Thailand To Control Low-cost Airlines

[Mid]

Thailand to control low-cost airlines

Thailand's Civil Aviation Department will enforce new regulations to control budget airlines beginning later this month allowing the department to examine promotional plans of the airlines following passenger complaints.

The department will soon announce new rules for operators of no-frills airlines.

The Post Publishing Public Co

[Mid]

Thailand tries to clarify prices in ads by budget carriers

[24 Jul 2007]

BANGKOK (AFP)

Thailand's aviation authority has imposed new marketing rules for the country's budget carriers after consumers complained that prices in their advertisements were misleading, an official said Tuesday.

Under the new regulations, the airlines are now required to submit their low-fare ads to the government for approval, said Chaisak Angkasuwan, director-general of the aviation department.

Consumers have complained that purchased tickets were often more expensive than the advertised prices and that they came with too many restrictions.

"Conditions required in some promotional campaigns are not fair for passengers. We want to make sure that price competition in the industry is fair," Chaisak said.

He declined to name airlines that had been accused of misleading advertising.

Nok Airlines, a discount airline owned by flag carrier Thai Airways International, welcomed the new rules, but said passengers should also read the fine print more carefully.

"We have received some complaints from consumers but sometimes passengers did not read through the conditions for the promotional" prices, said Sehapan Chumsai, the airline's executive vice president for marketing.

Sehapan said competition in the low-cost aviation industry was getting tough, with passengers using cheap carriers expected to hit 10 million in 2007.

servihoo.com

got to wish them success in this endeavour

[think_too_mut]

EU will introduce that regulation on Jan 1 2008: only what is actual price, all inclusive, may be published.

Just recent ads with ridiculous prices of 30 baht from BKK to select domestic destinations snowballs to 630B for inconvenient flight times.

[cclub75]

EU will introduce that regulation on Jan 1 2008: only what is actual price, all inclusive, may be published.

Just recent ads with ridiculous prices of 30 baht from BKK to select domestic destinations snowballs to 630B for inconvenient flight times.

In EU, the regulations state that the price must be all inclusive. If a company fails, then punishment. Fair enough.

But here, our brillant thais authorities state that the companies must submit their ads, for approval !

I mean, it's totally different !

[the gent]

EU will introduce that regulation on Jan 1 2008: only what is actual price, all inclusive, may be published.

Just recent ads with ridiculous prices of 30 baht from BKK to select domestic destinations snowballs to 630B for inconvenient flight times.

Snowballs to all of 630bt? My,my, imagine one's dismay at being confronted with such price gouging. Grief, that's almost 3 x the price of a taxi to the airport.........absolutely scandalous!

[Mid]

the gent ,

fail to see your point here ,

do you buy hamburgers for 20 b then add another 10 for the bun etc ?

IMHO nobody is calling price gouging , rather they are calling for the total ticket price to be advertised not it's components .

[think_too_mut]

EU will introduce that regulation on Jan 1 2008: only what is actual price, all inclusive, may be published.

Just recent ads with ridiculous prices of 30 baht from BKK to select domestic destinations snowballs to 630B for inconvenient flight times.

Snowballs to all of 630bt? My,my, imagine one's dismay at being confronted with such price gouging. Grief, that's almost 3 x the price of a taxi to the airport.........absolutely scandalous!

It could have jumped to 6300B - I would not use any low cost airline in the region anyway.

That price (630B) is hardly any different from daily run off the mill.

There was a poster here who would, after 20 hours on the planes from the USA switch to a low cost airline, even travel across BKK to Don Muang and was asking for an alternative to "500B taxi rip-off".

Other than locals, there are some farangs who would call it "scandalous".

[samran]

EU will introduce that regulation on Jan 1 2008: only what is actual price, all inclusive, may be published.

Just recent ads with ridiculous prices of 30 baht from BKK to select domestic destinations snowballs to 630B for inconvenient flight times.

In EU, the regulations state that the price must be all inclusive. If a company fails, then punishment. Fair enough.

But here, our brillant thais authorities state that the companies must submit their ads, for approval !

I mean, it's totally different !

you forget the modus operandi of the typical Thai civil servant. The more power the better. This makes perfect sense to them.

Funnily enough, the Thai's typically look to the French civil service system for inspiration. Apart from junkets to Paris for study tours, the system there provides them with a model which makes the most sense....

[think_too_mut]

EU will introduce that regulation on Jan 1 2008: only what is actual price, all inclusive, may be published.

Just recent ads with ridiculous prices of 30 baht from BKK to select domestic destinations snowballs to 630B for inconvenient flight times.

In EU, the regulations state that the price must be all inclusive. If a company fails, then punishment. Fair enough.

But here, our brillant thais authorities state that the companies must submit their ads, for approval !

