anotheruser

47 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

It's a good idea, if a price was chosen that enticed the majority of people to not bother with retirement visas or doing loads of visa runs the authorities would make more money.

They aren't trying to lure retirees or visa hoppers. 

Just now, Flustered said:

I agree on this one.

 

I am not sure what there is to gain by upping the income levels as there are no benefits to a foreigner living in Thailand so no drain on the State. ExPats are however spending money in the Thai economy so you would imagine they would be welcome.

 

Certainly I have not seen any reason for me not to go for the 20 year TE. It ticks all of the boxes for our needs. 

 

 

More foreign currency sitting in a bank I guess. Insurance has been a hot button issue but that's all in another thread. Most guys on 65,000  a month and over 50 can't afford insurance. 

Anyway we are getting off topic. The only real reason not to but a TEVis if you don't like the price. That is a very subjective thing. 

Just now, Flustered said:

I do not think that put anyone off and I do not remember any articles on long term tourists being affected or visas cancelled.

 

Has anyone been deported out of Thailand with a cancelled visa due to the Government revoking them? Have any long term foreigners with ties to the country ever been deported or forced to leave due to the Government cancelling visa schemes or the usual once every 5 years internal dispute?

 

These are always internal Thai issues that have little effect on foreigners. The Thai's go out of their way to avoid involving foreigners although there are always stupid foreigners that get themselves involved.

The airport thing for sure put people off. Anyway I never suggested anything about the past. I was talking about what may take place in the future. One thing people are saying is they do not feel comfortable with committing to a TE for a long period because of the uncertainty of the future. I was somewhat commenting about people making those comments and said the risk of a TE isn't any higher than anything else people are doing.

I also mentioned in a worst case scenario if things did heat up the cost of a visa would be the least of one's worries. As far as visas go I suspect they will not cancel any visas but will probably make the requirements to obtain a visa more difficult in the future. This is why I said it will be the lower hanging fruit that finds itself at risk.

No visa cancellations will come but income requirements being upped at some time in the future is almost a certainty imo. 

2 minutes ago, Flustered said:

Out if interest, how many times in the last 50 years has Thailand become unstable enough to put off long term tourists or how many times have visa programs been revoked and people lost their visa status?

Just off the top of my head a few years back the airport was shut down. There have been a few other times people have avoiding coming because of local skirmishes in recent times. 

The reality is if times get really rough and things kick off big time it is then a question of who can afford to leave not who can afford to stay.

3 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

I think it was my comment which may have been considered a 'chastise'... when YetAnother commented on cutting the cost in half and tripling the interest - how could he possibly know that ?... He doesn't it was just an off the cuff comment which he didn't really think about...  Of course lowering the cost of anything would increase interest, but it's impossible to quantify how much... 

 

He wants the T.E. Program to be affordable - it is, just not to everyone. 

 

The Scheme has been running for over 10 years now, but it's history has been somewhat marred by whether or not it will remain running - I'm guessing that will never go away which is why many have been reluctant to go for the 20 year option making the 5 year option more attractive as a direct result of foreseeable instability. 

The thing is if the country becomes that unstable visas will be the least of the worries. These guys who won't buy a TE because of potential instability in the future yet built houses here carry the same risk. 

In that regard TE members aren't really taking any sort of disproportionate risks. I did the 5 year one as well as it was all I needed and won't even use most of it. However if people are really worried about being denied visas the other visa types are just as vulnerable if not more so do to having yearly extensions and the burden of proving finances etc. to get another year. 

The lower hanging fruit will always be the first to get cut should heads be put on the block.

If the government decides in the future for whatever reason to not honor TE visas they can just as easily do this to anybody else they want to. Now we are going back to something that has already been discussed though. 

Just now, elviajero said:

 

They already have!!!

 

No doubt they will introduce more 'membership programs'  in the future as it seems to be the only way they've kept the scheme going to date.

Okay so the price should be affordable now? People were asking for a price cut and got it. Can't see the entry level ever going below 500K. I don't think there is enough to chop up if they discount it any further. 

I don't think the price is wrong but the demographic may be off. If they cut the price in half again many still couldn't afford it. They may have over estimated the kind of people that come to Thailand. 

But here is a clue how much TE cares about any of our business opinions are ideas on the matter. Look at the date of last visit in the picture. So it seems they don't exactly come here often to farm this place for our clever comments and ideas. Seems they gave up on this place being anything useful since at least last August

1 minute ago, YetAnother said:

drop the fees by half and you will see 3 times the number of people signing up; o, sorry, too advanced for the thai elite folks

No way they could do that. A news release stating they are dropping the price in half isn't good for them and would piss off those who are already members. 

Just now, jankan88 said:

Yes, before going to immigration and affix the visa you will already gotten your ID number and welcome letter.

