of 50฿ for every second you hold it in over 5 seconds.

Farang Fines

BREATHING 2000฿

EXHALING 4000฿

If this were really about "PUBLIC SAFETY" I would accept it.

But this is such a transparent attempt to encourage corruption and extortion it is literally embarrassing.

It will be interesting to see if officers will actually make more this way than their normal bribes and salary combined.

Just hang out by MBK, Paragon... or NANA PLAZA Soi 4 between say...9pm and 2am!!!

What are they going to use to get everybody?! ... Tuna Nets!?!?!

Those guys will be pulling down millions a month....

HEY!!! I WANT TO BE A BANGKOK POLICEMEN!!!!!

crocodilexp and UNIQ...sounds like you guys work for the TAXI services... because us "old hats" know there is very little chance of murder and need for scare tactics. NICE TRY...NOW GO AWAY.

just read correctly before you start yelling - 1500 THB for a 90 km trip in the AOT limousine is actually even a fair price, a cab will be around 1000...

I don't understand what all the noise is about being scammed - a person with a bit of sense for reality won't get duped and the others don't really realize anyhow. if you compare prices with western countries, it's still dirt cheap, for 1500 thb i don't even get a 15 km ride in my home country...

1,500THB for 90km/45miles isn't too bad...but considering you can take a MiniVan or 1st Class Sleeper Train to anywhere in Thailand for that amount, it is still expensive.

However this is Thailand, not your home country...and by overpaying you encourage the 'dishonest' practices to continue.

PEOPLE...STOP THIS...COMPARED TO MY COUNTRY THINKING...it is not relative for anything except your pocket...and not up for speculation of others to gauge how much they can get away with overcharging you.

It is just wrong for them to do so. If the well dried up they would disappear and you would have a greater time in Thailand that is MUCH LESS EXPENSIVE.

IT's not about how much money you have and how much you can afford...it is as much a matter of principal.

ALSO HELPFUL LINK: http://www.1stopbangkok.com/getting_here/airport/

SCAM ALERT! Airport taxis

When collecting your luggage you’ll notice large signs warning you to avoid unauthorised taxis and use the AOT Limo Service instead for your own safety. In fact all taxis at the airport are authourised Bangkok metered taxis and perfectly safe, while the AOT Limos are aggressively and unfairly promoted, costing three times more! Even if you ignore their well placed desk, an army of their reps will accost you when you exit, politely but firmly hawking this rip off option. It’s not a very good first impression of Thailand, but the AOT airport management have poor judgement when it comes to transparency. Outside the ground floor (the taxi rank was only recently moved up from the basement after persistent complaints) you’ll find an orderly queue, and for a 50 baht admin fee will be in a taxi in no time. They’ll even help you insist the driver uses the meter - average price 300 baht. As with all developing countries you might occassionally encounter a dishonest driver (if so record his publicly displayed taxi number and threaten to report him to the tourist police). You can avoid this by spending 900 baht on the AOT’s highly profitable limo service, but we discourage it out of principle.

Crackdown on illegal taxis begins at Suvarnabhumi Airport Friday

BANGKOK: -- Illegal taxis at Bangkok's Suvarnabhumi International Airport will be targeted in a crackdown by the authorities from Friday, according to Deputy Director of the Department of Land Transport Chairat Sanguansue.

Speaking in his capacity of chairman of the sub-committee to regulate public transport at Suvarnabhumi, Mr. Chairat said intensified crackdowns on unauthorised taxis will start Friday July 31.

Notices have been issued and posted at the airport and a public relations campaign has been initiated to warn offenders, he said.

Meanwhile, police officers and security guards patrolling airport premises on Thursday began warning unlicensed tour guides before beginning to arresting those who are unlicensed from August 9.

-- TNA 2009-07-30

It is not (only) the illegal taxis who scam the tourists. The legal taxis and the official counter where you get the official ticket are scam. Every time they try to scam me different.....

Correct, flew in on the 1st of May this year and wasn't really bothered in shopping around for a taxi.

Took the first and the 'best' I met and that was AoT Limousine service in the luggage claim section.