I mean, it's totally different !

you forget the modus operandi of the typical Thai civil servant. The more power the better. This makes perfect sense to them.

Funnily enough, the Thai's typically look to the French civil service system for inspiration. Apart from junkets to Paris for study tours, the system there provides them with a model which makes the most sense....

French model in asia - they don't need Paris - they should be sent to Cambodia or, money permitting, to Vietnam.

[Mid]

must admit , it's nicer to study the French model in Paris as opposed to it's country of origin .

[onzestan]

Thailand to control low-cost airlines

Thailand's Civil Aviation Department will enforce new regulations to control budget airlines beginning later this month allowing the department to examine promotional plans of the airlines following passenger complaints.

The department will soon announce new rules for operators of no-frills airlines.

The Post Publishing Public Co

It's about time.

I have never used low-cost airlines and one of the reasons is their pricing policy (not to say scam).

Only the real cost should be made public.

The airlines in question are NOT going to do it, as long as they're not obliged to.

My opinion

onzestan

[terryp]

I must say this is very good news, I fly International & domestic with budgets about every 4-5 weeks and the final prices are just crazy…last week Got 2 @ 99 baht flights to KL end price was almost 7,000 baht…just booked 2@ 299 baht to Krabi end price was almost 5,000 baht……1 two Go had the right idea with the all in ticket price

If you are going to fly everyone has a price they are prepared to pay…the system at the moment is just overly confusing for people who do not fly regularly and a plain irritation to the people who fly regularly

[Florin]

I just don't pay attention to the print ads...I mean, come on, who in his right mind could imagine a flight would cost as much as a portion of pad thai??

And whatever price they print WILL be innacurate...because the whole LCC model relies on VERY flexible pricing depending on how long in advance you book, which flight of the day you want to be on, etc. Even if they advertise "2.700 Baht roundtrip to Chiang Mai!", it is definitely not going to be 2.700 Baht if you actually want to fly in a day or two.

What they should check thoroughly is the maintenance of the aircraft...I don't know about you guys, but I find a cockroach going up the bulkhead wall in front of me (true story on AirAsia) a much more irritating sight than "WOWOWOW! 0.5 Baht to Macau!!"

[peter991]

To make it even MORE confusing ... there does not seem to be any logic in the pricing:

Example: Airline A offers a fare of 99 baht & 1200 baht taxes & charges to Khon K. You pay: 1299 baht.

Airline B offers a fare of 999 baht & 300 baht taxes & charges to Khon K. You pay: 1299 baht.

The total fare is the same. Is one airline 'better value for money?' Taxes and charges, in my opinion, should be no more than 40% of the pre-taxes and charges fare.

Peter

[nonthaburial]

I would be more inclined find out how much that cockroach paid for the flight. Was he scammed too ??

[siam2007]

I can not understand this outcry.....

the budget-carriers don't do it in a different way than the big airlines.

ALL will add their taxes, fuel surcharges, fees.....

everywhere in Asia, ALL advertised fares do NOT include Taxes, fees and fuel-surcharges. If you read the BKK POST, you'll find plenty of ads for air-tickets everyday.

but, for example, if u book a 30.000 BT Ticket to Europe, with THAI, AUSTRIAN, CATHAY, or any other airline, you will end up paying 37.000 - 39.000 Baht.

so why blame the Budget-Carriers for doing it the same way ?

I still prefer flying to Krabi for 630 Baht (99 Baht plus taxes) than paying a full fare of 3.000 BT with a big airline.

oh, and I should add: THAI AIRWAYS does the same thing. right now they do have a promotion for domestic destinations (with quite competitive prices indeed), but OF COURSE the advertised fares do NOT include all the taxes and surcharges.

Edited July 25, 2007 by siam2007

[terryp]

You are missing a very important fact…….WE ARE NOT THAI

The vast majority of travelers on budget airlines are Thai travelers who until recently almost always traveled by bus…so yes the 99 baht adds are very confusing to that group of travelers.

How pretentious to assume everyone is as well versed in the airline advertising scams as you all appear to be

[Florin]

You are missing a very important fact…….WE ARE NOT THAI

The vast majority of travelers on budget airlines are Thai travelers who until recently almost always traveled by bus…so yes the 99 baht adds are very confusing to that group of travelers.

How pretentious to assume everyone is as well versed in the airline advertising scams as you all appear to be

What's pretentious about finding it normal for an airplane ticket to be several hundred baht more than a bus ticket?? Even a peasant selling his things on the side of the street has to have at least SOME concept of market prices, otherwise mango would cost 5 Baht here, 200 down the road, etc. Also, airlines like AirAsia don't sell their tickets in travel agencies, they do so online or through a call center...I reckon if someone will have the intelligence to get on the Internet, they will also have the intelligence to realize that there is no way they can get 900km away from Bangkok for 99 Baht! It's not rocket science!

