Parents Of Children From 1.5 To 2.5 Y.o.

[MikeWill]

I'm expat, married a Thai lady and have a 1 year 10 month old daughter. We are staying in Bangkok: Sathorn-Rama IV area, nearby the Garden International and Noddy Play Group schools.

I would like to call on similar families to pool our resources and meet regularily for homeschooling: all types of activities for small children (such as English and Thai languages, swimming, dance and music, and other classes...)

Please contact me via email: [email protected]

or by phone: 01 812 9010.

Michael

[Harry Palmer]

for those with young kids... this is probably the best post i've seen in ages... sadly i'm in chang mai but may contact you to see how it goes...

i am most interested to learn what you guys are doing about schooling the little monkies... i/we really don't want to send ours to a native school, so the only real alternative is to send her to an ex-pat school & bite the bullet over the relatively high school fees...

... not so sure that it was a good idea to post your tel no here... lots of nutters on this board

[dfwbkk]

I like it too. Moving back to Thailand next year with 3 kids 1-4 yrs old.

Would'a jumped at this if we'd been there already. Great post,.

/// dfw

[boogie]

Agree with dwf and HP, we are considereing a move to Thailand in just under 5 years time. I know it doesnt help you condo_bk and apologies for going off topic, but I was wondering what you think of raising children in Thailand. There was a topic on this subject a little while back, but it ended up in a bit of a slanging match over matters of opinion.

I would be intereted to know what other parents think, especially those that have already settled in Thailand or even those who have left because they didnt think it was a good place to raise children.Would also be interested in schooling ideas.

My wife is Thai and I am English. Our children will be 7 and 5 (due in three weeks !) when we move. We havent decided for certain yet, but if we do move it would probably be Chiang Mai or even Pattaya/Rayong. The other alternative is England !

If you dont want to continue this subject on this thread please feel free to PM me, or maybe I should start another thread.

Cheers

[MikeWill]

... what you think of raising children in Thailand. Would also be interested in schooling ideas.

Actually, this topic is about raising children and schooling in Thailand. All ideas/suggestions/questions in that regard are most welcome.

If there will be enough children to set up our own class, I think this will be the best option for our children, as well as for us the parents.

[350torana]

Yeah, a great post. Our little one is only 13 months ,maybe a little young. Her education now is having stories read to her at night . I always wonder about the future, when she is older. In my home country,it's perfectly normal to send a kid to daycare before kindergarten . I notice here in the kingdom it is more common for grandma to be the daycare. This might sound great, but think it is important young children learn to socialise and play with other kids without being spoilt and smothered as Thai grandmothers tend to do

[MikeWill]

Per my knowledge and perception it is rather customary even in pure Thai families to send thier little ones to the kindergarten, nursery, etc. More arguable, is it an international or private Thai preschool, each has its own pluses and minuses, and it comes at rather high cost.

I have already visited several such schools, and have discussed that matter with both Thais and foreigners alike. The most common criteria for choosing a school is budget and location.

BTW, in which language do you read the nightly stories?

[Sulaphat]

Thanks, Condo_bk, for starting this thread.

We are trying to determine how best to educate our children. Right now we have two in nursery/kindergarten (3 yrs and 4yrs old), one at home (16 months) and another due next May.

The school that the two attend uses English exclusively, however 80% of the children come from Thai families. Of the non-Thai children most are other Asian nationalities including Japanese, Chinese, Indian, etc. This suits us fairly well.

Since the school only has classes through kindergarten, we will in the next year or two need to find an affordable school for them to attend. The big name international schools such as ISB and Bangkok Pattana are above our budget. We are also concerned at the large number of expatriate children at many international schools who will probably only be here for a couple of years before their parents get posted elsewhere. We'd like a more stable school community than that. If I'm wrong on this point I'd be glad to hear otherwise from someone.

We'd like to find a school that is affordable, but uses English as the primary language of instruction. But we also want the school to have enough Thai language offerings so that our children are not at a disadvantage when they need to use Thai.

I suspect that there are lots of other families facing similar choices. Would be interested in hearing what others have found.

[siamruby]

It s really a good idea starting this thread,as I am planning to homeschool our kids when we move to Thailand next year. The eldest is 14 and will be doing English GCSE soon and the youngest is only 5. I am not worry about what to teach and how as I have been reading up about it and bought a lot of books,cd etc but the problem with their socialising, how can they make friends without going to school? I searched on the net for the Thai homeschooling group and didn't find any.