I 'bought' a taxi-ticket from Swampy to Amata Nakorn for THB 1,500, a bit overprised, but what the heck.

After I passed the customs there was another AoT boot and one of them took me out with my luggage.

The guy there checked my voucher and started to yell to the guy who came with me outside: THB 1500 no good, THB 2000 is the price. Anyway, they discussed and phoned back and forth for about 10 minutes until I said (with a read headed face): "I want my money back and I want it now!!!!" They forced me to start calling for a BiB and after my first attempt of catching a BiB's attention, they saw that I wasn't bluffing (in fact I was) and they called for the cab.

1,500 THB "A BIT OVERPRICED!?!?!" 300 THB to Bangkok Center is good, 450 THB is a bit overpriced.

1,500 THB is rape without a condom!!!

PLEASE PEOPLE SPREAD THE WORD...THESE GUYS ARE HERE BECAUSE YOU LET THEM GET AWAY WITH CHARGING THESE PRICES!!!

AoT is just the 'organized' version of what has been going on for years.... now the goodfellas have taken over.

The layout of the new airport is almost 3.5 kilometers to the nearest main road. Pack light and you might be able to take a bus to where you need to go... or at least to the nearest main road.

I WONDER HOW LONG BEFORE THEY BUILD THE MRT or BTS THROUGH TO HERE?

I've attached the Airport's Transport Options for you to look at.

Maybe the buses work better for you.

AirportSuvarnabhumi.pdf

Well I for one would welcome this if the change actually takes place.

A great start to change the way people see Thailand when they clear immigration.... only to be hit by a bunch of liars and thieves.

They need to extend this to the Train Stations and Ferry Services as well.

HEY!!! I THOUGHT THIS WAS THE NEW BAR GIRL RATING SYSTEM!!!

Well I guess since technically bar girls, prostitution and brothels are all illegal in Thailand, it would be silly for the government to have a rating for it huh?!

Hello, I would like to see some proof of any torture before I can believe it. It is very dangerous to accuse the powerful people that can make the rules, or make things happen. Cheers.

go there and watch CHAINS!if you need any proof.

You only need to watch any American TV show or movie to see they also use shackled around the waste, wrists and ankles of prisoners

I just can't decide if Thai TV is as terrible as I think it is, or am I genuinely missing something? I do not speak anywhere enough of the language to pick up what is being said so there is every possibility that what's being said is not as mindless as it seems. I could be being overly hard on the Thais.

Recently I have been spending a lot of time around the Tv in the evening than usual. The vast majority of the programs seem to be abysmal looking game shows and celebrity chat shows. A lot of these shows are fronted by or include the same group of a few Thais, including a small chubby boy/man, a middle aged transvestite, a spiky haired bloke and various high so type women and mop topped youths. Then of course we have the ever present 'boing' noise and play back loops (covered by me before). This is accompanied by pointless censorship and pixilation of all kinds of things, including cartoons.

I have recently seen several Japanese and Korean game shows dubbed into Thai, which seems totally ridiculous to me. Plus the dubbing is in the most irritating voice that I don't even think is normal for Thais.

But I am beginning to question if I am right. I am sure that it is generally poor, but is it really as terrible as I think? Last Saturday I found myself aghast at what seemed to be a quite pathetic singing show/contest. I thought that this was particularly bad for a Saturday evenings entertainment. But then I realized that at home in the UK the same format show, of 'Pop Idol' was probably been shown. And celebrity seems to be an obsession all over the world.

I also get in a twist at the number of transvestite and mincing gays included in almost every show, but again my home country, the Uk, has plenty of them included in TV shows. Don't take offense at this. I just find it annoying that they seem to be a requirement on every show.

A lot of the late evening shows here seem to me to be basically kid's style shows seemingly watched by adults. But I have seen one or two shows with some interesting content, but again in a childish format. I saw a program a few evenings ago at around 9pm all about ostriches farmed in Thailand. It did seem to be in a childish format and at a strange time of night though, but it was at least a little but interesting. And there are wildlife programs on quite often.