[onzestan]

I can not understand this outcry.....

the budget-carriers don't do it in a different way than the big airlines.

ALL will add their taxes, fuel surcharges, fees.....

everywhere in Asia, ALL advertised fares do NOT include Taxes, fees and fuel-surcharges. If you read the BKK POST, you'll find plenty of ads for air-tickets everyday.

but, for example, if u book a 30.000 BT Ticket to Europe, with THAI, AUSTRIAN, CATHAY, or any other airline, you will end up paying 37.000 - 39.000 Baht.

so why blame the Budget-Carriers for doing it the same way ?

I still prefer flying to Krabi for 630 Baht (99 Baht plus taxes) than paying a full fare of 3.000 BT with a big airline.

oh, and I should add: THAI AIRWAYS does the same thing. right now they do have a promotion for domestic destinations (with quite competitive prices indeed), but OF COURSE the advertised fares do NOT include all the taxes and surcharges.

I think you are missing the point here.

Yes all the airlines should be obliged to publicize the end price, but there's a big difference with adding tax of abt 20 % to adding extra costs amounting to 600 percent.

Fact is a lot of people will be lured to these websites and probably a lot of them will be scammed, through their own fault as you will call it, but a scam is a scam, and any rule that makes the pricing policies more transparent should be applauded.

My 3 cents

onzestan

[THAILIBAN]

the Taxes are a FIXED amount usually, so of course the percentage of the Taxes is higher if the actual fare is 99 Baht than if it would be 2.000 Baht.

so, may I ask, where is the scam ??? thats absolutely nonsense.

u think its scam because they charge u 99 Baht plus Taxes instead of 2.000 Baht plus Taxes ? well, then go for the 2.000 baht ticket and scam urself and be happy.

Though, I do agree with the "publicize end prices" thing.

but that doesnt mean, to sell a ticket for 99 Baht (and there are PLENTY of them available, its not just a promotion-joke) is scam....

[onzestan]

the Taxes are a FIXED amount usually, so of course the percentage of the Taxes is higher if the actual fare is 99 Baht than if it would be 2.000 Baht.

so, may I ask, where is the scam ??? thats absolutely nonsense.

u think its scam because they charge u 99 Baht plus Taxes instead of 2.000 Baht plus Taxes ? well, then go for the 2.000 baht ticket and scam urself and be happy.

Though, I do agree with the "publicize end prices" thing.

but that doesnt mean, to sell a ticket for 99 Baht (and there are PLENTY of them available, its not just a promotion-joke) is scam....

Sorry if i have offended you.

In my book, these ridiculously low prices are publicized for luring potential customers, on FALSE pretenses, whether it's carriers or low-cost carriers.

If you cannot see this as a scam then I rest my case.

If the fish has been lured to bite the worm he's been had, hasn't he.

Again my 3 cents

onzestan

[realthaideal]

"I would be more inclined find out how much that cockroach paid for the flight. Was he scammed too ??"

In-flight meal for the gecko.

[somtaamgaiyang]

Ironically now, it will be interesting to see if they print all the components of the prices. Since we are effectively held to a monopoly by AOT, will we be able to see AOT's pricing increases, fuel surcharge increases by the airlines, or will we see prices increasing arbitrarily so that AOT can bail out the people living near SVB?

[Florin]

Ironically now, it will be interesting to see if they print all the components of the prices. Since we are effectively held to a monopoly by AOT, will we be able to see AOT's pricing increases, fuel surcharge increases by the airlines, or will we see prices increasing arbitrarily so that AOT can bail out the people living near SVB?

What countries don't have an airport authority monopoly? Any privatization in these kinds of sectors has to be done very carefully...Britain is considered a developed country with a strong free-market tradition, yet screwed up royally when initially privatizing British Rail, how do you think Thailand would fare at it? Airport taxes all over the world increase based on whatever project the authorities need money for, or simply a surge in traffic that would put a strain on existing resources...plus, the whole "not in my backyard" compensation system is very normal in the West for anyone living near massive state construction projects. I don't quite see your point...I would not consider such increases in price arbitrary.

[my friend I]

Hopefully the control will extend to airlines that cancel routes eg Tiger Singapore - Udon , leaving people stranded.

[somtaamgaiyang]

Ironically now, it will be interesting to see if they print all the components of the prices. Since we are effectively held to a monopoly by AOT, will we be able to see AOT's pricing increases, fuel surcharge increases by the airlines, or will we see prices increasing arbitrarily so that AOT can bail out the people living near SVB?

