MrHammer
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Posts posted by MrHammer
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well they do in america and the uk - talent from all over the world heads to silicon valley or cambridge to found startups.
the same would start happening here if the government didn't expect 51% to be handed over and 4 layabouts employed before even a line of code has been written
There it is again. The tripe about "giving up 51% of your company to a Thai"
The idea that you have to "give away 51%" only holds true if you don't want to bother finding one of the thousands of Thais that can and would gladly pay for their 51% with funds, land, property and equipment. Of course, to find them, you have to leave the Expat Ghetto and actually mingle with the natives.
I know dozens of Thais who are extremely entrepreneurial, and would be in the top 1% in annual income in any country they chose. And if I know dozens, that means there are thousands just like them- because I don't get out much.
The "give away 51%" tripe also completely loses sight of the fact that having the right Thai partner can actually smooth things over in every interaction with the government, the banks, the po-po and any Mafioso that may want their cut for nothing. (Caveat- of course, having the wrong partner can kill your business, but that's true anywhere)
And if you can't find something for 2-4 Thais to do, each making a minimum wage of $300 per month, then you're not thinking hard enough- or your time as a company founder isn't worth much. Run errands, chauffeur, do shopping, change the oil, clean the office, walk the dog, watch the kids, clean your socks, wash the car, keep air in the tires,...,... As an alternative, they can just stay home and be on call for your every need.Those 2-4 employees will cost you less in a year than the lawyer you have to hire just to incorporate prudently back home. And here, your Thai partner will take care of the incorporation. Part of his 51%.I'd rather have 49% of a thriving business than 100% of a non-starter. The good news is that so many foreigners buy into the "give away 51%" crap, that the competition for Thai investment money is pretty sad. The bad news (for me anyway) is that my contract doesn't allow me to moonlight and I'm pretty happy with what I'm making already here in Thailand. And no desire to stay if the paycheck quits coming.You must be kidding, no businessman in their right mind would EVER sign away control of their company at the founding, and definitely NEVER only to be allowed to incorporate. I think, I'll stick with my 100% owned, 0% corporate tax HK company thanks.
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Lets say conservatively that someone consumes 100.000 a month, with 7% VAT that is 7000 paid a month in taxes. We should then factor that the person who got the money will pay taxes on that money in the form of either business tax, personal income tax or VAT again in the form of consumption. I am not going to make that calculation now, but you money being earned abroad and spent in Thailand is what any economist would wish for. It is quite literally the best kind of situation there is for a country.
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A ray of hope that digital nomads and online workers are registering on the minds of Thai government. As others have said, it doesn't read like it changes much however. We all know that there has never been any problem working online on a tourist visa or getting a bank account or a driving license, but that doesn't change the fact that he is talking about tourist visas still, which is not what most online workers are interested in.
It is great that the younger (and older) digital nomads now can feel more legit on their 3-6 month trip to Thailand, but doesn't change the realities for those who would like to make Thailand their home and live there without constant visa runs. What is really needed is a complete overhaul of the business registration code to allow for the fact that Thailand is very popular with freelancers, online workers, online entrepreneurs etc. Decide if you want them in the country or not. Singapore doesn't mind them. Hong Kong don't mind them. Philippines and Cambodja don't mind. Thailand minds?
The business code is archaic and needs to change to match the modern reality of global software and internet companies.
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Seems like people can't read the study.
They tested those who voluntarily showed up. That means you will get a larger subset of those who may think they are at risk including drug users.
44% of all street based prostitutes had HIV. 4% only of brothel based prostitues and again only those who went voluntarily. Very low number and then a proper study should discount IV drug users to get sexually transmitted HIV.
I hope most guys are smart enough to realize that street prostitutes are there for a reason, most likely because they are drug users and therefore can't work in bars or brothels. IV transmission is by far the most 'effective'.
But yeah, I hope some of the guys who are happy to pick up a 500 baht whore from Beach Road realize the risks.
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Sign him up for Thailovelinks and Thaifriendly and state exactly what he wants. Finding a perfect girl on a short vacation might happen by chance, but going looking for the perfect girl in a short time probably won't bring good results. Finding an educated, young, attractive woman with kids who is looking for a stable guy with his finances in order and who will treat him well is very doable. Without kids, then that is another story.