 

The temporary letter I was talking about (perhaps same as the ID/welcome letter) was just to be used instead of the actual card if you use any of the benefits like golf, spa etc. It didnt have anything to do with the visa...as far as I understood it.

Even before you wouldn't get the card until the visa was affixed. Last year the day i went to get the visa is when I got the card and welcome box. When I made a bank account they never asked for the card. I had a letter and appointment made already.

I have never used the limo service so no idea but if TE runs that you can assume they will accept your letter or even just show them the visa in your passport would suffice. There is no real reason you need the card as far as I know. They may want it for some of the hotel deals which I have never used. 

Just now, lkn said:

As I already wrote, it’s unavailable at this time. But imaginary makes it sound like it’s just some wishful thinking by expats, when in fact rather specific details have been given to us by the Ministry of Tourism and Sports, or do you have some new information that is cause for pessimism?

 

I’m not sure what your thing is about the health insurance, but I am sure that the people who are considering spending 500,000 baht or more on the Thai Elite membership can afford to pay for the required health insurance.

 

The new scheme is designed to eliminate losers.They would be draining the swamp. Of course if you can afford health insurance and a TE you are still welcome. 

I have answered all of this many moons ago. If you don't trust my answers talk to TE directly when you scrape up the money whenever that might be.

1 minute ago, gk10002000 said:

I have contacted them and waiting for a reply.  Why don't you provide some answers instead of being obtuse?

Because you ask the same questions that have been answered 25 pages ago. I simply can't take you at face value with your questions.

Let us know what they say.

Just now, scubascuba3 said:

Still easy, you just say you are totally healthy, pay the premium, and then use the certificate for the visa. That's why the idea is flawed.

Healthy and have insurance eliminates around 90% of the people here. Nobody wants to touch them with a ten foot pole insurance wise. 

2 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

No I don't already know.  I assumed the 5 year TE visa covered everything.  The part I quoted from their website says one must pay for extension.  Other people seem to be saying the one year extensions are automatic.  So are they automatic but you still have to pay?

 

Also last year they announced an 800k option for 10 years.  This is not that nutty sounding investment 10 year thing.  Has anybody gotten the 800k for 10 years?

I just wouldn't buy one if I were you. Why not contact them directly if you are so curious? 

Just now, scubascuba3 said:

I would have thought its easy for people to choose a low cost health insurance policy, even if people declare no previous health issues.

Not when you are 80+ plus years old and have an artificial heart. 

3 minutes ago, lkn said:

There is a 10 year retirement visa in the works, it requires an initial balance of 3 million or income of 100,000 baht/month, proof of health insurance, and will cost 10,000 baht, but while it has been approved by cabinet, it still hasn’t shown up as an option when applying for visa.

It is an imaginary visa at this point. The health insurance aspect eliminates 90% of the people in Thailand anyway.

On 5/6/2017 at 4:10 PM, BritTim said:

Presumably, the British gentleman in question was due to be detained by the authorities on arrival back in the UK. I can understand why, in such a case, the Thais would wish to ensure the gentleman arrived at his intended destination. The position of those being deported for overstay is surely rather different. I could imagine many countries not wanting to receive a deportee but, with him not expected to face criminal proceedings anywhere, I cannot see why the Thai authorities should really care where he ends up. The main thing is that he has left, and will be unable to return should that have been decided.

Because it discourages people with criminal records to stay in the country. Deportation is a very good way to return people to where they may face criminal charges. If you leave voluntarily you choose where you go. 

If you are a criminal holed up in a country hiding out you get sent to face the music. This system is in place by design and can be used to bring criminals to justice when extradition isn't an option or viable. This is to encourage those type of people to leave while they still can.

Deportation for example would be a good way to bring somebody like "Boss" to justice. 

On 5/6/2017 at 6:19 AM, colinneil said:

My friend has a problem, how many times is that one posted?

If anybody is on nine years overstay, they deserve a stay in theI IDC.

It shows a total disregard for the law, total lack of respect for Thailand.

Many things here are not to our liking, but as we chose to live here, we have to put up with them.

I don't agree with this. I understand the sentiment but Thai immigration should use the threat of incarceration to get people to come in. If you surrender and can pay the flight and 20,000 to leave they should let you do it.

What do we care if somebody spends time in IDC isn't is better to allow these people to simply leave and never come back? I believe even America let's people go back to Mexico and waives punitive measures in order to attract people to voluntarily leave.

Well realistically that crowd isn't wrong. Most of the posters saying that would be better served with a used Toyota and a trunk full of baby formula and diapers than a TE visa. Laos and Cambodia funnily enough are less easy to move to now with the land crossing thing.

If you want access to Thailand's shopping better get a visa.  The visa game now squeezes people on both sides of the border. I have a visa for both Thailand and Laos but see the impact it has had on people living on the Lao side who aren't as fortunate. 