Lately there seems to be a nightly airing of propaganda on a subject I had best not mention. This I also find appalling.

I know this topic has been mentioned before, even by me, but I am interested in if I am being too critical and what others really think.

Do you feel your brain shrinking, hurting right behind the eyes, followed by a numbness? THEN YES YOU UNDERSTAND ENOUGH THAI!

That's your brains circuit breaker trying to switch off.

If you actually start laughing at the show and find it genuinely funny...it's too late for you.

Looking for an Endocrinologist. Can someone translate please? Endocrinology, Endocrinologist, etc

Thanks a lot!

Give this to any college educated Thai and they can help you out.

The Thai word is: การศึกษาเกี่ยวกับต่อมไร้ท่อ

on the letters page -

Regarding a recent article in The Nation about the Thai authorities' denial of torture in Thailand, this is an out and out lie.

I have witnessed this in progress at the following places while held illegally for a case that was dreamed up by the police and which was subsequently thrown out by the court: the Immigration Department detention centre, police cells and the Bangkok "Special" Prison.

Of course, it is very difficult to actually prove to others what goes on behind closed doors, as those in charge will never permit investigations, will never answer with the truth, and will ridicule anyone who tells what they have seen. There is also great danger for anyone who is known to have information or evidence.

Torture is common in the following forms and there are undoubtedly more: Beating of Burmese prisoners; the rape and sale of the young women; occasional acts against individuals that are far worse than "waterboarding" - a plastic bag over the head, handcuffs very tight on wrists and ankles, in which about six officers, supervised by a senior, beat the cuffs with their batons; beatings for prolonged periods with batons, repeated after intervals and the next day; guns stuck in the mouth with a threat to kill; no medical treatment.

In other cases the beatings are carried out by the officers' "sub-contractors" so that they have less chance of any action being taken against them. In police stations, Burmese are kept in dark rooms with no ventilation or light and very little, if anything, to eat. I could go on forever with what I have seen but no one would believe me

-- The Nation 29/07/09

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/topstory/3...in-Thai-prisons

SORRY!!! I SAW THE WORD TORTURE AND THOUGHT IT WAS A FORUM ON MARRIAGE!!! MY BAD!!!

Yes they have Torture in Thai prisons too!!!

But who will save the 'FREE MAN' from torture?!

Most Thai people often ask me - of past relationships with a Thai woman - 'But does she love you?'

If Thai people do not marry for love or have loving relationships, why on earth would they be asking if the g/f of the day loves me?

Weren't you aware G54? Asians dont know nor understand love .....not like we do, of course.

B.S and double B.S.

Come back when you know what you are talking about.

Didn't pick-up on the sarcasm smilies, Mate? Little serious, are we....??

Think it was more lack of sleep and p...ed off with the uk mate. sorry over reaction from me.

alls well that ends well i'm out of here and back in bkk saturday.

with all seriousness and joking aside, you do realize Thai's translation of love and a westerners translation are not the same?

They are capable of Love, just not always our version. Would take too long to explain here.

Buy me 57 beers and by that time...it won't matter. .... OH NO!!! MORE GIRLS!!!!! ...and so the cycle of life goes on.

WORLD POPULATION:

6,600,000,000 +/- 100,000,000

WOMEN IN WORLD:

3,400,000,000

WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU BREAK UP WITH WIFE/GF, ETC.

3,400,000,000 - 1 = 3,399,999,999 OTHER WOMEN LEFT TO RUIN YOUR LIFE.

OH YEAH!!! You're going down....but are you going down laughing or crying...it's up to you

Just a few thoughts:

As others have pointed out living together equals married in village eyes

People get married/live together because they love each other with a few exceptions. That doesnt vary between Thai or western.

When you marry you marry into a family as your wife or husband marries into yours as well and with that come some commitments (could be financial or not or emotional or things like learning the language) as well as some advantages (land inheritances for kids maybe, an opportuntiy to learn about real Thai culture, support from a family).

People seem to obsess about money. There are far more important things in life.

First there was sex for the sole purpose of mating...and recreation. No rules, no guidelines, just get the right parts in the right place and let nature take its course…no videos, books, Cosmopolitan or Oprah required.