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Mr. Hammer, now it's perfectly clear you're making the wrong decision. Say it ain't so!
Take another look at Thailand--get out of BKK above all.
If you must go, consider the Phils, Vietnam, Cambodia, or Indonesia.
The bike has been sold, the lease has been ended and I will buy a ticket for Taiwan tomorrow and stay there for 3 months to learn mandarin. Who knows what will happen after that, we shall see. Taiwan seems very agreeable too. It would be foolish to not listen to experience from those who have been in China, but it would also be foolish to not try out things for yourself.
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Well you've run the gamut quite successfully. I even spotted a thinly veiled death wish on behalf of one of your detractors!
I hope you will keep us updated on how your experience goes. Remember it'll be uniquely yours to experience and regardless of what this thread may presage could be fantastic or terrible- only one way to find out.
Those of us who are more familiar with your posts know how you meant your comments to be taken.
I wish you the best!
Thanks for the comment. You are right in your assumption.
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I'd like to get in an apology before an eventual lock for the choice of words regarding mixed thai-farang children. I did not mean to deliberately offend parents of mixed ethnicity children and it was a very poor choice of words. The comment was supposed to be aimed at the beauty standards of some thais rather than an insult.
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555 you are really ignorant my friend... You are leaving the pot for the frying pan... Oh yeah, the Chinese are friendly and love foreigners, and if you are white they kneel in from of you. Stop dreaming. The attributes you mention are a constant all throughout Asia. The disdain of foreigners is a constant no matter where you go, even more in Northern Asia. The only ones who will respect you are the rice eaters in the villages where they have never seen the white man. You must be proud of that! Other than Philippines or Indonesia, Asians tend to be cold and unfriendly. And In Philippines and Indonesia friendliness is not gratuitous either. Maybe Singapore has the most evolved culture, but that makes them respectful, not necessarily friendly. If you want to escape all those things you mention just go to Central or South America. Spanish will be easier for you to learn than Chinese!
Yeah, I am sure you are right, however I have in fact known quite a few chinese in recent years and I do at least like that they don't mask their emotion as much. I do not need or want fake friendliness or groveling. I would much rather a chinese from the old generation curse me out in public, than a Thai smiling at me then muttering the same to their friends. I prefer less frequent genuine smiles over fake smiles every day.
I hear your suggestion about central and south america and have considered it seriously but businesswise I am not sure it is the right place to be for me at the moment. I have time to go there later too.
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I still don't see where the 'bashing' element comes into play?
You're right that I've lived in an expat ghetto, though more japanese here than farang, and that I've grown tired of the partying and that's when I discovered that once I took away the party scene, there wasn't much else to interest me.
Your whole OP basically bashed Thailand. Nightlife in BKK sucks nowadays and is just filled with a bunch of sleazy Issan whores, Thais are xenophobic and have nothing but contempt for foreigners, no quality in materials or people, no business / career opportunities, etc.
All the while, it doesn't sound like it has anything to do with Thailand. Yes, if you live in a farang ghetto and center your lifestyle in an area filled with tourists, expats, and Thais who have chosen the lifestyle of working in the entertainment industry and/or who go clubbing & partying every night, then you're right, you're probably not going to find very intelligent or sophisticated people. Nor will you find great career opportunities.
Then you mention learning Thai is too high of a language barrier, so you're switching over to Mandarin. I don't really understand the logic there, but all the power to you. China may have more opportunities than Thailand, but I can promise it's going to be quite brutal to be able to seize those opportunities.
I could mention other things which add to my decision such as the insane traffic, polution, lack of caring about common areas, for example, the fact that people in my soi drive Porsches but throw their trash on the street like a Mumbai slum. That you can't walk 100 meters without some horrible noise blaring at you or a commercial playing at full volume everywhere. That visa requirements are specifically made to keep people from staying (you get 3 months as a given in Taiwan and Hong Kong for example). That permanent residence here is all but impossible, where as there are fixed and firm rules for such things in Taiwan and Hong Kong.
I mean, these are minor annoyances, but I've been willing to accept them because I felt the price was worth it. I don't do so now. I don't think learning Mandarin will be easier, but I think the return on investment will be worth it compared to learning Thai in Thailand. After all, speaking Mandarin opens all kind of doors, where as speaking Thai doesn't really do much.
