thailandpeter2

agreeing here. well, it would be an already larger accomplishment than the last times (2010 for example), but still a looong way to go to show any maturity...

"If we can get through the current crisis and political confrontation without killings or a coup, that in itself would be an accomplishment and a sign of political maturity."

No....Political maturity would be if elected officials create a dialogue and accept a compromise which benefits a majority of the people. In addition, the electorate also accepts this decision for now, and if not satisfied, offers alternatives and uses fair and honest elections as a vehicle for change.

Not killing and not having a coup does not demonstrate "political maturity". What it does demonstrate is a society which is just a step above total barbarism.

generally it wouldn't be that bad if the PTP ship would sink, together with her... so, maybe they SHOULD keep her around - which they will most likely do anyway, regarding who her brother is...

thay can't just dump thaksin's baby sister...!!!

She is a total lame duck in the water. The sooner PTP dumps her the better their chances of getting more MPs in the next election.

Unfortunately for YL, Thais, like most of the worlds voting public, are very fickle and she is last year fashion. Other than a few forum posters, she has been well and truly 'dumped' by the public; notice how few people are leaping to her defense - The UDD? Are they still at Rajamakala stadium in their tens of thousands? They have been very quiet, which is unusual as they normally want attention! Whats going on there?

If PTP has one gram of sense in it, they need to do dump her. Otherwise it will be a case of the ship going down with the captain, as opposed to the captain doing down with the ship. Otherwise it's checkmate with Suthep the victor.

thay can't just dump thaksin's baby sister...!!!

She is a total lame duck in the water. The sooner PTP dumps her the better their chances of getting more MPs in the next election.

Unfortunately for YL, Thais, like most of the worlds voting public, are very fickle and she is last year fashion. Other than a few forum posters, she has been well and truly 'dumped' by the public; notice how few people are leaping to her defense - The UDD? Are they still at Rajamakala stadium in their tens of thousands? They have been very quiet, which is unusual as they normally want attention! Whats going on there?

If PTP has one gram of sense in it, they need to do dump her. Otherwise it will be a case of the ship going down with the captain, as opposed to the captain doing down with the ship. Otherwise it's checkmate with Suthep the victor.

why? do you like public inconveniene?

. . . creating the least public inconvenience.

This phase is worrying.

regarding: 1. Individuals or groups prone to agitation or provocation, disrupting public peace and stopping officials from carrying out their duties, are banned from entering or leaving the following premises, ...

they are also banned from LEAVING?????

this said, looks like suthep has totally overplayed his hand. whoever worked out his current strategy, has to be a complete idiot. while the mass demonstrations until sunday and partially also the marches on monday were quite ok and in line with democratic stanards, the occupations of government offices are totally out of line. and he shows that he is not better than the pad in 2008 or the red shirts in 2010...

the goal of the demos itself was good: ged rid of a bad law (amnesty bill) or of a corrupt government (sfter the bill was shot down). but the means employed are very likely likely to put the protesters in a losing situation... or to increase the height of violent confrontation greatly...

probably not long any more before the red shirts will come out of the stadium they have been in...

same here, but even if the government falls (peacefully), what will come after? the best for thailand in the current condition might be an interim government of independent experts, not affiliated with any party and suspending elections for a few years. but who would select them?

the second-best option would be snap elections. but it would be far from sure that the same government would not emerge again - they still seem to have much support in thailand, espeially in the north and northeast. and then? maybe the demonstrations came too early to have a good chance to be successful?

and if the democrats win, then you'd have probably the reds all over bangkok again.

i guess there is only one virtually sure thing: it will get VERY interesting....

I'd love to see this government fall and held accountable for anything they've done but I'm not sure this is the way to go about it. It depends on what they do next as there's a risk of it becoming violent.

It would be interesting to see what the government would do if the protesters caused as much trouble as in 2010 but that wouldn't help those who live and work in Bangkok.

suthep has said they will win in 3 days. today was day one. what happens/what will the protesters do if they don't win in 3 days? just give up or continue (if they'd continue anyway, then why the 3 day forecast?). it's never good to make such forecasts... but it seems they are very popular in thailand (promise to solve a certain problem in a certain time - usually nothing happens).

or was that only 'encouragement for the troops'?

basically i agree with most reasons for the protests - buth with his past, suthep is maybe not the right person to lead them...

also, what do they want? the only really democratic thing would be dissolution of parliament and snap elections. which the opposition would very probably not be sure to win. and then we'd very fast just have the same scenario again as now.

violence or the miltary stepping in would not be any viable solutions.

the problem is that she has to deal with a lot of morons in her party, generally only because they have money and power... so don't think that she could exert much power, even if she tried.

