JohnLocke

Had a bad night of sleeping - nasal passages shut down, barely breathing, and thought it was because the AC might be too strong or something. Opened the curtains and took in the day's view (from my 8th floor balcony) and "voila" - there's the reason. We're right back to smoke levels we had about 3 weeks ago. This nightmare

just

won't

end.

It really beggars the question - if one cannot safely live here for one quarter of the year, is it really sensible for foreigners to consider CM as a viable retirement destination? Obviously things will never change, since a ghastly two months of smoke "crime" is simply answered with as much smoke as possible as soon as possible the very moment things look to improve.

(sound of weeping)...

Closed, per post number 4.

No, they are not open on saturday. They will be open again on Wednesday the 18th.

If your permisison to stay expires during the holiday, you will not be fined for oevrstay provided you apply for the extension on the 18th.

We were there right on time (uh, 11:48am) this morning, only to notice right away the empty bike parking lot and then the sign on the door that it was closed through the 17th.

Is Mario2008 correct, that we won't get charged an overstay fine if our tourist visas expired today the 13th and we show up at Imm. on the 18th? Very hard to believe, but great news if true. Can anyone confirm this? Thanks!

rain.

It is starting to seem like the media is just reporting about every farang who gets sick in Chiang Mai as if they are all related.

True.

The description in the OP matches incidents of illness I've experienced in Chiang Mai... India, Indonesia and China.

I've had very serious food poisoning a few times, including 5 days hospitalized in Saigon. Never had chest pains, nor sore arms or blue lips. Therefore, based merely on anecdotal experience, I'd hesitate to discount this one as unrelated.

The report in the paper leaves out two vital pieces of information that I truly wish were included: WHERE did this couple stay, and WHAT did they eat at the Night Bazaar (if she's fairly sure it was directly from that meal)?

Archive Number 20110420.1227

Published Date 20-APR-2011

Subject PRO/EDR> Undiagnosed deaths - Thailand (05): (CM)

UNDIAGNOSED DEATHS - THAILAND (05): (CHIANG MAI)

************************************************

A ProMED-mail post

<http://www.promedmail.org>

ProMED-mail is a program of the

International Society for Infectious Diseases

<http://www.isid.org>

Date: Thu 14 Apr 2011

Source: cnews.canoe.ca, WorldWatch, QMI Agency [edited]

<http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/2011/04/14/17995481.html>

Mystery Thai illness strikes another tourist

--------------------------------------------

Another Thailand traveller was treated in hospital after spending

time in Chiang Mai, where a number of tourists have mysteriously died

since January. A 26 year old woman from Seattle [uSA] became violently

ill on 4 Apr 2011 along with 2 friends after eating and using

restrooms at the Night Market in Chiang Mai, Thailand, on 30 Mar

2011.

The Night Market is next door to a hotel plagued with mysterious

tourist deaths since the beginning of this year [2011], including an

Edmontonian [Canada] who was found dead after using the hotel's

facilities 26 Jan 2011. His symptoms began with severe chest pain

keeping him up through the night, a close friend earlier reported. He

later died of "suspected natural cause", after being diagnosed with

acid reflux in a Thailand hospital and sent home.

The Seattle woman and her husband had to abruptly cut their one-year

world tour short, after 2 weeks in Chiang Mai resulted in the 26 year

old woman making 2 emergency hospital visits -- "the worst week of

their lives".

She was treated in a Chiang Mai hospital after suffering chest pains

and flu-like symptoms on 8 Apr 2011. They were staying at another

nearby hotel. "My hands and legs were shaking and really sore, and

later my husband told me that my eyes had rolled back in my head and

my lips were blue. We were really scared," she said.

After arriving at the hospital, staff ran tests including an EKG

(electrocardiogram) and concluded it to be either food poisoning or

acid reflux. While in the hospital, the couple ran a Google search and

discovered the 7 cases in the area of tourists with similar symptoms

since January [2011] -- all of whom died after experiencing similar

symptoms.

They returned to the hotel from the hospital, where the woman again

collapsed and began vomiting in the elevator. The couple packed their

bags and headed for the airport to catch the next flight home but once

in the car, she began convulsing again. They went to the hospital

instead. "All that could go through my mind was the stories of the

recent victims," said the woman. Medical staff hooked her up to an IV,

ran another EKG and did blood tests before sending her home.