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OP,
have you been to china?
I am interested to hear of your future, and hope you update your thread.
I would have been interested in golf but it appears physically defeating here,
the one poster who has been married 34 years is an exception,
but I would like to know how people prosper in thailand
I have been to Hong Kong. This time I plan to take a 3 month intensive mandarin course in Taiwan, then proceed from there.
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It sounds as though you didn't really give Thailand much of a chance. Almost sounds as if you moved into a farang ghetto somewhere, have now partied yourself out, are bored of the scene, and want to checkout somewhere new. Basically, you got bored of Nana and the sexpats, so time for something new.
That's fine and all, and hope you have good travels. Don't bash Thailand over it though, as it has nothing to do with Thailand. It's due to you living in a farang ghetto, wanting to party every night.
I still don't see where the 'bashing' element comes into play?
You're right that I've lived in an expat ghetto, though more japanese here than farang, and that I've grown tired of the partying and that's when I discovered that once I took away the party scene, there wasn't much else to interest me. I do not generally find Thai culture and Bangkok leisure activities particularly interesting after the novelty wore off. That's just for me personally. A lot of what would make Bangkok interesting again has high barrier to entry in the form of connections or high language ability and even then, as foreigner you're not invited a lot of places. Again, I am not willing to make that kind of investment, when I think that time and money would be better spent elsewhere.
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I am actually a long time reader of TV but over the years I have refrained from posting mainly because of the negative thai bashing people on here.
Then of Friday I was talking to a mate about this forum and I asked why do expats that live in Thailand just bag the the place and it's people and yet still stay there?
We'll he said those people with such attitudes will never be happy anywhere on earth it's just in their DNA basically they are just narks and lead a miserable life and want other people to come down to their level.
You and I won't call you sir are a typical example of the negative farangs that should have never stayed in the first place.
So go and take your negative thai bashing views and go and inflict your racist negative views on the Chinese .
Their loss thai lands gain.
And I hope the doors hits you on the way out!
And you sir is a perfect example of the other side of the coin, the hopeless naive who will be back here in a couple of years moaning over having lost their house or having been scammed.
If you read the post at all, you would have noticed that I do not really blame the Thai, nor could what I wrote in any way be construed as 'racist' or 'Thai bashing'.
There is always another side to the coin. One man's trash is another man's treasure and reverse. What appeals to many about Thailand: the corruption and freedom associated with it, the low education levels and therefore low incomes and low cost of living, is also the reason for many of its problems. For me, the positives do no longer outweigh the negatives and so, I have chosen to leave. That is a personal decision and one which you don't have to agree with. Maybe your requirements for a happy life are different than mine?
I might be a miserable nark, but I'll be slightly less miserable once I leave Thailand.
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Yes, here comes another post about another nobody leaving Thailand and I am waiting for the 'don't let the door hit you' replies and that is fine. In any case, it's time to pack the bags and head for greener pastures in China.
I first came to Thailand more than ten years ago, spent a couple years in Europe and some years here, a lot has happened since then. Bangkok where I spent most of my time has grown economically and has changed a lot. I generally don't think it has been for the better for the foreigner. The cost of living has gone up a lot, rent is high, food prices have increased a lot, drinking and partying is now more expensive than many European cities. Attitudes have changed at not for the better.
Nightlife is crap now compared to years past. The cost in most clubs have risen a lot, particularly where foreigners often go. I pay the same for a whisky in Levels that I would in much better clubs in Japan or Europe and for what? The clientele on the lady side is still the same Isaan <deleted>, only now there are tons and tons more young guys who with the internet have been drawn to Bangkok with lures of easy <deleted>. I noticed this a couple weeks ago in Climax - where I only went because of a friend on vacation - the club is flooded by twenty something guys from the US and Europe. I'm only a couple of years older, but what the <deleted> is the point in having to compete for isaan prostitutes? Is that really the best we can do or that I can do? Nope it is not. Nightlife for the foreigner in Bangkok is saturated and even the gogo bars are severely lacking in quality for way to high prices. Yes, you can go to the Thai clubs, but standing around a table and absolutely having to know people to socialize isn't my idea of fun. In summary, Bangkok and Thailand is PLAYED OUT, it has became simply another stag party destination and the locals have adopted attitudes to match that.