Second, ownership of women between tribes and families as early methods to perpetuate the human race. Little is written on the walls of caves about love.

Third, 'civilized man' (I always like this term for its oxymoron) created a ritual of sharing his daughter through arrangement which became what we now know to be an "arranged marriage". a dowry, was to pay for the expenses of raising her. Though not politically correct to say, much like buying a head of cattle and paying for the cost of feed and care, as well as a little profit. Not much has changed in Isaan, India or other places where "arranged marriages" take place.

NOTE: TODAY, about 1/3 of the world's population is involved in some form of arranged marriage. India and surrounding nations 1.4 billion, some areas of China 1.5 Billion, Northern African nations of high Islamic belief, middle eastern nations...and it is not uncommon for girls past their mid 20's approaching 'old maid status" in Japan and Korea to ask their parents for help in arranging a suitable husband.

Fourth, The ritual became formalized by tribe leaders and early forms of government to record ancestry. Love between parties was a bonus, as the woman's primary role was to take care of home, children she provided for the man and work in the fields with the rest of the workers to sustain. Only up until the last several hundred years was the religious belief installed that polygamy was wrong. Until then it was always completely acceptable a man have as many wives as he could afford. Only Christianity beat it over our heads that it was wrong, even though many of the Old Testament characters such as Moses, Noah, etc. had several wives (bet your Vicar, Priest and Reverend failed to drive that subject home on Sunday)

It has evolved into a requirement by laws of many nations to be recognized as a legitimate marriage that parties register their marriage.

Fifth, The present day fairy tale that love is the primary reason for marriage was created to encourage men during the Victorian ages to marry one woman only and that love should carry them beyond their hardship. Hardly consolation for giving up other field workers.

The Knight in shining armor and Princess fairy tale concept of love is mostly a Disney story that was eaten up by western women, mostly American and British who believe a Princess becomes Queen and equally rules the kingdom... until she's pi++ed off divorces your As+ and takes here half that she didn't have before the marriage and the spends the rest of her life trying to get the other half from you using your children as hostages!!!!

OH! OH! OHHH!!!

But, as Walter Cronkite (God rest his soul said) "And That's the Way it is."

MORAL OF THE STORY:

Don't fall for the GF's family trap crap...but if you do... it is usually cheaper than the cost of an American or British woman...and MUCH CHEAPER THAN DIVORCING THEM!

You forgot to mention in #5 how the Queen fattens up and doles out sex biannually, which the King doesn't really mind because she is so fat he would rather mount a cow.

I loved the show John & "Hate" Plus 8 it really put the reality of marital bliss.

TOO RIGHT!!!

"God Bless America", cos nobody else is gonna!!!

I channel surfed onto that show once.... made my 'member' afraid to work for a week knowing how much damage he was capable of doing. Then I bought him some extra battle gear.

Trojan condoms (extra large to make him feel better about himself...ever notice association between battle and sex....you need a Trojan to get into the fortress ), some THUNDERBIRDS GO! pills...aka Viagra and some some Slide gel...just because!

I thought about starting a movement to get all of the men out of America into Thailand. Then I realized if I did that, the American women not being able to take a hint would follow and then commence to try to 'educate' Thai women on the proper way to browbeat and force their men into submission.

Sorry Guys!!! You're on your own....hard enough to school the boys that make it this far.

Uuuuugh! Get out of your box and change the paradigm!

In the West: THB 100k = small engagement ring

In Thailand: No engagement ring required at all! Just offer the same amount in cash and everything is bliss! If things are good with the family, you will get it back when nobody else is looking. If the family is dirt poor, maybe not - up to what her family really thinks about you and your sincerity.

To the OP: You have to understand TIT! This Is Thailand! In Thailand and especially in the village, if a guy so much as does the naughty with a girl, they MUST get married or at least engaged - IMMEDIATELY. It's the traditional family values and honor thing we used to have in the West. All that Pattaya loose and casual relationship behavior DOES NOT HAPPEN or APPLY in the village. Get with the program or really, you need to find another country. You are in Thailand. Thai rules apply, not yours.

