jmapodaca

If you are already giving them 15,000 Baht a month why would you want to give them anymore?

They must already be the richest family in the village.

Wake Up.

I don't want to send her anymore. I told her I would be sending her mom less money when she finally comes to the US. I knew the 15K Baht was more than she needed, but not a big deal to me at the time. The amount is creating problem now with her expectations perhaps higher.

As noted above, it does not cost a lot to live there in Petchaboon. I figured I would give her extra to have fun with (e.g., shopping, restraunts, etc.). In retrospect, may be a bad idea

Excuse all the scarcasm from some hard-boiled members here, such as myself. But seriously, you should consider a few things and I have some questions. What are your ages/ Where did you meet her and how long have you known her? Do you plan to marry her and take her back to your country to live? You mention her Mother. Does she have a Father & is he with the Mother & supporting the family? I think you ment to say her Uncle can live on 8,000 bht not dollars. $500 U.S. is a lot of money to be handing her every month. If you want to pay sin sod, I would tell them that the monthly payments stop in the future then. This talk from other posters about getting the sin sod returned is a pretty "iffy" thing. In many case I know, the family has no such intentions and they expect monthly subsidy as well. Do you no for a fact that another Farang paid $2 million bht, or is this second hand story from her family to enhance the kitty (pot od money)?

I'm 42 and she is 20. We met one year ago and are now in the final days before she may get her fiancé Visa to come to the US. She lives with her Mother and Father and 14 year old sister. They own a home and two pieces of land which the mother and father grow rice and corn crops. The father works periodically as a construction worker and maintenance man. In short, they do okay. The have one of the best houses on the street. But all-in-all they're still are poor.

Yes, her uncle (from South Carolina) lives on 8000 Baht. The $2M is a story coming from my fiancé about another mother in town getting said sum. I'm don't believe the story necessarily. After living in the area a short time, I know the stories are often BS with a lot of the ladies competing with one another.

forget yourself and the money for an instance and face reality, the mother has worked very hard all her life to raise the daughter, the daughter loves her mm and the mom has no pension, so, you pay 100.000 baht dowry or so to make your girlfriend's dream come true; finally a lucky break for her mom, so she can buy stuff, then there's the no-pension, so you send 2.000-5.000 Baht every month

that's the normal situation, strictly speaking it's just very human in this reality

of course; there are also a bunch of b!tches out there, so the money shouldn't be the question; the question is if your GF is sincere or not ... how long are you together with her?

I've been with her for 1 year. I stayed there for 3 months last year and I am going again for three months next Sunday; we are expecting to have her interview at the US Embassy (fiance Visa) within the next 60-90 days.

The problem with her right now is she's unrealistic and perhaps too young (20) to understand things clearly. While staying there last year her mother chewed her out several times for being difficult to me. I get the feeling that her mom is good with anything. She want's her daughter to live with me in America and have a good life. Good grief.....

you send her 500 USD a month? how much was she living on a month before you came along? its your money so do with it what you want, but something does not add up here.

Yes, $500 a month, which is 15,000 Baht. What are your thought, specifically.

if her mom is living in a village somewhere in isaan, she was probably living on 2-3k a month. now you are sending her 15K baht which is wayyy more then the average Thai makes. so i ask, what was her monthly salary/stipend before you came along and why did you triple/quadrouple it? again, it is your money and you can spend it however you want. if it makes you happy to give more, give more, but i am just pointing out that it seems likely that you overpaying by a wide margin.

once you start giving sin sots and large amounts of money that you dont expect to receive back, it feels like itll open the flood gates to me.

i have many thai friends whose parents bug them constantly about money, they play down their income and they also set budgets and stick to them. you dont have to look any furthor from Thaivisa to see guys being ate alive by their wife and her relatives. good luck.

She lives in Petchaboon and I don't know how much her family lived on before along I came along. I wish I did!!!! Her Farang uncle who lives there in Petchaboon says he can make it on $8,000 per month.

The "REAL MEN" on the forum claim they don't pay their wife/GF family or the girl nothin'. Your self-respect and hers - out the window. It seems although, that they buy houses and vehicles, gold and other what not's in the sole name of their "true love", in lieu of cash monthly payments. Take her & Mama house shopping. One or two million ought to be good for starters.