Reputation of foreigners is at an all time low, don't fool yourself, there is ZERO positive rep to being a foreigner now, unless you want to meet the destitute farmer girl. There is always the implied idea that you're a <deleted>monger with the Thais. I find in general that Thai people are rude, dismissive and ignorant now towards foreigners. This has been much more obvious to me as I've met a lot of people from the rest of Asia recently from Taiwan, Singapore, China, Japan etc. After a while dealing with the Thais you begin to wonder if you're really that contemptuous a creature simply for being a 'farang'. Having met a lot of other asians recently, I can simply conclude that is not the case, but that the xenophobia and disdain for the farang is at an all time high. Do you really want to live in a place where you are constantly regarded with suspicion and ill will? I do not. I find the Thais to be among the least friendly and interesting people in south east and all of Asia.
Lack of quality is a real problem in Thailand. Both material, but equally much in people. Smart, open minded and capable people are simple few and far apart. Most of the people who fit that description that I've met and made friends with are foreigners. Western or asian. Thai's are herd animals with very little and I mean very little capacity for the slightest independence of action or thought. We can add the vast majority of foreigners living here to that. Most foreign expats are trash, simply put. Alcoholics, sexual degenerates, criminals and perverts. The kind of conversations found in many social expat settings are simply not normal. Addiction to either sex, alcohol, drugs or your own ego is the norm. This of course is a major reason our reputation is in the <deleted>. A former loose business associate recently tried to commit suicide after just a month ago having boasted of his great riches and investment opp. Turns out he was living a lie. Another acquaintance who recently moved here is trying to survive now on 30K a month most of which goes to <deleted>, then comes to me asking for biz help, all the while denying to lend me 1000 baht the last time I forgot my wallet. Stories like that are endless. QUALITY people. Not to say there aren't good people here because there are, but you really have to make an effort to befriend them, because they, like me, are also very wary with reason of other foreigners.
Business and career opportunities are sorely lacking here. I am a guy with an education, highly marketable skills, who have been hired for almost every job I have ever applied for and who has also been successfully self employed for a couple of years. Not more than 3 years ago, I was a senior manager in my field at under 30 years of age. Over here in Thailand, despite having sent several applications for jobs that I am more than qualified for, I receive no interest, in fact, no response back at all. In my country, we consider it at least common courtesy to send a standard mail to all applicants regardless. Not so here in nepotist Thailand. People get hired not on merit, but on connections and for that reason, Thailand will continue to lack behind the rest of Asia. Lets talk business shall we? Which business you could ask. There is zero opportunity for startups here and no real legal protection either. No access to a skilled workforce or investment capital. Thailand is a black hole that only takes but does not give.
Why China? Because it is the rising power and while the best wild west days are probably gone, there are still great opportunities there. What's more important is that chinese people are actually looking out, something that no thai has done in the last 30 years - and the chinese are actually very interested in what the rest of the world are doing, how we are living, what the world thinks of china etc. They want to learn from others, to work together. The white man is not seen merely as a despicable walking wallet to be fleeced in between <deleted>mongering activities. It's a huge county, massive differences in culture, nature and language. The opportunities there are endless. There are also jobs, there are business opportunities, possibilities to make things happen if you are a hardworking guy. Oh yeah, and their women are far more attractive than the isaan prostitutes or the weird looking halfbreeds adored by the Thai media.
I believe too many people have just stayed in Thailand because of the ease of status quo. I only went back because I knew the country, not for any real desire to live here. I think there are much better places to live now than Thailand, for a lot of people. More importantly, I think a lot of Thai expats could actually do a lot better for themselves outside Thailand, only they have incrementally accepted lower and lower opinions of themselves and expectations of life.
In any case, see you later Thailand, I won't be back except perhaps for a quick prostitution spree - the Thai way.
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Good grief, this thread became full off self righteous holier than thou types, which unfortunately are often ones found to be abusing alter boys or caught sneeking out of some pervert gay bar.
And LaraC, we get it, you feel threathened by prostitution because you feel it indirectly lowers your sexual value, when a fixed price is set on p*ssy. I wouldn't get too cocky though, as you will likely find that older men do have an easier time finding sexual partners, paid or not, than older women. With your attitude, you might soon find yourself in the shoes of those old men, except you will be going to Ghana instead.