What countries don't have an airport authority monopoly? Any privatization in these kinds of sectors has to be done very carefully...Britain is considered a developed country with a strong free-market tradition, yet screwed up royally when initially privatizing British Rail, how do you think Thailand would fare at it? Airport taxes all over the world increase based on whatever project the authorities need money for, or simply a surge in traffic that would put a strain on existing resources...plus, the whole "not in my backyard" compensation system is very normal in the West for anyone living near massive state construction projects. I don't quite see your point...I would not consider such increases in price arbitrary.

I am talking about printing all the individual components of the price and how they are calculated. which is what is being debated in Britain because of fixing by BA and Virgin. They rigged fuel surcharges, which were not disclosed in the pricing of the tickets thus defrauding the consumer. Thai Airways domestic fuel surcharged have rocketed HOPEFULLY in line with fuel prices. Railways are proven to have been a mess airports less so. BAA owns 8 in the UK, Heathrow being the most obvious screw up. This is because the laws in the UK do not encourage it to invest in existing facilities. This is being debated right now and will change.

There are many large consortia running different aiports in UK, Europe, and many local authorities operating them also. This is how Ryan Air survives and is able to deliver low prices. Wouldn't it be great if someone could buy Don Muang and put it in direct competition with Survanabhumi, we might actually get some service.

[Florin]

Yes, what you're saying is the case for European cities with many small airports in their immediate proximity...here all we have is Suvarnabhumi and Don Muang and I don't think the government will ever relent control...and they'd probably be especially paranoid about Don Muang, given that they have military facilities right there.

Thai Airways tried to get control of the Chittagong airport in Bangladesh and there was a huge outcry, Manila's new terminal building project is subject of a loooong dispute with the widely-respected-in-Europe Fraport, it just seems like in this part of the world there is no wish to hand what is deemed as a strategic facility over to foreigners. And I definitely wouldn't want to fly through an airport run by a newly-established Thai company with no previous experience in the field.

[somtaamgaiyang]

Yes, what you're saying is the case for European cities with many small airports in their immediate proximity...here all we have is Suvarnabhumi and Don Muang and I don't think the government will ever relent control...and they'd probably be especially paranoid about Don Muang, given that they have military facilities right there.

Thai Airways tried to get control of the Chittagong airport in Bangladesh and there was a huge outcry, Manila's new terminal building project is subject of a loooong dispute with the widely-respected-in-Europe Fraport, it just seems like in this part of the world there is no wish to hand what is deemed as a strategic facility over to foreigners. And I definitely wouldn't want to fly through an airport run by a newly-established Thai company with no previous experience in the field.

Well we have to fly thru a newly established airport with an EXPERIENCED Thai company running it. I am not sure an inexperienced Thai company could do much worse could they?

Of course they won't ever relent control of it, there is too much money to be made for a select few, and we the weary passenger have no option but to eat it. And where would the generals all play golf? If ever there was a case for deregulation Survanabhumi and Manila are the ultimate examples.

"The world-renowned Singapore Changi Airport is one of Singapore’s best-known icons, and has won international awards and accolades for many consecutive years. Behind the successes of Changi Airport is a group of Singapore companies with diverse capabilities. With their combined expertise of services and industry knowledge, they have been instrumental in the construction, development and management of Changi Airport.

In mid 2003, these companies came together to form a consortium known as the “Singapore Airport Consortium”. The aim of the Consortium was to share and combine the companies’ experiences and expertise to jointly bid for overseas airport projects by offering a complete suite of products, services and solutions. "

Members:

Changi Airports International Pte. Ltd.

CNA Group Ltd

CPG Consultants Pte Ltd

Inter-Roller Engineering Limited

Jurong International

Keppel FMO Pte Ltd

NCS Pte Ltd

Sembawang Engineers and Constructors Pte Ltd

SIA Engineering Company Limited

Singapore Airport Terminal Services Limited (SATS)

Singapore Technologies Engineering Ltd

ST Airport Services Pte Ltd

And this is how it is done in a world class airport. Private and Public working together to create the best airport in the world why we have AOT still working out how to pay off the local residents.

[samran]

Ironically now, it will be interesting to see if they print all the components of the prices. Since we are effectively held to a monopoly by AOT, will we be able to see AOT's pricing increases, fuel surcharge increases by the airlines, or will we see prices increasing arbitrarily so that AOT can bail out the people living near SVB?

the prices and charges at Thai airports are controlled and devised under the CPI-X single till framework, which is the system used in the UK and many Australian juristictions and regulates the prices that can be charged for monopoly services that occur at the airport. Anything from re-fuellers, catering, landing charges, airtraffic control etc etc. Ultimately it is the ministers call, but the advice he gets is grounded in this methedolgy. The next price review is being initiated by the MOF, and if all goes to plan, will happen next year. The review if done properly should take 12-18 months to do. Results will be presented by the department of aviation for his consideration.