Thailand "hub" Of ...

[francois]

hi'

I posted this one in vip, but wanted to share it with all of you

here it is :

as some news said. a new war on bird-flu, a new war on drugs, soon a new war on corruption(the return), and why not many another ones ...

I just feel that this governement is spreading fears among Thai people ...

fighting a disease is one thing, call it a war is another...

fighting drugs is one thing, call it a war is another...

war on drugs is like cutting the trees when they get too large ... cut some branches, and it will grow better soon ... so it is for drugs.

no government succeeded in such "wars" ...

in US, they spend more money to fight drugs than the NASA is spending in a year!

what are the result? NONE!

not any reduction on imports, no less drug users ... and some problems ahead ...

is it under control ... may be ... may be some people have some interests to keep this on.

birdflu ...

what an announcement!

get rid of it or I'll sack you !! ... in 30 days

who can seriously think that such a problem can be solved in such a little time?

even, scientist say so ... NO WAY!

but mr PM is going on ...

a war on corruption ... let me LOL

mr PM would like to get rid of those who could give him hard time ... may be ...

and why they did not check him first to show that the governement was clean?

any risk at it?

they want to show that they are tough on problems ...

what do the Thai people get better, did their life change a bit since mr PM is in office?

did they get the phone "in every mooban"? NO ... and will probably take years to happen ...

any improvement for Thai farmers? (70% of the population) ...

Thailand is or was a nice country to live in ... before mr PM took office, everyone was hoping that such a rich man can do something for them ...

another "money talks" ...

and so many that still believe that things are getting better ... mai kaod djai:(

something that I can tell you ... in the village where the family of my wife is living,

they won't vote for him again ... just got tired of promises that never came out to be true, they begin to realize that politicians are just a band of professional liers...

even if they pay ... the word is now: take the money and vote what you want.

this is good for democracy .. if we still can call it this way in Thailand ...

disapointed but still hoping for a better Thailand

what are your thoughts about all these wars, and all these lies?

francois

no flame would be appreciated ... thanks

Edited October 5, 2004 by francois

[kayo]

Without being too specific about T.S. or for that matter Thailand, I read an interesting article a while back, which I´m just going to pop off to look for... (PLEASE HOLD)...

Here is the text copied from the website below. Slightly edited for brevity. In Particular, the parts in BOLD print I deem relevant to your points.

"Thinking forms virtually our sole basis for dealing with life. We

are attached to our thoughts. We think they are who we are.

...

Thinking, by itself, is subject to inherent flaws. ...

Hardly anybody agrees about anything. The world's problems are created around differences of opinion - often regarding relatively minor issues - around which vast intellectual and emotional edifices are

gradually built.

...

Are we actually in control of our thoughts at all?...

....

Thought is rarely accurate. Each person possesses an in-built

system of presuppositions, prejudices, societal conditioning,

religious background, and psychological complexes. Even the

extensiveness of our vocabulary plays an important role in

thinking. The precise mix is different for each person, but it

all critically affects the way the person thinks, and the kind of

thoughts that occur. Also, none of us possess total and perfect

information. Even if we did, the deep-seated biases within the

minds ensure that our conclusions will almost always be

imperfect.

Certain key human issues are necessarily relative. Morality is a

prime example. A person's moral framework derives from sources

such as family, society, peer groups, religious training, and

even the kind of TV programs a person habitually watches. The

only way to make morals absolute and to cast them in stone (as

Moses did) is to appeal to a moral absolute such as God, who is

beyond dispute. However, even here, we can then debate as to

which type of God we choose to follow, which revelation from God

is true and which false, and so on. Consequently, morality

becomes dependent upon the society in which one is raised, and

the kind of religious undercurrent present.

To make it worse, our thought processes, flawed as they may be,

are being subtly manipulated by the government and media.

Communists and Islamic fundamentalists are not the only ones

subject to brainwashing. Those in the West are also told how to

think, and usually go along with it compliantly. For example, we

are currently being sold war as a remedy for violence, and

bombing as a method for achieving peace! Could there be anything

more ironic?

Indeed, the recent international situation highlights another of

the mind's inherent fallacies: the tendency to create polarities.

