barryFunk

More fantastical figures from TAT about increases in tourism. The East and North East needs visitors with money in their pockets to be able to boost income to the area but the main issue will be what is there to attract them and how is there going to be ongoing promotion to the area? Having 100 operators come to QSC in Bangkok may only fall on Thai ears not International although I suspect a few 'Farang' will creep in for a look. I guess it's a start to help the ailing area but sounds more like a PR stint by TAT.

Build up the infrastructure with local tourists first and then aim at foreign visitors? Not a bad plan I guess. I haven't been up to Isaan yet so not sure if there's much to see / do?

As a backpacker destination it could work since the North-East is on the way to Cambodia and it's a long bus/train ride that many might want to break up.

I flew back to BKK from Saigon last night in Qatar business class and I was the only one there. I would have liked to have see another passenger face.

Upgrades to frequent travellers still do occasionally happen when Economy isn't full. I'm Star Alliance Gold with bmi (British Midland). My wife, a friend and I were all upgraded on Lufthansa from Saigon to Bangkok a few weeks ago even though the plane was pretty empty in both Economy and Business. According to the check in agent it was out of pure generosity because only two of us could use the lounge at Saigon as per Star Alliance Gold policy.

Nothing beats an upgrade - even on a short flight!

Barry, finesse is clearly not your strong point...

Sarcasm works wonderfully in text.

The reason for the bus trip is that the airline pays a lower fee than those who use the jetways.

It may be cheaper but this isn't usually the reason. Most of the time when you take a bus to a Thai Airways flight the plane will have just arrived from a domestic sector and be going out on an international sector or vice versa. Rather than move the plane to the relevant area of the airport which would take time they simply bus passengers to it. This happens at many airports worldwide - especially in airports in the Shengen area of Europe when a Shengen flight arrives and then needs a quick turnaround for a flight to a non-Shengen airport (or vice versa).

I can't say I mind the bus (especially inbound) at BKK since it drops you off right by immigrant saving the trek.

Overall, BKK is pretty good. I work with many colleagues who fly in and out from the UK and used to do so myself. I've never heard a complaint about the airport - except hassles with taxi drivers. I don't really mind the walk to the gates though I'm fairly young still. I probably wouldn't be so pleased if I was an elderly passenger.

Of course, after spending billions and billions of baht on a project, it's perfectly reasonable to expect complicated connections, high prices, slow service and crowded conditions... Why else would they have built it, if not to achieve those goals...

Complicated connections? Perhaps at Makkasan but certainly not at Phaya Thai

High prices? 45 baht (1 GBP) for the City Line and 150 baht (3.20 GBP) for the Express service - compared to 6.90 GBP for the slow train and 18 GBP for the fast train to Heathrow which do not include check in service

Slow service? 25 minutes from the BTS on the City Line and 15 minutes from Makkasan - one of the fastest airport links I've been on (it's no Maglev in Shanghai.... but then again that goes nowhere near where you want it to)

Crowded conditions? Crowded on the City Line perhaps but that comes with success. If you don't like it, take the Express where you'll see more tumbleweed drifting through the aisles than passengers.

It's not perfect but it's nowhere near as bad as you seem to think it is. Anyway... I'm sure you'll continue to enjoy your taxi to the airport which is perfectly fine. This is just one more option to get to the airport (and a number of places in between). Shouldn't we appreciate choice?

Barry, you're painting a too one-sided view of the comments here by those who have used the ARL....such as myself.

Sorry that you read my post that way! It was more a response to Honolulu's comments about the ARL being a complete waste of money because it doesn't serve every type of passenger coming to Bangkok. My reference to those who dislike the rail link refers to those who think the whole project is a failure and a waste of money.

I agree that the location of the terminal in Makkasan was not particularly well thought out for two main reasons:

- the MRT is still a good 250 metres away even if there is an easy connection built between the two... not ideal

- the road situation around Makkasan makes it difficult to get anywhere useful from the station (not sure how they can fix this?)