Luckily for me I have a TE and can come and go as many times as I choose and my freedom of movement isn't impeded in anyway. I have a condo here in Bangkok and a guesthouse in Laos so I go across land crossings more than twice a year to bring supplies. Just another benefit of the TE that is hard to put a price on.

I won't get into prices in Laos but it is more expensive to buy commodities there if you can not access shopping on the Thai side.

6 minutes ago, BritTim said:

My own sense is that Thailand has become a little less attractive for Westerners considering long term residence. It does not matter. The future of the TE program lies elsewhere. When thinking of the Chinese, people here think of the obnoxious tour groups with people who have never traveled outside China before in their lives. Those are not the Chinese buying up property all over Thailand right now. Those investors may only visit Thailand for a week 6-8 times a year, but applying for visas is a pain, and the Thailand Elite program costs petty cash for those guys. Most new memberships will be from those in Asia. As far as Westerners are concerned, those who have existing 5-year memberships will often choose to renew as they expire. All the evidence is that they are happy with what they have received, and unwilling to settle for a lower level of convenience going forward.

This is pretty much on point. The TE crowd will simply go somewhere else if they tire of Thailand. Many of those in the market for a TEV consider it a financial pin prick. Even I felt I got okay value out of even having it a little over a year. The cost of the visa doesn't influence my plans as to where I am going to live. It is/was a useful thing to have in Thailand.

If for some reason TE closed tomorrow and my visa was declared invalid it would hurt Thailand more than my bottom line. If 500K is so much you consider it a life changing sum then this program isn't designed for you. I would be surprised if most TE members buy one because they plan to live in Thailand until they die. TE members have enough money to come and go I don't think they worry about squeezing every penny out of it. 

15 minutes ago, DUS said:

 

That´s true, you do read quite a bit about long-timers leaving LoS. But at the same time you cannot avoid reading "Hey, I am coming to TH soon" threads almost daily on TV either. But a few posts on TV certainly aren´t conclusive enough to say whether that means net immigration or net emigration from Thailand.

 

As for the Cambodia forums: given that Cambodia has significantly fewer expats than TH I am not sure that it is a meaningful comparison. Maybe it is, but I just don´t see it that way. 

 

That said, that´s probably a topic for a separate thread and not for the TE thread.

You read all kinds of crazy stuff in the Cambodian forums. It could be argued Cambodia is one of the few places that make Thailand look sane. 

As far as old timers leaving I am not aware of one of them that had a TE. Different demographic and never target customers of TE. TE customers mostly seem to be a little younger and not married with families. Most of the people leaving have been through a few marriages, businesses, are in bad health etc. 

Will new people come in sufficient numbers to keep TE going? Who knows? If people no longer find Thailand a desirable place to live or retire what the visa options are become largely irrelevant. 

The fact I plan to repatriate in 6 months makes me care less though. :) I may be the first TE member to leave in spite of having a valid long term visa. I have no reason to believe if I decided to come back in 3 years my visa wouldn't be honored. 

You can almost tell the passing seasons from this thread. Every 3 months or so somebody discovers this thread and rehashes everything said in the first 20 pages. A handful of people seem interested in the program and then you get "that" guy who feels it is his life's duty to save people from paying for one.

As far as the bashing in other threads goes, sometimes it is funny to see the arguments here... and then go into another thread and see that guy's plan. Piecing 6 back to back VE stamps together, he has done his two land crossings, been too Malaysia, PP, Savanneket, VTE, and Bali. Now he is looking if the embassy in Ulaan Bataar will issue a visa to a passport full of funky stamps.

Suggestions range from faking his own death and getting another passport to overstaying. Even at 100,000K a year which is the most expensive TE it isn't expensive unless you simply put a really low price on your time. Especially if you are under 50 or not married. 

I have already pretty much recouped a lot of money I paid just having one for a year. I am estimating my break even would be two years. If I had to make even one trip back home to the USA to get a ME that's going to cost me more than $3,000. It simply doesn't make sense.

Just now, scubascuba3 said:

Infrastructure? Motorways and railway lines? Employees? 10k+ a month x?, benefits for customers? 200 baht massages, 1000 baht taxis. 1000 baht+ Golf green fees. There's a big hole, i can only guess where it's gone

They planted a bunch of mangrove trees in some restoration area around Rayong according to the latest TE news in my mail box.

Just now, thaifoodruns said:

 

 

OK worst case within 5 years, then I'm at a loss, but if I get second 5 years visa then I'm at no loss really, my risk is 25 percent then I breakeven


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

Okay if that works for you great. I prefer I have my 5 year visa and no risk at all. There is no risk whatsoever of having to renew it. It is a done deal. It helps that I am not hoping to be in Thailand more than 5 years so it was the most cost effective visa for me.