We like to think we are clear-minded enough to be able to judge

Good and Evil. In many cases, we CAN determine certain rules and

penalties that will enable a society to run efficiently, without

degenerating into anarchy. However, to ascribe categories of

"good" and "evil, "saint" and "sinner", as liberally as we do, is

almost always unwise. Given our own highly fallible thought

processes, who are we to judge? From a metaphysical context,

events may be occurring for all sorts of reasons of which we can

have no idea whatsoever. Indeed, was it not Jesus himself who

said "Judge not, that you be not judged"?

Polarizing tendencies seem to arise from our need for (a)

certainties we can feel comfortable with, and ( generalizations

that enable us to make mental short-cuts to rapid solutions. We

need certainties because we want to understand the world we live

in, and exercise some degree of control within it. We also need

to generalize complex information. Otherwise, it would be too

hard for most us to deal with, and we could never reach a

conclusion, and hence achieve the certainty we desperately need.

Overall, such thought process leave us with the comfortable

feeling that we "understand" the issues, whereas the reality may

well be that we understand nothing at all! A good example is the

recent labelling of certain people as "Islamic Fundamentalists".

This is a convenient term that enables us to package such

individuals in the "evil, insane, brainwashed nutcase" category.

Thus, we don't have to seek to know anything further about them;

their history, their motivations, or their desires. After all, it

is a disease, is it not? These people are "evil", and belong to

an "axis of evil". What more is there to understand?

One disastrous result of polarized thinking is the sequence of

attack and counter-attack we see in all the trouble spots in the

world; whether it be Israel, Sep 11 2001, and formerly in

Northern Ireland. Such a pattern ensures only more of the same.

It is the politics of the playground - of five-year old children.

Sadly, many adults have not advanced much further than the

playground in their problem-solving capacities.

The above is not intended as a support for any group, but rather

serves as an example of how simplistic we prefer to make our

thinking, in order to live in a world we can understand. Our

governments deal in bite-size explanations of highly complex

issues. The general public, the majority of whom know little

about history or foreign culture, swallow it whole without

question.

Reality is inherently complex. It is doubtful if anyone is

capable of completely comprehending it. For any event to occur,

there are a myriad contributory causes. The polarizing mind seeks

an easy explanation; often a single cause. In doing so, we do not

solve any problems we face, but rather perpetuate them.

However, thought processes can be redeemed by seeking ever deeper

communion with the source of Being; the higher self, the God

within, or whatever term you prefer. Realized Masters, who are in

perfect union with the Divine, have no need for conventional

thought, but perceive reality directly. This is a worthy goal for

each of us to aspire to, but it is a difficult one. It may hint

at why all spiritual traditions call upon the follower to enter

the silent gap between thoughts, and dwell ever more often in

that zone.

That is best done initially through meditation. Through steady

practice, this state of mind can follow us outside of the

meditation session and into the whole of life. By simply being

more mindful of our habitual thoughts, we may also become more

aware of the quality and direction of them. In that way, we can

catch ourselves engaging in tendencies that are unhelpful or

untrue.

In conclusion, our thoughts and opinions are rarely even a

remotely accurate view of reality. We need to be ever watchful to

not take ourselves or our opinions - or those of others,

particularly those in authority - too seriously. Instead, by

working continually within, and by studying in a spiritual

tradition, it will be possible ever more into our awareness, the

Higher Self, who can redeem, purify, and ultimately transcend,

the power of Thought.

Copyright 2002, Asoka Selvarajah. All Rights Reserved

Web Source:

http://www.aksworld.com/discus/messages/4/...html?1043088804

of which I am a registered subscriber

[francois]

hi'

read thoughts ...

here some lines that I really do appreciate at their right values :

Thought, I love thought.

But not the juggling and twisting of already existent ideas

I despise that self-important game.

Thought is the welling up of unknown life into consciousness,

Thought is the testing of statements on the touchstone of consciousness,

Thought is gazing onto the face of life, and reading what can be read,

Thought is pondering over experience, and coming to conclusion.

Thought is not a trick, or an exercise, or a set of dodges,

Thought is a man in his wholeness, wholly attending.