Whereas,in the Uk we have a lot of groups, local groups,meetings etc. It's a shame that you are in BKK as we are moving to Chiang Mai. Unless any of you want to set up a group in Chiang Mai?

[Ice Treasure]

Chiang Mai has a home schooling group, based I think on First Church. We considered it once but decided against it for our charge because it was far too thematic (Christian), which is pointless since our charge is not Christian.

[siamruby]

Thanks for info Ice.. but it s the same here as we are not that religious. But I will have a look at their website ( which I have just found). Guess to have a Christian homeschooling group is better than having non or much better than a drug smuggling homeschooling group

[MikeWill]

The school that the two attend uses English exclusively, however 80% of the children come from Thai families. 

Since the school only has classes through kindergarten, we will in the next year or two need to find an affordable school for them to attend. 

We'd like to find a school that is affordable, but uses English as the primary language of instruction.  But we also want the school to have enough Thai language offerings so that our children are not at a disadvantage when they need to use Thai.

Where is that school located? Maybe you can mention its name.

I know of one preschool (called Thien Prasitthisart) in Soi 1 of Sathorn Tai Rd, which plans next year to open English teaching classes. This is rather famous private preschool in Bangkok. It charges ~30K THB per semester.

But still, my idea is to find enough children to set up our own homeschooling class. There are several schools in Bangkok that could provide their facilities for that purpose.

[phormio]

...

If there will be enough children to set up our own class, I think this will be the best option for our children, as well as for us the parents.

....

Per my knowledge and perception it is rather customary even in pure Thai families to send thier little ones to the kindergarten, nursery, etc. More arguable, is it an international or private Thai preschool, each has its own pluses and minuses, and it comes at rather high cost.

I have already visited several such schools, and have discussed that matter with both Thais and foreigners alike. The most common criteria for choosing a school is budget and location.

BTW, in which language do you read the nightly stories?

My wife(Thai) , myself(US), and our 12 month old daughter are moving to Thailand at the end of 2004. We still have some time to consider the options and look around for child care/education needs. Sounds like you have been evaluating the options in-country and have decided that none are palatable (either too expensive or not high quality)? I would think that there are many choices but on the expensive end of things, since a lot of the expats have packages that have generous educational allowances for children, tending to drive prices to the extremes.

How long have you lived in Thailand and why have you decided to concentrate on the home-schooling solution?

[Sulaphat]

Where is that school located? Maybe you can mention its name.

Where is that school located? Maybe you can mention its name.

Twinkle Star Nursery School in Sukhumvit Soi 61.

Not cheap. Baht 50k per semester, 3 semesters plus a shorter (baht 25k) summer term in July/August. A bit more costly if you opt for extended hours (until 2 pm instead of noon). It has been in operation since the late 1960's or so. Clean and cheerful atmosphere and the staff really take an interest in the children's progress. We checked out a number of schools and this was the one we found that suited our preferences the best. Claims to be Montessori approach and have no reason to doubt it.

The teachers are native English speakers for the most part, although there is at least one Thai (with fluent English) that also teaches. The teachers aides are all Thai. The founder of the school is Thai, married to a Singaporean, although I think she is retired from active involvement in the school now. Believe that the school was started in the late 1960's or so.

When we looked into nursery schools we found that most of the ones that used English as the medium of instruction catered to the expat community and were expensive and did not have many Thai children in attendance. The Thai language nursery schools were much more affordable, but frankly did not seem to be of the same standard. Perhaps we did not see the best of the Thai nursery schools however. We believe we found a very good balance at Twinkle Star.

[Pudgimelon]

My wife(Thai) , myself(US), and our 12 month old daughter are moving to Thailand at the end of 2004. We still have some time to consider the options and look around for child care/education needs. Sounds like you have been evaluating the options in-country and have decided that none are palatable (either too expensive or not high quality)?  I would think that there are many choices but on the expensive end of things, since a lot of the expats have packages that have generous educational allowances for children, tending to drive prices to the extremes.

How long have you lived in Thailand and why have you decided to concentrate on the home-schooling solution?

Unfortunately, in Thailand, "expensive" doesn't necessarily equate with "quality".

There is a very large black hole of accountability in the Thai education system, and so I feel bad for any parent who has to put their kids into a Thai school. It can be a harrowing experience trying to find a school that actually gives a sh-t about your KID and not just your WALLET.

Schools often try to hire the most qualified candidates, but as the beginning of term approaches and pressure mounts to fill positions, many schools often scrape the bottom of the barrel and hire the next warm body to walk in the door. This may be an ideal situation for some down-n-outs who don't have a clue about education (but still want a job teaching kids), but for parents, it can be a nightmare.