They are Thai, but other than that, they are just like families back in the West. I am sure her family is being asked by others back in the village: "Hey, is that guy going to marry Nit or is she just his whore?". Your actions will answer that question for them.

When I married the wife in the village here is how it went:

For Sin Sod we put in 50,000 THB, the ring valued at about 200,000 THB (family heirloom of diamonds set to a new ring to fit my wife's finger), a few baht of gold that we had purchased over the 5 years we spent together before marriage, the deed to a 1 rai plot my wife purchased before we married.

At the end we received all of it back except for a 1/2 bt gold necklace we gave to grandma and about 15,000 bt we gave as a gift to grandma.

I paid for the wedding - this was a 3-day affair during which we never rain out of alcohol or food - total cost was about 100,000 maybe a tad more.

The family is poor, the parents have passed on, I give support monthly in small amounts to the grandmother, and help my brother and sister in-law make ends meet as necessary. Estimated at about 5,000 per month all-in.

The extended relatives used to try to ride the money train, but over the first couple of years we found a neat system - if they borrowed and didn't repay they were cut off. This was made clear up front. Most of them are now cut off. Works for me. Obviously in a true emergency I would consider helping even those who are cut off, but they don't know that.

Now THAT is the proper way it should happen. Good on you!

In my case, I made a promise to Mae and we just signed the papers. During our several months long courtship, with me being able to speak the language and understand the local culture, and with my wife having been "married" previously (an arranged "farmer's marriage" which she ended soon after), although Pa wanted some extra whiskey money, everyone agreed sin sot was unnecessary. Her daughter was happy with me and that was enough for Mae. I volunteered to remodel the old house as a show of my sincerity to be a good provider. Shortly thereafter, Mae became deathly ill and passed on before it was completed - but she passed on knowing I would take good care of her little girl which is all she wanted.

The village (mostly family, anyway) knew me well from participating in village activities (helped with building the local wat and a neighbor's house, gave good advice to settle disputes when asked, helped with farming, drove to the market in the wee hours of the mornings to pickup things for them to resell, etc., etc.). Heck, the remodel of the house gave many of them a much needed opportunity to work when a large farm decided to switch to a different crop which did not need their labor. I paid them all very good wages which helped many families get through a tough transition period. So, one could say that accumulated merit was more than enough sin sot for everyone to be happy.

So, surely ignorant flamers would say "You cheap bastard. You should have paid something like the rest of us.". To which I would respond: Reread this post. If my wife's family was in the West and I had done the same, would things be any different? No. Which is my point. So many falang have this unfounded notion that Thai families are so different from Western families. They are not. The language is different, some customs are different, but the people are exactly the same. Most falang cannot overcome the barrier which is their own ignorance and inability to shift the paradigm. The falang who are able to shift the paradigm are the ones who can "boast" that they understand Thais.

The difference between "us" and "them" is that there really is no difference other than our own ingrained ethnocentric perceptions and ignorance.

As for the family wanting to ride the gravy train, I did something similar to you. I offered a "pot" of THB 10,000 which anyone is welcome to borrow. However, it must be repaid before the next person can borrow. I haven't seen the money since it was all loaned out, and I have no idea who needs to repay. Perhaps my wife does, but whatever. The wife sends a food allowance to Pa of THB 3,000 monthly (he's been living in the remodeled old house with his new chick and new son) and we help little brother-in-law who never asks for much (but I sneak him more than the wife wants him to have - shame on me).

Cheeers!

THESE GUYS GOT IT RIGHT!

Look when in Rome, do as the Romans do.

If you find you weren't planning to go to Rome, and don't like it... RUN FORREST, RUN!!

You are not obligated to buy into something you don't want.

If you are SURE you found the one (requires several years in Thailand) then you will have observed and understand how Thai men deal with this same issue. You shouldn't be treated or act differently because you are farang.

Just a few thoughts:

As others have pointed out living together equals married in village eyes

People get married/live together because they love each other with a few exceptions. That doesnt vary between Thai or western.