Well my wife is one of 10 children, of the married sisters,none were /are bgs,. here are her comments when asked this question, normally its a volunteered amount, not a demand or or a request, one of the husbands gave flowers as he had no money, he told mother in law he was in love with her sister and would look after her, they are still 20 years on happily married,other dowrys ranged from 6.500 baht to 150.000..by the way 2 of the husbands are farang, neither of us has been asked for a penny since the marriage, so whether its "REAL MEN " or not i dont know, but i think its more like is it a "REAL " woman,or a gold digging bg,..in most cases where people i know have married a bg they do pay monthly as in most cases they have had their girlfriend quit work, then of course the wages have stopped and the men take over as breadwinner,.unfortunatly greed also takes over and the family in most of these cases get out the farang milking machine,.some can see this coming,others jump right in,.if it smells wrong, it will be,.

Thank you for the comments. That is very helpful.

I don't believe this smells bad. Currently, her neighbors daughter and other young ladies in her villiage have married Farang's and one Farang paid 2M Baht. Since then, she has asked me how much I am going to give her mama. I don't know exactly how to answer...yet.

just so you know, sin sot is supposed to be given back to you after the ceremony. but maybe the cultural rules differ for farang spouses. It sounds like that is the case here. Better come up with the 2m before she meets another bloke who can.

What is sin sot?

you send her 500 USD a month? how much was she living on a month before you came along? its your money so do with it what you want, but something does not add up here.

Yes, $500 a month, which is 15,000 Baht. What are your thought, specifically.

The "REAL MEN" on the forum claim they don't pay their wife/GF family or the girl nothin'. Your self-respect and hers - out the window. It seems although, that they buy houses and vehicles, gold and other what not's in the sole name of their "true love", in lieu of cash monthly payments. Take her & Mama house shopping. One or two million ought to be good for starters.

Well my wife is one of 10 children, of the married sisters,none were /are bgs,. here are her comments when asked this question, normally its a volunteered amount, not a demand or or a request, one of the husbands gave flowers as he had no money, he told mother in law he was in love with her sister and would look after her, they are still 20 years on happily married,other dowrys ranged from 6.500 baht to 150.000..by the way 2 of the husbands are farang, neither of us has been asked for a penny since the marriage, so whether its "REAL MEN " or not i dont know, but i think its more like is it a "REAL " woman,or a gold digging bg,..in most cases where people i know have married a bg they do pay monthly as in most cases they have had their girlfriend quit work, then of course the wages have stopped and the men take over as breadwinner,.unfortunatly greed also takes over and the family in most of these cases get out the farang milking machine,.some can see this coming,others jump right in,.if it smells wrong, it will be,.

Thank you for the comments. That is very helpful.

I don't believe this smells bad. Currently, her neighbors daughter and other young ladies in her villiage have married Farang's and one Farang paid 2M Baht. Since then, she has asked me how much I am going to give her mama. I don't know exactly how to answer...yet.

OK, one more. Is this dowry a one time deal, meaning that her family forfiets the rights to ask you for money in the future? It could be worth it if the 200k up front is all you'll have to give them versus 5k/month for the rest of their lives.

There has been talk about a one time payments, although I don't believe that it will end there.

On a more serious note, you presumably are giving her daughter a nice home. Without you she will go work in a bar (although she's probably a university educated professional). "Saving" her daughter from the bar life should be "dowry" enough.

You are thinking as I do.

I will be giving her a nice home and very nice life style, she can go to school if she wants (although she isn't interested in doing that now) and which I encourage her do, and yes, she will never have to work in the bars. Her parents and family in general know this as well. She wants to appear the good daughter and get Mama as much as she can.

I just took two years off from my career to get an MBA. Although, things should be more than fine once I start working, I cannot afford to fork over large dollars now.

Somewhere between 50.000 to 200.000 Bath

That seems more reasonable.

Tell her mother that in your country the dowry is paid by the woman's family to the man and ask how many cows, chickens and land they intend to give you to take their daughter off their hands.

I did just that last January. Even her Grandmother was taking my side - jokingly of course. Now my Fiance just calls me a "bad man". But it was funny.

The "REAL MEN" on the forum claim they don't pay their wife/GF family or the girl nothin'. Your self-respect and hers - out the window. It seems although, that they buy houses and vehicles, gold and other what not's in the sole name of their "true love", in lieu of cash monthly payments. Take her & Mama house shopping. One or two million ought to be good for starters.

