‘No huge compensation’ over gold mine closure

[Srikcir]

5 minutes ago, greenchair said:

So a court order is binding and can be appealed. 

Is arbitration binding? 

Can it be appealed? 

What happens if the losing party doesn't follow the arbitration order? 

Arbitration is binding and cannot be appealed with regard to the TAFTA.

The TAFTA is between countries and not between companies per se. It's an umbrella agreement that covers a whole host of trade and development activities between the two nations, subtended by companies on one side or both sides.

 

"If the complaining country [ie., Australia] is not satisfied that the other [ie., Thailand] has adequately implemented a tribunal award [ie., compensation to Kingsgate], it may suspend the benefits it owes to the other country under TAFTA." !!!!

http://www.thailaws.com/law/e_laws/freetrade/australia/tafta_business_guide.pdf

 

I am not a free trade expert. So ....

I would guess that Australia could make Kingsgate whole by raising TAFTA agreed import tariffs, imposing a special tax on those Thai imports, imposing a special tax on Thai businesses operating in Australia under TAFTA, etc. to meet Thailand's financial obligation to Kingsgate if so awarded. As these events occur in Australia, Kingsgate needn't deal with taking its claim for compensation to the Thai courts.

 

Such possible remunerative measures might further "distress" other current and future free trade agreements between Thailand and other nations because of Thailand's apparent willingness and demonstration to  breach free trade agreements without acceptable cause. That is a dangerous path for Thailand to follow if it wants economic growth.

 

 

[Sid Celery]

1 hour ago, Srikcir said:

Arbitration is binding and cannot be appealed with regard to the TAFTA.

The TAFTA is between countries and not between companies per se. It's an umbrella agreement that covers a whole host of trade and development activities between the two nations, subtended by companies on one side or both sides.

 

"If the complaining country [ie., Australia] is not satisfied that the other [ie., Thailand] has adequately implemented a tribunal award [ie., compensation to Kingsgate], it may suspend the benefits it owes to the other country under TAFTA." !!!!

http://www.thailaws.com/law/e_laws/freetrade/australia/tafta_business_guide.pdf

 

I am not a free trade expert. So ....

I would guess that Australia could make Kingsgate whole by raising TAFTA agreed import tariffs, imposing a special tax on those Thai imports, imposing a special tax on Thai businesses operating in Australia under TAFTA, etc. to meet Thailand's financial obligation to Kingsgate if so awarded. As these events occur in Australia, Kingsgate needn't deal with taking its claim for compensation to the Thai courts.

 

Such possible remunerative measures might further "distress" other current and future free trade agreements between Thailand and other nations because of Thailand's apparent willingness and demonstration to  breach free trade agreements without acceptable cause. That is a dangerous path for Thailand to follow if it wants economic growth.

 

 

 

Wow. That's hardball. I don't think I understood what the consequences of Thailand losing the arbitration and doing their usual trick of ignoring the result could be.

 

Duly educated.

 

With some pleasure in fact. Thank you for the info.

[kaorop]

6 hours ago, Dave67 said:

 
“The firm has to date not submitted any demand for compensation,” Wissanu said on Monday. 
 
He added that the arbitration process had not yet been officially triggered.

 

What do they think arbitration is?

They dont know and you can be sure they wont agree to anything and will drag it out and not pay any awarded compensation....They would rather sully and cost the whole nation than lose face themselves, and for who privately, will have little to no consequences. 

Edited November 21, 2017 by kaorop

[watcharacters]

On 11/21/2017 at 11:38 AM, Srikcir said:

Any lawsuit against a government entity would be pure fantasy.

Under the Free Trade Agreement neither Kingsgate nor The Kingdom of Thailand can be sued in court. Their grievances can only be settled in binding arbitration. Such process lowers the risk for foreign investment in developing countries that might have questionable judicial processes. Conversely, such process attracts large foreign investors to developing countries without a country having to self finance (ie., borrow) for resource development.

 

 

THanks for the validation , mate.

[Basil B]

Anyone who watches Gold Rush would realise it is not just in Thailand gold miners get shafted... 

[chainarong]

On ‎11‎/‎20‎/‎2017 at 9:03 PM, Briggsy said:

From Kingsgate's own website.

"On 2 November 2017, the Company announced that it would commence international arbitration proceedings against the Kingdom of Thailand (“Thailand” or the “State”) under the Australia Thailand Free Trade Agreement (“TAFTA”) to recover substantial losses resulting from the unlawful expropriation of the Chatree Gold Mine in 2016, and other unlawful measures taken against the Company’s covered investments in Thailand (the “TAFTA Claim”).

Both sets of proceedings have now been commenced."

 

Refuted

 

Why would Kingsgate negotiate when they will win at TAFTA. Typical vague khui dai comment

Irrelevant

 

Suspension or revoking of licence. There is little difference. Huge damages accrue whatever.

Irrelevant

 

Perhaps like China they will choose to ignore the International arbitration decision,  as Thailand hasn't the power of China, for some companies this brings into play sovereign risk.

[Srikcir]

11 minutes ago, chainarong said:

Perhaps like China they will choose to ignore the International arbitration decision,  as Thailand hasn't the power of China, for some companies this brings into play sovereign risk.

See my post #32.

 

The arbitration decision made in the Thailand vs Kingsgate case will be made by three arbitrators: one chosen by each country and the third chosen by the other two. So not really an international arbitration in the sense of an International Court.

There may be costly consequences for ignoring an arbitration decision made in connection with a free trade agreement. Can you name a country that has rejected an arbitration decision under a free trade agreement and without consequences? I don't recall China doing so in recent history.

 

The idea of a free trade agreement is to disconnect the risk of a country's sovereignty to take direct interference in a free trade agreement. Essentially two countries in a free trade agreement are equals with regard to due process without regard to their particular judicial and governance systems.

 

[Watchful]

On 11/21/2017 at 2:10 AM, Grumpy Duck said:

Perhaps the juntas recent activities to foster relations with Communist China will offset losses with Australia? Coming soon Australian products being charged duties as high as American products...

 

Does anyone really believe Beijing has intentions of outsourcing jobs to Thailand? Or building factories in Thailand?

 

All Beijing wants is cheap raw materials to be transformed by Chinese factories into products China intends to export.

[Grumpy Duck]

11 hours ago, Watchful said:

 

Does anyone really believe Beijing has intentions of outsourcing jobs to Thailand? Or building factories in Thailand?

 

All Beijing wants is cheap raw materials to be transformed by Chinese factories into products China intends to export.

Or to sell submarines, military hardware, build a high speed rail system...