I almost feel sympathy for this woman. Almost.

She's a wife and mother who previously spent her time looking good at one of the Shin companies. Now she's starting to show the intense pressure thrust upon her by her megalomaniac criminal brother. She seems to put a brave face on her predicament. Well done Teflon Lady.

If I were the PM and had the power of a party that she has... Christ, what has she wasted...

yes they chewed up A LOT more tha the british. in any case, during the reign of rama 4 and rama 5 thailand lost app. 40 % of it's territory.all laos and cambodia, and a little bit in the south...

but that was logical: france wantesd to gain possessions; britain had them already in india/burma and malaysia. and they both wanted to retain a buffer state (thailand) between their colonies...

The British did take Burma and a good part of Malaysia away from Thailand.

I guess you could say they colonized them after taking .them from Thailand.

After WWII the Brits walked away from both, but they were not returned to Thailand.

Some Brit expats I know claim they are not treated as well by the Thai government ( immigration ) as other expats.

I wonder if the Thais still hold a grudge?

Probably not.

Most Thais I know don't know much of their countries history.

Some of Siam was reorganized but that was a fair time before WW2 not as a result of it.

Interesting website here: http://www.csmngt.com/thailand_history.htm

1809 siam.jpgcolonail expansion by year.jpg

Looks like France chewed up more than Britain!

the first landing of the japanese was actually NOT with the thai government's approval and there was some brief fighting. the thai prime minister had been upcountry and learned of the landing only a fw hours later and then gave his approval to stop the figthing...

The country was occupied by the Japanese during WW11, with the consent of the government at the time; but there was much resistance to this.

No, there was never an occupation. Thailand maintained its fully armed police and military, even joining in some of the fighting, mainly in the north against the Chinese.

The landing of Japanese troops was with the consent of the government, but there was never an occupation.

And there was very little resistance to both the landings and the presence of the Japanese throughout the war. Resistance of note - a bit more than a full day - occurred at Prachuap Khiri Khan, with the deaths of approximately 33 Thais.

Throughout the country, there was very little resistance or even disapproval.

so, they did NOT employ enough police officers? really a very dumb oversight from these russians...

The ATM scammers who recently arrested violated the labor laws. If they had had the four required Thais for each foreign worker (8 Thai police officers in this case)...they probably never would have been apprehended. The extras could have held the bank cards so they didn't drop to the ground resulting in the notification to the police.

he did not mention WHERE he saw the show...

I saw a Ping pong show years ago with an aussie girl,the thai lady was on the later side of forty and resembled a fat midget,despite this she certainly was not shy.

Can't say I was entertained but hey it's still in my mind so it had something.

Did the Aussie girl have a work permit?

i guess you mean the car of course, right?

It has a lovely white sporty body, nice attractive curves, probably a real pleasure in the right hands.

i remember that a few months ago i had found swiss cholocate (i think it was Lindt brand) with chili at The Mall. dark chocolate with chili. i bought one and it wasn't bad, although not entirely to my taste... i would not buy it again.

but i don't know how good the dunkin' donuts mixture is...

the man is either a complete idiot - or he believes the whole population in thailand to be idiots. otherwise one really can't explain his behaviour. his 'modus operandi' every time there is a problem:

- first he denies repeatedly that there will be any problem

- then, if he sees that there will be a problem, despite of him having anonunced that there won't be any (I wonder why the problems 'dare' to persist despite his announcements), he does either one of two options:

- either he shuts up immediately and goes completely mum for a few weeks/days

- or he comes up with a totally unsuitable solution first and then shuts up

- if, after a few days or weeks of his silence the problem has - expectedly - gotten out of hand, he does not even try to seek for solution any more, but just forecasts that the problem will go away by itself in a certain time frame - this time frame being adjustable (usually to a later date in the future) any day...

i have never read or seen that he actually had come forward with a solution which has helped to solve any problem...