Upon arrival back into the US, the affected tourist saw a doctor to

follow up on her symptoms and has an appointment with an infectious

disease specialist. "I'm feeling exhausted, relieved and sore. I am

hopeful that the source [will be] identified soon so that no one else

becomes ill and so that people can continue to enjoy the wonderful

city of Chiang Mai without worrying," she said.

"The doctors in Thailand said it was probably food poisoning and

dehydration. In Seattle, we haven't received all of the test results,

but initial diagnosis was infectious enteritis. I had an x-ray and an

EKG, and my heart looks normal. The doctor also referred me to follow

up with an infectious disease specialist."

The other Chiang Mai cases

--------------------------

The death toll now stands at 7 between January and March of this year

[2011] - all with similar circumstances.

An elderly couple from England died simultaneously of a heart attack

inside their Downtown Inn hotel room on 28 Feb 2011.

A 23 year old woman from New Zealand, died in hospital 3 Mar 2011

after she and 2 friends became ill in the same hotel.

That same day, a 47 year old tourist guide was found dead in a room

located next door to the New Zealander.

A 33 year old American woman also died after experiencing similar

symptoms as Carter. However, she was not staying at the Downtown Inn

and lab results for the cause of death have not been received. Her

husband has demanded the Inn be closed and that he receive the lab

reports.

A French woman was identified as being the 6th person to die with

similar circumstances.

Evidence of [a] coxsackievirus infection was found in the New Zealand

woman and [an] echovirus was found in another victim. Four of the

deaths have been linked to myocarditis, an inflammation of the heart

muscle that masks itself as flu symptoms or chest pain resembling a

heart attack.

The World Health Organization [WHO] told QMI [Press] Agency that the

cases are under watch. "This event is being investigated by the

authorities in Thailand," said Gregory Härtl, communications of WHO

global Art and Response team. "The investigation is still on-going and

no conclusions have been reached. I cannot tell you much more than

that right now."

Freelance journalist Andrew Drummond in Thailand has been closely

following the cases and reported the Thailand Department for Disease

Control said so far there are no links between the deaths of cases

examined of people visiting Chiang Mai in January and February, and no

link to the Downtown Inn.

[byline: Jasmine Franklin with files from Andrew Drummond]

--

communicated by:

HealthMap alerts via ProMED-mail

<[email protected]>

[The evidence for linkage between these deaths and cases of severe

illness remains almost entirely circumstantial, with provisional

diagnoses including food poisoning, myocarditis, and virus infection.

The association with the Downtown Inn in Chiang Mai seems no longer

considered to be the relevant factor. A final verdict from the Thai

authorities is awaited.

Chiang Mai in northern Thailand can be located using the

HealthMap/ProMED-mail interactive map of Thailand available at

<http://healthmap.org/r/00cC >. - Mod.CP]

[see also:

Undiagnosed deaths - Thailand (04): (CM) 20110325.0949

Undiagnosed deaths - Thailand (03): (CM) 20110322.0904

Undiagnosed deaths - Thailand (02): (CM) 20110318.0866

Undiagnosed deaths - Thailand: (CM) RFI 20110312.0802]

.................................................sb/cp/ejp/sh

*##########################################################*

************************************************************

ProMED-mail makes every effort to verify the reports that

are posted, but the accuracy and completeness of the

information, and of any statements or opinions based

thereon, are not guaranteed. The reader assumes all risks in

using information posted or archived by ProMED-mail. ISID

and its associated service providers shall not be held

responsible for errors or omissions or held liable for any

damages incurred as a result of use or reliance upon posted

or archived material.

************************************************************

Did you just feel the next one about 2 minutes ago? (around 11pm)

Yup! Felt it. Just as I heard about it for the first time. Bloody 'ell...

But then again..................

Wunderground is forecasting chance of rain from tomorrow evening onwards, and daytime highs falling to 20 degrees by next Monday. They called it right last time. Here's hoping!

As I predicted (to my grumbly old self), the lovely fresh air that was delivered with the freezing rains last week will quickly be seen to by the industrious folks who need to get their leaf litter burned away just a day or two after things get dry. Sure enough, this afternoon has strong winds carrying that lovely smell and eye-stinging haze right along. Ah well, that's the life... many suffering in the interests of the few. Yes, it HAS been said before. Yes, it IS certainly worse in other parts of the world. Yeah, yeah, I dig, I dig...

Merry Christmas all you fools!

Recommend DOGA... dog yoga. It will help your dog find peace and eventually achieve samadhi.

:jap:

Putting on socks and shoes is a whole new strange experience for me... Guess life has been very Tom Sawyer-ish.