When you marry you marry into a family as your wife or husband marries into yours as well and with that come some commitments (could be financial or not or emotional or things like learning the language) as well as some advantages (land inheritances for kids maybe, an opportuntiy to learn about real Thai culture, support from a family).

People seem to obsess about money. There are far more important things in life.

First there was sex for the sole purpose of mating...and recreation. No rules, no guidelines, just get the right parts in the right place and let nature take its course…no videos, books, Cosmopolitan or Oprah required.

Second, ownership of women between tribes and families as early methods to perpetuate the human race. Little is written on the walls of caves about love.

Third, 'civilized man' (I always like this term for its oxymoron) created a ritual of sharing his daughter through arrangement which became what we now know to be an "arranged marriage". a dowry, was to pay for the expenses of raising her. Though not politically correct to say, much like buying a head of cattle and paying for the cost of feed and care, as well as a little profit. Not much has changed in Isaan, India or other places where "arranged marriages" take place.

NOTE: TODAY, about 1/3 of the world's population is involved in some form of arranged marriage. India and surrounding nations 1.4 billion, some areas of China 1.5 Billion, Northern African nations of high Islamic belief, middle eastern nations...and it is not uncommon for girls past their mid 20's approaching 'old maid status" in Japan and Korea to ask their parents for help in arranging a suitable husband.

Fourth, The ritual became formalized by tribe leaders and early forms of government to record ancestry. Love between parties was a bonus, as the woman's primary role was to take care of home, children she provided for the man and work in the fields with the rest of the workers to sustain. Only up until the last several hundred years was the religious belief installed that polygamy was wrong. Until then it was always completely acceptable a man have as many wives as he could afford. Only Christianity beat it over our heads that it was wrong, even though many of the Old Testament characters such as Moses, Noah, etc. had several wives (bet your Vicar, Priest and Reverend failed to drive that subject home on Sunday)

It has evolved into a requirement by laws of many nations to be recognized as a legitimate marriage that parties register their marriage.

Fifth, The present day fairy tale that love is the primary reason for marriage was created to encourage men during the Victorian ages to marry one woman only and that love should carry them beyond their hardship. Hardly consolation for giving up other field workers.

The Knight in shining armor and Princess fairy tale concept of love is mostly a Disney story that was eaten up by western women, mostly American and British who believe a Princess becomes Queen and equally rules the kingdom... until she's pi++ed off divorces your As+ and takes here half that she didn't have before the marriage and the spends the rest of her life trying to get the other half from you using your children as hostages!!!!

OH! OH! OHHH!!!

But, as Walter Cronkite (God rest his soul said) "And That's the Way it is."

MORAL OF THE STORY:

Don't fall for the GF's family trap crap...but if you do... it is usually cheaper than the cost of an American or British woman...and MUCH CHEAPER THAN DIVORCING THEM!

the new advertising campaign should be tagged:

Thailand! Burma with Electricity

THAT is funny.

i don't know the Thai's well enough to really comment, but the kind of comical stuff their interchangeable governments come up with is embarrassingly comical to the world outside of Thailand. my question to those of you who have lived in Thailand for a while: do many Thai's realize how mickey mouse their govt comes across, or is the Thai pride thing so ingrained that they just don't see it?

as i read this, all i can think is that this is the govt. cozying up more to the BiB. 'you want more money? no problem, we'll create some more ridiculous laws to give you a new avenue for tea money'.

i have spoken to many thais about world events, international image etc etc etc. Blank looks is my first impression. They dont get it. The ones I have spoken to are unable to comprehend their country as anything but near perfect. Recent events have certainly opened their eyes as the government has been advertising the fact on TV and told them to behave in a more buddist way.

A while back the family of my thai gf asked me about Taksin. I said he is corrupt and lies and steals from the Thai people and would be finished soon. They nearly fell over at my comments. 2 weeks later he was ousted. months after that all the facts about his dodgy dealing started to be aired. Still they didn't beleive it. Only now are they realising the damage he has caused Thailand. Thais are only just waking up to the world around them, but they lives are often so hard that they give little thought to what the world opinion might be. it's unlikely to effect their lives that much and if it does it was destined to happen so why worry about it.