I really wonder, how the people in floodeed areas feel now about the government's assurance that there is nothing to worry about flooding this year...

I have just read the whole thread on this, and it seems nobody has mentioned the the PM offered early elections and a five point road map. His deputy also handed himself in to DSI as requested by the red shirts.

The redshirts could have gone home with a victory and saving face if that is truely what they wanted.

They did not, they then put up further demands which were unreasonable.

The government bent over backwards to help the red shirts but the leaders just did not want to know.

It seems they had a lot more in mind and that was shown when the military HAD to move in to dispan them.

The red shirts need to be educated in what democracy really means.

Right............it is almost beyond belief what this government decided to offer them after they (the Reds)did everything in their power to cause violence.

What the PM gave the Reds was an extraordinary gift and they (Thaksin) refused to accept it.

Imagine this: An angry mob moves on Washington DC, breaks into government buildings, uses explosive devices and guns, kills people, causes mass transit to stop running, threatens to burn the city down.............etc.,.............and the President of the United States decides to "hold elections early," etc.

It would never happen in one million years!

to all the posters who seem to condone the burning of buildings in thailand, just one question:

in order to be fair - if the reds are allowed to burn buildings in bangkok, would that also mean that the yellows/their political opponents are now allowed to go to khon kaen or udon or ubol and burn the houses of the reds? after all, it would not be personal - just a political struggle...

i think the only way to go forward is:

- for the government, to make sure for the moment that the country is secure

- then, to extend the olive branch to the moderate sectors of any democrary movement really intending to advance the development of the poorer population/regions in thailand and to try to develop the country in accordance with them.

- for the moderate read/democracy groups in opposition to the government to distance themselves from thaksin and the people who have advocated or taken part the receont protests and following violent incidents, set up a new grassroots movement, maybe register a new political party, etc., so that they can partake in the next elections. also, they should better not be connected to phuea thai anyway, as this party is lead by the old school politicians and these are surely NOT on the side of the poor and economically disadvantaged...

also, as all this needs time, i do not see any advantage in the government stepping down soon or in snap elections. that would only result in more political violence, for example government candidates not being able to campaign i chiang mai, or udon, and therefore surely not in free and fair elections. and then, whoever wins them, the other side would protest against the outcome again. in the meantime, economy would go further down the drain. it will get hard enough (probably ESPECIALLY for the lower middle class - employees, workers, etc., who for example would not have much savings to get over this period) in the next months and maybe years already anyway, even without further political disturbances...

http://www.vwt.net - Thaivisa co-locates servers with them, we are very impressed.

thx, george! will contact innerspace via PM now...

cheers

peter

Singapore train users are much more rude and aggresive than here, particularly in regard to blocking the centre section of the platform opposite the doors supposedly for departing passengers to use.

I noticed a few weeks back, there are now huge posters on some of the stations, requesting boarding passengers to adhere to this what should be common sense rule.

yes, in thailand they mostly actually queue nowadays anyway, at least during non-rush hours. but there are sometime people standing smack in the middle of the door closing the way for exiting passengers. my receipt for these people: when exiting the train, charge straight at them - they will retreat very quickly and fade to the left or right side of he door. of course you have to look first WHO is standing in your way makes me maybe the rude farang, but i do this only against the occasional rude thai...

Was 3,000+100 for 1 year WP, but recent report indicates has/is going up to 3,000+600. Plus looks like further changes coming with expected alterations to Foreign Business Act regulations.

thx - yes, i read they also want to extend the list of businesses not allowed for non-thais to do, and that they would not even publish he new list... but that it will affect work permit renewals as well as new work permits

so, it seems that nothing really chnged form last year. do you know whether it's still baht 3,000.- for a year's work permit or did they increase the fees?

Just would like to know where i can find an updated list of current documentation needed for work permit extension. used to go to http://www.doe.co.th/workpermit/index.html, but that link does not work any more and on the web site http://www.doe.co.th (which is all in thai language) i cannot find any hint rew where i might find that info.

any ideas?

also, i am married to a thai and have 2 kids. would it be helpful (and making the renewal easier) if i also attach documentation of my marriage and the kids with my work permit application (just as proof that i support a thai family with with my work too)? any info on that?