I don't mind giving her mom money. I already send her US$500 a month to help out. Quite frankly, I cannot afford to pay her mom 2M, or anywhere near that amount.

Your bet would be correct. But she is expecting me to pay her mother something. I had heard that tradition says you give the mom 5 ounces of gold. I understand now that they may be wrong.

She loves her mom, I understand that, but large sums of money - not to mention the periodic remittances - may serve to be a problem. There must be a guideline, right?

My Fiance is asking me how much I'm going to pay her mom pursuant to the dowry system they have in Thailand. Okay, I need help!!!! What is a reasonable amount to pay?

Agreed, point taken. It's not easy for people to spend less than they make. In the US that fact is all too familiar.

I am all in favor of having people here in the US begin learning how to manage money in Jr. High and High school. Perhaps, then the saving rates would increase from zero to some positive number. Further, perhaps young college bound kids will learn that the generous banks that offer them credit cards are not doing so because they are altruistic.

Parents teaching their children good practices IS very important. My father is a wonderful English and Spanish teacher and generally a very smart man. He, however, doesn't have a clue about managing money and therefore would not have been able to teach me good financial practices; although mom did. Have you ever had a discussion about business with a doctor (e.g., an M.D.)? Everybody has skills and abilities, just not the same ones…..that's where formal education can be very beneficial. But that's just my take......I've spent a lot of time in school.

The fact is you cannot ask Thai parents at home to teach their children about such complicated topics if they themselves never learned.

The fact is that 'spending less than you make' is hardly complicated. Sure, there are plenty of more complicated lessons down the road, but the majority of less well off folks (Thais, Americans, and Brits included) are where they are because they can't get past that first lesson.

Spending less money than you make is indeed easy to do provided you make enough to support your family to begin with. My Fiancé’s grandmother - along with all the other folks in the villages of Petchaboon - work for 140 Baht a day to work the corn and rice fields when a chicken costs 150 Baht and pork at 100 Baht. Thank god, or whomever, that these folks can obtain some food from the land and forest areas. Education and a living wage would be great.

I spent the later part of 2007 in Petchaboon, Thailand visiting many, many very nice people that simply don't have enough money to live (i.e, the very poor). It was very enlightening. I am happy to be going again shortly for another 4 months as I love the area.

As an example, the banks provide loans for the kids to go to school and require repayment two years after the child graduates; not interest free of course. Most, therefore, do not finish school, which only perpetuates the problem of getting the poor out of poverty.

Families that farm often borrow money to grow their crops and hope they yield enough to pay off the debt and have some money left over to live. All too often they come up short.

Luckily, my family and I have never experienced not having enough food or proper shelter. But many in Thailand, my experience primarily with villages in Petchaboon, don’t have enough money and many live in shacks. They do what they have to do to support their families and that includes borrowing with the hope they can pay later.

The bottom line is education is key. I also noticed that when Thai’s get a little extra money they spend it inappropriately, at least to my thinking.

movable debt = depreciation (in most cases) = buying to save face = stupid

The US and UK citizens have higher debt levels then any other people on the planet, i dont believe all this money was borrowed for the educational needs of their kids.

Thais are no more or less stupid about borrowing then anyone else.

If you take a snapshot of the current situation of the countries mentioned, I'd say the they are better off because even amongst the debtors, I think you'll find a much higher percentage that still have 100% equity in their homes, so they don't run as much of a risk of becoming destitute/homeless. The same cannot be said for a surprising amount of middle class home "owners" in the US and UK. And because of the nature of interest, that weight only becomes heavier and heavier.

Oh now, some folks want to make this into a racial thing or a this country vs that country.... my above statement still stands no matter what a persons race, color, creed etc is.

I believe the points made above regarding US and UK simply point to the different strategies of employing capital; perhaps, the availability of finance and accounting education in these countries provide an advantage.

Imagine what could happen if the Thai people were provided with (at all levels, particularly the poor) formal educational in finance and accounting, and business strategy. The fact is you cannot ask Thai parents at home to teach their children about such complicated topics if they themselves never learned.

The formula,

“movable debt = depreciation (in most cases) = buying to save face = stupid”

*Forgive me, I’m a corporate CFO and CPA and do not recognize this formula Just kidding.

appears to describe consumers’ consumption of non-appreciating assets (e.g. cars, motorcycles, etc.), which only decline in value and generally do provide the owner with income. In short, there is no return on investment/purchase.