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The uneducated like to attack the educated.
Like this silly claim above that Chula is on par with a british high school. Says more about the poster than about Chula.
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I've been in Thailand a long time and I have long figured out that most Thai girls prefer a Thai guy about their age. I accept that. But there are plenty of Thai women who, by circumstance, are looking for foreigners. For example, single mothers. Just the other day, I advised a close friend that a single mother may be the best way to go. She'll be ready to settle and won't be "hard work," as the OP says. But if you want to compete with a Thai guy for a grade A hottie, a Thai guy who's got the culture and language advantage down pat, you've got no chance. Sorry, but that's reality.
I worked that out by my second trip - absolutely no requirement to spend years in the country, just go to a Thai venue outside the usual Farang haunts. It's a bit like telling us that hot 20-somethings in Oz are looking for guys with washboard abs, a BMW and a 6-figure salaries : it's only a discussion here because some of us are sufficiently deluded to believe that nature is somehow turned upside down in Thailand.
Where it IS different, IMO, is with women over 30, but apparently this is a discussion about 'grade A hotties' so I wont go there.
It's good that you "get it," but I can assure you that a lot of farang guys don't. I've got men visitors from America all the time and they're constantly smitten with the belief that "Thai girls love us!" Of course, they come to this conclusion after spending most of their time in girlie bars. I've met many farang guys who think that every single Thai girl wants to be with a farang. I would imagine you know guys like this.
But you do have a point about women over 30 (or 40, whatever that magical over-the-hill age is). Once a woman realizes that her due date is coming up quick, she's very open to different options.
Basically what I am trying to say is that people who have trouble finding a partner in their native either because they are too shy or other reasons they will not have easier play in Thailand or anywhere else. What I enjoy here is the fact that there is no bad reaction when starting to start a casual conversation with women, but there is still the cultural barrier.
Before the thread went into overdrive, I will say I mostly agree with you, but not fully.
First of all, anyone here can find a 'girlfriend' if they throw some cash around. If we exclude that and say that you only want to find a girlfriend who is middle class, educated and up, then it may actually just be harder, assuming you're a normal guy simply because you are likely mostly to meet a certain kind of woman and the language and culture barrier.
However, for guys who are otherwise 'normal', but have certain traits which are not popular in the west such as being short and skinny, they will fare much better in Thailand, because that is the norm here. Some guys I am sure would do better with women in China for example instead of Thailand, because China is a more masculine culture, or Japan, which is a more introvert culture.
I'd say, if you're an extrovert, short and skinny, then Thailand is the perfect place to be
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Excellent salesmanship by the girl here.
Not sure what qualifies as "excellent", but not only did she fail to close, she wasted 4 weeks on a poor prospect and got thrown out by the customer.
Based on her performance this quarter I'm not sure she would make a very good sales rep?
You're right, she needs a rigorous course on closing. Any volunteers?
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Excellent salesmanship by the girl here. First she built a connection, then she made the irressistible one time offer at the time you were your weakest. These girls waste their time selling sex. If they had any kind of drive, they could have made excellent sales reps in other business.
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The older man, younger woman hate by most western women is usually just a barely hideable personaly fear that if older men - by virtue of their wallet or smashing personality - can date younger women, then who will date them when they are out of their prime.
Maybe it's also the fact that no man - or very few - will sleep with an old, physically unattractive woman for money, while plenty of women have no problems doing so with men.
I dont think you guys get it..or you are deluding yourself.
Ive actually dated a man who was 15 years older than me some years back.
He was very attractive, was in great physical shape (was into exercise -like me, and enjoyed eating healthily), he didnt drink, hated watching tv (like me), and had a successful business.
We dated for a couple of years and he wanted to get married.
The problem was that ..well frankly i wanted something else in life. He had a lot of responsibilities..kids from a previous marriage etc, and i was finding it all a bit too overwhelming as i still wanted to have a bit of fun, do "younger" activities etc.
I had to bite the bullet and admit to myself that i just wasnt ready for it all.
When people looked at us, they saw a couple who were well matched in terms of similar interests, looks, physicality etc.