I must say.

JohnLocke has been attending since 2003, and it has only grown more popular as time has gone by. The goods on sale are definitely priced fairly, but after a while, how many fisherman's pants and incense-holders can one desire? The best reason to go is PEOPLE WATCHING (which I think is partially enhanced by the incandescent lighting). Yes, it is a well-packed throng, so come carrying as little as possible. And there are several bars to seek refuge in if you need refreshment. Another tip is the leg massage places - it's a cheap exotic thrill to sit back on the edge of the push and shove, let your feet be abused, take in the various traditional Thai music going around (or up and down the way) and realize you're in a distant land.

Have some rather tedious photocopying to do and don't want to micro-manage a machine operator for half an hour to get everything done. The details of this effort would surely be more tedious.

I know there is a place on Tha Pae right above Black Canyon that has one, but they close early at night and I keep missing my chance. Anyone know somewhere else in town?

Thanks.

There is no 30 day tourist visa for Japanese. A tourist visa entry to Thailand for them is for 60 days. Japanese get the same 30 day visa exempt entry that most first world countries get.

I guess I was thinking if the party in question planned to cross by land into Thailand. Wouldn't that give them just a 15 day visa? But yes, getting a 30 day visa, pulled that out of my hat, so sorry for the bad example.

We feel that Japanese embassy / consulates are either retaliating against the insane complexity of the Japanese system (rules, rules, rules) with their own spiteful strictness, or that it's an attempt to prevent yakuza members from easily lurking in Thailand, at least directly from Japan. Whatever the reason, it's well known amongst the Japanese that there is no need to bother even trying, even for the 30-day tourist visa.

Also, be aware that what often works while IN the U.S., i.e. downloading software (legitimately), or watching Hulu (TV shows/videos online), will not work if the request is coming via a Thai IP address (or any Asia-Pac IP address). You might want to first check if your ebooks are downloadable here. Welcome to the silly copyright wars...

First, some information one cannot find anywhere online:

The phone number for FedEx Chiang Mai (main office) is

053-305-212 or 053-305-213

There, now it's on the web.

Second, I wanted to report my recent experience in dealing with FedEx.

I had some software discs sent to me here. I didn't want to low-ball the value since at face value it costs approx. $1,700, and there wasn't any easy way to make a backup or copy (therefore, they were irreplaceable). However, this was an upgrade to an upgrade, so I declared the value at $159. Additionally, the package had a pair of new sandals which I stated were $20 in value.

Here's how they tallied the value to get the final charge of 631 Baht, paid by me at the time of delivery.

$179 = total package value = 5,820 Baht (32.51 Baht = $1)

Insurance, 1% = 58 Baht

Freight = 297 Baht

1. first charge: 185 Baht

(first charge is an import duty of 3% of the above subtotal (6,175 Baht))

2. second charge: 446 Baht

(7% of new subtotal (6,360 Baht) for VAT)

In other words, charges are added sequentially, first 3%, then 7%.

FedEx was as professional here as they are almost anywhere else. They had been trying to deliver to me for a few days, but unfortunately they left no note in the main office of my building, nor did they successfully call my mobile. That said, when I called the office they were polite, competent, and spoke quite decent English, so it all worked out well. The driver knew our building, so there was no need to explain driving directions, which was helpful.

Cheers.

Thanks to the hive mind at work here on ThaiVisa, my wife and I promptly took up the recommendation of Duang Dee and bought some of what the owner described as "classic". Our order was ground on the spot, as we needed a slightly larger grind for our french presses. Result: Excellent.

We've been buying for the last two years from Hillkoff. Almost always satisfied with French Roast. Not so much the other types (i.e. City Roast or Espresso). People there are real merchants - diligent, friendly, but down-to-business. They are actually running their business, not paying bored staff a pittance to give you nonchalant and slack service. You can even order coffees and drink them on the couch at the front, though it's a little awkward and takes about 15 minutes. They are always busy. Always. Definitely the only place to buy any kit. They have everything. Grinders, machines, jars, imported cocoa, etc.

However, we think we've found an even better coffee supplier at Duang Dee. Taste is just wonderful. The German owner is quite the crank, though friendly and liable to story-telling. It is hard to find. It's the last possible left before you get to the NE moat corner, on the outside. The road isn't so much a soi as a parking lot for the rows of old shop houses, so don't look for a road per se. Duang Dee is at the end, on the left.