Worst still, the concepts of "professional assessment" and "professional training" are almost completely unheard of in Thailand. This is doubly strange given the composition of the job pool here. Since many teachers in Thailand are not qualified (or under-qualified) and lack experience, it would only make sense to supervise and train them for the job. And yet schools rarely do this.

The problem is not entirely the fault of the schools, but they are in large part responsible for perpetuating it and failing to remedy it. Western teachers are a notoriously unstable hire. Many flee the school after only one year or semester (or even after one paycheck), so I can understand that the schools are reluctant to invest money in properly training and supervising teachers, but at the same time, much of the frustration that new teachers feel could be allievated if they were giving proper training and advice. So even though Western teachers are a flighty lot, it comes back on the schools to be responsible for helping them adjust to their new career.

For a parent, this situation cannot be more worrisome. I know because I've gone along on "scouting trips" with some parents as they check out new schools in the area (parents are constantly "shopping" for a better education option). They've expressed some of their concerns to me. For example, they might come across a really good school with fabulous classrooms and a wonderful staff of teachers. So they want to put their kid in there, but what about next year? Will the school be able to retain all its teachers? Will that terrific 2nd grade teacher still be there when their child comes back next year? Will the school find an equally wonderful replacement or will they be forced to hire some drunk with a lisp?

As a future parent (I hope ), I look forward to the education of my children with a certain degree of dread. If my girlfriend (future wife) and I decide to stay in Thailand, I will be extremely worried about the quality of my child's education. Schools often invest a great deal of money in their outward appearance (to attract new customers), but once they get the kids in the door, the amount of concern they show for the kids would be laughable if kids weren't involved. Instead it's rather sad.

I've already told my girlfriend that I'd rather move back to the States while our kids are in school. Not that the schools in America are problem-free, but at least there I would be reassured that there is some amount of accountability. If there is a problem, I could at least be assured that someone would take responsibility for it and try to remedy it. Here in Thailand, I doubt that would happen.

Most worrisome to me is the lack of supervision and training provided to teachers. The lack of training means that teachers are often unaware of the particular problems that Thai children encounter when learning in English. Even a fully-qualified teacher with a Master's degree in Education would still need SOME training to adjust to a Thai classroom. Yet sadly, many schools aren't even aware of the NEED to do this (and those that are aware, ignore it in favor of "beautifying" the school for parents).

Worse, the lack of supervision means that there is little guarantee that the school is hiring individuals who are SAFE around children. The recent arrest of an alleged British pedeophile proves that Thailand is seen as a haven by many wishing to avoid the law back home. These same people may or may not seek employment in Thai schools. How does a parent know?? Given the complete lack of screening and supervision in the hiring and employment process, it would be a very simple matter for "bad people" to get jobs in Thai schools.

If I were a parent, I'd find this fact rather troubling. And hence, I completely sympathize with someone who wants to homeschool their kids in Thailand. It seems like the only certain way to make sure that your child gets a SAFE and QUALITY education in this country.

[phormio]

...How long have you lived in Thailand and why have you decided to concentrate on the home-schooling solution?

Unfortunately, in Thailand, "expensive" doesn't necessarily equate with "quality".

...

There is a very large black hole of accountability in the Thai education system, and so I feel bad for any parent who has to put their kids into a Thai school....

For a parent, this situation cannot be more worrisome. I know because I've gone along on "scouting trips" with some parents as they check out new schools in the area (parents are constantly "shopping" for a better education option)...

Schools often invest a great deal of money in their outward appearance (to attract new customers), but once they get the kids in the door, the amount of concern they show for the kids would be laughable if kids weren't involved. Instead it's rather sad.

...

If I were a parent, I'd find this fact rather troubling. And hence, I completely sympathize with someone who wants to homeschool their kids in Thailand. It seems like the only certain way to make sure that your child gets a SAFE and QUALITY education in this country.

Hey Pudgi,

Thanks for your detailed and thoughtful response to my query.The bolded sections(your text, my bold) seem to be the crux of it.

As I will be looking for employment as a teacher, and realize that appearance is of the utmost importance, which may be of some aid in helping me to land a good teaching position, in a bit of a twist it plays against me when scouring the landscape for the best educational options for my daughter.

I am perhaps more fortunate than most in that I still have a few years to make a decision and my wife has a wide number of contacts that will likely be able to help us separate the wheat from the chafe when it comes to evaluating educational institutions.

[MikeWill]

My wife(Thai) , myself(US), and our 12 month old daughter...