[DH.Lawrence]

it says it all in a way ...

I was thinking to what's happening to Thailand these days, I have been living there for

quite some time enough to realize that times are changing because of the "new" way

to do and edict things to do ...

it is only thoughts ...

what are yours? was the question

nice text, but I did not see your opinion is there ... have you any?

cheers

francois

Edited October 6, 2004 by francois

[kayo]

Yes francois,

I'll post my own thoughtsd in the next couple of days, just want to take some more time than I have right now,

Later,

Chris

[Ice Treasure]

Interesting regions in that post I think.

For me at least, conscious, regular thought is not an end in and of itself. It is a pathway to the final destination of the process. Sort of like "half the holiday, is the journey".

Thought is the welling up of unknown life into consciousness,

Making the original microscopic process which was the beginning of the thought, into a semblance of expressible idealogy, to be shared, adjusted, revisited and then published, either verbally among friends and colleagues or published as a scholarly paper as a PhD student for example.

Beautifully expressed thoughts attain their own life, even this thought, about thought.

Thought is pondering over experience, and coming to conclusion.

Thought is not a trick, or an exercise, or a set of dodges,

Thought is a man in his wholeness, wholly attending.

Likewise, the journey begins, leading into a persons singular movement, only ever forward, never reversing, since all thought leads to learning and all learning is forward moving. Honest thought becomes personal moral law, I believe.

Thoughts like this shared, then expressed externally, become a touch paper of personal growth.

This is what a forum should be about.

Congratulations and thank you for sharing that Francois. I would love to undertake discussions at this level on the board in the future.

[PeaceBlondie]

Agreed, the PM is a bit silly if he puts 30-day and 90-day deadlines on things as pervasive as corruption, bird flu, drug trafficking, immorality among young people, etc. Maybe it would mean more if he volunteers to resign if his own staff can't solve the problem within the deadline.

No so-called "war" has been less successful than the war on drugs, unless it was Europe's "100 Years' War." Absolutely totally unsuccessful. The war on drugs keeps focusing on the supply rather than the demand - not a good example for these champions of the capitalist economy.

[thaiwing]

Hi francois and thanks for last.....

No matter how much you shout about the present govt. Nothing will be heard and we cant play a part of it. The guy has three main factors driving his popularity downwards from natural causes, More ripping from threads arn't heard....only recorded en mass......from what i can see this year, higher living costs for the thai's, widespread corruption and the govt's inability to curb ongoing separatist attacks in the south that have claimed more than 310 lives.... He's a buisness man with self employed views, wearing ear plugs and unmoved by critics from first world countries deploring his go get actions like war on druglord campain etc....Thats politics francois...re-direct the flow to change the thoughts of many with some of the mis-direction stated within your thread....again..thats his job.....

P.M is under a lot of pressure to dissolve parliament to open for early elections because of setbacks (yes i said setbacks and not kickbacks) and loss of credability within the masses...the govt is on a slide 13% downwards and still counting...

The thai populus will make the right choice next time..have a cup of tea and calm down....

[francois]

hi'

Likewise, the journey begins, leading into a persons singular movement, only ever forward, never reversing, since all thought leads to learning and all learning is forward moving. Honest thought becomes personal moral law, I believe.

Thoughts like this shared, then expressed externally, become a touch paper of personal growth.

This is what a forum should be about.

Congratulations and thank you for sharing that Francois. I would love to undertake discussions at this level on the board in the future.

you're right, I wanted to share some thoughts of what's happening to Thailand these days.

I have been living in LOS for quite some time ...

and I have seen Thai society changes ...

some I liked, some I disliked ...

what were the reasons?

I used to live among Thai people, feeling home and even better than in my homeland ...

within a couple of years, I have seen and felt that Thai were changing, not only the Thai society, the people and their way of thinking.

since mr PM is in office, things change even faster ...

after 1997, life began to be harder for any Thai people (except real rich people, may be),

all prices went up and no tendancy to see them going a bit down ...

this has hit the entire population, any farmer would tell you that they earn less money than before, due to increase of plantfood prices and handwork prices, for the same amount of hard work.

in the other side, Thai society become a bit more aware of what politics mean ...