A couple of things that may save the Express Line / Check-in:

- the fact that you can check in 13 hours early (check out of your hotel, check in your suitcases and still have a 10 or 11 hours of meetings/shopping depending on whether you're here for business or pleasure)

- new development around the Makkasan area with hotels, office towers, etc... (plenty of open land in the area)

- it's not a taxi and there are plenty of bad stories circulating with travellers, tourists and business people about Bangkok's dodgy taxis

- somehow sorting out the MRT connection / area roads (not sure how!)

The biggest problem that the Express Line has going for it (as you point out) is that the City Line is too cheap! I'm not complaining and have taken the City Line seven times since it opened (and only once taken the Express Line) but why would anyone pay three times as much to save 5 minutes?

In Vancouver, you pay a surcharge (approximately $5 if I remember correctly) if you get on or off at the airport on top of the regular fee. If the City Line had a surcharge that brought the two prices in line with each other it might be feasible, but then most people would probably just take a taxi.

I hope it works out since the opportunity to check in my bags and then head to the office and work for the day is very attractive for me, but I am skeptical as well as you.

The point of my earlier post was about the overall project which I think can already be considered success based on the City Line's ridership and the fact that I get can to the airport in a predictable amount of time without my nerves being shattered by a high-speed taxi ride.

So now I'm asking myself why they would spend 10 years and 100 bil bht. to build a train that only works for backpackers and locals.

40,000+ people a day are now using the link and it's only 4 months old. I think it's been well worth the investment of 25 billion baht (not 100 billion - source: http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BQQ/is_4_45/ai_n13659215/). There may have been a few cost overruns but I doubt the budget quadrupled in size. Regardless - even if the cost doubled being able to build a 160km/h capable rail line 30km long in a densely populated city is remarkable compared to what it would have cost to build it in a developed country (check out CrossRail in London and its £16 billion price tag).

While the link might not be useful for a family of four with luggage/strollers/etc... what rail link anywhere in the world is?

For someone with a backpack or small wheely case it's great and there are plenty of residents using the link for this purpose as well as the tens of thousands of commuters who are benefiting from faster commute times and less time spent twiddling thumbs in traffic.

We'll see how the Express Line pans out. Hopefully the check in service will help drive a few extra passengers to it. If not then perhaps they can refit the Express trains and increase the frequency on the CityLine which would benefit the majority who are taking the cheaper (and slower) option.

And to all those who are so grumpy about this rail link - enjoy your taxis! No one is stopping you from using them and hopefully the traffic on the main road will be less than before since lots of people are using the parallel rail line.

Cars are not licensed. Driving one is. You can have one standing on your private property and even drive it without a license.

And the point that guns are made to kill vs knives supposedly are not. Alright, how about spears? How about the so called 'Rambo' knives?

How about fishing-hooks and fishing-rods? They are clearly made to capture an animal to kill it...

And I like you last point, typical social fascist.

"Am I being punished by not being able to carry a gun? Hardly! So why should you have one?"

Wow, if that was the basis for all laws...

Basically you are for banning everything that you don't like and against banning everything you like.

And we should always go for the 'most ban' in all cases? You want me to introduce you to Sharia Law?

Many places in the world ban things intended to kill such as the spears and 'Rambo' knives. And they should be. Anything designed to kill should be banned - that's my whole point. Your point about licencing of driving is pure semantics.

The point of my last line was not to suggest banning everything in the world that I don't need (but wow I'm impressed that you managed to read it that way!). My point was that I do not carry a gun and I have no intention to. It doesn't harm me not to carry a gun but it may harm me and others if you or members of the public unnecessarily do. I don't know your mental state or how responsible you are. More worryingly I don't know why you are so adamant that you should be allowed to carry a gun and that in itself is a worry!

How long will it take them to put all 3 systems (BTS, MRT and Airport Link) on a single smart card system? This isn't rocket science.