Thailand is getting a wake up call (the recession), but it is probably beyond most people's comprehension (that is actually true for all delevoping countries and for the less educated in all other counties).

people either dont understand the ramifications or long term impact the recession will have on their lives.

The answer to your question is probably no, they dont realise how MM their government comes across, but no more than the average US or Brit citizen don't realises their countries are war mongers driven by greed in the name of fighting global terrorism.

I am British by the way and an Ex Mil Forces who fought in GW1 and has worked with UK and US military and private agencies and personnel in the ME.

I think every PM in Thailand's history has been connected with some level of corruption.

It seems endemic to Thailand's people and Government.

That being said...

In such situations, you measure the amount of good vs. bad they had done.

Thaksin grew Thailand's economy from Agrarian as it's No.1 industry which required bumper crop yields to be good for the economy to Tourism which only required a smile and stable government....OK both are instable...

Thaksin brough technology, foreign investment farther along than any of his predecessors or successors who seem to spend more time infighting than governing.

Present team in place seems to have lost the plot altogether and moving towards a dictatorship. Burma with electricity...funny...I LIKE IT! So which is it?: A. Burmese Dictatorship? B. American style government under a repressive GW Bush like administration?

I PICK.... C. Constitutional Monarchy who loves their people and believes in democracy for its people as intended by King Chulalongkorn,(Rama V) พระบาทสมเด็จพระจุลจอมเกล้าเจ้าอยู่หัว "พระปิยมหาราช" and our present King of Thailand.

Sad part about a government is even when they get it right...someone comes along after a few years and changes it for the worse.

What is this... The UNITED STATES!?!?!?!

OH!!!...So thats where GW Bush went after he left the White House!!!

It makes sense...RED SHIRT Protests...Republican GOP Party

When my wife picked up her first new car, the monk told her it had to be on a Friday with a blue ribbon tired on the sterirng wheel, and only at 2:15 pm could she turn the key to start the engine and the car must be facing east.

ANY MONK REPRESENTING HIMSELF AS "MAW DOO" OF SOOTHSAYER/FORTUNE TELLER IS IN "DEFEAT" OF ONE OF THE FOUR DEFEATS PREVENTING THEM FROM BEING RECOGNIZED AS A MONK OF BUDDHISM... ACCORDING TO THE PATTIMOKA

PRESCRIPTION FOR HUMANITY WITH FARANG MEN IN THAILAND:

WHEN WE SPEND MONEY ON A GOOD AND NOBLE CAUSE EVERYONE WINS.

WHEN A WESTERN MAN TRIES TO LOOK LIKE A HERO IN THE EYES OF THAI PEOPLE BY USING SPENDING MONEY, INEVITABLY YOU LOSE BIG TIME!!!

APPLY ACCORDINGLY, AND OFTEN.

For goodness sake, try to understand the culture here.

And what is that (the culture here) To sell your daughter to the highest bidder or to live off her earnings as a prostitute

That could be an interpretation of some Westerners who understand very little about Thailand and its culture, I have a slightly different interpretation however.

Let me see if I can't put the term culture into perspective and call it tradition instead.

If you've ever been close to Thai's who are truly poor and live in small clusters in grass shacks with corrugated tin roofs, a single room that provides no privacy or protection from the elements and is full of mosquito's, 24/7; if you had listened to their stories about how their crops failed one year, a family member needed hospital treatment and there was no work to be had anywhere, other than perhaps 200 baht a day laboring on occasion; if you have seen the anguish as a parent tries to dress their daughters child in the best clothes they can find as they prepare her for school and worry about government loans that must be repaid and they have no idea how they will manage that, or even where they will find food for their evening meal unless they go into the hills and cut bamboo shoots. If you had seen those things then you would understand what it's like to be really really poor yet despite all of it, the family remains a family unit, it has love, support and that's really all they have.