The wife and I tried this place a few days ago, and lo and behold, their coffee is simply divine. We both are budding coffee snobs, and didn't expect anything beyond the ordinary. The menu already indicates that this is a place that cares deeply, and is enthusiastic and forthright with the plan of operation, ingredients used, the fact that the cheese blintz is a recipe passed down over three generations (four?), etc. So, for coffee, it explains how they use "peaberry coffee beans" (sorry, I'd never heard of it), what they are, and how they are basically really tasty. Also, they use a ___ machine (forgot the make), which is meant to be top top notch. Anyway, we couldn't stop ordering cafe lattes, they were so dam_n good.

As for the food, we recommend anything that is baked. Scones, pies, bread or cakes - it all looked and smelled great. As for the menu, it seems to also cover many "comfort foods", though missing a few spots (imho). Grilled cheese sandwiches, BLTs, lots of peanut butter items, even sausage and biscuits, which they didn't have the day we went.

Two request to the owner:

1. We figured there would be a special emphasis on butter (I know that's being quite literal), but no butter came with the bread we ordered.

2. put some ham on that menu - i.e., a ham and cheese melt. Ham and biscuits, etc. Or did I just miss it?

Anyway, it's a new place, with two owners (farang and Thai wife) who are trying very hard to make their customers happy. If this cafe being a sponsor of Thaivisa makes one cynical, don't be. I'm giving this place "big ups" purely on merit. The food can be a little pricey, but you get what you pay for. Coffee is exactly on par with most cafes.

Thanks for the thumbs up and even more for the suggestions.

You're right about the butter. I thought our staff did serve butter with the bread. I'll look into it.

And as for ham and swiss, we really should do that since my wife is now making real deli rye with caraway. It tastes just like the rye I used to get from the jewish bakeries on the lower east side. Which I suppose makes it a sin to profane it with ham. Actually, I did buy GM ham and real Emmentaler (commonly called Swiss cheese although ours comes from France) last week and promptly forgot about it. I'll see about getting it on the menu tomorrow (Thursday, may 26).

I do keep track of our prices vis-à-vis our competitors and I think we mostly match them although occasionally costs necessitate a somewhat higher price. We do make our sandwiches pretty big. I guess I should check our competitors' prices again.

Just to be clear: when I said "can be a little pricey", I meant vs. a 35 baht bowl of noodles or plate of fried rice. The usual budget meals for budget-conscious expats here. Compared to other quality sandwich/bakery shops.... oh wait. Scratch that, the field is pretty bare.

The one thing that's been missing here for as long as we can remember is a place with BOTH good bakery goods AND good coffee. They kind of go together... (and it's wonderful to find a place here finally that has both).

I'm about to have some software discs mailed to me here from the U.S., a suite of programs worth about $600. From reading this thread, I'm sensing that USPS may be the smartest route? Either way, if I just have to pay 7% VAT plus 200 baht, I'd be thrilled. If they tried to charge more, I'd be depressed.

I suppose I could send them in a secure way but claim they have no value and just take the risk of being told differently... ?

My limited experience in C.Mai has been paperwork Fed-ex'd to me here, with no problem whatsoever.

Cheers.

The wife and I tried this place a few days ago, and lo and behold, their coffee is simply divine. We both are budding coffee snobs, and didn't expect anything beyond the ordinary. The menu already indicates that this is a place that cares deeply, and is enthusiastic and forthright with the plan of operation, ingredients used, the fact that the cheese blintz is a recipe passed down over three generations (four?), etc. So, for coffee, it explains how they use "peaberry coffee beans" (sorry, I'd never heard of it), what they are, and how they are basically really tasty. Also, they use a ___ machine (forgot the make), which is meant to be top top notch. Anyway, we couldn't stop ordering cafe lattes, they were so dam_n good.

As for the food, we recommend anything that is baked. Scones, pies, bread or cakes - it all looked and smelled great. As for the menu, it seems to also cover many "comfort foods", though missing a few spots (imho). Grilled cheese sandwiches, BLTs, lots of peanut butter items, even sausage and biscuits, which they didn't have the day we went.

Two request to the owner:

1. We figured there would be a special emphasis on butter (I know that's being quite literal), but no butter came with the bread we ordered.

2. put some ham on that menu - i.e., a ham and cheese melt. Ham and biscuits, etc. Or did I just miss it?

Anyway, it's a new place, with two owners (farang and Thai wife) who are trying very hard to make their customers happy. If this cafe being a sponsor of Thaivisa makes one cynical, don't be. I'm giving this place "big ups" purely on merit. The food can be a little pricey, but you get what you pay for. Coffee is exactly on par with most cafes.