Well... it took five years to get the Oyster Card up and running in London. Much of the delay seems to have been caused by the Public Private Partnerships (much like the BTS) so I guess that's a reasonable estimate of how long from start to finish it would normally take.

Source: http://www.ciltuk.org.uk/download_files/ltfapr06underground.pdf (quite an interesting read for any transportation geeks out there)

It took a further four or five years to get the commuter train companies on board.

And the HK and Singapore cards,as well as similar system in Tokyo, also offer a debit card facility for most other services.

This idea is twenty years behind the thinking of first world locations, such as those mentioned.

Can't we be glad that they're finally doing something about it rather than complaining?

There are plenty of 'first world' without fare integration. Take a quick trip to Toronto (or most places in North America) if you're interested in horrible integration of transport... Bangkok's well above average when it comes to public transport compared to its peers in the developing world (outside China at least). Take a trip to Jakarta, Ho Chi Minh City, Phnom Penh, Manila, Dhaka or Yangon and you might realise how good we have it here.

It seems like a lot of people on these forums expect the best of both the developed (perfect infrastructure, less corruption, etc) and developing (cheap) worlds. Perhaps instead you should just appreciate how good Bangkok can be and appreciate developments such as this even if they take a bit longer to implement than we'd all like.

It is that while the world has many morons, we cannot forbid everyone from buying guns/cars/knifes in the event that someone might, someday, misuse it. We can however clearly inform that driving safe, not drinking, not shooting guns in public during parties, not juggle with knifes around kids, is points to remember. And strictly punish those that fail on these points by endangering or hurting others.

Aside from your horrendous grammar...

... cars and knives aren't designed to kill people. They are designed to provide transport in the case of cars and cut things (mainly food) in the case of knives. They can be misused but the vast majority of both products are used for peaceful and productive purposes. Knives are an interesting point and they are banned from certain places (ie: airplanes, and in many places of the world, in public should the blade be of a certain size). Cars are dangerous and licenced for this reason.

Guns are designed to kill. Plain and simple. As an object, they accelerate a bullet which is entirely designed to penetrate skin and take life. They serve no other purpose and should not be in the hands of anyone other than law enforcement officers.

Am I being punished by not being able to carry a gun? Hardly! So why should you have one?

My wife and I will definitely try out the check in on the way to Oz in February. I'm skeptical that there will be demand for it though considering how cheap the CityLine remains and how at both BKK and Makkasan you're naturally guided to the CityLine stops rather than the Express stops. Hopefully they'll sort out the pedestrian link between Makkasan and the MRT soon since access to Makkasan is far from great at the moment.

We've taken the CityLine lots even though it probably takes a few extra mins from our flat in the Silom area. We like that you don't have to gamble with travel times (you can essentially predict how long the trip will take within about 15 minutes) like you do with Bangkok traffic. Also - anything that avoids the lottery of insane taxi drivers is good with me.

Considering that Thai and Bangkok Airways represent a big chunk of traffic at the airport this seems to be a good way to trial the check in service before taking a gamble with lots of other airlines. Hopefully they'll add some other big players soon. Air Asia would be great but I don't see it happening since they're low cost...

My wife was stopped from going through the EU/UK immigration counter with me at Manchester 2 times, the second with a baby in arms.

Strange. My Aussie wife and I (British passport holder) used to go through the UK/EU queue at LHR T3 together without any troubles. She was told she should shortly after we got married though this may have been partly because she was a resident of the UK at the time.

The problem has now been solved by her gaining UK citizenship before our move to Thailand! The queue for non-EU immigration at Heathrow makes BKK's look like child's play. Before she switched to the UK/EU channel it wasn't uncommon for it to take 1.5 hours or more to get through non-EU immigration.

Back to the OP's question though you should be able to go through non-EU with your girlfriend since all the immigration officer will do is take a quick look at your passport and scan it. He/she may appreciate having you there to vouch for your girl's trip to the UK.