Very good move. I hope it catches on and spreads throughout the country.

Unfortunately it doesn't include the worst givers of plastic, 7-Eleven, where you get a bag regardless of the size of your purchase, plastic bags inside plastic bags, a plastic straw if you buy a litre of milk etc.

1.) the big retailers surely make a step into the right direction.

2.) whenever i buy something a 7/11 and it's only 1 or two items, i either tell them 'no big' or grab the items off the counter before they can give me any plastic bag... and if they give me straws i either tell them that i don't need any or just take them out of the bag (if i got one) and put them on the counter...

also, and this is currently in all the stores: where they do with one bag only, they give you three...

I have been working with my thai company (i am the only foreigner in my company) for several years and we have four thai employees - the usual minimum number needed per work permit holder - on the company payroll. now i have heard that, if the foreigner holding a work permit is legally married to a thai citizen (wife) - as i am - only two thai employees are required on the company's payroll.

our company is located in bangkok. the information regarding only two thai employees needed was received from an acquaintance with a company upcountry. so, i wonder whether this regulation would also apply to a company in bangkok, or whether there are any differences depending on the company location (in which province).

anybody with information regarding this?

This situation is beginning to get very scary. I think the closing of places of entertainment should be seriously considered, also any other places where a large number of people gather in one confined space. Of course it begs the question, what about supermarkets, bars, restaurants, airports etc. I would not want to be the minister who activated closure of these places too, but if a two week closure would see the dramatic reduction of infections we are told would occur, and possibility a swifter end to this 36 month plague, we should bite the bullet and do it.

Of course there is the question of compensation for lost revenue. But should money speak louder than human lives? Again I would not want to be the minister making that decision either.

P&M

While i agree with you that some public places should be closed, closing all would be risky and not only a matter of lost revenue. i would say, close:

- schools and universities (this should really have been done last week or so already)

- entertainments places (bars, theatres, massage parlors, internet cafes, concerts, etc.)

- possibly restaurants

- demonstrations (red shirts, yellow shirts, etc.), as they are also mass gathering of people which could 'help' the flu in spreading

of course, the people working there or the owners would have to be supported financially by the government - it's not just a matter of lost revenue, but some people - epsecially the workers in these restaurants, and small foodstall or small restaurant owners, are dependent on their daily income to survive)...

to close down other public places which - i agree - could be transmission points is very risky, and NOT only regarding lost revenue:

- supermarkets and maybe also food markets: where will people get their food then, especially in cities?

- airports, railway stations, public transport: there ARE definitely situations in which people need to travel, and which are not 'only' for business or holiday reasons...

- bank's branches counter services outlets like bank branches counter services, utilities services outlets, etc.: quite impossible to do that...

so, while surely something HAS to be done (while working on a vaccine/prevention AND also of course on effective cures for a possibly mutating virus which can get resistant to current treatments too), methods applied have to be selected carefully. while of course a spread of the flu should be minimized, on the other side you surely would not like to see a total breakdown of the country and it's society... because following this health care services could also break down and that would be counterproductive...

also, of course free treatment and free vaccines would have to be provided at least to people who would financially suffer from the temporary shutdown of their work and income place/sources...

How does 165000 to 27000 equate to a 33.45% drop? Even if this statistic was meant to be a drop "OF" 27000, it does not add up. This is wildly wrong or else I an misinterpreting "year on year".......

Anyone?

I am always 'amazed' about the math of government and organizations here. remember, when a couple of months back, they reported a fall in exports of 20 ++ % and a fall in imports of 30 ++ % year-on-year, estimated a loss of 200 - 300 billion baht for the tourism industry (out of targeted 500 billion baht) and then estimated the GDP to shrink for 3-4 % this year? at that time i really wondered which sector would GROW that much to enable a shrinkage of only 3-4 %... and hey what, a little bit later they announced a shrinkage of the GDP 7.9 % in the first 3 month (year on year-basis). my estimate is rather that minus 10 % only this year would already be much better than could be expected... and now they come up with the sudden recognition that tourim is going to be REALLY bad this year... guess they never asked hotels and tour operators before how they are doing currently...

11 million tourist arrivals this year? i guess half of it would still be a quite good figure.

amazing thailand, really... but this hasn't really changed during my 17 years in the realm...