How long have you lived in Thailand and why have you decided to concentrate on the home-schooling solution?

I am an oldtimer, ~20 years in Thailand, but just recently have started to pay attention to the issue of child schooling.

I start looking into the issue (visiting schools, speaking with friends, neighbors, other parents, Thai and expat teachers) trying to find the best solution for my daughter, I will be able to afford.

Referring to the post of Pudgimelon, I can't say that it is relevant to the best and most expensive schools, but surely it is true in regards to the average International school. On the other hand, it isn't a subject of this thread to address the problems of education in Thailand in global terms.

So, what are the alternatives...

Not sure, if the term "homeschooling" is the right one. To more clearly clarify my intend...

It is not only the after school activities, but mainly, I would like to set up a class (atleast 10 children) where parents will choose the teachers, decide on curriculum, language studies and other subjects including music, etc., time of starting and finishing school day, and all other matters of importance, including the facilities (i.e. the school itself), where that class will take place.

In other words, it should be our own class organized and taking place in facilities of some private school.

Not only it will be less expensive, but it must be of better quality as well.

[phormio]

...

So, what are the alternatives...

Not sure, if the term "homeschooling" is the right one. To more clearly clarify my intend...

It is not only the after school activities, but mainly, I would like to set up a class (atleast 10 children) where parents will choose the teachers, decide on curriculum, language studies and other subjects including music, etc., time of starting and finishing school day, and all other matters of importance, including the facilities (i.e. the school itself), where that class will take place.

In other words, it should be our own class organized and taking place in facilities of some private school.

Not only it will be less expensive, but it must be of better quality as well.

Really you want to set up your own 'private school' . Do you know enough to set up things to satisfy the educational requirements of Thailand ? TAre children even required to go to school in the LoS ? Probably want to be able to ensure that the education will fulfill requirements in the US/UK so that the kids won't have transition problems in the future, possibly upon repatriation to their parents homelands.

This sounds like a good idea - I haven't started looking into the issues and so am uninformed on the myriad of issues that come to the forefront.

[MikeWill]

Really you want to set up your own 'private school'.  Do you know enough to set up things to satisfy the educational requirements of Thailand? ...

Actually, as far as I'm aware of, there are afew private (Thai & International) school's projects in the making...

But, I'm not even thinking of such undertaking. All I'm planning is, to organize a class in collaboration with the school we (the parents) choose for that purpose.

So, if someone knows the parents of children aged 1,5-2,5 in Bangkok, please spread this message. For now, we have already 4 children.

[Ice Treasure]

Just occured to me, in Chiang Mai there is Hudson Kindergarten, in the Soi opposite the Government Hospital Suan Dok. Been there for hundreds of years and seems to have reasonable reputation.

Remember talking to the old pommie that runs it once, when I was at that stupid farang club on Saraphi Road. He seemed a pleasant enough old guy, but it wasn't an issue at the time as the charge was only about 10 months old at the time.

[phormio]

Really you want to set up your own 'private school'.  Do you know enough to set up things to satisfy the educational requirements of Thailand? ...

Actually, as far as I'm aware of, there are afew private (Thai & International) school's projects in the making...

But, I'm not even thinking of such undertaking. All I'm planning is, to organize a class in collaboration with the school we (the parents) choose for that purpose.

So, if someone knows the parents of children aged 1,5-2,5 in Bangkok, please spread this message. For now, we have already 4 children.

I'm not going to be in Bangkok and in shape to do things until January 2005; I have some Thai friends working as a director of a childrens' school in the outskirts of Bangkok; she went to Harvard to take a workshop on alternative education for children and also spent time volunteering in a Montessori school here in the States before returning to the LoS.

I'll keep you in mind and see what I can find out and get back to you when I'm able to add something substantial to the discussion. At this point I'm too removed from the situation and ignorant to do anything else.

Its Great that you started this discussion and hopefully you'll get things going - there is nothing more important then getting the kids well taken care of.

[Blake7]

There seems to be some sort of expat nursery in the grounds of the bangkok Garden serviced apartment complex - as far as I can make out it is not managed by the Bangkok Garden and appears to be private. Does anyone have any experience of this place?

[MikeWill]

Bangkok Garden serviced apartment complex

Can you pls clarify where is that place located and if you know the Tel.

[Blake7]

Bangkok Garden Apartment

289 New Sathorn Rd. (Naradhiwas Rajanakarindra) Soi 24

Yannawa

Tel 66-2-6720001

This is the Bangkok Garden address and telephone number - but as I said I think this place is run seperately from the apartments.