I'd take the rail link any time of day to save being in a taxi likely without a seatbelt often travelling at 160km/h with the driver on amphetamines. And I'd suggest it to anyone I know visiting the city either for business or pleasure and staying within 3km radius of a BTS station without too much luggage. Even with luggage it's not a bad option. A cab from an Airport Rail Link station to hotel/house is less dangerous because it's not on the expressway and unlikely to result in death.

On a slightly less dramatic note... The ARL is comfortable, efficient, fast and cheap. It links easily with the BTS (and hopefully will soon with the MRT at Makkasan) and is much easier to use than a taxi. After travelling to many countries around the world - if there's an easily accessible rail link I'll always take it since the directions are almost always in English, you don't need to struggle with a taxi in a foreign language and wonder if they're driving you in circles or have a rigged meter giving an inflated fare. Also it's almost always a faster option.

Judging by my two trips out to the airport on the train since it opened the City Line is very well used especially from Phaya Thai to the airport. Lots of locals and foreigners.

I saw a new four car train pass by Chong Nonsi station this morning as I got off the BRT on the way into work. Looks like they're trialling at least one this weekend before they take over the whole line next week?

It looked pretty sleek.

Well after a few emails to pubs on Sukhumvit all I can conclusively say is that the Sportsman will definitely not be showing the Grey Cup. <sigh>

Hello Canadians!

Anyone know of a pub that will be showing the Grey Cup (Canadian Football League's championship) very very early on Monday morning?

Is it one of the top 10 airports of the world? No - probably not. But over the past three years I have formed a very close relationship with Suvarnabhumi - not by choice but by necessity! I have had regional responsibility for the South-East Asian market for a British company for the past three years. I ended up using Bangkok as a hub because of BKK's excellent connections in the region and the fact that it was an efficient airport (not to mention that the Thai market was growing fast and it made financial sense). On average I was passing through BKK at least twice a month for nearly three years. In those 36+ arrivals/departures/transits I have experienced very little of the hassle that some of the posters seem to have on here. In fact part of the reason I chose to relocate to Bangkok about a month ago was that the airport is efficient (especially with the added rail link) which will allow me to go about my business far better than being based in the UK - meaning even more trips through the airport.

I have never waited in an immigration queue for more than 25 minutes and it has never taken me more than 45 minutes from landing to be in a taxi. This despite many of my arrivals coming at the end of the European/Australian Thai Airways 747 arrivals bank in the early morning. I have learned a few tricks - realising that there are two incoming and two outgoing immigration points and that there are screens at each that show the other often less busy queue - and that it pays to pick an immigration queue that isn't full of obvious tourists who may not have filled in their immigration cards.

Yes some immigration people are a bit surly (but they are everywhere - except apparently China thanks to some Facebook-style feedback buttons). Perhaps not everything works as well as it should (but where does it other than Singapore's Changi Airport?). But overall - it's a very good hub that processes tens of millions of passengers in relative comfort each year. And it does so much better than most.

Since I travel so much for work - now mostly in SE Asia but before in Europe, other parts of Asia and North America as well - I have experienced dozens of airports around the world. The only ones I would rate above BKK are in Singapore (obvious choice!), Ottawa (beautiful new terminal and very efficient - though slow incoming immigration on international flights) and perhaps Toronto (thought the walk to the gates in the new T1 feels nearly as far as the far reaches of BKK and baggage seems to take forever to come out).

Nowhere is perfect - especially not in a developing country. I've noticed a lot of people on this thread and other threads like to compare to Changi. Changi is a propaganda piece by the Singapore government and they are very very successful in their effort! It's not fair to compare.

In the meantime - I think a bit of praise for the team at Suvarnabhumi is in order for making this effort. The airport has much improved since I started using it. Reupholstering the seats was a great move - as was adding the big lounge chairs where the security checks on the 2nd floor will be. The addition of the rail link (albeit rather late!) has made my commutes to the airport much smoother without the safety Russian roulette with taxi drivers (though only one has tried to rip me off - a few have nearly plowed into traffic at 160km/h).