Much of the wealth of the US and UK is attributed to capital asset appreciation through business ventures and other investments such as real estate. These countries are very good at creating value with various investment strategies. Unfortunately, as mentioned above, there are also many greedy people in these countries that develop worthless derivative securities only to line their own pockets.

Without formal education in such disciplines, the Thai people will have a hard time teaching themselves how to manage their finances. They (the poor) generally live hand-to-mouth. I have spent a year trying to teach my Thai fiance and her family how to manage money better. Although they are fairly good at it, we have a long way to go.

Since turning in Packet 3 (received by the Embassy on 3/24/08) we have been waiting just about 5 weeks now for the Packet 4; interview date. Is anyone else waiting at this time? Currently, how long is the Embassy taking to process Packet 4?

lopburi3 and jstumbo, thank you very much for your help. Your combined comments have spelled out nicely how the process works and will likely lead to a smooth process for me and be of great value to other members as well. Thanks again.

You can only get visas from consulates and embassies. You cannot get a new visa in Bangkok. You will need to leave Thailand and go to a consulate or embassy in a neighboring country to get another visa.

And it is easy to do.

You will not be denied your 30 day extension anyway.

Sorry to beat a dead horse.....but I would like to get this process down.

I am going to apply for a Tourist "two entry" Visa next week. Can I assume the following process?

1.) Enter Thailand and stay for 60 days;

2.) On the 60th day get a 30 day extension;

3.) On the 90th day make a border run leaving Thailand;

4.) Return to Thailand (same day) by re-entering on my Visa (2^nd entry) and stay for another 60 days;

5.) On the 150th day get another 30 day extension;

6.) Return home by the 180th day.

This provides a total of 180 days on a "two entry" Tourist Visa. Would that be deal? Thank you all for helping me clarify the details. The Visa process is definitely not my specialty.

No. You must exit/return to obtain a new 60 day visa entry if using a two or more entry visa. But your extension will not be denied. It is virtually automatic. If not issued for 30 days it would be issued for 7 days.

Thank you very much.

You do not have to leave Thailand for any period of time. The only restriction is that you can not stay more than 90 days in a six month period using visa exempt entry (30 day border stamps). But you can always stay on a visa entry.

The only people denied a 30 day extension were a few isolated cases last year of people who had been staying in Thailand for extended periods and did not have a ticket out of Thailand to show Immigration - they were provided a 7 day extension rather than the normal 30 days. But it was a very small percentage and have not heard of any in the last six months or so.

The Laos border would probably be your best crossing (Nong Khai) and if you need a visa Vientiane is currently the best place in the area.

So I understand, if a 30 day extention is denied on my first 60 day Tourist Visa, I simply apply for another 60 day Tourist Visa in Bangkok (same day the extention was denied)?

After that (assuming the 2nd 60 day Visa is issued), when the 2nd 60 day Visa expires (assuming a 30 day extention is denied again) I can leave Thailand crossing the Laos border and return (same day) on a Visa exempt 30 day stamp and do that two more times for a total of 90 days? Also assumes I do not pursue a 3rd, 4th, etc. 60 day Visas.

My total stay in Thailand would be 210 days (60 day Visa + 60 day Visa + 30 exempt Visa + 30 exempt Visa + 30 exempt Visa).

1. A tourist visa entry for US passport is 60 days. You can still extend your stay 30 days at Immigration (for additional fee) and see nothing on that web page that indicates otherwise. You can extend entry 30 days in almost all cases.

2. They provide the price "per entry" for tourist visas which seems to indicate to me that they will issue two or three entry if you have a valid reason (but they do state validity to use will be 3 months so may not add anything to that). What they say is no Multiple entry visa issue (which is a category used for non immigrant visas) and not what they use for two/three/four entry tourist visas. If you want more than one entry ask for them in block 1 of the application.

3. In worst case you can easily obtain a new visa in any country near Thailand or just cross a border/enter other country and return for a 30 day visa exempt entry (up to 3 times).

Late last year I did get a 60 day Visa and then a 30 day extension with no problem. The wording on the website this time around through me off.

Worst case, if I am denied a 30 day extension how many days do I have to leave Thailand before being permitted to return - either on another 60 day Visa or on a 30 day passport only stay?