So the role of the eldest daughter (and younger ones also these days) is to provide whatever support she can to that unit and most of the ones I've ever come across take that job very seriously. Some Westerners might call it prostitution but the Thai's will refer to it as working and don't get all hung up about western religious values of no sex before marriage - many Thai's will also see it as a trade off, you want me and sex, I need support for my family. At the end of the day nobody forces the Westerner to take the Thai girl and have sex with her, he could always go a totally different route in life. But if he chooses to take the girl, culture or tradition suggests he should pay, that's the tradition and from a moral perspective, it's not a bad one in my book. Of course, if your Thailand experience has consisted only of life on upper Sukhumvit or an apartment in Langsuan with the odd trip to Koh Samui, you may have no idea whatsoever what's being talked about here and couldn't possible begin to understand the concepts involved.

Nice post but LOVE was not mentioned even once!

I believe;

If she is in love she will protect you from all the nonsense that goes with marrying into a poor Thai family.

If she doesn't love you and she is only after your money then you have to pay bigtime.

It really is that simple

I agree 100% no 1000% no 1,000,000,000,000,000%

If she doesn't protect you from it, SHE's IN ON IT!!!

Hello,

been living with my Thai gf here in bangkok for a few months although we have dated for over a year. Today went to her parents house because her mother wanted to speak to us. Should point out that she is from a poor family.

They told us today they want 100,000 or 200,000 bhat plus gold because we are now "something".....this was all in Thai..but gf explained it as "kind of engaged".

I quietly thought ...<deleted>?.... we are not engaged and are still at early stages of living together in a full on relationship.

I have read that dowrys still exist here for marriage but has anyone heard of a custom of giving alot of money to the parents just to date the daughter. my gf could not explain it well. Also a little bit flustered because her family has not been especially friendly so far but today were all smiles. hmmm.

Thanks.

RUN FORREST!!! RUN!!!!

Even if you love her and intended to marry her, this is a sign of only the beginning of what's to come in the future.

DO THE MATH MAN!!!!

100,000 divided by 1,000thb (if you speak some Thai and can negotiate) for GF experience at any Bar of your choosing = 100 Nights in heaven.

REMEMBER WHAT CHARLIE SHEEN SAYS: "I don't pay to have sex with women, I pay them to go away afterwards."

THE FACT THAT YOU EVEN HAD TO ASK SOMEONE ON THIS FORUM INDICATES YOU ARE NOT READY.

การสบประมาทศาสนา

gaan sòp bprà-mâat sàat-sà-naa

(gaan changes verb to noun, sòp bprà-mâat insult belittle, sàat-sà-naa religion)

Thank you. The only problem is with the word ศาสนา included it's difficult to apply the การสบประมาทศาสนา in a figurative way. For example, if a highly reverend monk is being accused of patronizing Poseidon, instead of 'sa raai' which means slander, I'd like to add some sting and say it's blasphemy. But really it has nothing to do with religion.

I believe that ไม่ให้เกียรติ or ไม้รู็จักเกรงใจ or ไม่รู้ที่สูงที่ต่ำ or another such phrase would be the most likely approach for a native speaker to make such a point. The outrage is that such an accusation violates the traditional social standing of the monk, so these common expressions work. The fact that this person of high social standing happens to be a person of high standing in the Buddhist clergy is perhaps only a side factor and doesn't need to feature in the expression of your outrage.

Also, I find it strange to think of an attack on the character of a monk as 'blasphemy'. I don't think we would use such a term with respect to a priest.

อานนท์

In Thailand if you want to make a statement about Buddhism or the actions of a particular monk, you should speak specifically to the actions. Never calling a monk or someone in robes a name. Since in Thailand it is equivalent to speaking poorly against the King or Royal Family. Do not expect to make friends or lure people to your way of thinking or religious beliefs this way.

In Buddhism, There is a "Right Path" and "Dhukka"/Suffering. To point out someone's mistakes is both unrpoductive and perpetuates more suffering. Not the path to Nibbana/Nirvana/End of Suffering.

In the Thai/Buddhist mindset fill the voids and mistakes with what is right will encourage growth. To speak in negatives is equal to putting weed killer on your lawn...since grass is technically a weed also, it does more harm than good.