And as another poster suggested to some of the cynics on here - how about trying to smile back when smiled at while passing through the airport? The positive attitude that results might even make you see the airport in a new and less grumpy light.

barryFunk

Remember, the last battle was made by men hiding behind civilians.

So I just want to get this straight... You're advocating turning Suvarnabhumi Airport into a fortress - checking every passenger on every train that goes to the airport (including the tens of thousands who use it daily as a commuter service since I can't see how you'd filter them out), every suitcase in every car, coach or minibus that enters the airport grounds, every package in every delivery van that brings goods in to the premises and all 45 million passengers who travel through the airport this year.... before they even get to the drop off zone. All this because you have insider information that the terrorists who wear black shirts and have used recent protests as a cover to go about their dastardly ways are planning an operation to violently take over the airport like in Die Hard 2 (or if you prefer... Die Harder).

While I'm sure there's a small chance this could happen I think it would be more sensible to bring in Bruce Willis and put him up at the Airport Novotel.... just in case we need a little help. Probably a lot cheaper and would inconvenience fewer people that way. We could just get each of the 45 million people who pass through the airport annually to donate 50 baht to the 'Put Bruce Up at the Novotel' fund. I'm sure they'd rather donate the price of a beer rather than sit in a queue stretching from the airport to Salaya just to get through the security you would need to completely rule out any threat.

Really? How many international airports elsewhere in the world have a rail link and at the same time have a case of a terrorist blowing up an apartment building along with himself?

Airports with direct terminal-accessible rail links (heavy rail or metro/underground) that have had terrorist attacks within their home nation's borders in the last 15 years:

- London Heathrow, Gatwick and Stansted

- Manchester

- Birmingham

- Tokyo Narita (and a particularly scary terrorist attack as it involved releasing sarin gas on an underground train)

- Tel Aviv Ben Gurion (which I don't believe has airport-style security even though it is the most terrorist-at-risk airport in the world but happy to be proven wrong)

- Madrid

- Istanbul (via Light Metro)

- Atlanta

- Washington Reagan Airport

- Moscow's three main airports

These are just some that I can think of off the top of my head - I'm sure there are lots more. I don't think any have any serious security checks on them - but happy to be proven wrong. Plenty of developed countries in that list as well.

Quite frankly I think the OP's post is ridiculous. Being so condescending towards Thailand because it doesn't implement security on a commuter rail line that happens to include an airport stop? Come on...

Though perhaps we can all cobble together a few baht to help cover the cost in packaging him in bubble wrap for every trip on public transport he takes just in case he's in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Bad people do bad things. This is reality. Security is a balance otherwise none of us would ever leave our homes. Bangkok has done nothing wrong in not implementing the ridiculous security checks the OP implies should be enforced.

Just one example, would any other country actually build an airport, today, which required passengers to walk nearly 500 metres?

Toronto's Pearson Airport - Terminal 1 - opened around the same time as Suvarnabhumi.

We live in a developing country and still the transportation system is better than Canada's. I think those of you who expect Thailand to be perfect should grab a reality check by taking a wander through the abject poverty that exists in parts of Thailand and realise how dam_n good you have it. This isn't a developed country and it's far from perfect but it certainly isn't as bad as some of you seem to think it is.

Just a quick correction to Richard's post... There's no such thing as Payathai Express station. The terminus for the Airport Express is Makkasan Station which is not connected to the BTS. If you want to take the airport train take the City Line to the end at Payathai. While it takes a few extra minutes (there are a number of stops) it is considerably cheaper than a taxi. The rest of Richard's post about taking the connecting bridge to the BTS and there being stairs at Ratchatewi BTS Station are correct.