Do you know which border is best? I will be staying in Petchaboon, Thailand. Thank you.

yes, yes, and yes. I would try to get a triple entry. They may only give you a double or single, but try to get as many as you can.

You visa will have a date on it that says "enter before" That is the date that you must make all of the entries before. You cannot come on that date, because you have to be there "before" that date. You can make your first entry, stay for about 60 days, go to immigration get an extension of stay for 30 days (sometimes they ask for a ticket leaving, but rarely). Then after your extension of stay is up, you leave the country however you want, fly or a land border. You come right back in and do exactly the same for the second and/or third entry. The key is to make sure that you make all permitted entries prior to the "enter before" date. So if you could get a triple entry, you could possibly use it for almost 9 months before you had to get another visa or use visa exempt entries.

But realistically they will probably not give you a triple entry. But you can ask, and maybe they will give you a double if they will not give you a triple.

If they only give you a single, then you can go to Vientiane Laos when that visa and exemption expires and get another visa.

The only limits on entering Thailand is 90 days total in 6 month period (as many entries as you want, just total days <=90) using the visa exempt stamps you get at the border when you do not have a visa. Entries using a visa and extensions of stay based off of that visa do not count towards that total.

I am in a similar situation and I am a US citizen. I've been looking at the Royal Thai Consulate website for Tourist Visa's and found that the 60 day Tourist Visa does not allow multiple entry anymore and appears not to provide a 30 day extention anymore either. See link http://www.thai-la.net/visa/visa-tourist-us.htm

I have been planning to go to Thailand now for my Fiancee's Visa interview (to USA), although we have not received her actual interview date from the US Consulate. It may be anywhere from 2 months to 3+ months from now. Although I would like to go now on a 60 day Visa, it appears I may risk not being able to attend her interview if it is finally scheduled after my 60 day stay (i.e., 3+ months from now). This is troubling

Anybody have suggestions....am I missing something?

I would like to let everyone know that the processing time to process a K1 fiance visa when submitted depends on where in the USA it is submitted to. Looking online I noticed that this must have changed from 5 years ago when my Thai GF (now my wife) and I applied. At that time we had to apply to the Nebraska Service Center because of the location I was residing at (Colorado). Looking online today I see there are no 'processing times' listed for a K1 fiiance visa at this service center. Now I am telling myself things must have changed from 5 years ago.

Anyway looking online at the Cailfornia service center for the USCIS I see that they are now processing K1 fiance visas that were submitted on or before 9/9/07... So if I do my math right that is at least 7 months wait from the time the paperwork was received at USCIS until now..... Vermont service center is not too far behind. They are processing K1 visa applications that were received on or before 9/17/07.... Please note that these posting dates were last updated by the USCIS on 3/15/08 so there could be a good sign that it will happen a little less than 7 months just to get the packet to prepare for the 'big' interview at the US Emabssy in BKK.... If you would like to keep a tab on the processing dates go to:

https://egov.uscis.gov/cris/jsps/ptimes.j

It is correct that the processing time depends on where the form is submitted. My K1 form was submitted to the Vermont center and it took 2.5 months. I just got the approval a week ago and submitted on Jan. 14th. I checked on line a few times to see how long it would take and everything pointed to about 6 months or more. I am not sure why in my case I got approval quickly but I am happy I did. I am not sure but perhaps because I had everything is order and included a cover sheet listing each item. I made it a no brainer for who ever first looked at it.

I am now waiting for packet 3 to be be sent. Any one have any idea on this time line ??? I believe the web site said 2 to 6 weeks.

I received an Immigration Dept. NOA 2 dated 2/13/08, indicating the file was forwarded to the State Department in Bangkok. The State Department let me know they had the file on 3/6/08 and I should expect Packet 3 shortly. We received Packet 3 in Thailand (2 weeks later in the USA) on 3/19/08.

I am in the US and ended up getting the Packet 3 information online on 3/19/08 and was able to start the document prep. It took a few hectic days to get everything together. I would advise you to go to the State Department website and and start preparing now. http://bangkok.usembassy.gov/immigrant_vis...structions.html

My Fiancee had two quickly go to Bangkok and get police certificates and medical papers so we could file and get the process moving for an interview date. It will take 8-10 weeks once you have filed the 4 items they want for you to get an interview. Best of luck.