No, most people (be they "western women" or otherwise), DONT feel any kind of "hatred" (as you put it) towards seeing an older man and younger woman. But yes, when you see an old decrepid man or a fat old balding singlet wearing beer guzzler with a thai girl a quarter of his age..its just downright weird...no matter how that may offend you. Same if i were to see a old grizzly woman with a young boy partner (especially if she were to paw at him in public). I dont care if its UN PC, it makes me gag. Anyway, Thailand is an un pc country..so im perfectly within my rights to say that i find grungy old men with little thai ladies creepy. They might be lovely if i got to speak with them etc..but that first impression..creepy. Like it or not, thats the view of most of us who arent retired old western men...
No, hating on old men and their sex drive is certainly not un-pc, it is perfectly acceptable. Hating on straight white men is the only hate that is allowed. Woe me, if I say I feel the same about seeing an old spinster lesbian and her Thai lover here.
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The older man, younger woman hate by most western women is usually just a barely hideable personaly fear that if older men - by virtue of their wallet or smashing personality - can date younger women, then who will date them when they are out of their prime.
Maybe it's also the fact that no man - or very few - will sleep with an old, physically unattractive woman for money, while plenty of women have no problems doing so with men.
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Fool myself?? o.O about what exactly?
About your middle class female friends not dating older men.
...riiiiiighhht..
Silly me.
Thanks for opening my eyes to that.
My naughty Thai female friends..there was me believing all along that they are happy with their young fit equally successful male partners..when they are off doing the dirty on them with old retired western dudes.
Tsk tsk!
feel really foolish now.
You have no clue.
Durex infidelity study: http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/309732/thai-women-ranks-no-2-in-infidelity
Thai women cheat the second most in the world, Thai men are also in top 3.
You didn't mention western older men in your post, go back and read it. I also didn't say it was western men, just older men, but because having a younger mistress is totally normal in all of Asia also means that the old western guy, young thai girl thing, really isn't out of the norm at all. It may not be your idea of a perfect relationship, but still very common among Asians.
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I seriously doubt that anyone on the thread have ever had a real conversation with a Thai woman who was not a bar girl. Yes, it is difficult for farang to meet educated middle class Thai women, assuming that you would want to do that. I also doubt that anyone has bothered to so some basic research on the Thai culture regarding communication, relationships, families, marriage, legal rights of women in Thai marriages, why there are a large percentage of education Thai women that are in their 30's,40's,and 50's that have never married because they do not like the way Thai men treat them.
My advice is to do your homework and stop focusing on young girls.
Most, if not all, my Thai female friends are middle class Thai women.
..none of them date old men however.
Or so they say.
Or maybe they are not attractive enough to do so.
This is Asia, mistresses, second wives and sugar babies is a sport here. You just don't see it, because you don't know what to look for.
Educate yourself: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/02/04/inside-china-s-mistress-industrial-complex.html
I'm not even old, but don't fool yourself.
Fool myself?? o.O about what exactly?
About your middle class female friends not dating older men.
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I seriously doubt that anyone on the thread have ever had a real conversation with a Thai woman who was not a bar girl. Yes, it is difficult for farang to meet educated middle class Thai women, assuming that you would want to do that. I also doubt that anyone has bothered to so some basic research on the Thai culture regarding communication, relationships, families, marriage, legal rights of women in Thai marriages, why there are a large percentage of education Thai women that are in their 30's,40's,and 50's that have never married because they do not like the way Thai men treat them.
My advice is to do your homework and stop focusing on young girls.
Most, if not all, my Thai female friends are middle class Thai women.
..none of them date old men however.
Or so they say.
Or maybe they are not attractive enough to do so.
This is Asia, mistresses, second wives and sugar babies is a sport here. You just don't see it, because you don't know what to look for.
Educate yourself: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/02/04/inside-china-s-mistress-industrial-complex.html
I'm not even old, but don't fool yourself.
Digital nomad, online workers.. Permission !
in Thai Visas, Residency, and Work Permits
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You're missing the point. Why would a startup go look for a co-owner when they don't anything but a laptop and an internet connection. That is the realistic representation of the modern tech startup.
Why would you give 51% to some Thai, when you can go to Hong Kong or Singapore and own 100%?