If it's your first visit to Thailand and don't speak Thai - it may be easier to take the train since you don't have to worry about paying tolls or any of the other hassles that taxis often incur in Thailand. Very few taxi drivers speak English while the airport train and the BTS are very well signed in English. It will also be cheaper (though taxis are pretty cheap compared to the west!) if you take the airport rail link since it's on a introductory rate until the new year.

I think Richard's main point is correct though - if you have lots of bags - take a taxi (and add 50 baht to the metre price which is the pick-up charge and prepare 45 baht for the two tolls you will have to pay from the airport to central Bangkok) but if you don't have big heavy bags then take the rail option which is hassle free and usually faster if there's any traffic.

Enjoy your trip :-)

barryFunk

Hi all

I've just moved to Bangkok from the UK. I have an Xbox 360 but I only brought my HDMI cable with me! Unfortunately the apartment I'm living in for the next three months has a TV without an HDMI hook-up. I had a look around Pantip Plaza yesterday but could only find counterfeit versions of HD cables for the 360 with direct A/V hook ups (three single A/V lines). The back of my Xbox doesn't have a place for these but rather an HDMI link and a 30 pin hook-up. My TV can take the usual three male A/V hook-ups and if I remember the cable that came with my Xbox it was designed to go from the 30 pin hook-up to the 3 A/V cables for the TV.

Any tips on where I can pick one of these up?

I know Microsoft does not support Xbox in the Thai market so this may be tricky.

Thanks for any help!

barryFunk

It seems that a number of posters on here want both cheap and perfect. I have yet to travel to a country that has had an integrated rail connection that gets me to the centre of the city for as little as the new airport rail link - plus it's fast and comfortable. It's not perfect for everyone but what rail links are? If you have a family and loads of luggage it's always easier to take a taxi. Though after my last three taxi rides to/from/to the airport I'll gladly take the new ARL to avoid the stress of taxi drivers trying to match the speed of the train through rush hour traffic - even if it ends up costing my wife and I slightly more to get there than a taxi would have once the new pricing comes into effect in January.

Let's compare to KL Sentral or London Paddington - the other two central terminii of airport rail links I usually use. KL Sentral is a 20 minute ride from anywhere I want to go... but I still use it despite costing the equivalent of £7 because it's considerably cheaper than a taxi. London... Paddington is only good if you want to stay in a cheap(ish) hotel in London. Nothing useful is around Paddington Station. The City is about a 25 minute tube ride away while Canary Wharf is even further. But I use it because it's a hel_l of a lot cheaper than a taxi... even though it costs £18 one way.

The ARL? 50 baht. £1. Cheap!

Is it perfect? No - of course not! Is Makkasan in the middle of nowhere? Well no actually... it's close to Suk and not too far off Siam as well. It's also well connected to the BTS and (hopefully) will be connected properly to the MRT as well.

I get the feeling that a lot of people on these forums wouldn't be happy unless the airport rail link came with a full service massage including a happy ending - or as one poster commented - travelled direct to Nana Plaza.

Perhaps we should all remember that we live in a developing city. Yes - the corruption is horrible and things aren't always built on time - but no where is perfect. And when it comes to infrastructure Bangkok is a hel_l of a lot better than any other developing world city that I've been to. If you're still feeling a bit grumpy and really really really want to compare to developing world cities then perhaps you should have a look at a few others - New York (requires at least one change if you take the rail link), Toronto (no rail link - the airport has faught it to protect parking revenues!), Paris (takes an hour and stops everywhere) or Stockholm (wow - fast! but costs a fortune).

So Bangkok's rail link is even better than some places in the developed world. Now go grab some delicious Thai food and a massage, chill out a bit and enjoy what you have which isn't as horrible as you make it out to be.

Cheers!

barryFunk

Thanks everyone for your help! This has been incredibly useful information. My wife (Australian - not Thai!!) will be following a month and a half later so we can ship things once my work permit it arranged.

Now all that remains is finding something for my wife to do once she arrives!

Cheers

barryFunk