I do think that no one in Thailand expect a better life coming from politicians. (imho)

I have been talking with a lot of people in the village I was living in(before to move to Chaing Mai), and the fact was, they have no interest in politics, the only daily worry is

how is going to be the next rice crop, and is the weather going to be nice enough not to have to fight with flood or any major disturbance in the "normal" life.

health is a major concern, so when the 30B sheme came out, many thought, it's going to be better, then realize that it was not what they expected ...

so many promises and so many things told that never happenned.

these are not thoughts, these are facts.

but, all this made me think ... where is Thailand going?

what do they want from Thai people ..?

a main part of the country is concerned with farming, so when the bird-flu went out,

everybody thought, they are going to do something to protect us and to protect our

chicken farms, they did (partly), but in which way?

slaughtering thousands of chickens when so many protected their 2 or 3 chickens of their own, no country plan!

province by province, mooban from mooban ...

and so the crisis raised again, and the worry at the same time.

the governement paid nuts for all this, and many felt "they killed all my farm and gave me quite nothing, I'm not even allowed to start again" ...

I have seen and heard the same complain so many times, it made me feel so sorry for all these people, just left apart from the crisis going on.

and the bird-flu is going on, why's that?

a real lack of efficiency from responsible people in government!

some might say .. it's the Thai way ..well, may be, but when a problem like this one is going on, why no one have some straight reaction and plan real well to tackle the problem out?

is it so difficult to make the people concerned about a real danger?

is it so hard to drive the people in a safe way for their own sake, health and security?

from what I saw and heard, this government is a champion of announcements

behind this, " we do what we can " is the main action

can't they do better?

I'm worried for the people I used to live with and the country I was living in.

this is thought and not this personnal.

my worries go to Thai people.

how long would they endure a leadership that drive them nowhere.

"he" said " I'll fight poverty.

I did not see a thing that comes along with this statement.

why do I say all this, mainly for one reason, I love this country, but I am worried about

it's future, I have still the idea to come back, but I would prefer that this PM is out before to do so ...

I remember that any real change in a society begins at the school level.

what did they do for school?

what did they do for education?

(not even long before going back to europe, I still hear "farang kin dek")

unacceptable in many ways!

I mean, what are the changes that we can really see?

my thoughts are concerns for all these matters.

they are thoughts and reflect what I feel about Thai life.

I remember to hear the King saying on a birhtday speech " a step back would be a Thai way, don't look at shining things like good things for you, thinking about the good for all Thai people begin by looking at every day good way to do and think about what is good for you, it is time to think at what is right and what is wrong in a Thai way, like we used to for centuries"

this was at the time of the financial crisis ... did any thing changed since ?

may be it was about to, but this PM arrived in office, and despite the King's warning, he is going on in the same way ...

I feel that the word "respect" does not belong to pm's mind and it makes me worry for the country as well as for Thai people.

but, it's only thoughts ... and I wanted to share this with you all, there is no anger for this PM, just a worry that he makes Thai people change and this may be not fot the best for them.

IMHO ...

francois

[francois]

hi'

The thai populus will make the right choice next time..have a cup of tea and calm down....

I do hope that Thai people won't let him in ofice a second term ... it's only hope

I'm calm and peaceful, just thinking at what is happening, and worry about the country's changes ...

what kind of tea do you prefer?

my favourite is the green one, either from Japan or China

and it's good for your health and mind

cheers

francois

[thaiwing]

your views are understandable due to your family commitment and future needs. As mine are for my thai family...it is a great worry with some of the news heard on daily and possible future changes the administration want to make. just have to hope for the best..

Read or heard something in the not-to-distant-past about the thai people and their thoughts of political leadership....it was stated - the thai people dont care who is in power as long as their children dont follow into politics...am i right or wrong...I'm not100% sure of the source of information...I certainly hope thats not how many of the thai think.

Get special delivery every three months from homeland...tea bags that is....

[RDN]

.... politicians are just a band of professional liers.....

Hey! That's my line! And one of the reasons I left England

[francois]

hi'

Hey! That's my line! wink.gif And one of the reasons I left England sad.gif

glad that you agree

so we are many to think the same

cheers

francois