I meant to say "Coffee prices are exactly on par with most cafes."

The wife and I tried this place a few days ago, and lo and behold, their coffee is simply divine. We both are budding coffee snobs, and didn't expect anything beyond the ordinary. The menu already indicates that this is a place that cares deeply, and is enthusiastic and forthright with the plan of operation, ingredients used, the fact that the cheese blintz is a recipe passed down over three generations (four?), etc. So, for coffee, it explains how they use "peaberry coffee beans" (sorry, I'd never heard of it), what they are, and how they are basically really tasty. Also, they use a ___ machine (forgot the make), which is meant to be top top notch. Anyway, we couldn't stop ordering cafe lattes, they were so dam_n good.

As for the food, we recommend anything that is baked. Scones, pies, bread or cakes - it all looked and smelled great. As for the menu, it seems to also cover many "comfort foods", though missing a few spots (imho). Grilled cheese sandwiches, BLTs, lots of peanut butter items, even sausage and biscuits, which they didn't have the day we went.

Two request to the owner:

1. We figured there would be a special emphasis on butter (I know that's being quite literal), but no butter came with the bread we ordered.

2. put some ham on that menu - i.e., a ham and cheese melt. Ham and biscuits, etc. Or did I just miss it?

Anyway, it's a new place, with two owners (farang and Thai wife) who are trying very hard to make their customers happy. If this cafe being a sponsor of Thaivisa makes one cynical, don't be. I'm giving this place "big ups" purely on merit. The food can be a little pricey, but you get what you pay for. Coffee is exactly on par with most cafes.

TOT being &lt;deleted&gt; is my fault. I just got back to Chiang Mai after three months away and had spent the day (Saturday) lavishing compliments for what appeared to be a 30-40% improvement. Should have known I'd jinx it. Sorry laddies.

One minor point of data however: the NY Times online seems to be getting express bandwidth, as it will load quite nicely, while other US websites time out, regardless of how light they are.

Oops. Regarding my prior post - it's Pai Yan Yai - which I'm told means "etc." in Thai.

Another little secret place is in Panthip Plaza, right off the food court on the top floor. It's called "Coffee 4 You". No view, no internet (?), but they serve really nice hot coffee at a good price, and always give you tea and water with each order. It's a nice little hideaway.

Absolutely - Bakerista is one of the best, but one wee trick - make sure the demure yet competent young man is behind the coffee bar - he's the brew-master. Anyone subbing for him and the coffee is just tammadan, and not really worth the price. Went there today, and they had just started their new Western Food. I'm sure it's good, but pricey. Internet isn't good, but the garden is very soothing.

Another place, run by the guy who used to be the top barrista at Bakerista, is called "Impresso". One block east of Nimman, middle-ish (soi 8,9?), next door to a new Tapas bar, down from some horribly named Japanese placed called "Sumo". A little bit more expensive, but his coffees are works of art. I've seen him holding little lectures for his friends - going on and on about how to roast beans, brew, etc. He has friends send him bags of beans from other countries, just so he can improve his coffee knowledge. He's the smart looking chap with glasses. One good thing about Impresso is that is stays open a bit late (whereas Bakerista closes around 6pm I believe). The bad thing about Impresso is it's more like a bar, less like a cafe. So, not so comfy for sitting around with a book or laptop, but sometimes there's a gaggle of people hanging out, if that's what you're after.

The other awesome place is Pan Yan Yai, down one street, opposite side of Impresso (just past a farang style bicycle shop). It has a waterfall wall on it's street-facing wooden porch. It's run by two very industrious ladies (a couple), and can get rather busy. Excellent internet speeds too. Very clean, spacious, and a good atmosphere.

By the way, I totally disagree with some people's assessment of Thai coffee prowess. You can get excellent coffee at all kinds of places, with smiling professional service even. It beats a majority of cafes I spent time in in New York or in Japan, and you just laugh at the prices ($1.50 vs. $5, $6). You just have to remember to always tell them "mai waan" if it's an iced coffee and you'll be O.K.

One other tidbit - Cafe Nero (Niro?) on Niman has a really wholesome cafe latte (hot), served with essentially animal crackers and a small shot glass of tea. It's expensive, but you're paying for the hi-so atmosphere, trendy couches, AC, etc. Still, if you're looking for a change, or need to sit around for hours, it's comfortable.